tv Morning Joe MSNBC September 21, 2021 3:00am-6:00am PDT
have a smaller universe. something both parties are thinking about a lot and we try to wrap it all up and look at the shrinking map and encourage you all to read the piece. my colleague did a great job. >> hans nichols, we'll read it. >> president biden addressed the u.n. general. 10:00 a.m. right here on msnbc, make sure to watch it. thank you for getting up way too early with us this tuesday morning. "morning joe" starts right now. in less than two years my administration accomplished more than almost any administration in the history of our country. america's so true. didn't expect that reaction but that's okay. >> well, when you say something so stupid that you have
accomplished more than in two years you will be a laughing stock in the united nation and around the world. that was back in 2018. today joe biden is going to be addressing the u.n. general assembly for the first time since taking office. mika, let's just say it right here. he does not do it in a particularly good time coming off of what's happening in afghanistan and also what's happening in france over the past week. >> it comes amid of what's happening. >> with ambassador etienne who was recalled from washington and he'll be on the show this morning. donald trump is calling on georgia's secretary of state to de-certify the election. brad ralph raffensperger is
joining us and we got bob woodward and robert costa is joining us on the former president's democracy. >> that's going to be interesting willie, i am going to enjoy talking to our friends woodward and robert costa. a couple parts of that book i would have to ask him about. i would love to know the forcing for william barr saying to donald trump, no, i will be your attorney general, sir, but get this straight. there will be a strict line between the department of justice and the white house, sir. >> did he really say that? >> it will not be politicized, sir, or i have to leave, says william barr. >> i am so moved. >> so there are a couple of those moments in the book where
i want to check the sourcing out there. >> yeah, it's funny how many people find their principles after they leave the trump administration and starting up books. william barr is an example there. >> woodward and costa, we have not been seeing them in six months, they have been writing this book. there are so much in there. we want to ask them about general milley, did it go down the way it went down. general milley says he was just doing his job and a lot of people knew he was not going back channel or not undermining anyone. a lot to ask, busy morning. >> along with joe and willie and me, we have our jonathan lemire and washington editor, ozzie media and katy kay is with us. president biden will deliver his first address, the united nation general assembly since taking office. the president arrived in new
york yesterday afternoon and held a bilateral meeting the united nation's secretary general. this morning the president is scheduled to deliver remarks at 10:00 a.m. his senior official tells reuters the president's speech will stress ending the military engagement in afghanistan will open a new chapter in the quote "intensive diplomacy," after his speech, the president is scheduled to meet australian prime minister, scott morrison, before returning to washington to meet boris johnson. prime minister boris johnson spoke today with savannah guthrie. >> what i can tell you is that i think he took a view and america has been there for 20 years.
it's a respectable argument to say that enough is enough. you cannot endlessly sub contract the government of your country to other people. there is got to be some sort of system. >> do you agree? sounds like you do? >> could we have done it differently? maybe we could. >> that's interesting. we heard our allies all opposed or many of them disappointed in the way the united states left afghanistan. there it sounds like the prime minister is far more understanding of what joe biden did. and decided to leave afghanistan after 20 years. many of his domestic opponents. >> there were a lot of members of the parliament members who were out spoken. some we had on msnbc who disagree the way americans
withdrew from afghanistan and believing much more efforts to be made. they didn't like the way it was handled. there were members of the party did not like the withdrawal at all and felt remanence of american forces should have stayed there and tried to man the campaign to get coalition forces to stay there even without the united states, believed that the commitment should carry on. the prime minister was am bif -- >> he was more mute when it came to those scenes and the terrible scenes we seen at kabul airport. he's about to go to the white house today to meet the president. it's not worth trying to say rude things about president
biden just before you walk into the oval office for a much treasured one-on-one meeting. this is something that the prime minister don't want, you don't want to diss your host before you get there. boris really wants joe biden to get on his side. the priority for johnson right now is trying to get a results out of this climate conference that's coing up and the person who he needs to get that result is joe biden. he's going to do everything he can interviews before the meeting to make sure he's on the same team as joe biden. >> it seem to me katty would draw equivalence with joe biden and donald trump. donald trump declaring a war basically against theresa may and mocking her and ridiculing
her and doing the same thing with angela merkel and getting into a challenge with macron and i can go down the list. was it the president in monte negro or something getting in front. the insults and joe biden did some things in afghanistan that some of our allies did not support. is there any e equivalent of donald trump and the missteps of what joe biden has had in his m presidency. >> here is a guy spent 12 years in the foreign committee and
knows half of the world's leaders and the expectations are high among european allies. not just in the style of donald trump but perhaps in the policies themselves. i think that's where some american allies in europe may have beenoverly optimistic, a little naive. america is going to always put its own interests first. if they want to get out of afghanistan, they are going to get out of afghanistan. that annoys the french. that's the way super power works. is it a little surprising? a degree to which the biden administration have had some collateral damage simply by not informing allies and calling
them beforehand and acting a little bit more diplomatically and i think that's what surprised allies. it's a different mood, joe biden getting up to the united nation today giving that speech, is it different mood for the europeans. it's in america's self interests the way it does. a little more effort to be taken from this white house to make sure less damage among our allies. >> jonathan lemire, joe biden did announce yesterday the lifting in november of a travel ban but for foreign visitors, the united states can show proof of vaccinations, that'll please european allies for sure.
what does the president view of his job here when he steps up to the microphone in the u.n. >> as katty just said, biden was hailed as a return to normalcy. there was french president ma macron giving him a hug in the beach. certainly as you just said the change and the travel ban from europe, european allies have been pushing it for a while saying this needs to happen. the president and according to officials i have spoken to is trying to do a few things here, behind the scene, he's going to do some public defending of the afghanistan withdrawal which was unpopular among our nato allies, usher in a new era of diplomacy and new focus. he's going to try to rally
people of rally allies o f the threat posed by china. that's polarizing, too. and certainly a big focus here is going to be climate change and the pandemic and vaccines in particular. tomorrow will piggy back off the president. a virtual vaccine summit and deposing vaccines across the country. the u.s. is trying to give boosters for our americans. >> he's got some work to dochlt he's not going to get laughed at. the reception will be cooler. >> let's move to covid, the biden administration is easing restrictions on international
travelers wanting to come to the u.s., starting in early november, foreign nationals will be allowed to fly into the u.s. if they show proof of fully being vaccinated and a negative covid test within three days of their flight. the cdc will require airlines to collect information for u.s. found travelers including e-mail addresses and phone numbers for contact tracing. americans traveling back to the u.s. will have to show a negative covid test. white house's coordinator says nothing is off the table. >> covid now has killed more americans than did the 1918 spanish flu pandemic >> wow. >> what? >> cdc estimates the flu killed
about 675,000 americans. nearly 680,000 now have died from coronavirus to date this month. more than 32,000 deaths reported compares to 28,000 in august. the united states is averaging about 2,000 deaths per day. >> with all the caveats, there's a staggering number just to stop and absorb if you think of where we are. it calls the mind all the people who says this is just a flu. well, now we have passed the 1918 pandemic in terms of death. just a breathtaking number. >> it's breathtaking when you consider that 100 years later that we had all the advantages that americans didn't have in 1918. we had a record siding vaccine
as far as time goes to get a vaccine out in less than a year, nobody expected that to happen. we had the best scientists in the world, the best doctors in the world. and, yet, what did dr. gottlieb says? one of the things our public health officials could never imagined that americans would not follow their instructions. americans would not listen to their family doctors and they would read facebook pages of conspiracy theories instead of listening to their family doctors. if they would read websites that are put out by chinese religious cults instead of talking the family doctor that had been vaccinating near children and them in some cases for a generation. but, they did and so it was willfully ignorance that put us in a position now where we are
doing worse. more americans are dying and even died during the splish flu in 1918. we are coming up and if we have not passed the number of americans who have died from covid-19 died in the civil war. our bloodiest war. we learned yesterday with that news out of alabama, mika, that this actually ended up being much worst than the flu. it was not just doctors making mumbai signing covid as the cause of death. i have all of my friends and a lot of my friends, oh, you can't really trust everything they're saying about covid. it's just the media that's gening it up. here we are, more people continue to die, more people
died in alabama last year than ever born. that's the first time that ever happens in the history of the united states. this has nothing to do with doctors signing on pieces of paper or hospitals. this does not have anything to do with your stupid conspiracy theories that are killing you, your family, and your communities. i mean stop listening to the conspiracy theories. i am not asking you to listen to dr. fauci. if you are too political to listen to dr. fauci, if your mind is too twisted by all the lies facebook is showing you and politicians have told you, just go talk to your family doctor, ask if he or she have gotten the vaccine, if they are among the 95% or 96% out there, they'll
tell you that they have. you should too. we care about you and we want you to be okay and your family to be okay. we really do. listen, i am sure you know somebody who has died of covid. it's a horrible way to die. so you just need to take care -- we don't get any points. i don't get any points. my side does does not get any points if you take care of yourself. it's good for you and your family and schools and good for your community. it's good for small businesses. i want small business owners and family restaurants that have been around for generation to stay open. i don't want there to be another surge this fall, take care of yourselves and talk to your family doctor. >> joining us now, director of the vaccine, education center and attending division in the position of infectious disease
of children's hospital. he's a member of the fda's vaccines advisory panel. and author of the new book "you bet your life," the long and history history of medical history. >> given deaths are up, how do you give where we are in this pandemic? are we at the end of it? >> no. there are sort of a willful ignorance and incredible selfish less in this country where people are saying we don't want to get vaccinated. we'll continue to provide further ground for the virus to spread and mutate and it will be more resistance in this community. what are you going to do about it? that's where we are at right now is trying to compel people to do
the right thing with mandates and frustrating. we have a way out of the pandemic, get vaccinated. a certain percent of the population is just saying no. >> correct me if i am wrong. right now children, younger children are not vaccinated so they can be passing it around to others that are breakthrough cases that are vaccinated which are not as bad. for those who are unvaccinated, it's life-threatening. >> right, when the virus came into this country last february. the children accounted for 3% of cases and now they account for 27%. our hospitals seeing many patients including children in intensive care unit. this is a disease of children. we have 250,000 cases, the last week of this country. we had 200,000 cases the week before that. we need to protect our children. the frustration is a lot of the children we saw were greater
than 12 years of age and they could have gotten a vaccine. a lot were quite ill have not gotten the vaccine and either are their parents. it's hard to watch. it's hard enough last year to watch children suffer but this year is harder and that it's preventable. >> dr. offit, let's stay with children in the news from pfizer that its vaccine for 5 to 11 years old are highly effective. what do you think this does to the pandemic. they're not taking the vaccines for themselves. they're sure not as heck are going to give it to their child either. what would that do to change the trajectory of things here?
>> i think we need about 90% of the population to be immune. i think we do need to vaccinate our children less than 18 accounted for 20% of the population. yes, it's important to have that. we'll look at those data and now we are hearing an era of science by press relief of the one page press relief that talks about their data. i am optimistic that we'll have a vaccine for children. only about 40% or 50% have been vaccinated. having the vaccine is not good enough. we have to give the vaccine. it's frustrating. we are coming into a time now where you have a completely stipulatable population of children. we are all be in one place, we are heading into the winter months and this virus is easier to transmit it.
it does not work if you don't do it. >> dr. offit, let me put a question to you, explain to the unvaccinated why even if they are young and healthy which i heard a lot from many people. i am young and healthy, why put this vaccine to my arms? what are you saying to those people making the choice of not to get the vaccine of why they consider it or hopefully do it eventually? >> epidemiology has changed. when the virus first came into the country and started killing people. 93% of the deaths were people over 55 years of age. the epidemiology now involves younger people. just go to hospital, that's what we are dealing with. you are not immune, including
young children and children less than five. very hard to watch. >> let's talk about your book. "you bet your life." the medical innovations that we have seen, actually think seem to be speeding up, such a remarkable pace and nobody expected this vaccine to come about the way it did. my god, while everything we seem to be racing downhill at this remarkable rate was not always that way. a very, very slow crawl leading to blood transfusion to where we are now. >> it's about learning as you go. i think people are uncomfortable with the notion that there is a human crisis. that's always true. it's true now. we'll never be able to point out to what we know.
the question is when they choose a particular medications. i go over eight of these -- okay, would you get it now? take blood transfusion, for example, a couple hundred years ago, we used farm animals and would you get it then? now we know of blood types and we didn't know about rh blood type and okay, would you get it now? there are viruses we don't test for with blood and there are virus we don't know about. it's a matter of trying to figure out when you should pull the trigger. it's about making decisions of
searching and it's choices to take different risks and that's always true. >> all right, the new book is "you bet your life." >> dr. paul offit, thank you very much. still ahead on "morning joe," we have a packed show ahead as we mentioned "the washington post" bob woodward and robert costa will join us with their brand new book focusing on the final months of the trump's presidency and plus the french ambassador to the united states joins us. he's in paris this morning, not washington. after being recalled in response to the u.s. nuclear submarine deal with austria. ever since losing the 2020 election, former president trump has begged georgia's secretary of state, raffensperger to
decertify the results. another new episode for -- and barry gibbs talks about his remarkable career. you can find the joe scarborough broadcast on spotify or where ever you get your morning forecast. "morning joe" is back in a moment. forecast "morning joe" is back in a moment vo: taking on climate change. this is our moment to get it right
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i just couldn't have asked for a better experience. don't cancel or let your policy lapse without finding out what it's worth. visit coventrydirect.com to find out if your policy qualifies. or call the number on your screen. . early morning look at the white house. 6:31 a.m. it's tuesday? >> it's tuesday.
>> it's not monday. >> no. >> not wednesday, it's tuesday. >> we are going to be in new york tomorrow. >> yeah. >> looking forward to that. >> of course you are already in new york. >> can we get a shot of mika's fantastic shot. it's a shot straight out of the matrix. t.j., i ask t.j. and alex if they were ""matrix" fans. the boys and i were huge "matrix" fans. what about you? >> who would not love the "matrix" ? >> when mika makes fun of the empire strike back. i am not going to go there. >> that's a deal breaker.
>> joe gets mad when i role my eyes when he's watching these things with his kids. oh, that's so stupid. >> and the emperor goes, so be it jedi, get out of the room and do your book writing or whatever smart girl. get out of the room. no, -- >> it's really healthy. >> the "matrix." >> i knew it was hopeless when she confused "star trek" with "star wars." are they the same thing? >> are they? >> i tried to show her "dumb and dumber" and she does not get that either. i love jeff daniels. i am glad when i interviewed him
ten years ago that i didn't know about that movie. it was in my notes. she goes to his house and meets his father and incredible wife, go to the lumber store where his dad works. they did not bring up "dumb and dumber"? >> he moved back to his hometown because he wanted to be grounded with his family. i think the first thing i asked about was "dumb and dumber." he's proud of it and does not change his life. >> there you go. >> it has been ten months since
the 2021 election and yet the big lie lives on and on. >> former president trump sent a letter to raffensperger, asking him to de-certify the election results. the letter was posted to twitter by liz harrington. >> remember the last election he says some people were standing in line and one of his golfing friends heard that illegal immigrants were voting? and the 2016 was rigged and he won the popular vote. >> secretary of state, raffensperger, he's joining us now. >> my grand mom would read for
me all the time. when i think back to those moments, i think of you because you have extraordinary patience and the lives continue. the former president is asking you to look in to some of these rumors and what have you found? >> prior to his letter, we have begun an investigation. we'll finish it up and find our findings to the board. at the end of the day, we have been rebutting and fighting all this information for over ten months now. it's not healthy for american democracy. what we are seeing is people losing elections as low as the pta level, all the way to the president not accepting the will of people. that's not healthy for america. i am a lifelong reagan
republican, i will always choose the country over the party. my job is we give honest and fair elections. it's the state of our job. >> i am sure you talked to a lot of republicans as you are campaigning. you sit there and explain to them that there were 62 and 63 and 64 challenges in federal courts and never was there any widespread voter fraud proven? >> you saw rudy giuliani going into federal court. it seems very few people when they have to sign on the dotted line before they went for the federal court pleadings. have few of them alleged that.
or at least never found widespread voter fraud. how do you take that message to your fellow republicans, people that used to be members of my party. >> on january 6th, they focused on other matter. i go through line by line and point by point when they say there were thousands of dead people voted, we found a handful. they said thousands of unregistered voters that voted, there were not any of those. any time an allegation was made, we ring it out. president trump did not carry the state of georgia. >> the conspiracy theorists seemed to focus on fulton county
and one of my friends sent an article from a website run by a chinese religious cult that says somebody is taking suitcases out from underneath the table and moving them out and some conspiracy theory. were all those theories been spread and have it been checked out? did somebody take suitcase and ballots and move them out? >> where is that conspiracy theory comes from? >> at the state farm arena it was under surveillance 24/7. people had come in and stuff ballots. what we did was we brought in the fbi and the georgia bureau of investigation and all three
law enforcement agencies looked at that and said there was not anything. they got around the world before our investigaors had the opportunity to bring in outside law enforcement also looked at it. >> they totally disproved. >> some people choose to understand the truth and others want to continue the big lie. >> secretary raffensperger, good morning. it's willie geist. how many times in total has the vote been counted for the 2020 election? >> three times. >> we had our first tabulation that you go through then we did a 100% hand recount. it provers the machine did not votes. after he had done those two, we went ahead and did another ballots of all 5 million ballots which also verified the total count that we had which is
president trump lost the state of georgia about 12,000 votes. >> is there any doubt in your mind that joe biden won the state of georgia? >> no, there is no doubt of my mind. people don't understand which i put in my book, we have 28,000 people, i am not voting for joe biden, i am voting for donald trump. they left it blank. >> in the metropolitan area of atlanta, senator purdue had 20,000 more votes than donald trump did. >> mr. secretary, you talked about the danger of this big lie and being perpetuated by donald trump and sending a letter for you to look into the claim of fraud. we know the infamous phone call that he made to you to find the 11,780 votes so he can win the
state of georgia. can you specific of what you think that danger is? the former president supported a challenger to you and your race to keep your seats. if someone who's not you and were sitting in your chair, what may happen. it's not just dodgers but the president is supporting the people who is supporting our lives. >> we have to really have people that are going to stand in line to say this is how the results came out. and not look right or left, and to have those integrity. >> it's really that you are honest and you have character and you are going to do the right thing. i think we also have a
discourse. we have to come together and we have talked respectably. >> we have to know character counts and always have and always will. >> i remember after the election, donald says how could it be that republicans won all over the country but i lost. would you just describe to our friends who are listening to right now was exactly what ron johnson was caught on tape admitting. i think he said like i won by 150,000 votes and then he said if you add up all the republican state legislatures, they won by margin of 56,000 or under 56,000. if you are looking at people in wisconsin, they won by the same number of vote. donald trump under performed for every republicans and so his
argument was caught on camera. if the democrats were going to steal elections, they would have stolen all elections. >> we all did well and we got the same number of votes. there were just enough republicans whether it was in wisconsin or in the suburbs of atlanta that we are just not going to vote for a candidate that's considered as toxic. >> we saw similar effect here in georgia. >> there is a difference right there. what's interesting is the congressman that's running against me is he voted to see his results. he says the one with the president is somehow tainted. he's a double-minded person and
a pastor should know better than that. that's another discussion and maybe i will bring in russell for that. secretary of state, final question, are the braves going to go all the way this year? are they going to win the n.l. east and continue winning in an all world series. >> incredible. they're going to play hard, 20 years of great entertainment. we didn't have the strike year, we would have won that one, too. >> we are really excited this year with our prospects >> brad raffensperger, thank you for being on. his fourth coing book is titled "integrity counts." it's available for preorder now.
bob woodward and robert costa is joining us and what's more for what's at stake for the president. "morning joe" is back in a moment. president. "morning joe" is back in a moment hi, i'm debra. i'm from colorado. i've been married to my high school sweetheart for 35 years. i'm a mother of four-- always busy. i was starting to feel a little foggy. just didn't feel like things were as sharp as i knew they once were. i heard about prevagen and then i started taking it about two years now. started noticing things a little sharper, a little clearer. i feel like it's kept me on my game. i'm able to remember things. i'd say give it a try. prevagen. healthier brain. better life.
take place to raise awareness of poverty, and vaccine doses worldwide, featuring dozens of artists and world leaders and philanthropists. joining us now is president ursula and cofounder and ceo of global citizen. >> i have to ask madame president. i think the germans found that you had to interview mika's father. was he polite to you?
>> how was he in 2015 to you? >> there it's. >> fantastic. incredibly experienced and knowledgeable. i had a fantastic memory of him. >> wonderful. >> aw. >> what are you -- you are obviously here and we are talking about global citizens and i am curious, what do you hope to see coming? >> you know, ngos are kind of civil society at its best. they have a unique capacity to
unite people and rally for a good cause. and, they are complement comple businesses. we have to team up. >> and their model is very successful. they're not out there asking for donations left and right from people that are listening. >> they just want action. how important is it for world leaders to stay here from those that are watching global citizen and demanding government. >> they are also keeping track of what has been pledged and delivered. so you don't only want to have
announcements but you need it delivered on the ground. on the other hand, what i like about global citizen is they unite people. they are always looking for solutions and always working hard and giving their own share of what activities is concerned. now a day, fantastic concert coming up on the 25th, around the world. this is making people aware of yes, we have a crisis and we have a big crisis but we can do something about it. we can change and we can overcome the crisis if we work together. >> so hughes, this one has a special job to do in terms of messaging around the world about
covid-19. i see you have stars, will these stars help spreading correct information about covid-19? >> absolutely. mika and joe, thank you for having us today. >> it's one in a generational moment to bring the whole world together. and we are encouraging world leaders to step up. >> they have been reached to various states. right now they're calling onto the 320 to keep a promise i should tell you that the eu has stepped up in this perspective, they committed $25 billion in financing the global climate fund. unfortunately, the u.s. government because the trump's legacy had not done yet.
so we call on president biden when he addressed the u.n. assembly today, step up and make a bold commitment. the u.s. is lagging behind others and we need the wealthist to step up. >> it's kay here, talking about u.n. speech. president biden is going to new york. yesterday, you said that the treatment by the biden white house over the americans of the submarine deal was unacceptable. this was not the way america should be treating their alies. what are you going to do about it? >> i think when french and partners being able to talk to each other and sort it out and be very clear. we are friends.
we know exactly what side of the table we are sitting together and what we are defending together. >> we need to make sure that democracy is strengthen. we have to define our values. it's important to be in constant contact, consult if there is an issue. that's what we are going to do. now in the margins of the united nation general assembly, it's good. >> hughes and "global citizen," good to see you. as you said you had to shift your focus a little bit to look at the vaccines and look at getting people treated for covid and developing parts of the world. what do you think about the debate that's happening in the united states right now and about getting booster shots and
versing making sure the rest of the world has all the vaccines it needs. what's your responsibility of the united states in terms of distributing vaccines around the world? >> i think every nation could learn. the u.s. practice what they preach. the u.s. government contributed 142 million doses, it's one of the few countries on the planet that followed through on their vaccine equity pledges. >> right now we need the g-20 to step up massively and create a billion doses by the end of this year. it's unacceptable to hear the united states, crossing over 50% vaccine rates and across africa, you are talking about less than 4%. there will be new variants that
emerge if we don't act now. >> if you are apart of the g-20. you must step up and contribute your fish here towards the vaccine doses to the poorest nations. >> so, madame president, we obviously have been hearing over the past week or so of challenges coming from china and how the united states and the u.k. and austria have teamed up together in a way that's upset. our french allies. >> china obviously, is on everyone's mind which will be for some time. if you look at the united states and the eu and our gdp together. e with are such a force economically in this world. what can we do to work together
better as we move forward, and as a much needed counter wave to authoritarian rise in china. >> you have an excellent way to team up. the one is to overcome to pandemic. throughout the whole pandemic, every second doses of vaccines that was produced has been sent abroad to other countries. >> it's an enormous important factor and indeed it's what just said, the donations exempted the united states that pledges and the european union is plette pledging 500 million doses and
then there is a third point where we can team up and that's bringing the mrna technology for vaccines to neighboring countries, for example, africa. we have them built the manufacture, with the private sector and finance that's necessary so that overtime africa is independent. >> the second tropic is the fight against climate change. i commend the united states for the ambitious goals they put forward. now it's up to us to give the funding that's necessary to find climate change.
we'll do our fair share and confident that our friends and partners and the united states will do it, too. >> the global citizen concert is this saturday. president of the european commission and cofounder and ceo of global citizens. thank you both. once again we look forward to it. still ahead, "the washington post" bob woodward and robert costa. join us at the top of this hour with a brand new book. >> a deep dive of the trump's presidency and the fraud transition of the biden administration. we are back in one minute. n administration we are back in one minute. this is a gamechanger, who dares to be fearless even when her bladder leaks. our softest, smoothest fabric keeping her comfortable, protected, and undeniably sleek. depend. the only thing stronger than us, is you.
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just to continue the margaret thatcher thing, have you talked to her and secondly, why does it take so long to get a female leader? look at what margaret in the u.k. >> well, i not spoken to margaret. >> that's as tough one. >> yeah. >> whoa, i have not spoken to margaret. that was her being nice. >> i do have a quiji board and we have been talking about -- >> being asked if she discussed the role of the former british president, margaret thatcher who died. >> anderson's portrayal of margaret tatcher was great, i
liked it because they did not paint her as a witch. she was 3 dimensional character. by tend, the queen understood it and so as a caring and loving mother. >> again, if you are going to turn a country 180 degrees, you will have it. >> i love the scene where she's cooking shepard pie home. >> she's got an apron on and she has these ways of not sure how to make it. >> when the role first came out, it was criticized as beingover the top but if you go back to the tape of tatcher, she does
have that extraordinary delivery of that deep voice. i think she got a pitch perfect, the development of the relationship of the queen where at first the queen is put out by her and finds her brash and does not think she's the one with the power. and the end she comes to appreciate her and sympathizes of the way she was being treated by some of the men. >> all right, let's dive right in with authors of the moment. bob woodward and robert costa are unioning us now. their new book "peril" is today. >> it's good to have you with us. there are some pieces of the book that have come out. what was most striking to you that have not been released to the public? >> wow. i guess the overall that this
was a national security crisis that trump brought because countries like china, russia, iran looked at what was occurring in the united states. if you go back and look at what trump said before the election, it was scary to people abroad. after the january 6th insurrection and china ignited on this point the chairman of the joint chief, mark milley had these calls with the chinese military and made it very clear, we are going to stabilize things. let's not have a war in a period of miscommunications and high tension. as history shows, that's when you have an incident or even a
war. >> so, bob, i read the milley part early on like everybody did and read the entire book. i was shot shocked by his actions because i guess like you were especially because you were in the middle of it. i grew up reading about it in your books and other books and basically what led the prime minister of great britain talk to a drunk richard nixon during the '73 israeli war how for a year from '73, it's time to get out and you had nixon cabinet members doing everything they could to keep the world stable when richard nixon was not stable. >> that's what happened here.
>> milley was confronted of a practical problem. they had various sense of intelligence, the chinese thought we are going to attack them. that was the most dangerous environment international. milley talked to his counter part in china and we have the dialogue and quite frankly it's clear what he's trying to do. he's trying to camp things down. i am sorry to take this literally from the book. but you got to do the literal moment when milley says to general lee, if we are going to attack, i am going to call you ahead of time. people have missed construe that. what it means is there will be a build-up and tensions and
they'll be talking behind the top secret back channel. >> that's what he says out there. if there is a war, some kind of connecticut action, there is going to be a build up justice like in history. >> bob and i have talked about this. we have some echoes of that moment in our book. the eve of the insurrection and the riot of the capitol. >> we have the scene of president trump not only pressuring vice president pence in the oval office but opening the air and having the cold air coming in and talking to his aides, can you hear my supporters outside. talking to these people as he hears them out on the streets on a free freezing night. we had to dig into what
happened. it was a debt domestic crisis. >> hearing the mob out there and he's enthralled with the mob and we discussed this and where he minded me nixon talking to the pictures of former presidents of the wall. a moment as watergate was cracking open and cracking his he's talking to this mob. this is his base. this is what he gets. >> who is he talking to that night? >> steve bannon on the phone. >> he's telling steve bannon we need to kill the biden presidency in the crib.
that was based on our reporting in that conversation. >> and, tell us, bob costa, tell us what you know about the pressure that was put on mike pence and anyone else on the administration or members of the nate to try to help trump stay in the presidency, even after he had lost. >> our book documents how vice president quail, he navigates the decision, what's most interesting to us is the new information we discovered on how the legal side of the trump's team. they're trying to convince the vice president president and his team to de-certify president-elect trump's victory at the time.
essentially walk away. that could have been a constitutional crisis. >> bob woodward. good morning. >> let's talk about how close this country came to overturn this election. >> you have vivid details. you have vice president pence sitting in the oval office and you have phone call and kevin mccarthy and two president trumps around january 2006. were they accommodating? >> were they supportive of his big lie and what was going on january 6th. what did we learn from some of those conversations? >> what's fascinating is politics and the writing both courses, pence is the model of this. he is doing something if he can stay on the good side of trump
as bob was pointing out. stan quail, he reads it in the constitution and the wall and says you are not an actor in this. simply he's counting the votes and pence is under less anxiety from trump. in the end, pence stood up and did the constitutional right thing. when he's there and they're voting to certify and if he said oh, i am confused and walked off, we would have had a worsen than a constitutional crisis because it would have undermine the legitimacy of the presidency. >> he was fishing around, vice
president pence to get this done for former president trump. as we look ahead to january 6th until that day and some of those phone calls, what were members of congress that we talked about a lot in the show. what were they doing and were they encouraging president trump to step forward, hey, stand down to the rioters who were attacking the capitol. what were they saying to the president because there were a lot of speculations of the conten of the phone call. >> a lot of efforts were being made at the time. members of congress like leader mcconnell were not talking to president trump. when you see the lack of power among the republican leadership to do anything to constrain this president and this reporting, this whole story peril, a
dangerous transition, raises the questions of the power of residency. >> what are our leaders and congress are doing to keep the executive on the straight narrow. >> there is not much they can do because this is a president who does not listen, in those final days. >> so there is as you talk about the most dangerous transition in american history from trump to biden, there is a lot about biden and some annoyance he displayed watching morning television. you can tell us about that. bob costa, i want to hear about his, and where that stands? >> senator graham is out north carolina carolina. >> he was friendly when he was in the -- senator graham's very
aggressive approach to the biden family. >> bob. >> you can write a whole book about senator graham's ab -- >> trump calls him back later and graham says i would have hung up, too. and so there is this view of trump and somebody who's this force in the republican party which indeed he still is. this is not going away. this is new york times reviewer pointed out that end of our book which is the prologue
that's -- what's going to happen to the republican party or the democrat party? who's going to be president or will trump resurface? >> in our reporting and talked about it. trump is going to run and some poll shows he can beat biden. >> in one quote, president biden. >> he runs again is going to be for vengeance. >> let's talk about president biden. >> yes. >> talk to us about what you are reporting and taught you where you can get -- not just his reaction on january 6th but also what he inherituated. >> president trump trump knew about the coronavirus. >> and she came to office.
walk us through how he was grapling with the enormous task ahead. >> he had a strong performance on him. >> he kept saying to biden make sure you do everything, don't under perform here. the response to the virus were very strong. >> we had the variant coming and now we are back. >> it's a lot of reporting we did and afghanistan and biden was insisting that we got to get out now. it turns out march of this year, biden's top cabinet officers told me blinken, and lloyd
austin. proposed formally and slow down the process. >> austin, it is -- >> it's a few here and now, don't do it. you now look at that and that probably was good advise that was not taken. >> the president is going to be here in new york and speak to united nation. and our allies were so strained from president trump. >> also, what do you see today of the task in front of biden. >> when you talk to sources close to president biden, you get a sense this is someone
who's been around power since the 1970. whether it's afghanistan, he's so formed and forged by decisions and debates that he participated in the past. we have seen in the books from the earlier obama years where he was grapling afghanistan. >> he said the military does not expletive with me. i am going to be an independent voice as a vice president and a president when it comes to this kind of decision. you can see this dogged approach and regardless of what allies asor cabinet members say. he's going to do it his way. >> yes, he's, you have talked to people who work for him. he's a very demanding moss. >> i want details. what's happening here? >> he's the question man. and, some are uncomfortable in
that environment and some love it. look on the three things. the virus is not a good time for the virus. >> i think maybe all of this we arover looking a seriousness of that. afghanistan didn't work out very well and on his big $3.5 trillion plan has been reported, it's an overrich in the environment. now, wait a minute, let's do things slowly. it's going to be quite a ride to watch biden and how he gets his arms around as bob would say power. presidential power is not like being in the person.
>> more on the transition between trump and biden you all write about and how republican leadership had to balance dealing. >> with trump brashly contesting the results, senator mcconnell says he'll give trump room toll get off steam. and not publicly recognize biden as president. >> more important, mcconnell worried trump may react negatively. the hotly contested run-off elections in georgia. those seats were necessary to keep the republican majority. >> mcconnell as majority leader. he also -- he called to in
infuriate trump. >> bob costa, this is somebody doing their best trying to contain donald trump and at the end getting burned by donald trump. >> it ended up going -- donald trump's conspiracy theories and donald trump telling republicans elections were rigged and donald trump going and giving rallies and talking about themselves and he blows it up in republican's face. >>. what is it like for people behind the scenes, how do we see these people in front of the audience and it actually worse. >> so he goes and heard about senator kunhs and willing to be
an adversary and all the key situations of president trump from exploding and disrupting of what's happening in georgia. that's how things work behind the scenes. you can see people like speaker pelosi, too. we put it all in there. show what exactly happens. let's make sure this process for nuclear weapon is under control especially in the wake of the insurrection. >> guys. let's talk between us here. >> nobody else. >> are we in the air? >> oh. we may be on the air. i don't know. >> bob costa, you and i exchanged notes a good bit in 2015 when we were talking to donald. we known him for decades because
he was on "the apprentice." >> we talked a little bit about it during the transition talking to donald. i am curious and bob costa, i will start with you, did donald trump, you written about him in this book lines up with the donald trump you are talking about and talking to and error reporting to in 2015. if there were a lot of him, this guy was trying to be an authoritarian president. >> march 31st, 2016, woodward and i were talking about this the other day.
it was the day we interviewed president trump together when he's was on the cusp of the republican party. i don't want to speak too much of what we discussed. >> i will remember for the rest of my life. >> we interviewed president trump for about 90 minutes. that's a long time. >> woodward said to me, fiver years ago, that was very important. this man could be president. take it seriously. that's the key that we recognize then and we have to recognize now. these people may be out of auchs may seem like they can't win the presidency but they can come back and win in 2016. you have to take the question of governing and the question of power. this is not a game. this is american politics and democracy.
>> bob, too many of us didn't think he could win. >> we got mocked and ridicule for even suggesting it's possible that donald trump could get 270 electric vote. nobody thought this guy was going to win. you were exactly right in march of 2016. >> but, i go back to conversation i had with him in 2015. you all were talking about him connecting with a mob. i just sort of get chills listening to you talking about that. he said something along the lines of of those people out
there. man, they love us and i can throw him -- >> there were so many things he said that suggested there was really disturbing side to him and nobody thought he was going to get elected but of coursely he did. >> the question is who is he. it's a big question. >> what does he care about? >> and we found from our books that he cares about himself. at one point sitting in the oval office, i asked, what's the job the president does. >> oh, to protect the people and if you look at his performance, he's protected or tried to protect donald trump, no t the
people. he's disconnected from that overall arching constitutional and moral responsibility that the president has. what this reporting and we used to come on your show and you would ask us and we would say we are in a cave or writing a book or going back and really trying to find out what happened. the discovery is this is the -- >> every knows. ail thanksgiving day all have disdain for trump. the only person who acted is general milley, he was very
dramatic. when he calls in the people in the commander center into his office. this was when pelosi said i am worry about what trump may do with weapons. >> millie. he says i am going to be involved. you call me before any military action that comes from anyone including the president. you involve me in this process. he literally goes around the room. got it? got it? yes, sir. and people say oh, he's trying to take over some of the commander in chief's power. >> no. what he's doing is setting in motion, sensible precautions and
if you look tat the procedures which are top secret, he's supposed to be involved. >> we lost sight of what -- >> we go back and look at president truman used bombs on world war ii and japan. >> these weapons, this is the end of the world if it happens. we danced around that edge and i think when you get, when you look at all of this, mcconnell and mccarthy, and attorney general barr, they're all kinds of looking out for their own
position, generally milley took action and put himself, he was in this moment where he had practical responsibility. what are the calamity that can fall before the united states? a war with china? >> the use of nuclear weapon. i mean -- it's unthinkable. >> he's going over routine procedures but it's an extraordinary american moment. >> a national security emergency. >> general millie thought to protect the relationship. bob costa, i want to go back for something that woodward touched on a few minutes ago. the idea of trump running again.
it's a question that hangs over the country right now. will he run for president again? what will go into the former president's decision about whether he'll run or not in 2024? >> the woodward method of reporting is sitting down with people for hours, we have been sitting down with people close to president trump for many months. he wants back. he feels he has the political capital with his reporters. he likes playing golf. this is someone who wants back into the presidency. he believes the republican party is still very much in his grip that people are not going to war with him at the highest rank of the party. even though there are others out
there with ambition like desantis and -- it's president trump who really wants back based on our reporting. >> wants back and if you get into the question, which is important to do what? and the answer is to be donald trump. that's not an agenda. that does not connect to the needs of the people in the country. his disconnect from that, the struggle that people are engaged in, he has no idea and again, the power of the presidency is so great. good things can be done and good things have been done to mobilize that power and make sure that it's going to be in the interests of the people and
the country. and you know, i think i would argue and i mean -- also, it's true that this book is not a partisan -- it's something where democrats and republicans, people on the left and right say what did he do with the presidency? >> why were there so many people who held him in disdain? they would check mate him because he would have very ideas, even bad ideas for him. >> that's right. >> i mean everybody and almost everybody you talked to in the republican party held him in disdain but he has the power and so they sat back quietly. i want to ask you guys the event
of january 6th from inside the white house. trump was gleefully watching the riot and family members getting beaten up. trump was gleeful about it. take us inside the white house that day and talk about the people begging the president to turn it off and the people who were going along with the president, celebrating, police being brutalized and the capitol being sacked. >> based on our reporting. the scene was colder. it was almost at an empty west wing. we have a scene in the book
where general keith, he walks in and tries to update the president. the president says, yeah, he's watching the tv show. people are coming in and say please try to react. it was not a gleeful scene. it was not a moment of crisis to have the capitol being sieged by trump's supporter it is. to many people around president trump was more alarming and some kind of celebrations that nothing was being done. we have seen people in the press office of the younger aides of the trump aadministration. how are they surprised knowing president trump but even they were stunned. how could this really be happening and others acknowledged privately.
this is who he is. >> and that is at the bottom line as i always thought i could never over estimate his shallowness and i always under estimated just how little he cares for this country and how little he knew about history and how little he knew about the constitution and we have seen it time and time again. how many articles have we read over the last five years and when he was president, this is the lowest point of trump's presidency. >> it gotten even lower. read it from liberals and conservatives. it seems like his ability to shock continue to the very end. bob costa and woodward, thank you so much. >> thank you. >> the new book is "peril," it's obviously one for the history books. >> yes, it's. >> one that's going to be read for a long time to understand what happened and one of the
most crucial moments of the history of american democracy. >> coming up, a rift between the united states and its oldest ally hangs over president biden's speech at the u.n. later this morning. we'll speak to the french ambassador who was recalled from the u.s. after his country was left out of that nuclear submarine deal. "morning joe" is back in a moment. ♪♪ moment ♪ wondering what actually goes into your multivitamin? at new chapter, its' innovation, organic ingredients, and fermentation. fermentation? yes. formulated to help you body really truly absorb the natural goodness. new chapter. wellness, well done. ♪♪ ♪♪ ♪♪
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>> that was french president manuel macron praising president biden willing to cooperate with allies in the g-7 summit back in in june. macron did not know president biden was meeting with british and the allies on the same day. that deal voided a trouble play 16 agreements between french and austria. the u.s. deal is a quote, "knife in the back. and took the unprecedented measure of ambassador to the u.s. that ambassador, eitennie, is joining us now. ambassador, thank you very much
for being with us this morning. i guess i would like to ask you were the french government completely blindsided by this? >> well, first thank you very much for inviing me eventhough i am in paris. >> recaling me as the french ambassador. we have indeed as you said of the contract of 2016 to build a new wealth submarines because it's a request of austria at the time. this contract is being implemented. if i take your opinion of the
clients. >> we here and first through the press about some unifications and nobody -- >> including the u.s. talked about, yes, we have been deliberately department outside of this addadministration. >> we have nuclear submarines and we are present in the endo-pacific. there are many reasons why we don't understand why it was not decided to consult us and to involve us? >> so, you used to word all of a sudden confirming that the sense of being blind siended and business is business in some ways. it appears some socks may have been amendable than yours. >> my question to you is prime
minister morrison says he has expressed significant concerns about the deal to president macron in june and made it clear that decisions were going to be made. i am just wondering were french truly surprised by this? >> there were discussions between leaders, of course. by the way, it was apart of the contract and we had -- this contract was the corner stone. but, we had discussions until the very last moment, that the contract would be terminated and a new project completely new project. we would be presenting it on the same day, on the 15th of september. again, this is very important
for the contract itself. it's smaller than the contract and much more than money. it's about strategic partnership and it's also about alive. what does it mean to be alive and if you hide from another and why france is an endo-pacific nation. we have armed forces and we have to commit ourselves to act and we have specific strategies. i remember i was a diplomatic adviser. we are considered by the u.s. as a trusted and able alive and partner. our military works very well together. here was the situation. i think everybody can understand that reaction. >> everybody can understand it's
really serious in terms of the engagement in the endo-pacific. it's not only a french issue but it's also european. >> so mr. ambassador, france is obviously america's oldest ally, thank you for helping us gaining our independence. >> yeah. >> you are a critical ally and we thank you. >> thank you. >> thank you for recognizing that. we look upon france being critical allies for the past five years fighting against liberalism and not only your country but across europe and the world. we are so grateful forl your voice there. obviously, france is an
in-dispensible. how can this relationship be mended? and what did the biden administration need to do to get this critical relationship, this historic relationship back on track. >> we, we were grateful to the u.s. of what you did for us in the two world wars. we are trusted allies not only endo-pacific but africa -- >> i think one of the most important that i mentioned is
europe union is interested. france is interested. that coincides with the goals of the united states of maritime coalition, for instance, we maritime circulation, for instance, we want to propose the pacific island, for instance, a solution for the development against climate change. we have a lot of things together, not only for security. so why again, why do we have this situation? the first thing, however, is to discuss this, to try to understand, to clarify, and, of course, then, to try to rebuild the trust. >> to rebuild the trust, not only with us but i think, as i said, there is also here a very european tradition. >> and nice to see behind you
the arc de triomphe, long-planned with the administration. >> absolutely. >> but let me ask you about the very correct criticism about the biden administration, talking about lies and duplicity and lack of trust. i think the white house has almost taken aback by how hard the french government took this. can you explain specifically why this impacted you so hard, why you were recalled, and what president biden could say to president macron to in fact make this better in some way, to repair the relationship you say has been pulled apart? >> well, first, i think i already to explain how it explains the choice of the words of the recall and myself to the ambassador in paris. you can see in paris now, the
arc de triomphe is wrapped up, the project. but the seriousness had to be underlined in words and acts. and i think it's important the seriousness of what happened is being stood not only in the united states but also i'm concerned but the oldest but most important alliance. now, we will see. president biden has proposed to have a conversation, a call with president macron that will hopefully happen in the next days. we will prepare it and we will try to rebuild the trust. but we start from this situation, and it's important also on the american side to understand what we felt. we, the europeans, we have this
direction because we thought it was indeed, seriously, a serious breach of trust. >> mr. etienne, it's katty kay in paris. you talk about it being a european itself but the uk itself is not united about what to do with the china problem. there are benevolent and different views how to handle china than there is here in the united states. and france actually looks isolated at the moment. you called off meetings with the uk about defense. you canceled a meeting with the swiss president to paris because the swiss were buying american military technology. the german presidential debate. the agreement wasn't even raised a couple days ago, important presidential debate. the germans didn't seem to want to talk about the australian submarine deal. it kind of looks like france is a little isolated in europe about its anger about what's
happened between washington and australia. >> no, we are not at all isolated. especially following the withdrawal of afghanistan, there is this awareness in europe, and i think it is also a good opportunity, by the way, and also for the united states. we need a serious conversation between the united states and european union. the united states has been asked for consistently more involvement on the union with our constituencies and we agree with that. we're asking in sirhan, where one ally, not just france, is meeting with the europeans but the u.s. decided not to send troops but supporting us very efficiently in the fight against terrorism. i think what is happening not only this year and this submarine's contract but other
evolutions. we really need to recognize that the europeans and the u.s. also recognize that the europeans have to develop their own actions and be a partner, which takes more -- a greater role in the world, together with the u.s., of course, because we share the same goals. and on china, contrary to your impression, we have more and more united european position. we have a policy which has been two years ago, which has been defined and which we follow. it is not at all what we had ten years, even five years ago. it is going much more articulated, and we describe our relationship with china based on three pillars, rivalry, competition, it could be technological or partnership when we have to discuss global issues such as climate, and,
frankly, it is not that far from what this administration is describing and is doing as its relation with china. if you look at china, at climate on one hand or more confrontational issues on the other hand. i don't think we are not united, i think we are more and more united on china in europe. >> france's ambassador to the united states, phillipe etienne. we hope to see you back in the u.s. soon. thank you very much for being on the show this morning. still ahead on "morning joe" -- democrats try to box in republicans on the debt ceiling but senate snort leader mitch mcconnell says there's no chance the gop will budge. but there are -- >> but, wait, they always pass the debt ceiling. why wouldn't they do it now? what's difference between a couple of years ago to now?
never do it now? they did it all the time for trump when he was passing record deficits and record debts and biggest budgets. i don't understand. this is so confusing. plus, the fbi ramps up the investigation into the disappearance of 22-year-old gabby petito. agents have now searched the home of her fiance, who has gone missing. we'll have the latest on that case. and we'll get a live report from the united nations ahead of president biden's remarks to world leaders this morning. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪♪ i can make an indoorsy person, outdoorsy. i can turn anyone into a beach bum. i make memories for people i don't even know yet. i am a vrbo host. ♪ ♪ what the world needs now... is people. people who see healthcare a little bit differently. where technology helps doctors provide more precise care...
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[ laughter ] i didn't expect that reaction, but that's okay. >> then president trump at the united nations back in 2018. today president biden will address the u.n. general assembly for the first time since taking office. along with joe, willie and me, we have white house reporter for the associated press, jonathan lemire. and washington editor at aussie media, katty kay. let's jump right into the news. the president arrived in new york yesterday afternoon and held a bilateral meeting with the united nations secretary-general. this morning the president is scheduled to deliver remarks at 10:00 a.m. a senior administration official tells reuters, the president's speech will stress ending the military engagement in afghanistan will open a new chapter in the, quote, intensive diplomacy. after iz had speech, the president is scheduled to meet with australian prime minister
scott morrison, before returning to washington to meet with prime minister boris johnson. ahead of that meeting, he spoke with nbc's savannah guthrie. >> do you the president is too stubborn about the total withdrawal by this date from afghanistan? >> what i can tell you is certainly that he took a view and america has done that for 20 years. it's a respectable argument to say that enough is enough. you can't endlessly subcontract the government of your country to other people. there's got to be some sort of system -- >> do you agree with the decision? sounds like you do. >> could we have done it a bit differently? maybe we could. >> you know, that's interesting, katty. we heard our allies were all opposed -- or many of them disappointed in the way the united states left afghanistan.
there it sounds like the prime minister is far more understanding of joe biden did, deciding to leave afghanistan after 20 years than many of us domestic opponents. >> there were a lot of members of the prime minister's own party who were very outspoken, and some of them we had on msnbc even, who disagreed with the way the americans withdrew from afghanistan, believed much more effort should have been made before the withdrawal of american troops to get u.s. allies out and nato and coalition allies out, and they didn't like the way it was handled. there were members of his own party that didn't like the withdrawal at all and felt that some remanent of american forces should have stayed there with european forces to try to mount a campaign to get coalition forces to say there even without the united states, believed the commitment should carry on. the prime minister himself was always more ambivalent about that position. even at the time of it,
reluctant to criticize joe biden for pulling out at all and even more reluctant to criticize the president for the way it was handled. he was more mute than those scenes of people clinging to the aircraft carriers in kabul's airport. and first of all, he's about to go to the white house today to meet the president. it's not worth to try to say rude things about president biden just before you walk into the oval office for a much-treasured one-on-one meeting, something the prime minister definitely wants. you don't disyour host before you go there. you might say it behind closed doors, if at all. and the prime minister has this conference coming up in glasgow in november and he wants president biden on his side. the priority for boris johnson now is trying to get a result of the climate conference coming
up, and the person who he needs to get that result is joe biden. so he's going to do everything he can, interviews before the meeting and during the meeting, to make sure he's on the same team as joe biden. >> it seems to me, katty, a lot of people are drawing false equivalencies with joe biden and his relationship with our nato allies and donald trump. of course, donald trump declaring work basically against teresa may, mocking her, rid crueling her, doing the same thing with angela merkel, getting into a grip-and-grin challenge with macron. we can get into the list, nothing off the president of luxembourg. the insults and slights go on and on. and the president has offended france and hopefully he can fix that. is there really any equivalence
between what donald trump, what his relationship was with our allies at nato and missteps joe biden's had the first nine months of his presidency? >> real equivalence, no. and a lot of that is about style. but here are the guy as president who spent decades on capitol hill, 12 years in the foreign relations committee, vice president eight years, knows half of the world leaders and expectations were perhaps disproportionately high among allies when joe biden came into office. we had a total change not just in the american language of donald trump, not just the style of donald trump, but perhaps in the policies themselves. and that's where some american allies in europe may have been overly optimistic, a little naive perhaps. americans will put their interests first. if it wants to get out of
afghanistan, it's going to get out of afghanistan. if it wants to do a deal with the nuclear submarines to take a poke at china and that anows the french, it's going to do that. that's the way superpowers work. that's the way nations work. you're supposed to stand up for your own self-interests. is it a little surprising the degree to which the biden administration has had some collateral damage in both of those actions simply by not i forming allies, by calling them beforehand, giving them a heads up, acting a little more diplomatically? i think that's what surprised allies. it is a very different mood -- joe biden going up to the united nations today to give that speech is a quantifiably different mood for europeans than when he went to cornwall not that long ago, it's great to have you back, we're happy to have you, joe, that's kind of gone. it's self-interest to act the way it did but perhaps more effort can be taken by this white house to make sure there's
less collateral damage amongst its allies. >> as you know, the white house said it's surprised by this reaction to the nuclear deal with australia. and france said we're surprised you're surprised. we're one of your strongest allies. you pulled the rug out from under us and effectively canceled this other deal we had with australia. joe biden did announce yesterday the lifting of a travel barn to foreign visitors from the united states if they can show proof of vaccine. that will appease europeans for sure. but what is his view here when he steps up to the microphone at the u.n.? >> as katty said at the g7 back in june, biden was hailed as return to normalcy, biden with european leaders. there's a picture of french president macron giving him a hug on the beach. he's not there this week but if he was, he would probably not give him a hug. but they are scheduled to speak
in the next several days from the white house, as you just said. and european diplomats have been pushing that for a while, saying this needs to happen. the european president is trying to do a few things, fence mending, and the afghanistan withdrawal, which was widely unpopular among allies. he will say this is a new era of focus. i will rally people by the threat posed by china. we will see how explicitly he does that. and that's polarizing too because they have more business with the u.s. than china does. and the pandemic, vaccines. tomorrow piggybacking off the general assembly's peach today, they're convening a world summit of world leaders to push for
more vaccines to countries across the globe that don't have any. but that comes with scrutiny too for countries trying to push for boosters for its own people, getting a third shot before americans and the rest of the world had a first dose. he has work to do. he's not going to get laughed at but the reception will be cooler than you would have thought a few weeks ago. still ahead -- more on the fight against covid and new move by the white house to ease one of the tough restrictions that started early last year. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪♪ one, two! one, two, three! only pay for what you need! with customized car insurance from liberty mutual! nothing rhymes with liberty mutual. only pay for what you need.
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the biden administration is easing restrictions on international travelers wanting to come to the u.s. starting in early november, foreign nationals will be allowed to fly into the u.s. if they show proof of being fully vaccinated and negative covid test within three days of their flight. the cdc will also require airlines to collect information for u.s.-bound travelers, including phone numbers and email addresses for contact tracing. unvaccinated americans who are traveling back to the u.s. will have to show proof of a negative test within one day of their flight. as for the possibility of a vaccination requirement for domestic air travel, white house covid coordinator jeffrey zion said nothing is off the table. willie? meanwhile, covid now has killed more americans than the 1918 spanish flu pandemic. that's according to data
compiled by johns hopkins university. cdc estimates the spanish flu killed about 675,000 americans, nearly 680,000 now died from coronavirus to date. this month more than 32,000 deaths have been recorded, compared to about 28,000 in august. right now the united states is averaging about 2,000 deaths per day. so, joe, with all of the caveats about adjusting for population growth over this last century, that is a staggering number just to stop and absorb if you think about where we were, some of the estimates in february or march of last year, it calls to mind all of the people who said this is just the flu. the numbers show it's fewer cases and deaths than the flu. now we passed the 1918 pandemic in terms of deaths. just a breathtaking number. >> it is breathtaking when you consider that 100 years later we had -- we had all of the
advantages that americans didn't have in 1918. we had a record-setting vaccine as far as time goes, to get a vaccine out in less than a year, nobody expected that to happen. we had the best science in the world, best doctors in the world, and yet what did dr. gottlieb say, one of the things our public health officials could never imagine, that americans wouldn't follow their instructions. that americans wouldn't listen to their families doctors, that they would read facebook's pages of conspiracy theories instead of listening to their family doctors. that they would read websites that are put out by chinese religious cults. instead of talking to the family doctor that had been vaccinating their children and them in some
cases for a generation, but they didn't. so it was willful ignorance that actually put us in a position now where we're doing worse, more than americans dyeing than even died during the spanish flu of 1918 and we're coming up, if we haven't already passed it, to the number of americans that have died from covid-19 than died in the civil war, our bloodiest war. and, you know, we learned yesterday too with that news out of alabama, mika, that this actually ended up being much worse than the flu. this wasn't just doctors making money by signing covid as the cause of death. i have all of my friends -- not all of my friends but a lot of my friends that say oh, you can't really trust everything they're saying about covid. it's just the media that's
ginning it up. here we are more people died and more people died in alabama that were born. that's the first time that's ever had in the history of that state. so it's a lot worse than the flu, guys. this has nothing to do with doctors signing on pieces of paper and hospitals. it has nothing to do with any of your stupid conspiracy theories. your stupid conspiracy theories that are killing you, your families, your communities. i mean, stop listening to the conspiracy theories. i'm not asking you to listen to dr. fauci. if you're too political to listen to dr. fauci, if your mind so too twisted by all of the lies that facebook has shown you and politicians have told you, just go talk to your family doctor. ask your family doctor if he or
she is getting the vaccine. i'll tell you what if they're among the 95%, 96% out there, they'll tell you that they have. you should too. not for any political reason, but we care about you. we want you to be care. we want your family to be okay. we really do. listen, i'm sure you know somebody who's died of covid. it is a horrible way care -- we don't get any points. i don't get any points. my side doesn't get any points if you take care of it's good for your family. it's good for your schools. it's good for your community. it's good for small businesses. i want small business owners, i want family restaurants that had been around for generations to stay open. i don't want there to be another surge this fall. take care of yourself and talk to your family doctor.
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it, and the reasons joe just stated, the willful ignorance and incredibly selfishness in this country with 65 million people saying we don't want to get vaccinated. we're going to continue to provide fertile ground for the virus to spread, continue to mutate, it will be more resistant against vaccines and what are you going to do about it? it's incredibly frustrating. we have a way out of this pandemic, get vaccinated. and a certain percentage of the population that are just saying no. >> and the frustrating part of that -- and correct me if i'm wrong -- right now younger children are not vaccinated so they could really be passing it around to others, so it's either breakthrough cases for those who are vaccinated which are not as bad but for those unvaccinated, it's life-threatening? >> right. no, when the virus came into
this country last february, children accounted for about 3% of cases. the now they account for 27%. i was on service last week and our hospital was dealing with many, many patients, including children in the intensive care unit with this virus. this is now a disease of children. we had 250,000 cases the last week in this country, 200,000 cases the week before that. we need to protect our children. the frustration is a lot of the children we saw were greater than 12 years of age. they could have gotten a vaccine. but all of those who were quite ill with that virus had not gotten the vaccine, nor had their parents. it's frustrating. we talk about booster doses, the need for booster doses. what we need to do is get people their first two doses with the mrna vaccines. it was hard enough last year to watch children suffer and this year it's harder in that it's preventable. >> dr. offit, let's stay with children and the news yesterday from pfizer that its vaccine for
5 to 11-year-olds is highly effective. they will look for emergency use authorization here in the next few weeks we understand. what do you think that does to this pandemic? the fear, of course, is the 70 million to 80 million who don't get vaccinated. if they don't take a vaccine for themselves, they're sure as heck not going to give it to their children. what do you expect the news, if we get an authorization from the fda to begin use anyway, what does that do to change the trajectory here? >> i think we need about 90% of the population to be immune from natural infection, immunization or both. so i think we need to vaccinate our children, and they account for 28% of the population. it's important. so we will look at the data generated by pfizer. now we're in an era of science by press release so i know as much as you do, one-page press release that talks about that data. optimistic on the vaccine for children.
but if you look at children between 12 to 15, only 40% have been vaccinated. having the vaccine is not good enough. we have to give the vaccine. it is frustrating. we're coming into a time now where you have a completely susceptible population of children less than 12 years of age who are all going to be in one place with the delta variant highly transmissible, heading into the winter months where the virus is more easily transmitted because it's cooler and drier. it's a recipe for disaster. the sooner we can get a vaccine, the better. but it does not good if you don't get it. doctor, thank you very much. coming up -- what wecan expect from president biden's address to the blernl ji. jeffrey bennett is standing by with more on "morning joe." ♪♪
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the massive camp of haitian migrants near the texas state line is slowly shrinking. some of the thousands are now in shelters. others have been deported back to haiti. but this morning nbc learned as many as 20,000 additional migrants in colombia are considering making the same trip. let's bring in nbc news correspondent morgan chesky, who joins us live from the border in del rio, texas. morgan? >> mika, good morning. overnight u.s. officials confirming they are keeping a close eye on several large groups of haitian migrants in central and south america that may be making the trip north to this very border, although it remains to be seen when and if that will be making place. where in del rio, humanitarian
is var from over. this morning massive crowds of people living at this makeshift camp at the texas border bridge starts to thin, new questions about the response by authorities as images surface of border patrol agents on horse bac, appearing to use their horses reins like whips to turn migrants back to mexico. sources calling it a tool to keep agents safe. the white house denouncing it. >> i don't think anyone who's seen that footage would think it was acceptable or appropriate. >> reporter: some 10,000 remain in del rio, most haitian. down from a surge of 13,000 over the weekend. federal authorities have already flown hundreds back to haiti, busing thousands more to processing centers. homeland security secretary alejandro mayorkas in texas monday defending the federal response. were there enough in place for this surge? >> i don't think we expected the repetitivety of the increase that occurred. we are now leading the challenge.
>> reporter: overnight the republicans blaming president biden for the influx and for failing to respond in time. >> you can't go around for months arguing there's not going to be any border security and creating the perception and reality people can enter the country and they can get to stay and not expect for thousands of people to come. >> reporter: federal officials now sending a message to anyone else considering the journey. >> if you come to the united states illegally, you will be returned. your journey will not succeed and you will be endangering your life and your family's lives. >> reporter: and dhs officials stressing not everyone will be deported from this group, saying they're going to be focusing on single haitian adults and new york.that do
geoff, good morning. the president has work in front of him today. >> willie, good morning. he does. as you know a speech before the u.n. general assembly is the highest-profile opportunity for a president to lay out his foreign policy agenda, and in speaking with white house officials, we can expect president biden to share a familiar message and that message is america is back. that's what he spent much of this past summer on during his first presidential visit to europe telling allies, who also say alliances are the backbone of who we are. that really is the foundation, the frame for his remarks in which he will talk in depth and in detail about a couple things. one being covid, the other being climate change. on covid, expect him to try to rally world ambition, world cooperation around increasing
the pace of vaccinations. you will remember it was just last week the world health organization criticized the initial u.s. plan to make boosters available, effectively giving americans a third voes of the covid vaccine before much of the world has received the first dose. the biden administration immediately pushed back saying there's enough availability to vaccinate the rest of the world and give americans the shot at the third dose of the shx. the white house making clear america has given more access and paid for more covid shots than any other industrialized nation. on climate change we heard the president say before over the next two decades he wants to make this country, the world in effect, carbon net zero by the yeart that requires the u.s. to work with geopolitical foes like china to accomplish that goal. here in the u.s. much of the climate policy is wrapped up in the social spending bill, reconciliation bill, $3.5
billion proposal on capitol hill that stalled. that in itself has become a complicating factor in the discussions here. lastly the president will talk about u.s. credibility, trying to reaffirm u.s. credibility. of course, there was that public spat with the french, the diplomatic dustup over the national security agreement among the u.s., uk and australia. the french felt as if they were cut out of that agreement and didn't have access for what would have been for them a lucrative military deal. you can expect those conversations to continue. and then there are allies who are frustrated with the the way the end of the afghanistan commitment, u.s. commitment in afghanistan ended up and you can expect the president to say closing the chapter on afghanistan, moving away from that, allows the u.s. to focus on what the white house sees as more intensive diplomacy, willie. >> and those remarks come about 80 minutes from now at the u.n. nbc's geoff bennett live outside the u.n. in new york. thank you very much. north korea's foreign minister is warning president
biden's nuclear submarine deal with australia could trigger what it's calling nuclear arms race in the pacific region. nbc news senior international correspondent keir simmons joins us from london. you spoke with one of the leading politicians there and saying the irrigation with kim jong-un is exploding. explain that, if you would. >> that's right. we're not paying enough attention to the continuing nuclear threat from north korea. we will see if president biden mentioned it today. we've seen the nuclear site producing nuclear-grade uranium again. now president song you could say is the second most important politician in the southwest, a mix of nancy pelosi and chuck schumer. what he's warning in thint view is the north koreans are developing nuclear missiles and
>> and he said the first step should go to topi blinken and the united states should offer humanitarian relief. the other aspect when we talk about china, we often forget to talk about the north korean aspects of this. clearly the chinese might democrat from being able to play peacemaker. that would be leverage for them in any crisis with the north koreans. now president song suggests on the other hand if america can drive a wedge between america and north korea, they can get the north koreans on side. now, there are many people who would criticize that perspective and that kind of view from south koreans like president song and say it isn't realistic enough. will? >> yeah, and we expect to hear a lot about china when the president delivers his remarks at the general assembly a short time from now. nbc's keir simmons in london. thank you very much, as always. mika? now to the showdown over the nation's debt limit. in a bid to force bipartisan cooperation, democrats are now
planning to attach an extension of the nation's borrowing limit to a bill that funds the government. time is of the essence. congress has until next thursday to fund the government or risk a shutdown and the treasury's department said the debt limit will be breached some time in october if it's not lifted, which could disrupt the u.s. economy. but republican minority leader mitch mcconnell still insists democrats handle the debt creting themselves, even though democrats worked with republicans to raise it during the previous administration. >> since democrats decided to go it alone, they will not get senate republicans' help with raising the debt limit. this isn't about the past, it's about the future. and democrats want to build a partisan future without our input. so democrats will not get bipartisan facilitators for their purely partisan spending
binge. >> but mcconnell's stance may not represent all reasons. louisiana senator john kennedy told reporters he will, quote, probably vote yes on the bill. let's bring in msnbc contributing mike barnicle and pulitzer-prize winning columnist and associated editor of "the washington post" and msnbc political analyst eugene robinson. i will talk to both of you. gene robinson, what's going on here? and mike barnicle, follow up with what you think of this. gene? >> mitch mcconnell and the republicans are being deeply irresponsible, despite what leader mcconnell said. it is about the past. this is about spending that's already been approved and authorized and has had borrowing taking place. the debt limit simply has to be raised, and it's irresponsible to even suggest the possibility
that it wouldn't be. republicans do this all the time. they played chicken with the debt limit. and i think, you know, democrats should just use reconciliation, take the debt limit off the table permanently. what we need is a permanent fix here. this should not be an occasion for this regular brinksmanship that rattle financial markets and threatens to upend the economy needlessly, absolutely needlessly. it is ridiculous. >> you know, gene is absolutely right, mica, but we should all just take a pause and imagine what the president of the united states is about to do. in about 75 minutes at the united nations here in new york city, he is going to address a world fractured at so many different levels over the past two or three years, fractured by covid, fractured by
international alliances that have become tenuous because of ridiculous things like the french basically trying to spend $98 billion on technology that would be outdated as soon as the submarines are delivered. and look what's happening in this country, look at the border we just covered, look at the contentiousness in the united states senate, look at the facts mitch mcconnell, the minority leader in the united states senate, is basically holding the american economy hostage, hostage to his politics. and that's all the president has on his mind as he steps up to the plate to address the united nations. would you like to be president? not me. >> well, we'll be carrying that speech live right here on msnbc, as we look forward to president biden's address before the united nations. that happens today. a lawsuit has been filed against a texas doctor who violated the state's ban on performing abortions after a
heartbeat can be detected, launching the first test of the constitutionality of the new law. san antonio doctor allen brig, who announced his violation in a "washington post" opinion piece on saturday, is being sued by oscar stilly, who describes himself in the complaint as a, quote, disbarred and disgraced former arkansas lawyer. "the washington post" reports stilly said he filed a climb not because of the strongly held views about reproductive rights but in part because of the $10,000 he could receive if the lawsuit is successful. stilley said in an interview, he is not personally opposed to abortion but thinks the measure should be suggest to judicial review. dr. braid declined to comment on the suit. geep, perhaps if someone else filed suit but the bottom line
is the case is going to now -- it is going to be borne out before judges who will take a look at what has happened here, and it might actually have a positive outcome for reproductive rights. >> well, it might. it's hard to tell. especially hard to tell with the ultimate arbiter being this supreme court. >> right. >> but this law should never have been allowed to take effect. it's a vigilante law. it empowers citizens to act as vigilantes in enforcing the law in a way that is deeply un-american and i think it has to be constitutional, has to be in violation of statutes as well as constitutional provisions but we will see. i will expect that there will be lower court federal judges who find many, many problems with
this law, and we will see what happens as it works its way up. hopefully somebody, maybe the first judge, will just call a halt to the law pending further review and end this sort of nonsense. roe v. wade is not the law of the land anymore in texas. yet it is the reigning precedent for the united states. that's a contradiction that has to be resolved. >> you know, mika, gene just used the word that is so appropriate in this country today, hopefully. hopefully instead of continue to fracture our country on a day by day, hour-by-hour basis, someone, group of people who step up to the plate and try to hold this thing together, this thing we call american democracy because it slips through the fingers of our grandchildren, because it will indeed happen if we don't stop it right now.
the fbi believes it has located her body in the grant tee ton national forest and has yet to confirm that. nbc news correspondent catie beck joins us from north port, florida, where the investigation has led authorities. catie, good morning. >> reporter: good morning, willie. yeah, state investigators say that an autopsy is expected later today to potentially determine the identity of that body, as well as a cause of death. this investigation is widening and focusing now on the missing fiancée, brian laundrie. this morning a cross-country investigation is under way. authorities searching for evidence in the gabby petito case, while trying to track down her fiancée, brian laundrie, who has been missing for a week. on monday fbi agents scoured the florida home of laundrie's parents where gabby and brian also lived, declaring it a crime scene. the family escorted from the house as investigators took photos in the backyard around a
storage shed. even towing a vehicle from the driveway. authorities suspended a search in a dense wildlife area where laundrie's family told them brian went for a hike last tuesday. days later a body believed to be petito's was discovered in wyoming. >> we continue to seek information from anyone who utilized the spread creek disbursed camping area between the dates of august 27th and august 30th. anyone that may have had contact with gabby or her boyfriend. >> our plan for today is to just hang out. >> reporter: the couple has spent months on the road together, posting upbeat content on social media about their van-life adventure. but on august 12th witnesses in utah called 911, reporting a dispute. >> we drove by and the gentleman was slapping the girl. >> reporter: a short time later footage from police body cameras captured petito appearing distraught. >> we have been fighting all morning and he wouldn't let me in the car before. >> reporter: according to a
newly released affidavit filed by north port police, the responding officer in utah described it as a mental health crisis, not a domestic assault. the case has fascinated people nationwide, with many amateur sleuths sharing tips and spreading theories online, including on tiktok where the gabby petito hashtag has gone viral, viewed more than 500 million times. laundrie who has not been charged with a crime has refused to speak with police, citing the advice of a lawyer. he is also not reached out to gabby petito's family in any way. according to her father who sat down with "dateline." >> there is no way that you come home on a trip with the love of your life, you've been in a van for two months and you tell no one. you don't answer phone calls, your parents don't answer calls, no one says nothing. >> reporter: now, investigators
say they are going to be heading back out to that vast reserve today, willie, to go search again for laundrie. they suspended that search yesterday. this is the area where laundrie's parents say he went for a hike last tuesday and never returned. investigators say this dense, thick, 25,000 acre area is going to be combed again today to see if they can find him. willie? >> nbc's catie beck in florida for us. thanks so much. mika? all right. some news this morning regarding the johnson & johnson covid vaccine. the drug maker reports those who receive its booster shot are better protected against coronavirus for a longer period of time. a booster dose of the j&j vaccine administered two months after the first shot increased protection up to 94%, effective against symptomatic illness in trial participants.
earlier this year the company said a single dose of its vaccine was 66% effective at protecting people from moderate to severe covid-19. so we will be watching that as well as news coming out about the shot for children by pfizer and when it could be available for children ages 5 to 11, which should really change the game. but let's -- let's talk about what's happening this morning. gene robinson, you're writing in the "washington post" about president biden's goals and how global warming needs to be front and center. >> yeah, and i think climate is one of the things he will talk about in his -- in his speech this morning to the u.n. general assembly. this is all leading up to the big climate summit in november and the u.n. has warned that, in fact, the nations have pledged to cut their carbon emissions, but even with what they've pledged to do, which is
ambitious and probably won't all be followed through on, even if they do everything they pledged to do, we're in for catastrophic warming by the end of this century. we have to do a lot more. we have to get serious about it. we have to get china and india serious about it and i think biden will talk about that this morning. >> and, mike barnicle, there's so much at stake which you laid out for us and you know joe biden personally. what can you bring to us in terms of how he's going to approach today or how he handles multiple stressors at one time? >> oh, good luck to him on that, mika. you know, he knows what we know. he knows that the world, the globe, is, as we speak of it, is an increasingly smaller frame of environment for everyone to live in. he knows that it's dominated by covid. the world is dominated by covid. he knows, as gene just pointed out that global warming poses an existential and a real threat actually to all of us in terms
of going forward, but he knows another big thing, that we have to calm things down politically. that the world needs to be more united in its goals and its goals on global warming and attacking the virus and getting this thing done. that's what he knows and i think that's what in part what he will try to do today. >> all right. that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. ♪♪ hi there, i'm stephanie ruhle live at msnbc headquarters here in new york city. it's tuesday, september 21st and this morning we are following several major stories around the globe. breaking news in the coronavirus fight to start. brand-new data about those one-shot johnson & johnson vaccines, as the u.s. death toll from covid surpasses more than the spanish flu. while in del rio, texas, the make shift migrant camp is slowly shrinking this morning as questions emerged about how officials