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tv   All In With Chris Hayes  MSNBC  November 5, 2021 12:00am-1:00am PDT

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had a bad in court. plus, the predictable freak out as the biden administration finally releases vaccine guidelines inside the company, as the world on climate for scotland. a major solution may already exist in a metal box in iceland. when all in starts right now. i good evening from new york, i'm chris hayes, on the night of the virginia gubernatorial election. votes are coming in, the field former president the united states leaves a statement, quote, all eyes on -- by the delay, trump was talking about fairfax county of course the most popular county in the state of virginia. we know, what he was doing. it's been five years driving conspiracy theories about voter fraud and there have been very real consequences that play out day by day by the sham on it in arizona, that was totally bogus and hilariously found joe biden actually won more votes than
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allegedly believed. to the current republican scheme to collect every voter in the state personal information, to order some proof -- there are ways in which trump was actively undermining the democracy calling state and local election officials pressuring them to find the. votes to overturn the election results, or endorsing candidates for secretary of state. in key swing states, to support his true claims of the stolen election. all in which this is to say, we know what donald trump means when he sent out one of his non tweet statements on election night saying, all eyes are on the heavily democratic county. municipalities have been setting the groundwork for days. in fact the day before the election, trump said, quote, we must win bigger than the margin of fraud by flooding the polls with both the believe in american first. the sentiment, former speaker of the cambridge, fox news. >> reporter: what if it's really tight?
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>> [inaudible] >> you can't afford to have a really tight election. you have to win by a big enough margin so that you can't steal. >> this is casual. -- it didn't stop there during the youngkin, rally in virginia. country singer john rich reportedly said, quote, why the hell is d.c. eric firms in virginia, what is, that what is she doing up here? we know what she's doing up here, she's working on. it do you really think california voters for gavin newsom again? i don't think. so stacey abrams was probably out there too. so, there was a lot of supposed concern in trump world about quote stealing the election leading up to it and then nothing. none of the alleged fraud ever materialized, because of course republican glenn youngkin won the race. and according to trump's allies, the election, there is only illegitimate, when democrats went, up it is that heads on, win tails you lose theory of american politics. and there's this interesting angle in virginia, which is a
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state that has a 45-day window of early voting including no excuse effort by mail. a policy which, if you remember, since the 2020 election, was kind of a problem according to many republicans. in, fact one republican senator tried to overturn the results of our free and fair election to put the loser in over the winter, against the will of the american people, he specifically, sided, mail-in ballots in the state of pennsylvania, and the reason. of course, holly is not concerned about that. now because he won. yes, obviously it's a good thing that republicans are not making bogus claims on election fraud but it is worth taking a moment to just think about what would've happened if the democrat, terry mcauliffe said, he got a win. by a few thousand votes. trump and his allies were transparently -- claiming that the election was wig, and if they want to quote the election they would be with their supporters in a frenzy right now is back to you. with protests outside of the
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election headquarters, like we saw for the 2020 election. maybe trump would even attempt to pressure republican glenn youngkin to resign in fact we are seeing something like this play on a much smaller scale in new jersey. where the democrat phil murphy did barely defeat his republican challenger in an election that was much closer than anyone ever predicted, was including acting land homeland security an attorney ken cuccinelli, are pushing these very trump conspiracies about the votes in new jersey. now we are not seeing the full trump effort to overturn the will of voters as i expect because new jersey is a very blue state, republicans did not expect to win, that there wasn't the sense of, oh it was stolen, it was so revved up about, it and he won anyway. but they're still very much an effort by him to claim the election was rigged. which they respectively do every time a republican loses. and again, it would be easy to dismiss it as the whining and
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controlling of losers or paranoid delusional people, but. the problem is it comes from trump all the way down to create the unsustainable equilibrium that we have in our politics. when democrats lose, they acknowledge defeat, everyone was, on when republicans, lose the democrats cheated, the election was stolen, iron tire democratic politics isn't legitimate. and there is of, course ever since january six, always a specter of a violent mass move in for a full ledge insurrection to overturn the results. just because a republican candidate lost. and that is part of a broader problem which is the conservative problem of the hole, essentially getting radicalized in its face against the very pillars of representative democracy. one of those pillars, until relatively recently was of course the voting rights act, one of the greatest achievements in the history of our democracy. it prohibited recently discriminating voting laws which is only necessary because the amendment that had done
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that and the 15th amendment was just violate, it also dramatically increase black voters participation in the south. it prohibited race voter laws and as you've seen the charred it increased black voter participation. just look at this graph. the orange bars are black voter registrations before the berry was, past the blue bars represent representation after. almost instant, look at that. the law has been slowly gutted by chief justice supreme court over the last few, years and for some context, in the not so distant past, reauthorizing the b, are used to always be a bipartisan non controversial enterprise. in 2000 and, six none other than senator mitch mcconnell, kentucky, was in favor of it. republican george bush signed into law, and made a show of. it will not democrats are trying to restore the law to basically what it was before the supreme court of john roberts caught his hand on it and what they are proposing is called the john lewis voting
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rights advancement act. named after the late congressman. -- who shed blood in the battle for people participation for black americans in our democracy. democratic side trying to fill the hole for the supreme court -- for a number of voting rights bills, and now republicans will nothing to do with. it in fact, when the jaundice bill came up for a vote yesterday, the same mitch mcconnell with votes with authorization tried to argue the new law with -- >> -- senator democrats make a another chance of robbing the new power in the election. rather than congressional democrats trying to grab all the power for themselves they are instead trying to pull off the power grab on behalf of the democratic attorney general, instead of watching democrats in the legislative branch seizing power of elections in the country it will be watching democrats and the executive
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branch. >> i mean, of course that argument is that if you prove too much you can pick the same thing for the 1965 voting. right maybe mcconnell thinks that those criticisms deserve a right to. >> notice how michelob does not engage with the actual bill, he just tries to reframe it to some scary takeover of the election. one republican ultimately supported that legislation yesterday, one. there are 50 republicans in the senate. only senator murkowski supported the most basic of voting rights protection. republican parties increasingly radicalized against democracy to create a situation in which they can compete for elections and use the constitutional advantage that they have in the sudden intellectual -- which are significant. growing and the use that they control to make voting harder will also make people believe that voter fraud is ramp it. we can see it play out all over the country. in north carolina, north carolina they are pushing to
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squeeze out any democratic opposition. in florida, republican sent this once a set of an office they're also pretty transparent to intimidate people who might vote for democrats. >> we are going to create a separate office at the state level solely dedicated to investigating and prosecuting election crimes and the state of florida,, the first person that gets caught, no one's want to do it again after that. because they know they are going to be consequences. >> that is clearly a mini desantis campaign. most importantly there is no widespread voter fraud in florida, or anywhere else in this country for that matter, what desantis is doing is flatly in attempt to intimidate and scare people to not voting. think of, it people may have criminal records. maybe i'm sure.
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i am no lawyer, but it's worth noting that among the many provisions of the voting rights act is an explicit ban on intimidating people who are attempting to vote. >> the senior reporter is cornell belcher, democratic poll turned strategists with the inside in the future of the democratic party in the light of tuesday's ongoing election shenanigans, he joins me now. let me start with you, ari berman, on the descendants announcement which outlet level is a stunt. but another really strikes me as essentially intimidation. saying, we're going to make a example of the first person caught,. it's saying we're going to try and senate siege to make people scared of voting. >> exactly. it is just the further weaponization of the big lie. remember, desantis already signed a sweeping voter suppression bill as an exclusive on fox and friends. so they already made it harder
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to vote. and now he is announcing a whole other unit that seems, as he, said on this propaganda, could also have a chilling effect on voter participation. and remember, chris, republicans created the entire system of elections in florida. so there essentially really against the system that they created. they created, job office, they created no 2000 voting, they created all of the election law hunt that they are now saying aren't enforced and so it gets to what you are saying earlier which is that if the voting system works for them, they are for. it but if it doesn't work for them, they are suddenly against it and they're saying the election is ring. but i think the clear through rhymes to all of this is that this keeps doubling down more and more on voter suppression, even when it doesn't seem to be in their political interest. >> yes, we should know that desantis said, i don't even think that we should have drop boxes, even though he signed the bill two years ago that force authorize the use of the
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state. they should talk to the people that created these rules, which are of course, republicans. there is also the fact, cornell belcher, this is something i've been bringing on about, i don't think anyone listens to me, but i'll just say it again -- republicans are -- well you listen to, me thank you cornell. republicans are fully capable of winning high turnout elections. this idea that, having, making it easier to vote -- but they just won in virginia. it's a state that just did all the, stuff in 45, days with no excuse. and they want. there it is not like it has some crystal clear advantage to make it easier for people to vote. >> yes, and no, there's a couple things on, that one is that when you look at the targeted effort that republicans have been doing in some of the states, it does this impact voters especially in urban areas, it does unfortunately impact voters who are younger and voters of
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color. people that the quite frankly -- that is not to the benefit that easy to vote. and another part about the fifth lie, it's about turnout. -- [inaudible] it is almost the perfect instrument for them. because one, as we know the big lie is about -- a republican base energizing to. and we see this as a ramp up and they get energized by the by it and the other thing is for a political party, when they do, you will have an enthusiast and energized voters. the big lie in doing, that is perpetuating that these people are stealing your country. these people are taking your country, what are you going to do about? it and as opposed to -- well i saw quite frankly that the research after the bush fight where i saw a lot of democrats thinking, my vote doesn't matter because they'll
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just steal it or take it away. republicans are actually having an opposite impact on. and the idea that something has been taken away from, them is actually energizing. them that is one. to, it also lays the predicate, and you see what desantis is. doing it lands down a predicate for suppression efforts that they then went to belong. top so the big lie is powerful on multiple fronts. and my question for democrats is simply this, if they get, energize around the idea that the idea of the big lie and lose them to take away our franchise is why the heck can't we use it as a re-visit to energize democrats to something bigger and say. you know what the next election is? about it's about having democracy saving our democracy can we energize our voters around that so that we can energize them around the idea of what is good for policy and bridges and roads in broadband and certainly not energizing.
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oh that's interesting the idea that the service. purpose a spot on and in a bunch of states you're in florida and in texas want to ask you in a. moment when you ask for republicans while we need people to trust the system. so they create the distress. and they called the process as well, so today as the department of justice will now speak to suing taxes. the sort of similar in florida violates the voting rights and civil rights by composing restriction and the pulling locations, and through absentees and how important is this from the doj to texas. ? >> well i think that it's important lawsuit it's important though to remember that the challenges only to parts of the texas law, so there is about 20 parts of the texas law that make it hard to vote. so i am so concerned about the 18 other provisions of the justice department and these
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aside for one reason not to challenge though but they did also decide that with others that are already challenging this law. i think it is very clear that we are not going to litigate our way out of this mess. that if you look at the courses that we're gonna go through, this is going to go through conservative court justice, it's going to go to the conservative circuit in the country, but it is going to go to the supreme court at the voting rights act. and that is why it is so important to have federal legislation for protective voting rights, that is why they're such a big push for a new voting rights act and for the freedom to vote act. because we both need federal protections, that we want. tax but we also need a new baseline of support for voting rights and protection of voting rights no matter where you live. and that is going to be the way to solve this. just like in 1965, the justice is not going to out-litigate the full texas undersea tax, wasn't going to organize full texas in. -- they had to pass legislation to
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stop the problem of voter suppression. we are in that same kind of moving now where there is no substitute for congressional action on voting rights. >> all right ari berman, cornell belcher, but thank you both gentlemen, i appreciate it. >> today donald trump's executive privilege claim had their day in court when they had to start turning over evidence for the january six. what to make of the reporting that probe the trump work has a new grand jury. that's next. jury that's next. oral-b delivers the wow of a professional clean feel every day. re-entering data that employees could enter themselves? that's why i get up in the morning! i have a secret method for remembering all my hr passwords. my boss doesn't remember approving my time off. let's just... find that email. the old way of doing business slows everyone down. with paycom, employees enter and manage their own hr data in one easy-to-use software. visit for a free demo.
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hearing evidence about the trump organization. today the washington post reported that the manhattan district attorney has convened that a new grounders hear evidence about the organization and financial practices and vote on criminal charges. that is separate from the ground jury that has which -- recovered, that is the one that handed the those felony indictments against those two trump companies as well as the trump organization cfo, allan weisselberg. the pollsters reporting is unclear whether if that is still in evidence. a but now we are learning another. and that happened when the lawyers for donald trump for busy fielding another legal battle in d.c.. the house committee investigating january six is requesting documents from donald trump related to the insurrection. well from the national archives. and he is arguing that the materials protected by executive privilege. mind you, trump is not the executive in charge. president joe biden's. the white house has already said multiple times that
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privilege should not be invoked in this case. today, trump has his day in court, and while we have not heard a ruling of this case yet, the district court judge did not seem to strictly convinced by their argument. then we that is -- years ago we heard cases about the judge presiding on the, case because she is a public defender. and joyce alene, we is a former u.s. eternity for the northern district of alabama. glenn kirschner, let me start with. you just lay out what is the issue we are and what the argument is that the trump lawyers were making. >> so, the trump lawyers are desperately trying to find a reason to prevent the documents from going from the national archives over to the house select committee. these are documents and phone logs and handwritten notes and talking points that will in live in the house select committee about what donald trump was up to in connection with the attack on the capitol on january six.
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and i will say. i was in the courtroom for all of the argument and argument after argument being made by donald trump's lawyer it was just being shot down by judge danya. she was really having none of. it and one of the recurring themes that i found really interesting, is when the defense attorney would try to suggest that this somehow involves the sued between the other branches of government, she corrected him and, said actually, this is what she referred to as a rare instance of harmony between the other branches of government. because the executive branch is representative of president biden said he did not invoke executive privilege, so the executive branch wants the documents to go over and the legislative branches, represented by the house select committee obviously blocks to document from the national archives. so they're in agreement. and she came back to the scene a couple of times saying, it would actually be an improper interference by the third branch of government.
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and judiciary to interfere with which -- >> i will read one, section that lines up with, that in terms why their documents are involved. because the committee doesn't have them in power investigation. they can only seek material directly in the running of legislation. as she says the, releasing the presidents notes, and records of telephone conversation of january six have no bearing of the conversation of the investigation. that was her question i think, a relevant one. it is also -- the next question here of course is about what happens. because there is the merit and there is whether he can delay. so you can roll the merits that they've got no case, hair but you still stay turning over the documents and then it goes to appeal, it will probably go to scotus, and the question of how long that takes that becomes the point of all the litigation. >> that is, right and one has delaying not been top strategy in his reason for using litigation and going to court.
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but i think, there is at least a little bit of good news on that front. judge said that she would rule expedition lead. that is such a close the hearing. there was a little bit of back and forth between her. and the jade lawyer, elizabeth shapiro, said that she had ample time to roll in order to facilitate the first released by the national archives. that is scheduled around the middle of the month. then there are two more prompts since there's documents that will be released two weeks later. the judge sort of laughed at that and made fun about how busy her schedule was. but it was clear that she plans to rule in a way that would permit the release of documents and the only way that trump could get delay after that would be if he can convince the court of appeal to state the release of documents. that is one of the reasons today that the arguments have laid were so important. the doj lawyers, and the congressional lawyers, did a great job of pointing out that he would stop for no repayable
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injured threes. because he has no personal interest in these documents. he is no longer a sitting president. there is every reason to believe that the court of appeal won't issue any sort of stay at the end of the documents could be well released on schedule. >> that is a great point, and i hadn't quite thought of it in that way. i want to ask, you because i have you both here, about this new reporting, about this new grandeur. glenn, let me read from the washington post. one person familiar with the matter was expected to do a matter with how he valued offsets, that appears to be separate issues from the one that indictment incitements. what do you make of this? >> you know, the big question that we have to read here,, chris this is this a procedural matter? or is this a sub severe? matter sometimes one grand jury expires and we need empanel. rights so we can keep the investigation. going but ordinarily, if it has to do with one unitarian investigation. what we would do is extend the first grand jury so that we can maintain some consistency.
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so this has the feel of a substantive matter where they need to empower a new country. and sometimes the way that we do, that is because evidence has been heard by the first country that we don't want to be used as part as the indictment decision-making process, so we will present only what we want a second grand jury to hear before asking for an indictment. >> that is clarifying. joyce your thoughts? >> it's possible that there's a subset in reason for using a second grand jury, this looks to me more like it's procedural in the federal system are counters a lax along longer in the new york state system the grander suffers sort period of time it is more difficult to re-up. them this may simply reflect the time has run on the original grand jury that is empanel and we were expecting it to run out at some point this month or earlier next month. so i would be careful about reading too much into. this >> all right, we will see, we will find out at some point, it will be revealed very
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shortly. glenn kirschner, i joyce alene, they get both. just ahead, he proved that vaccine requirements are working. look no further than the nypd. the empty threats behind the right-wing freak out, after this. out, afte this [gaming sounds] just think, he'll be driving for real soon. every new chevy equinox comes standard with chevy safety assist, including automatic emergency braking. find new peace of mind. find new roads. chevrolet. when cities and counties across
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the country started mandating covid vaccine to police officers, firefighters and health care workers, i and teachers, many of the people who were forced to be vaccinated started openly threatening that they were going to walk out the job. [laughs] [noise] >> i know my employees very well, and i cannot lose five to 10% of my employees who will react to someone trying to impose something. >> right now, 45% of police officers are going unvaccinated. many of them are going to get vaccinated. i think what's going to happen on november 1st, is that they're going to have to close down 30 to 40% of the houses in new york city. >> all i can say is, we suspect
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the numbers are true. and we can get a large number of our members who stand firm on their belief that this is an overreach and they are not going to supply the information or submit the testing that we need. then it is safe to say, but the city of chicago, we'll have the police force at 50% less. >> that last, guy is the one who compared the vaccine mandate to the nazi chambers. >> the deadline for those came and, whenever really happen the way it said they would. look at new york city to just take one example. new york times reported in the 12 days when the mandate was force announce, and monday's deadline the vaccination rate shut up as many cities. the city's emergency medical services which operated ambulances, the vaccination rate jumped to 87% from 61. sanitation departments a vaccination rate jumped 20 points, to 82. the adult vaccination across
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new york city is at 86%. that is a pretty good boost in less than two weeks. brings those agency bases in line with the overall vaccination rate in the city. in fact, across all the city agencies, about 9000 employees have been placed on unpaid leave. that may scene like a lot. but keep in mind the city is over 3000 and 70,000 people on people. those 9000 people make up less than two and a half percent of the initial employees. i would've up police? well, fewer than three dozen uniformed officers have about 35,000 replaced on home paid leave on monday when the deadline expired. less than three dozen. 34 near cops were put on leave, out of 35,000. about port zero 9%. this isn't the case in the city where police union bosses have threatened that they will walk, out there's gonna be chaos on the, street and then you know what happens, they don't. they get the vaccine. like in seattle rusting ten,
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the police department warned that 27% of its officers did not get some of their vaccination records ahead of the city's deadline, when once the mandate was, in place about 176 police officers and firefighters combined were unable to report to work. the city both said 99% of interrupt the 11,000 employees were in compliance of the mandate, by the deadline. that is all this appears to work every time, once a mandate goes into place, things happen. an overwhelming majority of people get the shot. and those people left making all the noise of tyranny, refuting, you're just a tiny mired nor the of holdout. today, the biden administration announced new updates on how they are going to make workplaces favors from covid going forward. and all the same people are calling that tyranny. coming up, next we'll talk to one of the tyrants. don't go away. don't go away.
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back in september the biden administration announced a plan to get millions of more americans vaccinated against covid with new workplace safety rules mandating that all
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employers with more than 100 workers are required to be vaccinated or tested by the virus weekly. which affects about 80 million american city. the administration said that the deadline for that policy implemented. with that effective will affect nursing homes and other facilities that receive medicare funds, must ensure all employees are vaccinated by january 4th with no option for texting. it seemed like a very good ideas. a sound policy. also a huge undertaking. secretary marty walsh, implementing these workplace rules, and he joins me. now secretary waltz, first let's describe how the federal government has the authority to do this for these employers with 100 or more workers? >> the law enacted osha and flies this by putting it in state. this is not done lightly. lots of conversations have gone
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on it. i heard you previously say, and i've listen to folks concerns about being vaccinated, and quite honestly, what we want to do here, i know you did next me, this will get into it, but what we want to do is provide a safe workplace for workers. and for people going into. work and what this does is pretty simple. it does ask employers to have their employees vaccinated. and if their employees don't want to get vaccinated they get tested once a week, i want the and work, they wear a mask. >> there has been obviously some rebellion to this. and i think it is worth noting that there is a testing option which we can get into. but you are something whose background is in u.s. labor movement. there are some who have tried to say that this is anti labor, that it is an inquisition as the police from a boss, or workers rights, to their bodily health. >> i wouldn't call this anti worker. i think this is pro worker.
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this is pro-making sure that workers have the opportunity to go into a workplace that is safe. that they know. say that they'll be able to look on a list to see not names of people, but see how many people in the office are vaccinated, and how many people are getting tested on a weekly polices. and i think as an employee, as a worker, you want to make sure that you come home safe to your family tonight. and this is one of the ways that will be able to ensure that workers get a chance to come home safe and not potentially be worrying about the virus at work. i cannot speak to being in a grocery store, walking down the street, but again, the workplace is really important parts of our country. to make sure that people the opportunity to go to work and feel sick. they're >> the scope of this is enormous. i think it's 80 million workers estimated who will be covered by. this obviously there's a lot of employers who employ more than 100 people in this country. they have a lot of workers. just a department of labor have the capacity to enforce this to
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make sure this actually happens? >> yes. the department of labor has particularly done work like this over the last 50 years. so they certainly have the capacity for the next couple of weeks we are going to be working with companies and getting the information. quite honestly, i think a lot of the companies already with 100 or more employees already have some type of vaccine program. and a lot of times of the, mandate this is a vaccine testing. and i think this is something that a lot of the people who are anti vaccine will see who they don't want, it i wanted to take a deep breath, and hear what i'm saying here, because i think it's really important to understand, it is about keeping people safe. including, people who don't get vaccinated, to make sure that they're safe. >> and so, they would have to test once a, week and you said, wear a mask indoors, so it does -- it is a choice that is being offered. >> it is a choice. and a lot of people, there's some pushback from some truckers today, and the ironic thing, is most truckers, aren't
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covered by this because they're driving a, truck there in a, cab there by themselves, they wouldn't be covered by. this people working outside. i heard some constructions just got pushback on. this a lot of constructions outside again in an open environment, a lot of. them so i would suggest that as we think about this moving, forward when the president announced this in september, we were having high levels of delta variant at that particular moment, lots of people are getting, sick people were, dying and they still are every day today in america. but, he recommended, or ordered i, guess whatever you want to, khalid that myself and we come up with a standard a lot of work went into it a lot of thought went into it and i feel that it's a good well thought out plan here and we are going to hopefully get some positive feedback, but more importantly some positive results from it. >> the governor of florida ron desantis assume the precisely
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is issued by the department of labor by the new law and has claimed that the federal government has exceeded its authority, this is specifically on the federal contractors part of this which is a different part of the policy. are you confident that all the different aspects of the policy from health care workers to and players over hundreds to the contractors can pass judicial review. >> yes, we feel confident about. that as i said, it was well written. a lot of thought went into. it and i think it is important. and i just want to, say you know, when this pandemic begin, i spent a lot of time in msnbc and a lot of station as a mayor city of arkansas, and every time and get in front of the, camera and i talked about all the people that call covid-19, and i talked about all the people who have died and set a prayer for, them and this time went on, that number in united states of america has gone over 750,000 americans. they lost their lives to
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covid-19. 750,000 people. that every single day, people are getting infected with covid-19, we saw people on ventilators. this is about keeping people safe. this is about helping people. this is not about a political stand and when i hear that, i just kind of see myself, i think of myself -- and i think back to my days. mayor my responsibility of mayors boston was to keep people safe and healthy and businesses safe, and open, that is why my job as mayor. was not my job as secretary labor, is making sure we're protecting american workers so that they can go to work and be safe and feel safe. and again, i don't believe that we are overstepping our bounds here. there's options here for workers in this -- >> all right secretary of labor marty walsh, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> coming up is a hot magma sitting under iceland the key to stopping climate change, the brand-new facility in iceland taking steps to cool the
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planet. right after this. ght after this
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scotland to discuss solutions to the climate crisis there is a rare we invention for climate. a working fully operational carbon plant that just came online. right now, it is sucking carbon dioxide and turning it into rock. the plant is in iceland on a volcanic lava plane and here's outworks. those gripping things that looked like giant air conditioners, you might see on the roof of a building, those are the orca direct air capture devices. four units, each with two large fans inside, the second the, air and filled out the carbon dioxide. the co2's been heated up, mixed with water, and pump deep underground, which overtime it cools down into stone. not the whole plan is run by geothermal energy which is key, it doesn't contribute to the problem, it is attempting to solve. and it can remove 4000 tons of monoxide to the airport year by turning it into rock, which is
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great. but, there is an enormous catch as the new york times points. out the problem is that orca outputs three seconds, which are closer to 40 billion metric tons. we would need, many, many, many more carbon plants like this to start making any type of denting global admissions. but it is a very promising development in a time that we need every possible solution to the climate crisis to come online and deploy it as soon as possible. david wallace-wells editor, large and editor of the uninhabitable earth, and he joins me now. david, i'm going to just put this up again to highlight the catch here right. which is that we are talking about 3.8 seconds worth of global co2 admissions for this one plant, i don't want anyone to come away from this conversation being, like we got, it were solved. but that said, the future is going to involve all kinds of ways to get carbon out of the,
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air and there is something encouraging about seeing this thing that i've read about for a while, up in operate. and it is not even being done and in the same price. point there's a much more expensive than avoiding it in the first place which is there a lot of things that we should be attacking than just letting the carbon burn and then taking it out. but it is close enough to an operational, economical, level, that we can imagine for decades and 15 years from. now within the public, support and public, investment we can start filling it, up and seeing it operate better at a climatologically significant level. that would probably, mean growing it 1000 polls. or maybe 1 million polls over the next few decades. the scientists, i think, say that it is possible. it won't solve the problem with fossil fuels, we need to get rid of them to start with. but once we got rid of, them this will help us clean up what is called the residual mission. the really dirty industrial. stuff and maybe even after a century, it will allow us to undo some of the damage that
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we've done at this point in indenting the climate crisis out of. nothing >> and for those coming at the television that there is already a technology that does this which is called trees, you are correct. that is also true. and there is other parts of this sort of carbon quiet during part of it. the admissions, there is a carbon question part that is both soil and trees which is another huge win -- >> i think we can, agree we need to decarbonization around our solar energy system and we needed very quickly. we have all electric vehicles on the road, we need to rethink our agricultural production, our industry, our infrastructure. we need to do all of that on the decarbonization admissions. but given where we are, today we are also going to have to take some carbon out of the atmosphere. because carbon hangs in the air force entry. which means even if we get to zero, the climate will not get cooler, it will at best, stayed
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the same. and if we want to bring ourselves back to, you know, the climate that gave rise to the human life in the first, place i have enclosed -- we are going to have to remove quite a bit of carbon. that is hard to do with the expenses that we are. now this is sort of a pilot. plan but if you, imagine 75, 100 years from, not especially with all the public support, and there we can do. that we can restore the climate. not to stabilize. it >> the copd, the cup conference is happening in glasgow. i know you've been covering it. this is hard to follow. but if you think like legislating with the democratic majority on this is complicated, try getting all of the world countries to agree to stuff. but at the broadest level, what do you see as the main thing to look for in this conference? >> the thing that i'm most focused on is the green climate fund. which is a money pot set up in
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paris in 2015, to allow the rich nations of the world, who are responsible for the overwhelming majority of climate pollution, and i brought up to this crisis at this, point which is done twice as much damage than any other country in the world, those countries that are sort of an adaptation and mitigation effort in the developing world where people can afford it nearly as easily. that is when it was supposed to be 100 billion dollars a year, that number has not been met to this. point the development are screaming about. that they actually screening that at the level they need to be in support -- and i would like to see that happen. i don't think it's -- i think they are looking away from the suffering and because it's a great injustice. but what i would like to see come out of. it the real reckoning with the moral debt with the rich nations of the world all, that have done the least engineer for this, crisis and we're gonna be suffering in the decades. ahead >> yes you wrote a
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fantastic piece that i want people to read about climate reparation, and you write that the climate crisis a result of that history as is the wealth of nations. and this connects to something else that i find manning but also promising in a weird way which is, the physics are unrelenting and unforgivable. they are but they are. the molecules are in the air. the economics are more malleable, there is money out there, we could spend a lot more money than we are spending on, this there is hopefully a lot of money in this bill, but in some ways, there are limits on them for political reasons, but we could, we do have the power to spend much more money on this then we are currently doing. >> i almost think it's a mistake to think of it in terms of spending money. 90% of the world, now in places where clean and energy is -- which means it's non markets that are slowing. us --
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if we really unleash the longest they will tell you it will bring us more prosperity, and a more just equitable prosperity as soon as a decade or so from now if we undertook it now. but it's not a burden. we always thought it was a burn. it's really an opportunity. it's just one we're not letting ourselves undertake. and that is one point i would like to connect back to, is that all of these obstacles, all of these human political obstacles, not technological obstacles, these are the ones that are standing in the way of our advance of renewables. >> yeah. >> so if you aren't happy with how fast we are building out this solar, chances are, we are not going to be rolling out anything that -- we need to overcome those human obstacles, and not worry about economics or you know other technology. >> david walsh, who i always learn from on this topic. thank you so much. >> before you go, a quick note
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anna we just released this, week i had a chance to talk to someone who has had a front row seat to how the climate impacts are every day, life the great al rocker, on my news podcast. i have been watching all for basically my entire. life he was a genuine pleasure to talk to him about lots of. things whether, climate, honestly find a how he became the famous weatherman that he is. the episode is out right now wherever you get your podcasts. that is all in on this thursday. night rachel maddow show starts right now, good evening rachel. >> i am going to for sure listen to that. that sounds fantastic >> it's really. fun >> excellent. well then my friend,. thank you very much and thank you at-home for joining us this find there's evening. thursday night. also known here as the rachel maddow show as friday eve. yes. it's great to have you here. there's a lot going on tonight. you will recall exactly this time last night, this time on last night show, nbc news had just called the very closely thought new jersey governor's
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race. virginia and new jersey are the only two states that hold their governor races in a year like this, the odd numbered year right after a presidential election, they are the only two states that do, if they do it every four years, all the way back to the 1980, every year t the president has seen the governor loose his race bothe in virginia and in new jersey. that's the way the pendulum swings. president biden this week actually became the first newly elected president of the united states since ronald reagan to not fall prey to that curse. to not have his party lose bothe those governorships. biden's democratic party did e lose the virginia governor's ir race but they won in new jersey, which we found out this time last night, when nbc news made the call. well, that said, tonight within the past hour the republican candidate in new jersey, jack ciattarelli, has just posted a video on twitter saying he is not conceding that race. he does not think this is over. he says he has a team of lawyers