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tv   Morning Joe  MSNBC  November 29, 2021 3:00am-6:00am PST

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where they are right now. there will be a bigger push on this sort of among the pharmaceutical but above national governments and covax trying to get us out. >> hans nichols, thank you so much. as long as there were unvaccinated people, a new variant would emerge. we'll be staying with this story today, all day on msnbc. thank you for getting up way too early with us on this monday morning. get your shots and boosters. "morning joe" starts right now. >> senator cruz told the attorney general that you should be prosecuted? >> yeah. >> i have to be prosecuted. i have to laugh at that. what happens on january 6th, senator? >> new information on january 6th and this emerging omicron. latest on what americans need to
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know about the evolving threat. plus, what those covid concerns mean for the economy. >> good morning and welcome to "morning joe," it's monday, november 29th, i hope you had a good thanksgiving week. it's the 29th, what am i saying? happy monday everyone. as we look at country around the world scrambling to contain a
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new strain of a new strain of covid-19. omicron has spread to african countries and a number of nations. the variant reached north america with two cases appearing in ontario. president biden is expected to give the nation an update on his administrations response. members of tl white house covid-19 response team briefed the president yesterday and warned it could take two weeks before there is definitive information on the characteristics of the new variant. >> it exploded in the sense when you look at south africa, you were having a low level infection and all of a sudden there is a big spike. when the south africans looked at it oh my goodness, this is a different virus we have been
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dealing with. it has the capability of transmitting rapidly. that's the thing causing us to be concerned but also to put the pressure on ourselves now to do something about our preparations. >> inevitably, it will be here and the question is will we be prepared for it and preparations that we have ongoing of what we are doing with the delta variant needs to rev up. the bottom line is getting more people vaccinated and the vaccinated boosted. >> it seems responsible, does it? jonathan lemire, the biden administration moving quickly as the eu and a lot of other countries restricted travels from south africa, seven other countries started today. restrictions are also being added and several other countries. morocco is going to suspend all in coming flights and israel
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banned all foreign nationals from entering their country. japan followed suits. that's going start tomorrow. you know jonathan it's so fascinating. you go around the club and everybody say why don't we do things right this time and why don't we close our borders. why don't we from people in the affected areas, why don't we do tests and see how bad this actually is. maybe we need make it quite a change to some of the vaccines and make sure they have this experience and republicans are
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freaking out. ronnie jackson turns maga congressman tweeting quote "here comes the mev." let's just stop here for a second. they are blowing up and freaking out, they're acting crazier than usual. brian cross says this. these people are breathtakingly stupid. this theory holds one that scientist and literally every other country on the planet are apart of a democratic midterm
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plot. democrats believe the benefit from a surge of covid cases is joe biden. one republican who actually had a bad case of covid and went on cnn and talk about how terrible it was and she could not walk upstairs, it was horrible. >> the cdc has done no policymakers have done so far is taken into account of what natural immunity does. natural immunity gives you 27 times more protection than future covid infection than vaccinations. we need to take all of the
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science into account and not selectively. >> i can't hear about it. she told us she had a bad case of covid-19 the previous summer. it took her three months to recover and nine months later she's still was not 100%. i was going to say republicans have lost their minds. they have freaked out and the biden administration seems going step by step just like the eu and other countries being responsible while republicans freak out and say this is
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launched in a lab to help 20-25 members in congress to win a race next year. that must be news of the people in morocco wants to know their government's ban as well as israel to help some members and the tide water region of virginia. >> this is a pretty bad one and requires certainly a remarkable amount of global reach to pull off. these comments were not sensible and irresponsible from republicans. there is a lot we don't know about this variant and rattled the stock market and drove concerns among americans who gathered with families this weekend over thanksgiving. the biden administration is quickly to response. president biden is trying to
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figure out what he'll do next, he'll address the nation in a few hours. the w.h.o. is constantly against that at least for now. this is inevitable. when there are pockets of unvaccinated people here in the united states or a huge part of the globe. people who are choosing not to do so for much around the world. these are people having the able to get one or two doses yet that this is what's going to happen, a new variant would emerge. it's too early to say. we won't note a couple of weeks whether or not the vaccines will be fully effective. but this is now a variant that is of concern and it's going to change public policies and potentially private behavior and is something that the biden administration is going to corrupt with and simply can't
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shake the shadow of covid. >> they'll go at it responsibly and reasonably and even as republicans freak out. it would be really good if mitch mcconnell is responsible for the vaccine and calling out some of the people that this is a conspiracy that's so reckless and dangerous. mora, you had covid in the past and had quite an impact on you. and going out and telling people of south carolina that would be better off to have the worst case of covid than to have the shots. >> it makes is harder for public health officials to do their job. and so all across america now we are going to have americans who say well i don't need the shot because my congresswoman says i
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have natural immunity i don't have to worry about it led alone to protect anybody else who have not been affected yet or does not have the vavaccination. i wonder and i don't know in this case but i will say that for those of us who got sick before, there were medications like regeneron and it's more frustrated for people slamming science. when they do get sick and they go to the hospital and get the best treatment that many of us did not have access to. it's extremely discouraging and i want to say this really should motivate us as a country to push pharmaceutical countries harder than we have. the biden administration could
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be tougher. to open and get access and vaccines all around the world. it's tragic that this is coming out of south africa for so many years devastated and continues to be by the pandemic even though they were delayed in getting those life savings hiv cocktails. this idea that we can isolate and take care of ourselves and that we'll be fine is clearly untrue and this should really light a fire under us. >> it's very much politically having it both ways but making sure you serve yourself and not caing at all of the health of the people you are talking to.
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dr. michael osterholm, if you can give us the bottom line of omicron variant and how dangerous it is and what is the potential that it comes to the united states. >> thank you, good morning. let me be clear, it's real and immediate and a real danger. those three words or all together sums of what we know to date. we want to be careful not to create a sense of this. all the information we have about the virus we see happens in south africa and spreading around the world. this virus is highly infectious and compromise how our vaccines work against it. >> so that the difference we know so far of omicron. when the delta came about it was much more transmissible and it
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could breakthrough a lot of the vaccines for a lot of people who are vaccinated. do we know anything else about it? >> yes, we do. what we know is the fact that if you look at the history of variant and the very first one that we were concerned about was the alpha variant first showed up in united kingdom a year ago. these variants could function differently than the previous version of the virus. they fell in the bucket of one more transmissible and could it compromise our immune protection from vaccines of natural infection. the transmissible bucket was the important one. that's the one that continues to dominate and become the virus king of the hill. the variant that basically compromise the immune response didn't make it.
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this one combining with both transmissibility and the potential to interfere with the vaccines. you get both of them now. what we are seeing happening in south africa is this virus is handing down beating down delta. it's likely it could become king of the hill soon and have these other dangerous parts of it containing within that virus. who what should the united states do? >> are we testing those to see how effective we are against this variant? >> i understand the u.s. government's efforts to limit transportation out of south africa to other parts of rural
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particularly our country. as you are seeing right now it's in at least 17 countries. i am certain it's here in the united states, we have not detected it yet. by the end of the month we'll see most countries in the world already having this virus. you will see the travel bans are not the answer. there will be more testing people before they cross borders. the administration is actively working with the vaccine manufactures to understand is in fact this virus is going to have some impact on how well the vaccines work. one of the things that's notable in africa of how many people who are infected by this virus being reinfected. the protection of illness did not protect them from the virus. the other thing people are doing is doubling down and get
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vaccinated. we had fewer people protected against this virus since the last several months. the reason for that is we have over 125 million americans who have their vaccines six months or more becoing susceptible and they're not boosted. these people again are becoming that risk for getting infected. we got to get them boosted and that's what the administration's trying to do. >> omicron, how much does a country being fully vaccinated matter? will this come here if it's brought here or already be here as you suspect regardless of people being vaccinated? >> we don't know it's going to be necessarily fully protected. what we do know from studies
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with vaccines in south africa and south america when those strains beta and gamma i mentioned did have the same ability potentially. the vaccine still works highly effective in limiting serious illness and deaths. at this point i rather take an infection than died. getting more people vaccinated will have a big impact that way. we can't guarantee it's not going to mean this virus is not going to spread in places like the united states. >> dr. michael osterholm, thank you so much, very good as always to have you with us. as the good doctor says everybody just listen to what he says. we don't know right now. we don't know how aggressively it will transmit across the united states, probably fairly aggressively if it gets here but we still don't know and we won't
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know for some time about the vaccines and the impact on this. certainly as the doctor says if you play the odds, you want to get the vaccine. we are still learning as is the case of every disease and as it has been the case with pandemic. you learn as you move along. i am sorry if this freaks out some republicans and some of my friends who sent me e-mails freaked out. oh, now we have it. yes, it's called a virus. it transforms itself and we have to be smart enough to keep up with it. it would help if americans work together and especially doctors going out and spreading lies that actually hurt their
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constituents. speaking of questions of the unknowns, stocks and oil prices plunging back. president biden encouraged shoppers consider small business shopping over the weekend. he also tried to quell concerns about stubbornly high gas prices. let's bring in dom chu. what do we know about this point? >> there are more questions than answers at this time. investigators and traders oftentimes sell and ask questions later. they want to seek those answers later on. that's the kind of action you saw on friday. the issue is there is going to be issues about whether or not we know anything about omicron. the stuff that got hit the
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hardest echoes what happens during the pandemic a year and a half ago. it's traveling and leisure that took the biggest hit. investigators are at the same time trying to figure out you some of the things that dr. michael osterholm just talked about. we don't know if there is any kind of issues of transmissibility. when it comes down to many of the traders right now coming in this monday is they're trying to play catch-up whether the sell-off we saw on friday was a little bit of a blow which is a reason why you see a bounce back in oil pricing.
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that's the real issue for many of us right now. >> all right, dominic chu. thank you so much. jonathan lemire talking about this be vast conspiracy that idiots on the internet especially doctors of the internet that are in politics are trying to push out that this is just a democratic conspiracy, how fascinating that people traded billions of dollars on friday and dumps on this conspiracy theory? again the stupidity is remarkable. it's all out there, do people in texas and in ronnie jackson's district believe that is moroccans are willing to let their government policy be impacted to help somebody win an election in virginia a year from
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now? again, it's just absolute complete stupidity but you see it across the board. i am hoping that mitch mcconnell and other responsible republicans calling this reckless loonisy, i hope he calls it out. >> the purple district and of course they clearly have an outside interests of what happens there. the greatest question i have about dr. jackson is how did he work for president obama? before he was president trump's personal white house physician, he was president obama's. those at the obama administration spoke very well of him. we can make jokes like this is dangerous stuff when someone like this floats conspiracy
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theory. we know this information is out there online and on facebook and on other channels pushed together by your favorite chinese religious cults and that people believe them. >> yes. >> there are people who still to this day unvaccinated and refused to get any shots and those are the people who are great risk and if indeed this variant is potentially dangerous as doctors seem to think. >> by the way, by the way -- this conspiracy theory does not impact what did bannon called? what cosmopolitans? we are not the ones in the emergency room, we took the boosters. this is what i don't understand mara, what do i have, motivation
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to have my friends and family members infected. i want what's best for everybody whether they are in ronnie's district or may's district. get the shot not because of any global conspiracy. bill gates -- he does not have a computer chip in there to track it. bill gates have enough issues of his own to worry about. i don't and that's what it will get about this conspiracy theory. i just want what's best for everybody's health. you want it too because you know how dreadful this disease is. >> it's completely insane. >> the only thing i can think is it's not just in red states, right? everybody knows someone at this point who is kind of just even if they have taken the vaccine, they're kind of living in denial because they are happier that way and less scary for them to pretend that this pandemic is
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not actually still going on. it's just extremely beyond irresponsible for these republicans to be acting this way. they are supposed to be public servants. it's one thing your crazy uncle is acting that way. they're not leading by example. it's reckless. it kills their voters potentially yet again is a short term of a close strategy if i am being extremely cynical about it. really don't understand where this goes. it's going nowhere good.
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>> if this comes, i guarantee you scientists who created this vaccine at record times is working to figure out. if there is something in this variant needs adjusting, they're working on it right now. >> they are. mara brings up a great point of what we learn of conspiracy theory can take a grip on americans people embrace conspiracy theory because life can be messy. it's much easier to think oh, there is another variant coming and we have to adjust the vaccine and we may have to get another booster three or four or five months from now.
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it's easy to think it's dr. evil working in his lab with will farrel and austin powers. there is no power to save them. they come up with absolutely crazy conspiracy theories and they'll listen to freaks on facebook that spreads lies and make money spreading lies as well as chinese religious cults instead of reading from reuters or the associated press or wall street journal entry, rupert murdoch, the news page is there. i don't get it. i really don't. i just want everybody to be well. >> we'll continue the conversation about omicron. still ahead on "morning joe" a smash and grab robbery in california turns deadly when a security guard protecting a news crew was shot by thieves targeting camera. plus, a rare joint op-ed,
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ambassadors of russia and china banned together to criticize president biden. we'll talk to members of the house elect committee investigating the january 6th, attack on the capitol, adam kinzinger, we'll ask him where things stand with the subpoenas and also about minority leader kevin mccarthy being forced to meet with extreme members of the republican party. >> that's not really a good look on kevin. also, ahead, broadway stars and fans gathered in times square yesterday to pay tribute to the legendary steven sondheilm. patti lupone will be our guest this morning. you are watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. we'll be right back.
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33 past the hour, the supreme court is set to hear a crucial abortion case this week that could dramatically alter decades of ruling on abortion rights in the u.s. on wednesday the supreme court will hear arguments in the mississippi case that bans abortion after 15 weeks, long before the fetus can survive outside the wound. the case presents a direct challenge to roe v. wade, the landmark 1973 ruling that legalized nationwide abortions around 24 weeks. the associated press reports both sides are telling the supreme court there is no middle ground. justices can uphold the constitution rights to an abortion or strike it down
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completely. as premeditated group robberies rise across the nation, two best buy stores in minnesota were hit over the weekend amid black friday sales. according to police, 20 to 30 people entered the best buy store while it was still open and stolen unclear number of electronics. no weapons were used and no one was injured. another group of a dozen adults of juveniles stole at the best buy. the perpetrators fled before police arrive and no arrests have been made. in california, police are searching for answers after a smash and grab robbery turned deadly. a security guard was shot last week while protecting a san
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francisco bay area tv news crew covering the theft of a clothing store. the armed guard provided security for news crew in the region, he was shot in the abdomen while protecting kron's tv camera equipment following the group robbery. a reward of $32,500 being offered for any information regarding nishita's killing. >> this is an ongoing problem that needs to be stopped. it has been going for quite some time. whatever they are doing is not working. coming up, reverend sharpton joins us on the guilty verdicts for the men involved for the killing of ahmaud arbery, plus, far right congresswoman lauren boebert apologizes for the
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bigoted comment she made about congresswoman omar ilhan. >> of course, kevin is the one crawling on his hands and knees to get support of the congresswoman who supported the bigoted statements. that tells you where kevin is. i wonder if contributors to kevin and kevin's pack, i wonder if they are proud of the fact they are supporting a guy who was endorsing bigotry? i guess they only have white customers? i don't know. >> we'll get into all of that straight ahead on "morning joe." straight ahead on "morning joe." ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪
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count one, malice murder, we find travis mcmichael guilty. we ask that who ever may removed
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from the court. the verdict today was a verdict based on the facts and evidence. that was our goal. >> yes! >> so we can do the right thing. the jury system works in this country. when you present the truth to people and they can see it, they'll do the right thing. >> come on. >> that's what this jury did today in getting justice for ahmaud arbery. >> that was the prosecutor who cross examined travis mcmichael in the killing of ahmaud arbery. joinings us now is reverend al sharpton who was there as the verdict was delivered and around the family and helping them through this. we'll be talking more about that. also with us, state attorney of palm beach county davis joining us. >> so great to have you here
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reverend sharpton. i can tell you the calls and texts and e-mails to people don't reach out talking about how moved they were by the words of yourself and others. let the words go forth all over the world, the jury of 11 whites and one black in the deep south stood up in the courtroom and said that black lives do matter. that moment in time, there were many people agreed with you not only outside that courthouse but across the country in the world that while we don't ever want to over generalize a single verdict that you believe and others
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believed that this could be looked upon as a turning point in some way. >> i believe it's important that i agree with you we should generalize but i also think we should also not minimize of the importance of that verdict we are talking about in the deep south, we are talking about the jury of 11 whites and 1 black where 55% of city is black. many of us questioned of the jury we can't get a fair verdict. we are talking about i was preparing the family for the worse. i have been in many courtrooms where he we thought the verdict should have went one way or another. we are talking a week after the verdict of rittenhouse in
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kenosha. i have faith in god we are going to get a conviction. i think we must give credit to those jurors because you must remember in the deep south the 11 whites live in that community voted against their neighbors because they looked past race and the racial antics and voted on the evidence, that gives hope in america. i think all of us in civil rights and all of us protest should be just as verbal when we see people that stands up and say wait a minute, there is the possibility of new bills and new openings. those 11 white jurors and 1 black sent us a significant
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message. >> they should be given credit for. so interesting afterwards and most agreed with you of the turning point. there were some voices where nothing to see here and move along. as a guy born in georgia and grew up in mississippi and went to school in alabama, a verdict like this does matter. as you were going through your statement where you said a jury of 11 whites and one black and then you paused and said in the deep south, somebody in the background says good god. i started laughing because you were right. if that verdict had come in atlanta, i would have interpreted it a different way. it came in though as you said in the deep south in georgia with
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history fought of racism. they made sure they did not just charge of guilty, it's a jury who did a great service, not only to this country but to the rule of law. >> uh-huh. >> they took their charge from the judge seriously. >> the thing that got to me after they read the verdict, the judge read the verdict, the defense attorney said we want to poll the jury and each one of them had to affirm yes this is my verdict. and as i said there i was sitting between the mother and the father and the mother taken my hand when they were getting ready to read the verdict d started praying, you saw the father jumped up after you heard the first guilty and i'm siting there and looking at these faces
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of white southerners in the deep south and one black saying yes, that's my verdict. and you could not have sat in that courtroom between two parents who were not protesters or public officials who just lost their son watching people defy some of the defense attorneys was hoping do and at least one of them hang the jury, they're holding onto their faith and listening to these young people and middle age people, yes, i am saying they're guilty. that was as very, very momentous occasions. you are guilty and you will hold accountable. >> i was moved by the words of ahmaud's family who said in the simplest of terms, i don't want
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any family to have to go through something like this. he really understood the broad message of the day. mara. >> rev, i am so glad to see you. it's nice to see you here. it's a remarkable verdict as you pointed out. what do you take away from this, are we going to see a shift in strategy? what works here moving forward that you may take to other cases that you are often involved in these high profile cases. was there something different here or is there a greater take away about what is possible in rural communities in which you have a majority of white jurors judging these cases, what is this take away and is this going to mark a change in strategy or is this a vindication of some of the work that you and others have been involved in for decades now.
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>> it would not have happened without this video. the local prosecutor, jackie johnson refused to arrest these three and she's now in charge facing jail time for interfering with this case. it took 73, 74 days for these folks to be arrested. when these prosecutors came in they state right on the law and did not allow the defense to abate their consultations and the family took a high tone they have us coming in as ministers and they told us to be spiritual about it. the local activists set a tone.
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at the end of the day, the country have moved more than people want to admit and say look, we got to stop this us against them and the facts are the facts. i think all that you said, both can be right at the same time. it's some of the cultures changing and some of the activism have paid off but the facts are the facts and i think that's what worked of the strategy we used. that's not an excuse of the make up of the jury. we need to look at how that's possible because it could have gone the other way but thank god it did not. >> there is so many people to look at and you look at a judge that maintained order in his courtroom from the very
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beginning. jonathan lemire, let's talk to another person who had a big impact. larry hobs in georgia, a guy who said at the beginning this does not make sense. you had a rortder that kept on saying this does not make sense. there were a lot of people who were working to make sure justice was served. >> he deserves a lot of credit. local news matters. this is why we need local news papers. >> yes. >> this is why community and investments and news gathering organizations or website or tv schedules or whatever it may be. local news matters. stories like this will slip through the cracks otherwise
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that can't be underscored enough. they had to clear a number of obstacles put in place by those who didn't want to be prosecuted to get there and your overall thoughts on the verdict. any surprises and each defendant picked up different guilty charges. give us yourover sense of what happened last week. >> these defendants walked free ten weeks. when they brought, you had multiple prosecutors had to accused themselves. one is being facing charges and second one is being investigated. the difference of this and rittenhouse's case, first you had the star witness had a
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video. it was much clearer and much more devastating than the video of the rittenhouse's case. you had a prosecutor in this case who was able to cross-examine the one defendant who decided to testify and destroyed him on the stand. that was different in the rittenhouse case where the defendant did really well. here you had the prosecutor exposed all his inconsistencies. i said it was a citizen arrest but he never reported that to the police. this is something they came up with. he never told arbery he was making a citizen's arrest. he never saw arbery steal anything. what this prosecuor did was leave the jurors with the only crime that arbery was committing was jogging while black. >> dave, you bring up a great
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point, fact matters and you look at the rittenhouse and arbery case and you have great variants in all of those things. i would start with some of the laws that needs to be changed in wisconsin. everyone 18 years old kids can be walking around with ar-15s, open carry, it's menacing. even if you are advocate of the second amendment. also, on the law of wisconsin, you had a very broad self-defense standard in the state of wisconsin and you had a prosecutor who many people believed had a tough case to proven the first place but some say he didn't was not quite
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effective as it should have been. two different cases and sets of facts. it was a tough case for prosecution and their key witness was terrible. you had a self-defense claim. these defendants were the initial aggressors unless they can show they were making a citizen's arrest. that fell apart. they didn't tell anyone they were making a citizen's arrest. i will leave it up to legislatures of wisconsin that changes the law there for the
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future. >> one more thing we should bring up of mika. we have been critical of brian kemp from time to time over the past several years. certainly we commended him for telling the truth about the election. brian kemp who was deeply offended by this video from the beginning and immediately called for an investigation on that case, too. you actually had from the start, people rightly offended by this video. so, a lot of people worked together to bring justice in brunswick, georgia, this past week. >> state attorney from palm beach county, dave, thank you very much. still ahead, how amateur online detectives helped the fbi to track down the january 6th rioter before he left for air force basic training.
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plus, opening arguments begin today in the high profile trial of maxwell. we'll have a preview of what to expect in court. nearly two years into the pandemic, the world is now racing to contain a new strain, dr. zeke manuel will peter otez will join us in the new variant of omicron and whether the world is prepared. the jury of 11 whites and 1 black in the deep south stood up in the courtroom and said that black lives do matter. let it be clear that almost ten years after travon, god used wanda and marcus' son to prover that if we kept marching and fighting, we'll make you heroes. in the state of georgia, a state
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known for segregation, a state known for jim crow and you turned it around. you took a young unarmed boy that they thought was worthless and you put his name in history. years from now, decades from now they'll be talking about a boy named ahmaud arbery that taught this country of what justice looks like. taught this country of what justice looks like
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it's time we acknowledge congresswoman boegert to a low standard. we would be here nightly chronically the cruel and
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bigoted thing that she says for fund raising. this is not about politics, assuming politics is still things like public hands and taxing - this is about us recognizing we'll hold a politician accountable if they say something viable once but we won't do it if they do it everyday. our double standard is unfair to all the elected officials in colorado, republicans and democrats who displayed human decency. >> that was kyle clark. the primary anchor at 9 news in denver. with that commentary after the republican called representative ilhan omar -- over the weekend we heard more from congresswoman
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laura boebert. she's now apologing to congresswoman omar. boebert suggests congresswoman omar is mistaken by a terrorist, omar is a muslim and wears a hijab. antimuslim is not funny and should not be normalize. congress should not be a place of hateful and dangerous. muslim trove gets.
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boebert tweeted an apology the next day. in a statement, congress mccarthy said he has spoken with boebert. omar was undeserving of an apology writing in part of never apologize to islamic sympathizers or those who fund murders with our tax dollars. that's a double down. >> it seems republican extremists now have control, they taken control of mccarthy. he condemned boebert's bigoted comment. i am glad she apologized and i
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am glad that hoyer took the call and is trying to facilitate a meeting between the two. i understand how heinous this statement is. we hope at some point this sort of hate will be isolated and members of the house, republicans and democrats can debate on the issues, my god. there is enough to debate on. that provides more than enough to debate about. mccarthy seems to be strategizing with extremist marjorie taylor greene.
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the republican leader does not have full support of votes. a good call off of gop leaders. he spent time talking about solving problems. i like what he has planned ahead. adam kinzinger replied, here is a real strength when kevin mccarthy had to call a freshman begging for permission to stay in power. so to jonathan lemire, i do wonder at what point do members of the caucus go to him and say you are actually crawling on your hands and knees and begging for the support of one member who's actually supporting bigoted remarks?
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>> i am wondering the people who are funding his push to be majority leader, are they proud of the facts they are funding somebody that supports antimuslim remarks that you are supporting somebody that's desperate to get the support of people who made anti-semitic remarks? he's willing to embrace politically of the most bigoted members i can remember to be in the house of representatives. how desperate is kevin? >> he's desperate. every decision he makes is done for the prism of what can i do to become speaker after the november's midterms.
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they all agree that's his strategy, a lot of that is to stay in former president trump's good graces. though boebert did offer an apology to anyone i offended and not about hey i am really sorry about this. marjorie taylor greene is extremely popular on the extreme light and has donald trump's eye and that at least for now. kevin mccarthy is unwilling to stand up to her. could that change if there were a ground of sports of members or gop leaders, i supposed that has not happened yet. there is not a realtime it will.
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paul gosar a few weeks ago depicting the murder of aoc and attack o f the president of the united states, mccarthy did not stand up to him either. supports anime cartoons that show the murder of a democratic member of congress and
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antimuslim bigoted remarks and a congresswoman who says and steps away from that remark and a congresswoman who made viral anti-semitic remarks and spreading conspiracy theories about stolen elections. you just go into the gutter and find the worst, most viable conspiracy theories and this is the person that kevin mccarthy is embracing here. i wonder again, we know kevin will do whatever it takes to be speaker of the house. i am curious of the people who were supporting his efforts. who are these people and have they no shame? >> no, i think you raise a critical point. we have ambition.
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he wants to be speaker but speaker to do towards what end. what kind of leader are you going to be? is this something that corporations and people with money really want to support? we must remember at this time of rittenhouse's verdict where people fear that vigilantes, i think boebert was right to apologize. we all had to apologize but then turn around and had somebody repudiate the apology and be condoned by a man want to be speaker. this is a little a bridge too far. i think that the right thing to do was apologize and the right thing to do was try to bring the
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temperature down and from mccarthy to not stand there and say this is right, this should not have been said, we can't in any way go along with this. i think it's irresponsible and telling us the kind of speaker he would be. >> reverend sharpton thank you. new travel restrictions is set to go in effectover concerns of omicron. starting today the biden administration will ban travel from several south african countries. nbc news' national correspondent gabe gutierrez. >> reporter: the u.s. is bracing for the new omicron. new cases confirmed if ontario, canada. president biden is meeting with his chief medical adviser, dr. fauci. >> it givers indication that it has the capability of transmitting rapidly. that's the thing that is causing
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us to be concerned but also to put the pressure on ourselves to do something about our preparations for it. >> reporter: new u.s. travel restrictions from south africa and seven surrounding countries take in effect. public health officials trying to contain not just the variant but fear. >> there is no reason to panic but it's a great reason to go get boosted. >> reporter: u.s. officials spoke to their south african colleague, this doctor was one of the first to sound the alarm. >> there is no reason for panicking as we don't see severely ill -- starts with the younger generation, the most dominant critical complain is severe fatigue for one or two days. >> reporter: authorities say it's too early to know whether the u.s. will need to impose new lockdowns or mandates the fight omicron. air travel can helicopter to be
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safe if protocols are following. with covid cases already rising in the u.s., one of the nation's largest labs says it should be ready for the holidays. the pcr test does detect the new variant. >> i think at least at diagnostic testing site, we should be well prepared to handle it. joining us now is dr. peter hotez, the author of the book "preventing the next pandemic." vaccine diplomacy in a time of antiscience. also with us, former president obama's adviser, dr. zeke emanuel. and ed luz joins us. good to have you all with us.
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>> zeke, we talked back in early march of 2020. you had several recommendations that you wanted to get in front of president trump, of course he didn't do any of them. you now obviously have concerns about what's happening and the biden administration should do certain things, they have moved in some areas, what else do they need to do? >> well, one of the first things we need to do is have good genetics surveillance in the united states of people who tested positive. we are nowhere near that. that's very important. we need to know very quickly,
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any of the oral pills developed by merck or pfizer work against this? everyone wants to know can we develop a new vaccine on the mrna platform, not a new vaccine but a new protein on the mrna. >> they may need to creat. those needs to be fast tracked. we can't wait six or nine months for those vaccines to be approved, can we? >> the sequence is you need the
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company to develop this new mrna. you need to test it in small number of people who is immuno-genetics. from what i have talked to the fda, they prepared to do that for a month because the platform is approved. i don't think that's going to be a major delay. the fda has shown that when push comes to shove, it can go rapidly. what is it about the world responding to covid making it impossible to get this pandemic
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under control? >> what we have seen over and over again that the most troublesome variance including the alpha and delta variants arrived out of unvaccinated population. alpha arose out of an unvaccinated option out of england and delta rose out of india and now omicron is at a population in africa towards the end of this year and into 2022. mother nature is telling us what she has in store for us. if we don't vaccinate the southern him hem sphere -- sout america and southeast asia are profoundly under vaccinated.
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there is no limit to the amount you can scale. we can go up and make 9 billion doses, we don't have the commitment from the g-7 leaders. >> ed luz, we spoke earlier of the goof ball like ronnie jackson who were saying this is all a grand conspiracy hatched by democrats to help the 20 or 25 democrats who need the win so they can maintain the majority because of the midterm election variants. this will be great news to define people of morocco and israel and the eu who are apparently apart of this grand conspiracy theory to help democrats and the western tide water regions get reelected. >> yeah, i am afraid we'll be hearing a lot more than that. i suspect this new variant is
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going to necessitate more restrictions. we don't have a qr code that you can show when you cross state borders. i suspect the need for that is going to become undeniable and the backlash against it and the conspiracy theory that this is a gateway to taking your bible or guns or whatever it is that people deeply fear. that's going to get worse.
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>> can you talk about some of the things that's happening across the eu of what they are doing to prepare for this variant? they all impose these bans the last couple of days but we got new restrictions coming in for the first time in britain now, you are going to have a mask when you are on public transport or other public spaces. i am hearing from colleagues this morning, 90% on the tube are now wearing masks which was double what it was last week.
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so you already got that omicron coming into that situation. what we are going to see is a lot more quarantining and a lot more lockdown and simply to hear a backlash against this. the good news is the stepping up of booster and hopefully as the two doctors are saying, there will be the ability to reformulate the vaccines to accommodate omicron. the ultimate point we are talking about this all year is you need to vaccinate the world. you have to vaccinate the world otherwise this will keep coming back to haunt us. >> dr. emmanuel, good morning, it's jonathan lemire, you mentioned earlier that we don't know whether we'll need to have
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tap vaccine tweets to defend against this new variant. walk us through what we know so far, how contagious and how transmissible do we believe it is and how dangerous do believe it is, are people getting very ill or is it a mild illness. what can you say? this news broke over the holiday week and sent a chills through a lot of family gatherings, what can you tell washington right now what do we know? >> we know very little. we know it's more transmissible, about four times more transmissible than delta. we don't know whether it's more dangerous and that i think is a big problem. that's delayed two or four weeks. this is spread among young
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people who have mild reaction to covid and the real worry is what it will do when it's spread among the elderly that's susceptible and dying much higher. we still have about 1100 deaths a day in the united states. and so its current vaccines are not as good as they were of the delta and alpha variants. we do know like everything, wearing a high quality mask will make a difference in protecting yourself. wearing an n-95 respiratory regularly is the best thing you can do, avoiding indoor activities where ever possible and wearing that mask in crowded
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outdoor activities whether it's holiday shopping or outdoor markets or whatever. it's one of the most important things you can do to protect yourself and family. i want to get to a positive about the effective of the number of cases. that's because people stopped testing over the holidays with commercial testing rather than the actual number of cases and as ed said we are definitely going to have a bump after thanksgiving and another bump after christmas as this omicron is floating around, we'll have substantial increases in the country. >> so dr. peter hotez, it comes back to being able to respond on a global level to this pandemic which clearly has not they're closing borders but that does little and it's already
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here. most doctors think it's already here. so, where are we with the w.h.o. and the u.s. in terms of being capable of vaccinating the world. >> there is really is not a coherent plan to vaccinate the world and the problem was there never was. it was always about vaccines for purposes of speed and innovation, operation warped speed was to rapidly immunize the united states with new and innovated vaccines. when you have a brand new technology like mrna, engineers tell you it takes time how to go from zero to 9 billion and that's what we need to vaccinate it is southern hemisphere and it was a science failure that nobody took a step back and say
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oh, maybe we should balance the portfolio with a simple easy to scale vaccine that we can vaccinate the world now. it was a tremendous source of personal frustration for me that we have a vaccine that's going to be released in india and bangladesh. had we had the help from other g-7 country, we could have had the world vaccinated now. that's the sort of frustration. >> dr. peter hotez and dr. zeke emanuel, thank you very much for being this morning. i am sure we'll have you back soon to talk about this. the russian and chinese ambassadors for the u.s. are blasting the american democratic
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system after not being invited to a white house-led summit for democracy next month. in a new op-ed for the washington based national interest magazine entitled respecting people's democratic rights, the ambassadors write, countries should focus on running their own affairs as well, not condescending criticizing others. there is no need to worry about democracy in russia, china. certain foreign governments better think of themselves and what's going on in their homes. is it freedom when various rallies in their countries are dispersed with rubber bullets and tear gas? >> all right, i had enough. >> this is forest, don't you
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love forest? to quote there sondeilm this morning, this reminds us so much of the garbage that we read during the soviet propaganda giving us a lecture while they are jam packed of critical prisoners and now we got the chinese doing it after they just run over democracy and freedom in hong kong throws 2 million uighurs in concentration camps and the russians, let's not start with them. this is of course hypocrisy of the first order. what's the purpose of this, what are they trying to get out? how does this help any of these countries move closer together?
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>> in their case is, this is a larger reaction to the biden administration framing of the global values contest between hypocrisy and democracy and clearly there is not only the democracy side of that. i think in particular the fact that the biden administration invited taiwan which is a democratic republic. it's called the republic of china and the fact they invited ukraine, these two were particular provocations and causes a concern of china to russia. they are there. their largest unfinished business, what will it achieve? that's an open question, a lot of countries include ugh the united states are now to find less democratic than they used to be.
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democratic backsliding and so there is some question whether america creates is in the position today to really play host and pick and choose so i suspect most of the attendees coming out of politeness rather than any great expectation this will be a big advance blow for the advance of democracy. >> well, compares to those attacking us, we are absolutely angelic in our respect for the rule of law. and angelic in respect of democratic traditions. we still have a federal court system that upheld democracy during the last election
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challenge. help me understand this, xi has to know that with his move on hong kong and his continued militarization, his bluster at home and his threats to taiwan, he has to know that it's going to move us beyond this don't ask, don't tell policy we had on taiwan now for decades. so if we the chinese do not want to be embarrassed by us even saying the word taiwan which governments have not said for some time but by pretending that taiwan does not exist, why do they put our leaders in a position where they have no political choice but to do that because of china's continued provocations. i don't understand that. >> i think it's a measure of the
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brittleness of xi jinping's own conception in china that he has to grapple with taiwan. he created a cult of personality around him that we have not seen since mao since the 1970s. he's trying to the thought of xi jinping's thoughts. he's been eliminating rivals through corruption campaigns. i think he feels that with the party of congress coming out next year that's why it's decided whether you will have another five years or ten years or even in defendant president for life decision. he feels he has to be as nationalist as taiwan because he
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made a lot of domestic enemies. china is being totaltarian with the surveillance technology. the guy is feeling brittle and taiwan is an obvious nationalist sort of lever to pull. >> right, but by pulling that lever, he puts any president of either party in a political position where they have to respond and therefore we bring up taiwan, we invite taiwan to democratic conferences which actually hurts him everyone more politically. i don't understand those provocations. i can say the same thing of vladimir putin in ukraine. he certainly understands after 2014 a move against ukraine is going to produce a move from the
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united states that'll also embarrass him at home whether that's sending troops into poland or sending weapons in to poland or whether it is if he moves towards kiev, possibly sending troops to western ukraine, absolutely the worse case scenario but is this a confrontation that vladimir putin wants to have? does he want 100,000 troops sitting in poland? >> remember the last two times putin has done this when he bid off crimea, there was a lot of rhetoric that you can't do this that our loyalty friendship to this country are unwaivering. when it actually happened, we did not do much. we impose sanctions, we had u.n. security resolutions but we didn't do that much. so i suspect both xi and putin's
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case, they may be testing biden and acting on the presumption which could be wrong that biden is a paper tiger and the american people are just too exhausted or lost their appetite. taiwan is a far away place of which they know little. i think there could be that psychology that these strong men, this is how strong men tend to act. they tend to test and tend to use the schoolyard early psychology. >> all right, ed, thank you soar much. the justice department accused of steve bannon trying to create a media spectacle. >> who could not have seen that coming? >> after filing a serious of frivolous complaints to fight his charges. it's cyber monday, one of the
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41 past the hour. wednesday night is when they'll light the rockefeller christmas tree. businesses are prepping for a record setting cyber monday after a below average black friday turn out. nbc news business jo lynn kent is at amazon's air hub has the details. >> reporter: good morning. we are at the largest amazon air
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hub in the country where they are processing half a million packages a day on this cyber monday. after in store shopping on black friday was down compares to prepandemic levels. >> reporter: cyber monday is upon us. today is expected to break record of $11 billion online. all in the hopes of bouncing back after a dismal black friday turn out. >> it's emptier than i expected to be. >> reporter: this year's foot track reached prepandemic number. shoppers spent less money online compares to last year. the sales slump comes after a slew of smash and grab robberies hitting big box retailers across the country. in los angeles, a string of heights put police on tactical alert. >> i have not coming out because
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i know stores have been getting hit. >> reporter: outside of concerns of shopping safety, discounts posted in the days and weeks before black friday had consumers checking off their gift lists earlier than ever. >> i started my holiday shopping back in july. >> reporter: today's deepest discounts will be on toys and electronics and clothes. the supply chain is in crisis. when shipping containers backed up in ports, big name like gap and target flying products overseas factories to meat holiday demand. from the air to the ground. it's a mad dash to dodge delays to get those gifts out the door. the best advice for those having must-have items on their list, buy now. >> when i see these planes i think of deadlines and what you need to know if you are doing
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that shopping right now, december 15th that's the deadline for usps ground shipping. that's two weeks away, mika. >> good advice, jo lynn kent, thank you very much. we heard a preview from one top republican senator as to why gop members will continue to sit on their hands. "morning joe" is coming right back. hands "morning joe" is coming right back
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a vote to raise the debt limit does not authorize new spending but it essentially allows treasury to raise money to pay for expenses the government has already authorized. this is to pay for things that
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already authorized. it's important to point out in your state alone this is paying things like 30,000 people getting snap benefits, food benefits and 33,000 students eligible for free to reduced school lunches. a lot of benefits from this to your state. why are you against it? >> well, many my state i was a member of the state's senate. we demand that we balance other budget every year and we live within our means just like families ought to do and the federal government ought to do. this is about democrat spending. this is 100% on them. if you get rid of all of the gimmicks of accounting. this bill that the democrats proposing is $4 trillion in additional spending. there is not a single republican is going to vote for the bill or to raise the debt ceiling.
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this is on democrats. >> it's interesting. >> trey was confronting john barusso. raise the debt ceiling three times under the administration of former president donald trump. >> and to be very clear here, as rupert murdoch's wall street journal said, and as trey was talking about on fox news, when you raise the debt limit, debt ceil, that's to pay for money that's already spent. this is to pay for money spent under the trump administration so you can say oh, this is all about democratic spending. and by the way, yes, there are a lot of democrats who want to spend way too much money, but debate that later. this is about money republicans spent when donald trump was president.
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>> treasury secretary janet yellen says the debt ceiling must be raised by mid december, or the u.s. risks defaulting. ols on the agenda, a short-term measure to fund the government runs out by the end of this week. so congress will need to work quickly to avoid a government shutdown, and democrats are trying to finish passing the build back better act by christmas. jonathan lamire, all this as the economy faces challenges and covid lurks. >> no question. this new variant, of course, shadowing the administration. we're going to hear from president biden later today on that. we're also going to hear from him the second time on the economy and supply chain issues. they know as we head into the holiday season, it's a concern for many americans. as i wrote with colleagues atfully politico, there's a growing move for the president to go against the republicans opposing any sort of economic solutions, opposing vaccine
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mandates for the administration to get its arms around this pandemic as we head into these winter months of cases on the rise. it's not necessarily a natural fit for president bide whon spent the first year trying to work with republicans with some success, to be clear, that bipartisan infrastructure bill. but there seems to be not much at this point going forward where he can count on much, if any, republican support. democrats. and some of his top adviser's say it's time to go on the attack to sharpen the contrast between the parties as we head into next year's midterms. >> joining us now, investor ray dalio, author of "principles for the changing world order:why administrations succeed and fail". the book is available, and a good question today. >> thank you for being with us. my entire life i've heard people predicting the collapse of the
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united states of america. japan was going to turn us into a granary in the 198 0s. and, of course, now we're hearing it about china. what i love about this book that started as a study is it's people like you throughout our history that have seen around corners and helped this country maintain its advantage regardless of failures and government. so first, why did you do this study that turned into this book? and looking around the corner, what have you seen? >> well, you know, it's so obvious that what's going on now is so different than anything that's happened in our lifetime before. but it's happened many, many times before. so i learned that in order to understand how things work, i needed to go back in history and watch the rises and declines of reserve currencies and their empires and i needed to go back 500 years to see the cycles. when i did, i saw that what is happening now is just the
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reenactment of what's happened many times before. it gave me a practical perspective. look, i'm just a practical guy who has to make decisions day-to-day. that helped me, so i wanted to pass it along to help other people. >> yeah. and five big factors. you're talking about five big factors that we need to look at to figure out what countries rise and what countries fall. >> your last segment just covered them. there's something going on with money and debt. there's something going on with how we are with each other. so the internal and external convict you referred to china, there's the external conflict issue with china. and then you dealt with the pandemic, and so acts of nature through the history have always been a factor. so five factors through time have determined that. let me just repeat them very quickly. how are you doing financially? are you earning more than you
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are spending? are you producing a lot of debt, and is it producing money? and what are the mechanical effects of that? we can talk about that, but there's a mechanical effect that passes through the economy. the second is how are we with each other? when we have a situation where the causes that people are behind are more important than the system, the system is in jeopardy, so there are risks about how we deal with each other in those conflicts. the third is the rise of the great power to challenge an existing great power. the risk of that external conflict that you touched on china. the fourth is the nature risk. through history, though they maybe come once every 100 years, there are pandemics, floods and droughts, and they have killed more people than wars. they've had a big effect. and then fifth is man's ability to adapt.
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that's technology. and will technology -- that's been a fabulous force for dealing with all our challenges, and will man's adaptation, the ability to adapt and come up with technology such as vaccinations, so we're seeing all of those, but we're seeing them together. and the first four of those are threatening. >> you warned the u.s. could be in a downward cycle. you say it's heavily indebted, increasingly unproductive, the military is overstretched and the foreign policy, and you talk about the citizens being bitterly divided. i want to talk about debt for a second. i've been obsessed about it. when i ran for congress as a 29-year-old, i was obsessed with deficits when our deficits were $250 billion a year. i wonder if, perhaps, people like me were too concerned about debt. and i wonder today, though, if
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at $29 trillion we really have reached the point where the united states reckons with this massive debt or else we face bleak days ahead. >> i'd like to answer that by explaining mechanically how it works. when the government takes on a lot of debt so it can send out those -- the checks, which in many cases are needed. i'm not arguing about whether they're needed, it requires borrowing. and when the demand for that borrowing is short of the ability, then the central bank has to buy that debt and print money. that printing of money produces inflation. it devalues the value of the money. so it has a consequence. you don't get richer by producing more money and credit. there's only one way to get richer, and that is to be more
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product i have. so that that dynamic risks the value of the dollar. for example, the world is holding a lot of u.s. dollar denominated debt, and it's holding it as an asset. too much more in its percentage of the portfolio, and pensions are holding bonds that have no interest rates to speak of. if they sell those bonds, there's a big imbalance. so there's a risk for the value of the dollar, and there's a risk of inflation that you have that consequence. it's just mechanics. the other side of that is to not provide some things that are needed. but that's the tradeoff. it reverberates through the market. so what we see is then all that money is coming to produce both inflation and cause asset prices to rise, and we also see when we're dealing with something like the debt limit issue, that is an issue that makes many
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question whether interest rates that they're receiving on their bonds are adequate, because they don't pay anything. they have a guaranteed negative rate. so the mechanics of that is a financial risk that has nothing to do with debt service. debt service won't be a problem, because you could always print the money and give people the money that is required. we won't literally default. i don't expect. but the question is we will print the money or you have to take it from people. when you take it from people in taxes, then people argue. i'm not saying it shouldn't be taken from them in taxes, but it's just history has shown that if you take those financial conditions and you put them together with the internal conflict of fighting, again, when the causes of people are behind are more important than the system, the system is in jeopardy, and if you put that together with when there's a rise of a power, the challenging
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existing power, that's very risky. it all comes down to how strong we are financially and also how we are with each other to deal with our challenges. that's been shown repeatedly the case. so this is a risky confluence of circumstances. and i hope people will see that in the book. >> yeah. well, the new book is principles for dealing with the changing world order. why nations succeed and fail. ray, would love to have you back. >> ray dalio. >> it's the top of the hour, but thank you, ray. greatly appreciate it. >> and ahead this hour, the directors of the national institutes of health, dr. francis collins joins us on the threat of the new omicron variant and whether the current vaccines will offer any defense. and the trial against the
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woman accused of recruiting jeffrey epstein's victims. also congressman adam kinzinger will be our guest after calling out kevin mccarthy for cozying up to extremists in their party. and remembering broadway legend, steven son time. we'll talk to tony award winning actress patty lapone. we begin this morning with covid. countries around the world are scrambling to contain a new strain of covid-19. since being discovered in south africa, the omicron variant has spread to a number of nations across the globe. raph sanchez has the latest from israel. >> reporter: travel chaos as countries around the world race to shut out the omicron variants. >> we are now in a race against time. >> reporter: the most drastic
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response in morocco where incoming flights are halted for two weeks. in israel all foreigners now barred from entering the country. these passengers, some of the last to reach tel aviv before the deadline the first night of hanukkah. >> just made it. probably one of the last flights to arrive before midnight. >> reporter: israeli surveillance teams will use cell phone data to track the spread of the variant. south africa's urgently asking countries to lift all travel bans. >> these restrictions are completely unjustified. and unfairly discriminate against our country. >> reporter: as omicron continues to make its way around the world. in the netherlands, 13 cases confirmed among passengers on two flights from south africa. new cases also confirmed in australia and denmark. adding to a growing list that already includes hong kong, italy, germany, the uk, and
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belgium. >> in south africa, stranded passengers are trying to figure out how to get home from a country cut off from most of the world. henry warren finally got a flight to the uk for thursday. >> i'm just missing any kids. my kids are missing me. i want to get home to my family. >> joining us now director of the national institutes of health for 12 years under three different white house administrations, dr. collins. it's good to have you on the show this morning. so tell us exactly what we know about omicron, and do you suspect it already is in the united states? >> well, what we know is that this is a variant that has a lot of mutations. more than 50 of them. i think the highest number so far. and we know that it is spreading quite rapidly in south africa, so it probably is highly
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contagious. we don't know whether it causes severe disease or mild disease. that's going to take a little while to sort out, because it's still early days. we've only really known about this for about naive days and a bunch of it has been our whole thanksgiving weekend talking to people in south africa trying to get all the information we could. will it turn out this is a virus for which our current vaccines don't provide protection? that's the big question. we'll know that in about two or three weeks. a combination of lab studies and field studies. but there's a reason to be pretty optimistic here. all the other variants that have e emerged during this pandemic have shown -- if there's a message i would like people to hear this morning is get the vaccinations and the boosters on the path here if you haven't already gotten vaccinated. if you have and you're eligible for a booster, do it now. this is the best way to protect
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yourself against delta which is very much with us in the u.s. and omicron if it comes to the u.s., which it almost certainly will at some point. >> right. and doctor, i'm so glad you said there's reason for optimism. i want to underline, i'm not being polly annaish, but as you said, our vaccines have been fairly effective. delta, of course, delta was horrifying not because it was more powerful than the other variants, but because it spreads so much easier, and those people who were vaccinated, of course, had a similar response to delta that they had -- that others had to other variants as well. so i just want to underline that as some people are starting to fear they're not going to be as responsive. i'm curious from what you've learned over five days, and i understand so much of it is anecdotal. what you've heard so far, doctor, is that mainly that this variant spreads more quickly, or
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are you hearing any instances of the impact of the variant being more severe than delta or earlier variants? >> mostly what we know now is it's rapid spread. it is certainly in just the space of two or three weeks become what appears to be the dominant variant in south africa. that's very quick, indeed. now, let me point out that this arrived in south africa at a point where cases were at a very low level. so it's not that this omicron virus had to compete with others. it was all on its own. we don't know what happened if omicron ends up in a place where there's already a lot of delta. will it be able to compete or not? that's one of the big questions we don't know. >> yeah. and let me ask you also about we've heard for some time about pfizer having pills that would have a positive impact on those with covid. do you know if our government is
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going to be running tests on how those pills work in south africa against this variant? >> i'm sure pfizer is already invested in setting up those experiments. there's reason to be optimistic here. because the way the drug works is it works against a viral enzyme. when you look at the omicron g gnome sequence, it doesn't look as if the sequence is any difference than any other covid-19 viruses. there's reason to believe that the anti-viral would still work, but let me be clear. it hasn't been approved yet by fda. that's being discussed. and also, i hope nobody will look at that and say well, we don't need vaccines anymore because we have a pill. that would be so much the wrong conclusion. the anti-viral is really there if you get infected to try to keep you from getting even sicker. but think about this as really the difference between a seat belt and ending up in the
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emergency room needing surgery. seat belts are your vaccine. the prevention. that's what everybody should take advantage of. it's really tragic that in the u.s. we have 60 million people that haven't even started on that. maybe this is another wakeup call. >> so doctor, as you're looking at the omicron cases around the world, are they breakthrough cases? are they among the unvaccinated? or both? and if both, is there a difference in severity between vaccinated or not vaccinated? >> see, these are really great questions, and i wish we had enough data. there's relatively few of these cases outside of south africa, and in south africa vaccination rates are quite low. i can't tell you yet whether there's a difference. certainly some of the cases are breakthroughs because most of the people who have turned up positive in other countries were vaccinated. we're not totally surprised by that. your question about severity is crucial. we'll know more about that probably in another week or so whether vaccination is already
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showing evidence of benefit in terms of preventing the most severe disease. >> all right. director of the national institutes of health, dr. collins, thank you very much for being on this morning. we really appreciate it. >> thank you. >> get vaccinated is what he said. we turn now to the unending influence extremists are having on the republican party. case in point, in a pod cost that aired thursday, marjorie taylor greene said the republican leader kevin mccarthy doesn't, quote, have the full support or the votes to become speaker if republicans win the house. but the very next day she tweeted, quote, i just got off a good call with the gop leader. we spent time talking about solving problems not only in the conference but for our country. i like what he has planned ahead. joining us now, republican
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congressman adam kinzinger, a member of the select committee investigating the january 6th attack on the capitol. very good to have you on the show. if you could explain this hold that the extremists have on kev? >> yeah. i mean, it blows me away every day. but i guess imkind of not really surprised anymore. look, i think it comes to this. there's the mitch mcconnell way which is this trump guy you talk about. i've never heard of him. and then there's the kevin mccarthy way. kevin, the only place he has to go is to the speakership. he's not going to be governor or president. that is what he desperately needs. i think he made the decision a week or two after january 6th. he was the guy that literally brought donald trump back to political life. donald trump was down in mar-a-lago rage press releasing. nobody was paying attention to
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him and mccarthy shows up, takes the paddles and brings him back to life with that picture. i think he made the decision i'm going to embrace donald trump so i can become speaker over the next two years and there is no doubt that people like marjorie taylor greene with crazy tweets and crazy things she says has a hold on the base and can threaten his power. so he's hugging it, as i said in the sweet. he's hugging the skunk. you're going to get sprayed, but that's his decision. >> but what i don't understand, adam, obviously, is that there are people more conservative, less radical in your caucus who will also be deciding whether kevin mccarthy is speaker of the house or not, and i usually found at least when i was there that if speaker lurched one way too far, he was always pulled back to the more or less the center.
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center right. by people on the other side. i'm curious are there members in the gop caucus that don't want kevin mccarthy to balance -- bow to the conspiracy caucus? >> yeah. you make a great point. because they're not the loud ones. these aren't the ones that tweet all the time. they're not the ones that are going to talk about jewish space lasers and make crazy racist jokes just to get twitter followers. these are members of congress that take governing seriously. i have taught the people that would surprise kevin mccarthy to know they're upset with him, and they have no intention of voting for him in a year. now, that can change. as you know, all the pressure and we've got to get to 2018 and have to be a united party particularly after we take the majority. but there are people upset with
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him, and he's only responding to the noisiest people. and i don't understand it. i mean, kevin mccarthy is smart. kevin mccarthy knows if he happens to win by catering to this what used to be the exotic part of our party, that they're going to not necessarily support him or he's going to have to continue to beg them for their support. i guess it is so important for him to win that vote in a year that he'll pay any price. >> congressman kinzinger, good morning. i want to switch gears to your work on the january 6th select committee. one of your fellow members, congressman schiff said yesterday that he anticipates that will be a decision this week on a contempt referral for mark meadows who, of course, was former president trump's chief of staff and who to this point has not cooperated with the proceedings there. give us an update as to where that stands. do you think that is
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appropriate, and could others beyond meadows also see a referral? >> yeah, look, we are going to pursue this doggedly to the ends of the earth. and i think if people deny subpoenas, we will go after them. i expect that there is going to be movement particularly on mark meadows that we'll know about shortly. in the next day, next two days or so. and i think the people will be pleased with that. the bottom line is this committee is going to get to answers. we're going to do what we need to do. we're not going to rush anything. but we're also going to make sure we're not allowing trump and his folks to drag this out to get to the end of this congress. we are going to get this done. so i expect some updates this week for sure. and i think we'll get to a successful conclusion with mark meadows. >> and we have this update on steve bannon. the justice department is
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accusing him or his defense team of lodging, quote, prif louse legal complaints in order to cause a public battle with prosecutors as the one-time senior adviser to former president donald trump faces charges for criminal contempt of the house january 6th select committee. politico reporting prosecutors said in a filing last night an attorney for bannon had repeatedly rebuffed their efforts to negotiate an evidence-sharing agreement. a standard part of the process in criminal trials. instead, the prosecution said bannon's defense used a public court filing on wednesday in a statement to the washington post to complain about the case. a prosecutor writes in court documents, quote, the defense is misleading claims, failure to confer, unexplained wholesale opposition, and extrajudicial statements make clear the defense's real purpose to abuse
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criminal discovery to try this case in the media rather than in the court. bannon has said publicly he intends to use his court proceedings as a forum to do battle with democratic leaders and the doj. the next hearing is set for december 7th. >> adam, this isn't really a surprise. people who worked with bannon in the white house and outside of the white house told me after all this went down that he couldn't be happier. all he wants is attention. they call him a gadfly. so yeah, if attention -- if he gets attention going to jail, that's fine with him. >> yeah. it's probably true. look, i mean, trump called him sloppy steve and within six months he's back trying to do trump's bidding. by the way, that is something that i don't understand about any of this dynamic. how he can unleash on people and yet, they still kind of come crawling back. but with steve bannon yeah, he wants the attention. it's the death of shame.
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there's no shame in it. he doesn't care if he has a criminal record. he cares if people listen to his podcast. that's what matters to him. podcasts and do i get followers on whatever he is using. so look, but it sent a very serious message, i think, to anybody else that is jeffrey clark, et cetera, thinking of denying the january 6th committee's legitimate ability to get to the bottom of what the american people deserve to know. and i think regardless, steve may want to go out and be a celebrity with his little whatever he's got going on, his podcast, but there are people that don't want to go to jail that don't want a criminal record. and i think this is a really solid message to him even if we make an inadvertent hero out of mr. podcasting mcgee over there. >> congressman adam kinzinger, we appreciate you being on this morning. and one final item pertaining to the capitol attack, the fbi arrested a
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19-year-old who participated in the january 6th riot before he went to basic training in the u.s. air force. aiden bill yard was arrested in north carolina and charged with assaulting law enforcement with a dangerous weapon, engaging in physical violence, and a restricted building or grounds and civil disorder among other charges. court documents say video footage shows him using a bat to break a window above a door into the capitol building and climb inside. >> yeah. you can't do that. >> prosecutors also say the teen was seen on video pointing to what appears to be bear spray toward a line of law enforcement officers. the 19-year-old had been nicknamed harvard sweats by online detectives which helped federal agents track him down from social media posts of him wearing the same harvard sweatshirt that he wore on january 6th. >> how fascinating. i mean, some of the people that
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were completing insurrection against the united states of america were doing so with harvard sweats. >> and getting ready to -- >> outside of the capitol. >> a and getting ready to go to the air force. >> there were people on the senate floor who went to harvard law school who were engaging in their own acts against the united states government. fascinating. still ahead on "morning joe," two big legal stories unfolding today. >> jeffrey epstein's long-time companion is due in court. prosecutors say she helped recruit his victims. plus actor jesse smolett's criminal trial begins -- >> that's not jesse. >> after filing false reports to police about an alleged hate crime. and later, remembering the legacy of steven sonton. a renowned actress will be our
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guest. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. we'll be right back.
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don't miss our black friday sale. save 50% on the new sleep number 360 limited edition smart bed. plus, 0% interest for 60 months. ends cyber monday welcome back. we turn to the sex trafficking trial of ghislaine maxwell. the charges stem from four alleged victims, all of whom are expected to take the stand. >> reporter: ghislaine maxwell will now be tried as epstein's conspirator. >> have a look at what's happening for the first time in history. >> the six criminal counts are focussed on a decade long period between 1994 and 2004 when
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prosecutors say maxwell assisted, facilitated and contributed to epstein's abuse of minors by helping him recruit, groom, and ultimately abuse victims. in some cases maxwell allegedly was present for and participated in the sexual abuse of minor victims according to the indictment. prosecutors say the scheme involved getting the alleged victims to travel to maxwell's personal residence in london. in epstein's residences in new york city, florida and new mexico. maxwell has pleaded not guilty to all counts. the four unidentified victims named in the indictment are expected to testify. two of them were just 14 years old when they allegedly met max well according to prosecutors. in recent years several women have shared their stories publicly. in 2019 one of the accusers told savannah what she witnessed when maxwell allegedly brought her to epstein's palm beach home. >> i followed someone up the
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stairs through jeffrey's bedroom and into a bathroom, and there's this man laying naked on a green massage table in the middle of the room. >> that same year jennifer cold savannah she was 15 when she was raped by epstein. >> did jeffrey epstein rape you? >> yeah. no, he raped me. forcefully raped me. knew exactly what he was doing. what hurts even worse, though, is that if i wasn't afraid to come forward sooner, then maybe he wouldn't have done it to other girls. >> she has separately sued maxwell, claiming she facilitated her alleged abuse. she is not expected to testify during the trial. >> that was stephanie gosk reporting, and coming up, another story from inside a courtroom. jesse smol et heads to trial nearly three years after being accused of a hate crime hoax. details on what's next for the
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back in 2019 actor and singer jesse smollett told police he was the victim of a racist and anti-gay attack near his chicago apartment. but now he's the one accused of committing a crime. meghan fitzgerald reports. >> reporter: that was actor jesse smollett in 2019 celebrating after prosecutors made the controversial decision to drop criminal charges against him. instead, ordering him to perform community service. >> i've been truthful and consistent on every single level since day one. >> reporter: that agreement later overruled after special prosecutor reinvestigated the case and found abuse of discretion and operational failures by the state's attorney. in february 2020 a new grand jury indicted smollett on six felony disorderly conduct charges for lying to police.
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the bizarre case began in chicago. smollett told police he was coming home from subway around 2 a.m. when he says two men attacked him while yelling slurs, threw bleach on him and put a noose around his neck. >> do you want to take it off? >> i do. >> reporter: after putting hundreds of hours into investigating the case, they say the attackers were two brothers that smollett paid to stage the attack. the brothers have expressed regret for their part in the alleged scheme and are expected to testify for the prosecution. they have not been charged with a crime. over the summer smollett's attorney accused the special prosecutor of political motives, writing in a statement, mr. smollett is innocent of these charges and now we are focussed on moving forward to trial. >> our thanks to meghan fitzgerald for that report. coming up, broadway loses a
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legend. we'll remember the life and legacy of the iconic composer stephen sondheim. our best, patty lapone whose friendship with him spanned decades. that's next on "morning joe." n. they guide me with achievable steps that give me confidence. this is my granddaughter...she's cute like her grandpa. voya doesn't just help me get to retirement... ...they're with me all the way through it. come on, grandpa! later. got grandpa things to do. aw, grandpas are the best! well planned. well invested. well protected. voya. be confident to and through retirement.
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♪♪ ♪♪ hundreds gathered in times square last night to remember composer and lyric writer stephen sondheim who passed away on friday at the age of 1i9 91.
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ann thompson has more on the tributes to the man who changed lyrical theater. >> reporter: for broadway, the best way to celebrate stephen sondheim was to sing. lin manuel miranda among the voices in new york square. near the theaters he loved and transformed. >> i want to tell stories and make people laugh, cry and have a good time and buy tickets. >> reporter: and they did. >> and a weekend in the country. >> reporter: to a little night music. falling sweeney todd, into the woods, and "sunday in the park with george". actress bern -- sentiments from
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many actresses. meryl streep and others sang for his 90th birthday. >> reporter: we all feel like or fans. until the end, he was theater's biggest fan, attending revivals of his assassins and company. portrayed on the big screen in "tick tick boom". it is sondheim himself on jonathan larson's voice mail. encouragement director miranda said sondheim gave generations of writers, repaying the debt to his mentor, oscar hammerstein the second. he pushed sondheim to write the lyrics for "west side story".
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now the movie is renamed. but it is in the theater, in that alchemy between actor and audience where sondheim will live forever. >> i like to be around for the shows. that the shows will be entertaining 100 years from now and they'll still have something to say. >> wow, joining us now patty lapone. she knew sondheim for over 40 years and appeared in seven of his musicals. most recently "company" which just returned to broadway earlier this month. it's good to have you on this sad moment. >> patty, he wrote the lyrics to "west side story" at 26. you can stop right there, but he didn't. and we've read so many tributes about how he changed american theater. why don't you tell us what -- knowing him like you did, why
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don't you tell us your thoughts about this extraordinary life and legacy? >> well, he was -- can you hear me? >> yes. >> okay, great. he was a complicated, deeply emotional man, and that is reflected -- excuse me -- in his lyrics. and it was an achievement if you did it accurately. if you said the right words and if you sang the correct notes. it was an achievement, because it wasn't easy to do. he was a task master. what he said earlier about wanting audiences to feel this, i think was the general thrust of why he did what he did. he's -- he was an incredibly
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intelligent man. and we have to work hard to hear and understand stephen's work. i think that elevates it. i can't think of anything right now other than that. >> yeah. well, by the way, i think if you're on the computer, if you turn down the volume, you may not get some of the feedback. i don't know if you can do that or not. i know it's -- >> okay. >> that's great. >> there you go. that is fantastic. so here's the range, the extraordinary range, as i said. he writes the lyrics to west side story when he's 26. then gypsy. then he says, i guess i want to start writing music. he's one of those rare composers that writing his lyrics and music. and then he completely changes american theater, and one of the
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tributes from paul mccartney, no slouch in song writing talking about how he wrote some of paul mccartney's favorite works himself. the gift is unlike any we've seen in american theater in half a century. >> yeah. i think so. and what do we do now? that's my question. what do we do now? i suppose there will be a ton of revivals of his music, but you always waited for the next sondheim idea. which changed. i mean, it wasn't just -- i mean, he wrote for musical comedy. they weren't all musical comedies, but that was his formula. musical, comedy. and he -- look at the ideas. look at "assassins". who would have the courage to write the musical from the assassin's point of view? and it's an incredible musical. great music.
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he had phenomenal ideas and implemented them. he had the support of producers and directors to put them on stage. it wasn't all just sugar coated stuff. >> i'm curious what your personal reflections are. what he was like to be with or what he was like to work with that come to mind. >> he -- when i had -- when i had the chance to be in a room with him, because mostly i recreated. i didn't create roles. i recreated them. so he wasn't in the rehearsal period day after day. he would come toward the end, the last two weeks to see what the director was doing, to see what the actors were doing. he was a task master. i have gotten some very harsh notes from him that were always im -- always improved me, but
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were hard to take, because they were quite to the point. quite to the point. and sometimes insulting. but he made me a better singer. he made me a better actor. as a person, we both live in a small county in connecticut, and people -- the same social situations quite a lot. and he was very funny. and very gregarious, and very at that time very gentle, and you could see how this man had the ability to write deeply, emotional music and lyrics. that's who he was. he was -- he had a well of emotion. and he was just searingly intelligent. put those two things together and ripe for the musical theater
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and you have a genius. >> you know, i notice that he wasn't to williams. my alma mater, and that he sort of had his burst into acting at williams college which also hosts the williams town theater festival in the summers. i don't know if you've ever done that, but it really was in him very early on in his life to share and to perform and to create. >> yes. and as a matter of fact, i did something for cbs sunday morning, and i asked him. i was asked to interview him. he's been asked every question. he's been asked absolutely every question, and i didn't know how i was going to approach this, and then when i saw he was an actor, it was something i didn't know. and he apparently was quite a good actor. so also coming from that side, a creator has the ability to understand what an actor does, that only enhances how he will
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write for an actor and a singer. and steve got great notices as an actor in college. i wish i could have seen him act. >> can you talk about for our audience, talk about how he moved theater from -- from the roger and hammer stain model where it was south pacific or "the king and i" or "the sound of music". musicals i love to far more emotionally complex and perhaps a little less commercially obvious, how he moved theatre in that direction? and broke just -- just broke through a series of barriers that gave other play rights the
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freedom to do the same? >> well, i think he was following in a vein of oscar hammerstein. when you look at the others, there's a sociological intent and political intent in them. they took chances with that. you know the song "you've got to be taught to hate" in "south pacific". and because steve was a protege of hammerstein. that was his major influence. he took it further. and why he chose these ideas, i can't answer. i i'm glad he did, because it challenges us. but i think he took what was begun, and he took it further into a contemporary period of
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time. and then because his music is different. it's not always a melody. you don't go out humming the tunes always. you do remember so many of them, but in the moments, you may not go out humming his tunes. that may have been a distinction that critics at the time were not thrilled with. he said it himself. he was not a critic's darling. he was -- he was forward. he was advancing the musical. and i think that is a destruction that some people can't handle at the time. progress. >> my condolences on your loss, and you spoke about movingly about your relationship with him and how he changed how musicals were received at the time. what do you think his legacy is going forward?
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not just his productions which, of course, will live forever, but in terms of influencing contemporary, younger artists who are on broadway, directors, actors, song writers, how do you see him living on in that way? >> well, i think it's courage of your convictions in your ideas that nothing should be off the table when you are writing for an audience. i mean, it is our responsible to instruct, to educate and have an audience be transformed by theater. and that is what stephen wanted to do. he wanted to -- i think first and foremost, was the audience. and his ideas were his ideas. why he chose these things, i can't answer. but i think he gave other composers the courage to put a
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hampton or a a spring awakening, the ones that are not cliche. >> patti lupone, thank you so much. and thank you for sharing. i know it is tough and we've really, really appreciate it. but just opened broadway revival of company with music and lyrics by the legendary stephen sondheim is at the bernard b. jacobs theater and patti, thank you sop for coming on this morning. up next, any a vaurnt has spread from south africa to europe and several other spots. is the u.s. next. we'll go live to london for the very latest, next on "morning joe."
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senator cruz told the attorney general you should be prosecuted. >> yeah. i have to laugh at that. i should be prosecuted. what happened on january 6, senator? >> oh, my gosh. >> my lord. >> there is that. >> so jonatha lemire, it is just crazy. sane, normal, rational human beings just lose their mind when confronted with facts and science. and it is happening all over twitter, which is not a shock. but also to see the republicans, elected members of congress, ronny jackson, a former white house physician who the obama administration even liked claiming that this is a deep state conspiracy and others saying, oh, just get covid, it almost killed me, but it is
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okay. it is just really, it is just one more step into the land of bizarre by these sad demeanted people. >> we're in a bad place. right now the country is so divided and broken and there is a party here, not all, but elements of the republican party right now want to fight on this ground. they want to deal in conspiracy theories and -- >> but why? i don't understand. what i don't understand is, nobody, fauci, he has got no reason to tell people to get a vaccine. i have no reasons to tell people to get vaccines. i want them to be okay. i want their kids to be okay. we've all lived through this long enough. where everybody has experienced a friend or family member or money they knew who died from this, who suffered from this, whose life has been forever worsened because of covid.
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that is what i don't understand. why are these people turning doctors and scientists into enemies when all they're trying to do is save their lives. >> elements of this, the opposition to science and experts and that existed before donald trump was president but he threw a match on the gasoline here. and politicized and polarized everything, including making dr. fauci, who was someone who has served presidents of both parties for decades, made him a political figure. suddenly that he was an emblem of the left according to trump and his coneys and worthy of attacking and the doctor said he had white powder delivered to his office. he's feared for his life and this is a moment again where he is being targeted by a party or at least elements a party that is governing ethos is not helping and it is to own the libs. whether it is a fight with big
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bird over vaccinations or taking swipes at dr. fauci, he's more interested in that and scoring political points and getting likes and re-tweeted on twitter and headlining a segment on fox news that matter more than governing for texas. >> well you just look at some of the really stupid tweets that i call them stupid because they do upset me, because the tweets are irresponsible and reckless and will cause constituents that follow them to put their lives at risk and put the lives of their family members, their parents, their friends at risk. i don't understand it. i do want, before we go today, mika, to underline what the director of the nih told us this morning there is reason for optimism, when you look at the vaccine how it responded to other variants, there is no reason to believe at this point that it won't respond
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effectively to this variant as well. >> to the booster. >> so we don't know yet. so i say that not just to those who are sort of pushing it off, but also to those who are catastrophe-izing. we should be aggressive and do everything we could do to keep it at a minimum in this country. keep the businesses open. keep schools open. we got to do the smart things to do that. but let's not catastrophe-ize it yet. let's get the facts and follow the medicine and let's be -- >> best thing people could do is get vaccinated if they haven't. and that does it for us this morning. stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. hey there, i'm stephanie ruhle live at msnbc headquarters here in new york city. it is

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