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tv   The 11th Hour With Stephanie Ruhle  MSNBC  December 23, 2022 9:00pm-11:00pm PST

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yes. yes. it's important that the secret service know that because th disagreements that might g public would have an impact on the security is not fair to say? short, my concern was for th vice president security, and i want to make sure that the hea of the vice president secret service was aware that likely, as these disagreements becam more public, that the presiden would lash out in some way it is gripping reading, and it is a reminder of the truly unprecedented nature of th events leading up to and including january six. that does it for us for now. happy holidays to all of you and now it is time for a special earlier edition of the 11th hour with stephanie ruhle >> tonight, brand-new januar 6th committee transcripts, jus in, as we analyze the full report, and where all of the investigations go from here. then, from dangerous weather
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to tripledemic illness on th rise. what you need to know, heading into this holida weekend. looking back at thi consequential week, and th focus on fighting for democracy, and freedom, both here, an abroad. our favorite historians, here to put it all i perspective, as a special, extra early addition of th 11th hour is underway, on this friday night. >> good evenin once again. i am stephanie ruhle. nearly 24 hours after its final report was mad public, tonight, the january 6th committee released a new batch of witness transcripts they are from interviews wit key people in trump' administration, including, bil barr, pat cipollone, kayleig mcenany, hope hicks, and his daughter, and senior adviser ivanka trump. we will brea down what we are learning in just a moment, but first, th committee's report is wrapping up its 18 month investigation, and it is very clear about the main reason for the attack o art american democracy. th panel says, the central caus
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was one man. former presiden trump. none of the events of january 6th would have happene without him. committee members want him barred from holding office ever again. the report, also, describing at least 20 attempts to pressure state officials into overturning the 2020 election. it says tha hundreds of millions of dollar were raised based on fraudulen claims of a rigged election. committee members hope their report helps the justice department stationary si investigation into trump himself, but they are also focused on those gop lawmakers who voted to not certify president fight biden' victory. >> republican returned to the house floor, and an overwhelming number, th vast majority of them, still voted to overturn the election still, essentially, advocate abdicated their oath of office chose their allegiance to th president over there allegiance to the constitution
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and that, is really, what pu us, additionally, at grave risk. with all of the focus on the attack that day, let's not forget about the insurrectionists wearing suits and ties. in terms of whethe any of them will fac prosecution, i leave that to the justice department. i do not think that they will fac prosecution, simply for thei betrayal of their oath o office, a serious of a matte that is. but, to the degre they may have been involved in the planning behind january 6th, we have to hope that the department of justice ha additional evidence to what we provided to, determine who was responsible. >> with that, let's get smarter with the hel of our lead off panel tonight. luke broadwater, pulitzer priz winner for the new york times. a former acting solicito general during the obama administration, and eli stoical, white house reporter for politico. luke, lucky you. you are pretty much not gettin your family any christma
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presents this year, in the las two hours, yet another massive dump. a huge amount of witness transcripts for you to g through. these are huge names. give us the takeaways. i kno you haven't gotten through the all you. >> right. with th caveat there is about 50 o these, and they came out only few hours ago, and i've read about one and a half of them, did start with hope hicks, because her interview was afte the january 6th committe hearings were concluded. w haven't had a chance to see an of her clips until just this week. so, a couple of things i hope picks transcript that stood out to me was that she for one, had told donald trump or had conveyed to the white house through eric herschmann, that she believed that donal trump plan to put out statement before january 6th calling for peace. that donald trump had rejected that. she said she asked for this severa times. so, there is a clea
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concern, ahead of january 6th, that this could be violent this could be a bad idea, that someone high up in the white house knew it could be a bad idea, and that donald trump di not want to put out such a statement. then, there is some evidence where she is watching the violence unfold, and i texting people about it, and she says, we all look like domestic terrorists right now. she's going back and forth, an text messages with herschmann, saying things like, this i totally regrettable, thi could've been prevented, and he's agreeing with her. thos are top, white house people, lamenting, in realtime, as the see a democracy falling apar in this attack on the capito by the president they ar supposed to be serving. so, thought that was a revealing window, and after that, started on pat cipollone's but
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it got about halfway through and here we are. so, sorry i haven't read all of them yet >> let's give you a break. a lot came through. neil, hope hicks was just one of many tha when we got the report las night, we saw this was his fault, he caused this, we knew this would happen, and at th end of the day the report wa saying, the central cause of this insurrection was a single person, donald trump. that wil go down in the history books but, did they find enoug supporting evidence for jack smith to use in a criminal investigation? >> i think they did, staff. the report did something which i hadn't eve focused on, which was th timing. what it did wa basically say, look, there was a first phase. trump gives a speech at the ellipse, he' telling the crowd, let's tak back our country from an election stolen. you have to fight like hell. when you catc someone in a fraud, you can go by different rules. he says al of that. at the very same time
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the proud boys were attackin the capitol. that was phas one. what the report says is the d. c. police were able t fight that back. the problem was, trump's speech at the ellipse induced does thousands of people to march from th ellipse, to the capital, overwhelming the polic resources at the capitol. that timing, and the way they did it, with such methodical step-by-step proof, i think, i enormously important project myth. the other thing i woul say, if you start to rea through these transcripts that very striking, is i have never seen so many people forget s much. i mean, a stoner convention has better memory than these white house staffers. just to take a few examples, austin basualdo, who's working in the trump wes wing, says he does not remembe where he was on january 6th. h cannot remember if he was in the white house, or at home. there is a way in county
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michigan official named monica palmer, one of the peopl involved in certifying the election for michigan, and she basically says, she can' remember if she knows trum called, can't remember wha trump said, even though he did call on the eve of the michiga certification. give me a break monika palmer is not getting calls from sitting president of the united states on regular basis, and can't remember what was said. it's ridiculous. there's another do official, can glucose key, and he says he can't remembe anything, about an conversation he's ever had relating to the election. it's over there with jack smith. >> that might be ridiculous, it might be pathetic, it might be transparent that they are full of it, but can they get away with it? we learned yesterday, that first trump paid attorney that cassidy hutchison has was clearly saying to her, you can't get in trouble if you sa you don't remember. >> right the differences, jack smith ha
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the resources of the justice department available to him in this investigation. so, what that means is for every one of those people that i've mentioned, the fbi is going to interview not only them, but all of them, and say, is i really true that he said nothing about january 6th when it happened? so, they have a whole suite of resources available to them. a subpoen power that congress doesn't. with respect to that attorney, staff, i don't think that gu gets away with anything. cassidy hutchison, bravely told the truth, despite th pressure on her, and her fea of bucking the trump world. now, the transcripts are in black and white for everyone to se what this attorney did. i don' know if it is true, but if i is, and i suspect it is, tha attorney committed various federal crimes, and will fac very severe consequences, an that modus operandi of tryin to hold over on witnesses, something, threatening them, o controlling them with the jo
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opportunity is, probably, goin to be true for other witnesses and that is something that the can get a lot of >> straight out of the mob playbook. we are going t continue not just to focus o this report but in the comin months, consequences consequences, consequences. eli, it has been almost 24 hour since the report came out. break it down for us, what has the reaction been from the white house, from the hill, an from trump world >> we are not hearing a whol lot out of joe biden's white house. they are content to jus let this play out in the background, or the foregroun really, in terms of the media. and they will go on doing thei own thing. they like the contrast and they don't feel like they have to be the one to draw it. at the same time the white house has, whe trump's made posts on to social, when his people have gone ou and done -- they have drawn lot of attention to some thing which is glaringly anti-democratic. this whit house likes this contrast. the president, the people who ar around him are expecting him t
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seek a second term and make it official in the new year. they clearly want a rematch wit donald trump so they will talk about this. i think on the hill, it is interesting, it is a mixed bag. kevin mccarthy is still trying to lock down th speakership and luke knows all about this. but he's not going to suddenly say, this report seems legit, maybe i'll thin about it. there's no way tha they are going to take the recommendations, and barr trum from ever holding office again with the republicans coming in and controlling the house in january. but at the same tim this was a republican part that is not monolithic at this time on donald trump. yes, man of them -- before the big li over the last year or two, but now after november, this is th third straight election cycl where trumpism has hur republicans. he hurlock more republicans now wanting to mov on from this. whether they'r hoping for an indictment or not, you know, there is frustration with the president, hi presidential campaign that h announced over a month ago has
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flatlined, to put it kindly. you have seen nothing afte that initial announcement, h is not scaring of th republican side of the field it is a different politica world on the republican side and congress, in the 202 conversations, and so i thin whatever happens in terms of what the special counsel does, whether he indict trump, these dual investigations are not, the republican party is no longer sitting there feeling like they are just stuck, bein held hostage by trump the same way that they were, you know maybe even as far back as late 2021 a lot of the things tha were in the report were playin out. >> well, they could have, of course, impeach donald trump and then been done with him. but they chose the dramati long, drawn out world of trump that we are still living in. the report also went prett deep on some of those extremis groups. the oath keepers, th proud boys, what stick out t
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you? >> i think it was interestin to me, because the repor really does draw a connectio between all of trump's pre-january 6th statements, an conduct basically giving aid and comfort, and support t these radical insurrectionis groups. many of them are deepl racist, and so i think that is an important threat in this. again, this is the first investigation of this. jac smith has other resource available to him to carry that investigation farther. but i is remarkable how much the committee was able to find i this time period >> luke, talk to us abou republicans in terms of what they're planning on doing in terms of pushing back on thi report >> right, well you saw a littl bit of it already this week. five house republicans put out their counter narrative report it is a completely alternative world from the january 6th committee's report, and this telling, donald trump is a voice for peace and calm o january 6th. nancy pelosi is the true villain who bundled capitol security and that is a reason for the attack on the
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capitol. you know, it is just complete counter narrative there was a senator, a senat committee that did investigate security failures, and they di not find that nancy pelosi was to blame for security failures in the least. this is the type of thing that we are going t hear for the next year or so republicans, when they tak over, they are planning to investigate the investigators. i asked chairman thompson ho he felt about that, and he fel like that was a distraction an nobody should even worry about it. he feels like their work stands, and they put out thi nearly 850-page report, they are putting out all of their transcripts. they think that they are being ver transparent. and they thin
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that their evidence is very, very strong. they think that they have an impact in bot weakening trump, and convincin much of the public. they credi themselves with that. if jim jordan, and jim banks want t go through their transcripts and criticize them, they say that you are welcome to do it, we stand by our work >> to that very point, eli given how detail this report is, do you think the republicans when they take control of th house might reverse course o back off from this idea of the investigation, given how detailed this thing is, they might end up humiliating themselves even trying to do this >> it is all in the eye of the beholder. rational people wh look at the facts and who live through january 6th, watched i live on television, yo remember the tweet saying be there it will be wild. everybody kind of knows what happened. but if you want to
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live in this alternative universe you can choose your own adventure, so to speak. so does the new republica majority decide that it is important enough that they hav to stand that up? they have to investigate the investigators, i think that they are going to do something, how wholesom that, is or how it seems a bit halfhearted remains to be seen i think it was telling i november that a lot of the people who were on the ballo who spent a lot of time on their campaigns talking abou the 2020 election who ar perpetuating trump's big lie they lost. they lost races tha maybe without doing that, they might have won. and after they lost, all but one of the conceded. they did not parro trump's behavior and go out an say that this is not true, i want to stop the steal. they just went away. and i thin that that has been something that the white house, i know and other folks who studie democracy look at and ar heartened by and say that is a lot better than what a lot o people feared. and it remain to be seen whether house republicans, the new majority, people who are running the oversight committee, whether they see that as well an recognize that for this part to be successful, to hold on t
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majorities, to grow majorities stop the steal, the big lie ma not be the path that they need to take. but i feel like they, it just seems like they are so deep, so deeply and on decid they are going to have to do something, and i think we will just have to wait and see ho far it goes and how much weigh and time they decide to pu behind it. >> sure, choose your own adventure, look at history. if you are one of these million of people who gave to the stop the steal, you just got totall played because that money wa taken and it was all conspirac theory. if you are a insurrectionist, you might b going to jail. the committee had eight pretty clear recommendations. what do you it is the most important >> to me, the most important i the referral that trump v. himself prosecuted for various federal felonies. really, th
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most serious ones, to me tha is such a historic thing. know that we get annoyed because we're talking abou trump all the time, and this i an extraordinary, extraordinar moment. to have this kind of referral by them. i think that the 14th amendment stuff was also particularly interestin to me. basically at the end of the civil war, with th reconstruction that congress put in a closing that if you give comfortin insurrectionists who can b barred from future offic holding. that was used back at the end of the civil war. bu it has not been used since. an congress does not have a mechanism to enforce it, and now they are going to push forward with the mechanism tha is the recommendation in the report >> all right gentlemen seriously luke, i have to as you. have you had any time t buy a single christmas gif this year? >> embarrassingly it was all o
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amazon and i regret that. i do like to shop local if i can. >> luke broadwater's, friend and family will be getting powerball tickets and gift cards this christmas season. luke broadwater, neal katyal you are about to get a ten out of ten for that roaring fire outstanding christmas tree, an blazer with a black sweater, you just nailed your christmas list. when we come, back by th intelligence community i escaping major criticism in th january 6th report. we are going to talk to a former d. c law enforcement official who warned of red flags before the attack even took place. an later, mitch mcconnell yet again calling out a diminished donald trump and sharing his plan to promote what he call quality gop candidates. we'v heard that before from mitch mcconnell, what does i actually mean? david jolly and amy mcgrath are here, and ho exactly that is going to work. a special edition of the 11t hour getting underway on a ver
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our thanks. your rewards. >> the january 6th committee's final report is nearly 900 pages long! but despit warnings that they could becom violent, we saw that the intelligence committee escaped major criticism for missin foreseeable capitol violence instead the committee and th report focused largely o trump's role, which wa inciting the rioters to figh like hell, concluding that the best defense against tha danger will not come from la enforcement but from a informed and active citizenry. let's discuss, for more i want to bring in associated press reporter, eric tucker, who covers the fbi and the department of justice, and dr. harvard, former chief of homeland security an intelligence who himself warne of potential violence ahead of january 6th. this has been a extraordinary frustrating,
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almost two years for you. yo said that this repor disappointed you in a big way. why is that? >> hi stephanie. we waited a long time to really hear about donald trump was a bad perso and thought him and hi associates plotted, and planned, and instigated january 6th. so if you are waiting 18 months for that, congratulations. a person in the field, we ar waiting for a more in-dept review of not the intelligence failures i want to make sure the report said clearly that there was a large amount o intelligence, and the proble is what was going on with that intelligence structurally. why was it not followed. and the report lets a lot of these agencies off the hook. when yo look at the juxtapositio between what the federal government did with that intelligence and what we did o
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the local side, it is clea that that intelligence that we all had was ignored on one side, and not ignored on the d. c. governments side. as you see i the reports, they canceled tim off, they had older officers out there that were available, myself we had our intelligence center, and we lean forward in the report that said specifically that loca government was proactive i their attempts to make sur that what we all saw was going to have an online bid. lastly, i will say that the report say that law enforcement intelligence could not hav prepared for the unimaginable. i push back on that. that is our job, our job every day these men and women go to work and you don't know who the are. they are intelligence officials, security officials, and their job is to plan for those things that ar unimaginable. in fact, a wee before january 6th, we did jus that. we did what we cal structure analytical technique and we went through variou scenarios. one of the scenario
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was that a large crowd would g to the capital, armed an violent, and they would be abl to successfully stormed th capitol and that there would b improvised explosive devices planted near the capitol. so t say that the intelligenc community and law enforcemen was not predicting this and ca never have imagined, i think i takes a lot of what you saw on the protective side off of the hook >> that is kind of the head-scratcher. it wasn' unimaginable, it was unimaginable. we have reporter at nbc within 48 hours befor the capitol riots saying oh my god, something horrible is going to happen, all sorts o different outlets were in thos channels, and they said this thing is coming. in good faith caroline forsman toward th committee really even say that this was unimaginable? i wasn't >> it wasn't, and my oldes daughter, she texted me tw days before this, she said dad is it going to be safe for you
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to go to work? she works in d. c.. she said my job is letting us out early or telling us tha we can take off. it look pretty bad online. so my daughter who is not an intelligence agent or homeland security professional we all knew that. my issue, an this is not to disparage the men and women who put a lot of time and effort into putting this together, is that i leaves us on a cliff-hanger in terms of how can we do bette as a home run security and intelligence committee. one of the things that bothered m specifically from the report the report states relevant oversight committees, an watchdogs should continue to find efficiency as a improvement, some of which are lead up in the committee's recommendations. a, what relevant oversight committee watchdogs? this job is done. i has been wrapped up. who i going to be doing that work? who are we waiting for it to come in and tell us what wen wrong on the other side of the house. and the second thing is that the recommendations tha you were talking about in your last segment, of the 1
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recommendations, their only tw that are related to the actual protection of the physical building of the capital. those are pretty weak in their own rights. once again, for me where is the beef? >> you are looking for a new watchdog, we got one. eric what stuck out to you most whe it comes to law enforcement in the report >> i think to the point that was just made, one of th things that was really interesting is that it was not an absence of intelligence tha law enforcement had, it was th opposite, it was really clea from the report that there was a lot of information, a lot of warning signs, and for whateve reason, january 6th unfolded and law enforcement quickly, and overwhelmingly found itsel totally overwhelmed, and swamped by this crowd. that is something that the fbi, an other agencies are reall trying to get their hand around. it is not as if no one
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had a sense that there could b large crowds, although i think it is also clear that nobody had a real sense of exactly ho many people were going to be there. one of the things that think law enforcement is slowl trying to figure out is if w had some of these puzzle pieces, how can we then respond to the more robust way. i think one o the clear challenges is when you have so many different agencies in washington, th blame spreads pretty far and wide. there is definitely no one single agency that dropped the ball, or that felt a share of the intelligence. this was pretty broad ranging issue tha many agencies were tracking, and agencies failed to respond to in the most appropriate way >> so the question is, why d you think that there was a failure if there was all of th intelligence leading up to it? >> i don't want to take credit for the recommendations, but one of the first things that i told the committee, and i me with him three times o separate occasions, it's from
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coordination standpoint, w found ourselves adrift because there was no central agenc that wanted to takrert reflected that. one of the recommendations, i think it wa a recommendation number five is to establish this particula date, january 6th, as national security event. had that happen, we do this for un general assembly is, joint - any joint session of congress. there would be command and control across all agencies, state, local, federal, tha would have their inciden command stood up so that all intelligence informations fe to one central node is share widely. that wasn't the case in fact, i realized that o january 1st, or maybe december 31st, about a week befor january 1st, and we took i upon ourselves as locals to sa
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that there is no one communicating about this collaboratively. and we were setting up our own meeting about what would happen on january 6th, because everyon was like who has got it, who has got it? those are some o the jurisdictional black holes that you have in d. c., wher you have federal in, you have local government land, and there's no individual incident commander report. the last thing that i will mention is this report does not eve mention recommendations for th d. o. d.. that was one of th biggest contentions. the wor national guard came up dozen of times in the report. bu there's a lot of finge pointing about who could cal the national guard, why wa that not done? we don't have clear recommendations on how the national guard could b brought in in this disorde control posture when they ar needed in a quick response force. >> we don't. but a quick reminder to our audience
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january 6th, the intel committee and the fbi was unde trump's control. eric tucker though -- thank you for bein here tonight. when we come back, mitch mcconnell has got a ne lie. he says he is done kissin the ring, doesn't actually mea that? and if so, what is i going to look like alice loves the scent of gain so much, she wished there was a way to make it last longer. say hello to your fairy godmother, alice. and, long lasting gain scent beads. try gain odor defense. be gone, smelly everything!
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committee's full report wa released, senate minorit leader mitch mcconnell was trying to distance himself fro donald trump. in an exclusiv interview with nbc news, mcconnell called trump diminished and said that he ha contributed to the view amon voters that the republican party was nasty and tended toward chaos. back with us tonight, retired lieutenan colonel amy mcgrath, she ran for senate against mitch mcconnell. and david jolly former republican a number o the u. s. house of representatives. he is now chairman of the serve americ movement and an msnbc politica contributor. i want to hav both of you here because o everyone i know in the political sphere, you to kno mitch mcconnell. bestie ra against him, what do you think about these comments >> it is not like mitc mcconnell is having some moral epiphany prior to christma here. he is not breaking wit trump because trump is massively corrupt. he's no breaking with trump because of
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trump's attack on our very democracy and the foundation of our democracy. he i breaking with trump because of electoral defeats. because trump, trump's brand is losing him seats. and one thing we ca almost always be sure of almost always about mitc mcconnell's that for him, it i party over country. party an the power that he wants is mor important even, then what th country needs. and make no mistake, when people say how long is this bridge going to last? he is going to get right back behind donald trump i trump's brand becomes a winnin brand again for the republican party. >> is he going to do anythin legislatively, push his part in congress to take action t ensure that trump wouldn't b able to run again, david >> absolutely not. he had chance to convict donald trump on impeachment charges and tha would ensure that he wouldn'
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be qualified for office agai and he chose not to. the onl reason that we do not make fun of mitchell connell for hi simplicity like we do for kevi mccarthy is because mitc mcconnell is not as obviou about it. but amy is exactly right. mitch mcconnell voted for donald trump, twice, h voted to keep him in office, not to impeachment, and he sai if he is a nominee in 2024 h will support the republica nominee. so he might be done kissing the ring, as you sai before the break, but it i only because he does not lik the way that the tarnish taste on his lips. the moment that donald trump has tha nomination, should he do it in 24, mitch mcconnell will polis everything up and raise it hig for the world to see and say this is the king we need t rule over us and 25. >> he also said that he will quote, actively look for quality candidates to promot and 2024. amy, he is a minorit leader, isn't the toughest job to do that >> i guess theoretically h should have been doing that al along. but i mean, again, just
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what david said, mitch mcconnell had a chance to stop trump. he could have done it he chose to ride the wav because it was important for his own power. and that is wha mitch mcconnell does. and don't expect that to reall ever change. >> comments aren't binding, yo could always take them back, but do you believe these comments could cause any tension or strain betwee mcconnell and kevin mccarthy i desperately trying to lock i power on the house >> kevin mccarthy is trying to make everybody has friends starting with donald trump. so he cannot bring the bridge lik mitch mcconnell can. mitch mcconnell it is personal donald trump arguably lost mitch mcconnell the majority leadership of the u. s. senate in these past midterms. bu here is the interesting thing, mitch mcconnell, kevin mccarthy, ron desantis, mike pompeo, michael rubio, ted cruz, all o
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them want the investigators to get rid of donald trump becaus they are not willing to do i themselves. they want donald trump gone. they want hi convicted. and then they wil play the game of politics fo him and find a new parent th next republican nominee. wha they do not want to do is take on the truth of donald trump's corruption, and try to beat hi at the ballot box. they ar fearful of doing that, including mitch mcconnell an all of his other colleagues. >> okay, maybe i don't understand what it is personal means, how long ago was it tha donald trump went after mitc mcconnell's wife? that wasn' personal? he seems to be oka with that. that is the definition of personal for me. >> of course, honestly, we laugh about kevin mccarthy because he tries to have i every single way. we look at mitch mcconnell as this more seasoned, sober majority leader, it is all garbage. the guy wil say anything he needs to say t beat whoever he wants to be to ensure his own political
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success and that of th republican standard. if it i donald trump he will do it even if it means turning a blind eye to the insults to hi very own wife. there is no reason to give mitch mcconnell credit in this moment, or an moment for the past six year since donald trump emerged. he is as much of a coward as ever single national republican o the playing field today. >> and if what you are seeing, amy, is that mitch mcconnell will not go so far as to tak action, which the committe recommended to ban trump fro running from office again, instead he is just going to do an interview here, and a interview there, and just drop these tents, what do the democrats do to take advantage of this moment where republicans are kind of dodging, weaving, and hiding? >> you know, i think that th democrats, first of all, the january 6th committee did it job. it did his job politicall because it outlined to the american public the systematic attempt that donald trump made to subvert our democracy. trum
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lead it, he knew about it, h knew it was illegal, and he di it anyway. and what it did what that reported was continu to show people, you are neve going to get the full on trump supporters. you're never gonna get all of them. but what yo can do is communicate to independents, and the coalitio of people to make sure tha donald trump, and this is th most important thing, neve gets anywhere near the white house again, or in any positio of political trust ever again. that is what democrats need to focus on. i think they hav done a good job of that so far >> so far, the american vote has been doing that in the las one, two, three elections? midterms, presidential election, and the midterms again. americ voted against him. amy, david, thank you both for being her tonight. coming up, 200 millio americans are under seriou weather warnings tonight. with holiday travel halting coast t
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coast, let's get even more scared. it turns out there i more to worry about. dr. vin gupta is here to talk about th tripledemic and how it i making it harder for kids to get the medicine that they nee right now. p, try vicks nyquil severe. just one dose starts to relieve 9 of your worst cold and flu symptoms, to help take you from 9 to none. for max-strength nighttime relief, nyquil severe. if your company actually practices the values that it posts about, then, yeah... you're on team earth.
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>> we are tracking a ver dangerous winter storm tonight that has already had more than 1 million customers withou power just before christma eve. our own get gutierrez has more
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>> tonight, the brutal arcti blast is racing east, batterin buffalo with a histori blizzard >> this is an epic, statewid hauser. there is no other wa to describe this >> treacherous, whiteout conditions prompting a trave ban throughout the area. we, it's ripping to 69 miles per hour >> there are cars about 35, 40 feet away, we can barely see them >> in ohio, rescues are no scrambling to help drivers caught in the massive pileup >> it's going to be at least two or three miles worth o crashes. >> at least three people hav been killed in kentucky, where it got as cold as eight below. >> the last second shopping is not worth it if it would cos you your life. >> and if that was not enoug there is also growing concer about the flu and covid ahea of holiday gatherings. nbc's sam brock brings us that story >> today cdc reports citin seasonal influenza activit remains high, but is declining in most areas. still, the gain are fragile. especially with
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the holidays upon us >> are we out of the woods yet or do you think america should still be pretty cautious a this point >> no, we are not out of the woods. the upcoming holida season may provide opportunities for even mor spread of these viruses an they could take right up onc again. >> rsv cases have essentiall plateaued, but covid cases deaths, and hospitalizations are all on the rise. and now many are taking extra steps to protect their loved ones >> we have not been going ou that much lately, just to tr to stay safer. >> that is why doctors are getting the flu vaccine now is key, it could offer full protection in 10 to 14 days. >> it is not too late to get vaccinated, but don't linger >> the russia flew cases against a backdrop of empt store shelves for basi medication >> we do not have tylenol, o mulching for kids. it is concerning, because many people,
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parents, kids, they walk out o pharmacies without their medicines. >> back with us tonight, our dear friend dr. vin gupta, a critical care pulmonologist in seattle. he's also on th faculty of the university of washington institute for healt metrics. vin, always good to see you, unfortunately it is never with good news. right now, a lot of healthy people ar vaccinated. they have gone through two, plus years of covid, and they are kind o over taking precautions. the are saying i'm not masking, i' not sitting home, i am livin my life. what do all of thos people need to know headin into next week >> it is always great to see you, good evening. what i woul say to those individuals tha you are protected from somebod like me, especially if you are overall a healthy individual you could be contagious, you could have an infection with the virus, especially during the holidays, new years eve,
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the celebrations, you coul expose somebody who might be medically higher risk, and might not be as well protected and lastly, i will just sa that we should be moving as medical system away from wha if when we get a diagnosis t what now? it is how do w prepare rather than react. s this idea of prescriptions, if you are somebody right now i watching this who is medically at higher risk, have a conversation with your docto and talk about maybe a prescription for something lik paxlovid. so you do not have t navigate a maze to get acces when you need it >> what about parents? shoul we be stocking up knowing that the tripledemic is upon us knowing how hard it was fo school kids, and now we ar heading into the secon semester, and cold winte months. our other drugs that w should simply have on hand i our house, or other things t do to prepare our families
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>> i'm glad you asked that, will keep this very brief fo your viewers here, but i addition to the anti fever medications, the ant inflammatory's, like tylenol if you could get your hands on that that is fantastic. othe symptomatic measures, i ge constant -- doc, i have chronic cough. this can help with the congestion. resilienc breeze, there is saline sprays for kiddos and for adults that can help. a humidifier, we d not use enough of this. this could help just open up, he ca just, great for young kiddos especially battling rsv. lastly, i will just as a fair warning, really quick, digita thermometers are great. if you are having persistent fevers for greater than seven days, i you are coughing up gunk tha
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is yellow green, and you are told that you have a virus on certain amount of days you'r not feeling better, you migh want to get tested again. in some cases you could hav bacterial super infection or a antibiotic might also be necessary. again, if you hav persistent symptoms over a week. last thing i will say, for those other, this is happening in canada, a word of caution. parents are cutting u adult pills thinking that mayb it could be helpful if the can't get their hands on children's pills. being very careful. talk to a pharmacist. if you are going to do, it tal to a pharmacist and make sur that the accurate pill cutte that you will get the righ dose. because children stephanie, unlike adults children it is all weigh based. even for things lik tylenol and ibuprofen. it' really critical to make sure you're doing things properly >> you are giving me flashbacks, is that the bendy straw with the sponge at the end that you sucked through to get whatever gun kids in your kids knows? that thing >> that is exactly right. an
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they also make the salin spray. >> i don't miss that. i know that product works, but i ca tell you that i do not miss it dr. vin gupta, thank you s much for joining, us alway make us smarter, safer, an hopefully healthier. happier holidays. and for you at home, don't go anywhere. guess what? christmas surprise. we hav another hour of the 11th hou coming up right now. we ar going to continue to break dow the january 6th committee' final report, and who better t talk to about it than one of its members? marylan congressman jamie raskin i here next. ♪ music (“i swear”) plays ♪ jaycee tried gain flings for the first time the other day... and forgot where she was. [buzz] you can always spot a first timer. gain flings with oxi boost and febreze. research shows people remember commercials you can always spwith nostalgia.r. so to help you remember that liberty mutual customizes your home insurance, here's one that'll really take you back. wow! what'd you get, ryan? it's customized home insurance from liberty mutual!!! what does it do, bud?
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>> good evening once again, am stephanie ruhle. the januar 6th committee is releasing new evidence from thei investigation. just a few hour ago the panel released 4 separate new transcripts o closed-door interviews wit witnesses. among them, several high-ranking officials from th trump administration. attorney general, bill barr, white hous counsel pat cipollone, secretary of transportation,
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elaine chao, also wife of mitc mcconnell, secretary of stat mike pompeo, and trump's own daughter and senior adviser, ivanka trump. this comes les than 24 hours after th committee dropped its fina report on the january 6t attack. dickey finding from he nearly 18 month investigatio was clear. that without donald trump, the riot would not have happened. let's bring in january 6th committee member and former constitutional la professor congressman jim u. s can. congressman, thank you so much for joining me tonight. i can imagine that you would lov to call it a day. after this week you just had. 845-pag report, huge. but the majority of americans are not going t read it. the bottom line, th bottom takeaway is that what happened was really bad, and donald trump is to blame. ho do you believe that this man i held accountable for doing wha he did
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>> well, as you know, we need referral to the department o justice of violations of fou different criminal statutes, including interference of th federal proceeding, conspiracy to defraud the u. s. governmen and american people, filin false statements with th government in the kelp perfect electors, and aiding and assisting and abetting and giving aid and comfort insurrectionists. we think tha we have comprehensive an overwhelming documentary proof of all of these charges. w were, if anything, ver conservative and very cautious in the charges that we advanced. so we hope and trust that the executive branch of government and the new special counsel, jack smith, will do their job and that it will not just be foot soldiers who ar prosecuted and go to jail, but king pins involved here. and the central, you know, the central mastermind of the whol
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attempt to overthrow the election and the governments are held accountable and for the rest of us, we have got to make sure that we ar fortifying democrati institutions against coups and electrical sabotage an insurrections and politica violence in the future, an making sure that we ar incurring the right to vote in democratic control ove government in all of our law and institutions >> so, let's call your recommendations the idea scenario. if you and i wer doing this interview one yea from now tonight, what would b the scenario where you would say yes, donald trump has face real consequences, and he ha been held accountable. wha would that look like, what would you want to see happen t him? >> you know, there are hundred of people who have already bee prosecuted and convicted and gone to jail. we are going t have to leave it up to the prosecutors and leave it up to the courts to determine it. bu
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i think that there needs to be a serious reckoning of individual accountability fo the people who sat all of th events into motion. is there anybody in the country who believes that any of this woul have happened absent donal trump's will? he was the one who got the groups to change the date and the time of their permits from january 21st. the were going to protest after jo biden was inaugurated to january 6th. he was the one wh galvanized extreme right in th country to focus on th peaceful transfer of power a the target of their wrath, and violent. it was the one wh spread the big lie. he was the one who tried to get the legislators to overturn th popular results to try to ge these state election officials to fabricate thousands of fake votes for trump. he was the on who tried to stage a mini coup at the department of justice and just get the doj to clea the election was corrupt and leave the rest to hi
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republican friends in th house. and finally, he was the one who decided to focus everybody's attention on mik pence, and ultimately to say i the middle of the riot, he didn't have the courage to d what needed to be done, furthe inciting and exhorting the crowd which was alread chanting hang mike pence. an they had already set up in the crowd. it is just impossible t think, of this happening without donald trump being the central instigator of the whol thing. and if somebody has got a theory as to why it wa really antifa that didn't, the bring the evidence forward. bu our bipartisan committee found no evidence of involvement b antifa. i don't know what othe theories are. this is not an agatha christy novel. we kno exactly who done it. >> you are obviously not going
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to tell us who, but in the las 24 hours since the report wa released, have you privately heard from any of your republican colleagues? >> i think a lot of them are having a quitters remorse abou what happened in the senate in the impeachment trial. i tol the republicans that i have th opportunity to speak to that they needed to vote to convict because the facts and the la compelled it, because th constitution required it, an because the country needed it. but if nothing else they hav to do it to save their own party because donald trump would come to destroy thei party. and we are seeing tha unfold right now. becaus donald trump has been expose to the world as the person who orchestrated all of thes events to try to topple ou constitutional order and seize
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the presidency, and yet he i now completely it's constantly republican party and they ar very afraid that if they do no nominate him he will take 30 o 40% of the party with him. tha could be the end of the gop, o lincoln's party. in th meantime, he has inspired al kinds of students, like the gu who just won the election from new york, santos, whose entire resume is a complete tissue of fraud. i mean, his entir identity is counterfeit.,, follows in the wake of donal trump and what he has done t lincoln's party. >> without a doubt. but, doe that in any way make you wonder, if it -- if his resume was put together with tissue paper, wh didn't his opponent blow his nose with it >> well that is a separate problem. but i would like to know exactly what happened t the simple candidate oppositio research. i can assure you tha that will never happen again especially with all of donal
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trump's students taking over the republican party all ove the country. these are peopl who are in it like donald trum pass a moneymaking proposition and may have nothing els available to them in their lives and are deciding to tr to use public offices an opportunity for self enrichmen and for business profit making >> this last question might be a stretch but it has been on m mind for the last day and realize that there is not an agency or mechanism for this cassidy hutchinson took an extraordinary risk, a true patriot in testifying. when we read what she went through i was like straight out of the mob movie. does the committee, or the government have any sor of protection or support for a person in her position right now?
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>> well, the congress of the united states does not have witness protection program and similar functional equivalence but clearly, the fbi does, the department of justice does there are other law enforcemen agencies which do. i do no know exactly what cassid hutchinson is involved in no in terms of her testifying, an being a witness but i certainl hope that one way or another she is getting good security and good protection becaus these people have run out of arguments and at this point, intimidation and coercion ar all really what they seem to have left. but when they say that our investigation was one-sided, i just tell them ye it was one-sided. it was one side of the truth, and the facts, and we had a bipartisan committee that was committed t one thing, which is getting to the truth and the facts. the have some alternative theories about how it was really antifa
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that did this and it wasn' donald trump, bring it on, w would like to see it. but at this point, the vast majorit of the witnesses were member of the trump administration, the trump white house, or th trump family. so if they say i was a partisan investigation it does look like it was a republican investigation but there were some democrat involved, too. so it was reall a bipartisan investigation >> lastly, before we go, one o your recommendations he woul like to see a move to ba donald trump from being able t run and hold office again. d you have any reason to believe when you hear mitch mcconnell' comments that donald trump has hurt the party, they need to distance themselves from him do you have any reason t believe that come a week or tw from now when we have a divide government, republicans will actually agree with you an make real moves to stop trum from running again >> they claim to b constitutional textualists, an
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original lists, so they need t read section three of the 14th amendment which settles th whole subject. it says tha anyone who is swearing an oath to support the constitution of the united states but violates the oath by engaging i insurrection or rebellion guess the constitution may never hold office again at the federal level, state level military, or civilian. that is a constitutional principle. if they want to change th constitution they should mov to amend the constitution an get a two thirds vote in the house and the senate and go ou to three quarters of the state but right now that is a law we are dealing with. it is not question of what the january 6th committee wants, it is wha our constitution says. s either we will be faithful t the constitution or we are not we believe that that is self actualize-ing, self executin principle that the courts have to follow. but we do recommend that congress undertake action to set up a judicial mechanism that would allow the departmen of justice and private parties to go to court and the distric of columbia, u. s. distric
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court in d. c., in order to ge declaratory and injunctive relief saying that somebody wa an insurrectionist. but some courts have already said tha they can just do it, they don' need to wait for congressional action. and of course, congres has already determined by bipartisan way that donald trump incited insurrection against the union. and even in the senate, there were 57 vote out of 100 for that proposition, and he was impeached for it on the house side. so we can sa that it already exists as legislative fact in the countr that donald trump incite insurrection >> all right congressman before we go, people acros this country are about to walk into christmas dinners. they are going to be talking to their family members about thi report. most of whom will no have read it. what is the on message you want people to tak away? this report taught us, next
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>> this report taught us tha we have to watch people who ge into power, which is a basic lesson of the framework of the constitution. the rule of la is all about controlling peopl who take public office and political power. because som of them will have readil ambition and they will attempt to do everything, includin inciting violent mobs agains us in order never to leave power. so that is the oldest story in the book. if you want to make democracy work, you, yourself have got to get involved and you have to stand over the principles of the constitution and for democrati freedom. >> hence the phrase, inform an active citizenry. about an hou ago i said what does that mean you just give us the answer. congressman jamie raskin, than you for joining us, i really appreciate it. >> thank you stephanie, happ holidays >> you too. let's bring in our legal panel to discuss, my dea friend barbara mcquade is here
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veteran federal prosecutor and former u. s. attorney for th eastern district of michigan she worked with the department of justice during the bide transition and is now professor at the university of michigan school of law, an former new york prosecutor and civil rights attorney charle coleman. barb, to you first, what is your reaction to wha the congressman just laid out? >> well, i think we've got a real national treasure and jamie raskin he is a constitutional law scholar with a dee appreciation for the history o this country but he has the ability t translate it to ordinary members of the public, which i think is incredibly important. the report details a coup. you know, if i would answer th questions that he just did, yo know, this report is about wha it is that trump tried to stea power from joe biden, with a coup he tried to overturn the vot of the people, and that' apparent in this report. and so, you know, what comes next after this is potential criminal prosecution, but yo know, there are a lot of way to hold people accountable, an
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criminal prosecution is just one of them. documenting these facts for th historical record is another it is a way to hold donald trump accountable for th history that is yet to come in this country and you hope that school children will learn thes lessons in their school books, and it will reinforce values about the rule of law an democracy, so this never happens again. >> here's someone who deeply understands how the rule of la works, and how to avoid tellin the truth. bill barr in his transcript, h cannot recall if there was tal of the 25th amendment, and m team was going through his transcript right now, and they are telling me a whole lot o do not recall, do not recall do not recall's. do you buy that, barr? we're talking about th attorney general the two-time attorney genera of the united states o america. >> you know, certainly, people have questions from time t time, in these sort of settings, and they usually don't recal things but i'm a little suspicious of any of these witnesses sayin
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they don't recall, after the testimony of cassidy hutchinson, who told us the way she wa coached, approached, which was if you say you don't recall, they can't prove what you do and don't know, so that's no perjury, if you just say you don't recall, the goal is to b least helpful as possible, s that they spend as little time with you, and don't want t come back to you again that's an interesting strategy and you know, most lawyers when they are preparin witnesses, do not follow the strategy the bottom line, as you were t tell the truth, and make sur you understand the question, you don't have to voluntee information. but it did end of the day, you have to tell the truth and so, all of this, i don't recall, certainly raises a eyebrow, you know, certainly there's some instances where that may be truthful but you, know some of thes assistance he just said, did everyone invoke the 25th amendment? my gosh, that is such an issue of such magnitude. how would you forget that, right? would that slip your mind?
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so, it strikes me as worthy of further investigation, let's say that >> that sort of nonsense of it all, right we say to our kids, you can' possibly say i do not recall, do not recall. it might make you a joke it might make you unscrupulous but. the fact of the matter is, you absolutely can say it, as yo can see right here, bill barr, ivanka trump, kayleigh mcenany charles, what's your reactio to what we heard fro congressman raskin >> well, i appreciat congressman raskin and his wor with respect to the committee. i do think that accountability and that's one of the things h testified upon in the end, it' something that all of us are going to wrestle, in terms o what's gonna look like accountability for some people means that we can pressure fro donald, trump and he ends up behind bars. i don't know if that's the typ of accountability we're gonn see. for some people, accountabilit is just the fact that he may b indicted and prosecuted. and for others, accountability is, the ultimate result of the midterms if you think about wha
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happened as a result of th country's backlash about wha they learned during the course of the committee's findings, and the pushback and the sto of the red wave, if you will during the midterms, for som people, that's wha accountability looks like. but i think the notion o accountability being lifted narrative is not one unfortunately it's going to be enough i stick to barbara's opinion but it's not gonna be enough t people to understand and learn the lessons in history book, because ultimately the rule of law vis-ã -vis prosecution, it doesn't hold up. it's not something that people are going to say it counts because they're goin to look at what happened, an then they're gonna want to say that these people will hav gotten in office so, first and foremost, i'm big fan of narrative and getting the narrativ correctly. i think that you actually have to reinforce this with consequences of some sort. and that's why the clock is on for jackson. >> then what's gonna happen to the j, charles, when they're met with the, i do not recal symphony, that clearly was sounded over the last 18 months it's common. ivanka, two months from now,
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ivanka isn't gonna go, you kno what, actually - i forgot, x y z happened baloney, she's never talking >> sure. i think there is a couple of things that i would respond to that, and i would imagin barbara would agree with me as a former prosecutor. never let a witness just leave with the, i do not recall, without asking additiona follow-up questions. that would make them see ridiculous so, for example, with a 25th amendment, like what barbara just said, if questioning bill barr, i'm gonna ask him, fro your experience as an attorney from your experience as th attorney general, have you eve had someone invoke the 25t amendment? since it's never happened, don't you think it's likel that you would likely remember if it did or if they didn't. so, it's one of those things that is so large, just lik getting a call from th president, for example, an saying, i don't remember if you are a person, you normally would not speak to th president. the idea that you would get call from the president is something that you would remember, and you woul
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remember the conscience of so, as a prosecutor, you'r going to zero in on that, an try to narrow the actual reasonable list of what's if that they're saying, so that's it see they're clear tha they're lying, or it's goo they have a well credibility issue. the other thing i want to sa very quickly, when you'r talking about jack smith and the doj, they are conducting a additional investigation and so, the fbi is going to be probing a lot more of thei story, in terms of the other people who are connected t that witness so, to find out whether they'r telling the truth. and so, what a witness may hav said to congress is up to th committee in the deposition of those transcripts. it may not necessarily b working stop in terms of jac smith, the fbi, and the do notes investigation. >> getting caught lying an having to face real legal or criminal consequences, tha might impact a lot of thes people but just looking ridiculous, i have a sinking feeling a lot o them are a okay with it. barbara mcquade, charles coleman, thank you so much for joining us when we come back -- preventing another january 6th
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the new changes, just passed b congress, help us, help us sto another jan sixth? we're gonna find out and later, michael beschloss and it's a christmas miracle jon meacham, they're both here to break down a truly stor wind ♪ ♪ ♪ peaceful state. full plate. wait, are you my blind date? dancing crew. trip for two. nail the final interview. buy or lease? masterpiece. inside joke. artichoke. game with doug. brand new mug. come here, kid. gimme a hug. have you gotten your updated covid-19 booster?
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ugh! but, we found other interests. i guess we have. [both] finch! let's go! oh yeah! it's not the same. what could you do to solve the problem? we could get xfinity? that's actually super adult of you to suggest. i can't wait to squad up. i love it when you talk nerdy to me. guy, guys, guys, we're still in session. ♪ ♪ ♪ and i don't know what the heck you're talking about. >> one of the major goals of the january 6th committee wa to find a way to make sure something like it never, eve happens again. and late this afternoon, the house took a big step in tha direction, passing the 1. trillion dollar omnibus fundin bill one part of it modernizes th electoral count act, making it a whole lot harder for someone to try, what trump tried to do in 2020. joining me now to discuss is leigh mcgowan, aka the interne 's very popular and informativ politics girl. and former florida republica
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congressman, carlos curbelo, now an msnbc political analyst carlos, can explain how th update of the electoral coun act is gonna work? >> well, steph, what i'll tell you is what i think is mos important. so, we know what donald trum thought the weak spot was. he thought that he could convince mike pence to just ge up there on that speakers rush room in the house, and just do whatever he wanted, cancel votes, declare certain votes invalid. so, the most important thing people have to understand abou this electoral count act refor is that it makes it very clear that the vice president's role is purely ministerial. the vice president does no have any discretion to allow o disallow certain electors to recognize certain votes and no others and that's important, becaus it eliminates the human elemen in all of this we were very fortunate tha mike pence, on that day, decided to do the right thing. that may not be the case in th future this reform takes care of that it happened in a bipartisa
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cooperation. mitch mcconnell signaled month ago that this was important to him as well, and now, it's the law of the land, and hopefully people don't have to worry about this kind of event eve again. >> doing what you do best, how would you explain th importance of this to th average person >> i think you have to look at it, like, the electoral coun act was written in the late 18 80s, right so, it's horse somebod language and it's that kind of language that allows some of someon like donald trump, whose kin of the loopholes, to find a wa and say, well, wait a second what if i did it like this and they were like, that's actually not written down that you can do it like that, but everyone knows, it's ceremonial everyone knows that it's bee approved by all of the states. they've all sent their slate o electors and they said, well, what if w don't do that. and i think with this language
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is saying is that you can't. you're trying to play a card that no one should play, and what it's officially sayin that that card is taken out of the deck >> loophole, officially closed carlos, in your opinion, i this reform enough to stop trump or someone like him? >> in terms of what he specifically tried to do on th 6th of january, to influence or to manipulate his vic president, to just get up on that ross trump, and say, hey, you know, whatever the law is, ignore it. you have the power, as he told the multiple times, mike, yo have the power, people are counting on us that's no longer an option for anyone because the law now i very explicit in that the vice president is just like any other person up there. they have to accept th electors that are said by th states, and they have to preside over the ceremony. it's a ceremony. this is not, like, whe congress gets together, an there is debate, and people tr to influence one another it's a ceremony, and the law makes it clear now that it's a ceremony and that the will of each stat
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has to be respected. so, this is very important it's a bipartisan achievement. look, a lot of people in the country didn't get the kind of elections they wanted, but people should know, as we go into the holidays, that this i a gift to the nation, becaus it's gonna make our democrac stronger it's gonna protect our kasea freedoms >> something under every american's christmas tree. leigh, this full report is ove 800 pages long how would you go about breakin it down for the general public what do people need to know? >> i think the figures, we'r gonna take a long time t figure out what we really need to know. like you said, it's a 2045 pages long i think that what the committe has done is extraordinary. i think what we should look at the committee asked, honestly, the biggest gift that we could
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have got was to see government or king the way it's suppose to work, efficiently, by the rules, by the book in fact, if anything, we wer given a gift when the 9/11 commission was turned down and we've got this bipartisa committee because we don't hav a lot of people trying to ge their own talking points on th air. what we got was a bunch of ver serious politicians, doing their job, and the america public was able to see wha happens when government works. and now we have this repor that's gonna take us, obviously, months and months for people t go through and diligentl digest but i think we're gonna find that a lot of shocking thing are gonna come out of this and we have to be ready an open minded about it and what i always say to people's, democracy is the participation sport. so, we have to watch, as thi unfolds. we have to read about this we have to talk at our dinin room tables about what's discovered in this, so that we don't do this again, so we learn from this, so improv from this. we have to ask questions we have to be curious, and w have to talk to our people as the details from this repor
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unfold >> quickly, before we go, no should they, will they carlos, we've been saying fo years, will ex be the thin that makes the gop believe donald trump wasn't for all? and it hasn't happened yet will this report be the thin that does it >> well, steph, i don't know i it was a coincidence but today, mitch mcconnell for the first time in years now, explicitly, in an intervie with nbc news, went at donal trump, and said that he's goin to actively oppose donal trump's candidacy in 2024. so, look, i don't think it's the kind of thing where we'r gonna say, of, there it is today, they're trump-ing donal trump. but i think it's happening little by little i think that's good for th country. i also happen to think tha that's a good thing for th republican party >> well, we'll soon find out leigh mcgowan, carlos curbelo, thank you so much for joinin us tonight when we come back, as we close out the year, how did democrac fare in 2022, and what's gonna look like in 2023?
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>> [applause >> the january 6th committee final report is out. >> willie, the committee has written a living document fo the public to take advantage of >> accountability's coming >> a very busy week to close just watching that makes you want to fall asleep. a very busy week closing out and even busier and more consequential year and according to our next tw guests, we started 2022 as divided as we have ever been since lincoln. if the midterms are an indication, we and democracy
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prevailed, yet again here now, celebrated author an presidential historian michael beschloss. his latest book, presidents of war. joining us also here, historia jon meacham, occasionall advises president biden. he's the author of many, man amazing things but most recently, and the there was light: abraham lincoln and the american struggle both are out now gentlemen, merry christmas happy new year i'm grateful for all that yo do for us. i'm grateful for you friendship when i talk about this week, and this year. jon, think about our democracy and the hurdles we crossed thi year what's your take away? >> well, you think about thi administration, it began in an era of disease, distrust, an insurrection, in january 2021. and besides that, this i lincoln's house -- right and here we are, 23 months later, and just enough of us and remember, that's wha democracy is, this is not a 90
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ten proposition. it's barely a 60 4 proposition. it's really 51 49. we'll just enough of us decide that for all its imperfections the constitutional order i worth preserving because it ha in fact produced, a more perfect union. and we want to preserve thos possibilities. what you saw in the midter elections with the defeat of the clearly wrong, cynical misled election deniers, wha they vote for truth. we can disagree on policy. i think we all pray for moment where we go, and we are all arguing about rising tax rates again, right let's take it, right that's fine. beschloss said, we fantasize about this, you know, give only what we can have, bob early george mitchell fighting again.
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but if we disagree about reality, and then we are doomed american democracy is not reality show it is reality. and i think just enough of u have recognized that a new >> well, what's the reality of where we are right now, michael? because democracy ha prevailed. >> democracy has prevailed, an let us just enjoy this moment. this year is closing in wonderful way. you know, with the beginning o this year, there was the chanc that there would be justic john, an election in which fiv or six key states for th election of 2024 would b dominated by election deniers, and threats of violence. and we could have lost a ver big part of our democracy. that did not happen. the people spoke, and they mad the right choice and then, now, we've got thi january 6th committee report
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let's imagine if that had no happened, if that had no happened, and if you had not had this committee, the hous saying that there was an insurrection, and it almos succeeded, almost took away ou democracy. and donald trump was at th center of it if you didn't have a repor saying that, you know, democracy is, to some extent what we normalize. and if that had been normalized, candidates of the future, wh lose presidential elections an other elections, would hav done what kari lake is doing i arizona. they would have said i reall won the election, and you know let's have some turbulence t demonstrate that i should be installed, even though, yo know, the voters and tha institution's say otherwise. so, between the election o this year and the january 6t report, sort of reminds me, 60 years ago, president kennedy had an interview in the oval office with reporters from the three networks, and was just after the cuban missile crisis and he said i think we ought t be rather pleased with ourselves this christmas he said that because he just been through the cuban missile crisis well, this was not a missile
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crisis, but we've been through big threats to our democracy we survived and prospered. the system is working. >> jon, democracy, i'm jus gonna, say it wasn't o everyone's minds we're gonna say that extraordinary speech fro ukrainian president zelensky earlier this week, we haven' seen congress this unified in really long time, have we? >> no, and i think that again, it's a hopeful sign. it's a battle not the war, speaking metaphorically. president zelenskyy is a reminder that this isn't laser tag, right that democracy, the future o democratic capitalism, human rights, this isn't just stuf people tweet about and post on their own social media sites they set up because they incit insurrection and get thrown of another, right this is a real thing what's unfolding in the larges european struggle in several
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generations, is the oldest kin of human dynamic someone strong see someone h believe is weaker, and onc what they have they want to take. putin wants to take. what democracy is about is poo of law that protects the wee from the strong. and creates what lincoln calle an open field and a fair chance and that's the perennial perennial struggle and what the caveat here, as w close out this year, is that a we have seen, thes institutions at home and abroa are inherently fragile, becaus they are human institutions. and we are fragile, and ou struggle in our own hearts and minds and souls between ou better angels and our wors instincts is a perennial one we have to remind ourselves al
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the time that when those bette angels prevail, all of us to better >> for the last five or si years, michael, we've been concerned, you've been concerned that we no longe agree on what is right or wrong, or common set of truths. but as we close out the year president zelenskyy, with th exception of a few far-right rabble rousers, that prett extraordinary bipartisan support this week, so as you look to 2023, is there a chanc that maybe we are coming bac to a more rational place >> it would soar be nice t think, and i think the other evening was a harbinger of that i agree with you, stephanie. because you know, one of the toughest things i think jo would agree for a president to do is get americans to mak pretty big sacrifices for place that they know ver little about that's what george h. w. bus tried to do in kuwait, in 1990
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1991, and said it's not just kuwait, we're trying t establish the principle that a country can't just invad another, and take it because they feel like it. that's something that presiden biden was able to do this day, or was able to do with ukraine with the american people and the other thing is that, you know, back to the beginnin of this country, jefferson and others hoped the condition o democracy would spread aroun the world, that the people who love freedom would fight for it, even if it meant that they would die for. that's what we're seeing i ukraine. so, at the same time as we are seeing democracy strengthen, and i hope to god, strengthene permanently, at least throug our lifetimes in the unite states, we see brave ukrainian fighting for democracy and freedom in their own country i think -- they would shed a tear one other thing if i might say stephanie, and another historical event tomorrow is your birthday. if i could say to all of our friends were watching, happy birthday
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i don't know better thin better than to have a birthday right on the day befor christmas, and during th holiday season >> my birthday, as well as doctor anthony fauci's thank you both that is very, very kind of you to say, i'm not really a birthday person. i think birthdays are like serial, they're there fo children not for adults it's christmas, we've go bigger things already. thank you both that is so, so kind of you it is great to see you both. happy holidays >> be well >> when we come back - these gentlemen are making m blush. -- a triple dose of paying forward, with the kindness o strangers this holiday ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ my name is austin james. as a musician living with diabetes, fingerst a real chal. that's why i use the freestyle libre 2 system.
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because it's not goodbye, world. it's hello, team earth. [clap] >> excuse me, question i forgot my wallet at home is there any chance i could ge a decent bread >> no problem. you want something to eat? do you want a cup of coffee? i'll pay that for you. >> are you sure? why are you doing that >> well we should be nice to each other [inaudible >> i'm zachary, by the way nice to see you. are you sure >> yes, i'll pay for it. i'm very sure. if i wasn't sure, i wouldn't d it we have to be kind to each other. it's okay. >> thank you so much >> if you can do something nic to somebody every day, pay i forward. >> can i pay it forward righ now? >> pay it forward to somebody. >> i've got $1,000 right here. oh my god -- >> this guy something else >> for you >> i'll pay forward back t you.
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>> what? >> yeah! i love you >> i love you too! >> what's your message to th world? >> we should be kind, not to b hateful. my mother said, we have common blood, there is no white blood and black blood. >> that woman right there, she deserves all the headlines not people pushing conspirac theories or stories abou jewish lasers. that woman talking about lov and kindness and togetherness. and that is the last thing before we go tonight the season of giving is what w talk all about remember, this country has unity, has good people, despit the fact that every day we tal about division, people fighting, undermining one another. there are good people doin good things every single day and i want to close this show, this year for me, mike taking moment to highlight a couple o stories of every day americans who pay it forward they do it in all sorts of way
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but especially right around th holidays with jonathan warner, he's a 12-year-old boy from cambridge minnesota. every year he goes above and beyond to sell popcorn for the scouts but it's not for the reason yo think. our local affiliate in minneapolis as that with a special story that i want to share. >> reporter: no longer selling -- >> so, we are going shopping t buy the christmas presents for the foster care children and for the domestic - >> reporter: let that sink in. with his share, the proceeds from selling popcorn, jonathan is buying christmas gifts fo people living in the domesti violence shelter and for every foster child we, in for, and part of a fifth. >> my dad was in foster care when he was a kid. it did not sound like he had a christmas. it kind of reminds me of peopl i would make happy during th holidays it just makes me happy
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>> all these presents, together, are around $11,300 >> reporter: and a dad who gre up in foster care. and that inspired his son. -- to make christmas better. >> he has so much privatel just wants to go bigger an bigger >> reporter: jonathan's goal someday, gifts, for ever foster child in the state. >> i just want to make kid happy for christmas, and let them know that their loved and appreciated. >> lastly -- another great person lester holt introduces us to another young teen makin spirits bright this holida season and she is doing it with a little bit of help from a majo league starter >> reporter: at this elementar school in houston, texas holiday gifts are piled high ready to be opened by some deserving students, all thanks to lily. >> i love kids, and enjoy that i see on their faces when they get a toy -- >> reporter: the 13-year-old started lilies toy box back in
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2017, after hearing about some children who lost everything during hurricane harvey. lilly wanted to help, so she gave away ten toys, but sh didn't stop there. lilies toy box became nonprofit, and so far, she's given away 40,000 toys and this holiday season, she i hit a home run, with a littl help from her friend houston astros alex bregman, and his wife reagan. together, the trio handed ou 1500 president presents, actually, make that 1501 a lucky student got to spend time with her favorite player. as your player, jeremy pena. >> say hi. >> hi! >> reporter: a holiday t remember, and a go girl hoping to inspire others with the gif of giving this christmas >> these amazing kids ar reminding us this holida season of a message we like to share all the time on this show if you need help, please, as for it
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but if you can give help please, give it. thank you so much for watching tonight, and throughout th year i wish all of you a very goo and a very safe night. special thanks to my 11th hour team, and to everyone who' been with us every single night, even those who are probabl complaining about me on twitte right now. i love and appreciate you too. from all our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, than you for joining us tonight have an amazing holida weekend. and i will see you next year ♪ ♪ ♪ peaceful state. full plate. wait, are you my blind date? dancing crew. trip for two. nail the final interview. buy or lease? masterpiece. inside joke. artichoke. game with doug. brand new mug. come here, kid. gimme a hug. have you gotten your updated covid-19 booster? they're designed to help protect against recent omicron variants. schedule yours at
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