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tv   Cross Talk  RT  October 30, 2019 4:30pm-5:31pm EDT

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saying we need to rethink the 1st amendment because it's really sort of out of date and out of step with the rest of the world to have unlimited free speech i exist as i say a world to have unlimited free speech i i didn't i say as i say as a factual historical matter i agree with what you did as i say as a factual historical matter i agree with what you did but i sort of wonder what is now the official line coming down from washington out i sort of wonder what is now the official line coming down from washington how intolerant will be about what is your what out isn't a genocide in you know guster opinion or intolerant will be about what is your would our reason to genocide in you know guster opinion of nancy pelosi. and if we just took a little bit more about to understand us politics nancy pelosi. and if we just talk a little bit more about to understand us politicians have proposed new legislation the calling on some to put sanctions on stations of propose new legislation the
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calling on some to put sanctions on turkey now that you know ticking there is a friend and ally turkey now that you know ticking there is a friend and ally is the lawmakers in washington trying to put some distance now between the u.s. and turkey. the lawmakers in washington trying to put some distance now between the u.s. and turkey. they are but there's again there's there's there's a method to their madness they are but there's again there's there's there's a method to their madness here and they talk about isis isis them the genocide of the kurds and all these things it's quite clear and they talk about isis isis them the genocide of the kurds and all these things it's quite clear what they don't want to see is president trump actually complete american player what they don't want to see is president trump actually complete an american role from syria which by the way is totally totally illegal under both international role from syria
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which by the way is totally totally illegal under both international and american domestic law because this would allow pretty russia an american domestic law because this would allow pretty russia syria and iran to cooperate on putting an end to this war in eastern syria syria and iran to cooperate on putting an end to this war in eastern syria bringing the kurds back under syrian government control and starting to wrap up this area bringing the kurds back under syrian government control and starting to wrap up this war and that's the last thing they want they want to american forces to stay there we have to guard the old war and that's the last thing they want they want to american forces to stay there we have to guard the oil and so forth which we don't we never say from whom and and as as a show shanks i actually still still believe in them in their opinion a political game where we have to keep pressure on the syrian government block the russian in
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a political game where we have to keep pressure on the syrian government block the russians and the iranians jim good to get your thoughts on this former u.s. diplomat jim jeffords margins and the iranians jim good to get your thoughts on this former u.s. diplomat jim jefferies my guests thank you. thank you didn't jim thank you to you forget thank you. thank you didn't jim thank you to you for cheating in stay with a bit longer but with more at the top of the hour. it shooting in stay with us a bit longer i'm back with more at the top of the hour. glass keyser with more of my. i'm max kaiser one more of my guide to
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financial survival this is. a guide to financial survival this is. my shoes by professional scallywags to earn money. for my shoes by professional scallywags to earn money. that's right this has clearly not accountable and we're just getting more and more to that that's right these hedge funds are completely not accountable and we're just getting more and more to the. destabilize the global economy you need to protect yourself. stabilize the global economy you need to protect yourself and get informed. and get informed.
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and welcome to cross talk we're all. hello and welcome to cross talk we're all things are considered times peter lavelle all across the middle east and beyond there are large scale protests and things are considered times peter lavelle all across the middle east and beyond there are large scale protests and growing political instability in many countries the old ways of doing business with only growing political instability in many countries the old ways of doing business with only in rich privileged elite while the prospects for the many are few and far in between rich privileged elite while the process. stakes for the many are few and
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far in between the elites have answers for today's growing problems. for the elites have answers for today's growing problem. rostock in global instability i'm joined by my guest. was talking global instability i'm joined by my guest james jackets and watch and he's a former u.s. diplomat and former advisor to the u.s. senate republicans jaharis and watch and he's a former u.s. diplomat and former advisor to the us senate republican leadership in plymouth we have he is the executive editor of the news website look in leadership in plymouth we have he is the executive editor of the news website 21st century wired dot com and in norman we cross to joshua landis he is the 21st century wired dot com and in
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norman we cross to joshua landis he is director of the center of middle east studies at the university of oklahoma all right gentlemen crossed director of the center of middle east studies at the university of oklahoma all right gentlemen cross talk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate joshua let me go to you 1st in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate joshua let me go to you 1st in norman all across the globe we have iraq we have we have lebanon we have in norman all across the globe we have iraq we have we have lebanon we have chile we have many other places around the world plus we have the whole division of chile we have many other places around the world plus we have the whole division over brags that in the u.k. we have the division in the united states there's a lot of over brags that in the u.k. we have the division in the united states there's a lot of instability out there but i want to talk about the specific country of lebanon just to start off here along stability out there but i want to talk about
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the specific. country of lebanon just to start it off here a lot of people say that it is the bellwether for the region what happens there fatah people say that it is the bellwether for the region what happens there 1st is an indication of what possibly and probably will happen in a number of other countries 1st is an indication of what possibly and probably will happen in a number of other countries in the region how do you reflect upon that go ahead joshua well i think you're right left in the region how do you reflect upon that go ahead joshua. well i think you're right lebanon is one of the is the 3rd most indebted country in the world riad salame a going on as one of the is the 3rd most indebted country in the world riad salame a the head of the central bank said that the country will crash economically if these protests are the head of the central bank said it the country will crash economically if these protests go on much longer but the protests are in many ways i think reflects go on much longer but the protests are in many ways i think
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a reflection of tremendous change in the world a an income gap that is yawning but i mean rich and poor and we can see that from a corruption of tremendous change in the world a an income gap that is yawning but i mean rich and poor and we can see that from across the world you know europe is the most equal part of the world and 3rd process the world you know europe is the most equal part of the world at 30 percent of wealth is held by the top 10 percent but the middle east the percent of wealth is held by the top 10 percent but the middle east is the worst it's 61 percent of all wealth is held by the top 10 percent is the worst it's 61 percent of all wealth is held by the top 10 percent now russia and america are hovering in the middle but percentage now russia and america are hovering in the middle but but it's that you
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know the world is becoming more and more unequal and but it's that you know the world is becoming more and more unequal and i think in places where you have bad governments like lebanon iraq egypt i think in places where you have bad governments like lebanon iraq egypt syria you're seeing this kind of explosion of syria you're seeing this kind of explode. of real you know there's not enough jobs there is bad government people are robbing at the top and real you know there's not enough jobs there is bad government people are robbing at the top and the public feels like they're getting a very bad deal and they're up in arms and the public feels like they're getting a very bad deal and they're up in arms you know patrick and i did everything that joshua just said there but we have these rules you know patrick and i did
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everything that joshua to said there but we have these ruling elites as i said in my introduction you know still doing business as usual the old ways here elites as i said in my introduction you know still doing business as usual the old ways here and this is a real wake up call and one more thing we look at the disparity in income we can look and this is a real wake up call and one more thing we look at the disparity in income we can look at the usefulness of a lot of these countries a lot of people. under age at the usefulness of a lot of these countries a lot of people. under 18 and what prospects do they have here but my issue is with governance here team and what prospects do they have here but my issue is with governance here what's it going to take because as joshua pointed out here this is this can explode it is what's it going to take because as joshua pointed out here this is this can explode it is exploding go ahead patrick you know this is a very difficult topic to kind of sick splode and go ahead patrick. you know this
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is a very difficult topic to kind of get your head around because there's so many uprisings or political much political and get your head around because there's so many uprisings or political much political unrest happening simultaneously and i think there's a tendency by the media by political unrest happening simultaneously and i think there's a tendency by the media by political commentators by economists and political economist to try to commentators by economists and political economist to try to find some generalized terms to sort of describe what's like a global phenomena and some generalized terms to sort of describe what it's like a global phenomenon i think that was a mistake that the west made with the arab spring by putting it all meant on i think that was a mistake that the west made with the arab spring by putting it all into one kind of soup and i think the reality is you have you have different into one kind of
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soup and i think the reality is you have you have different aspects and different characteristics with each of these there are common aspects and different characteristics with each of these there are commonalities however if you want to talk about overarching frameworks for and ality is however if you want to talk about overarching frameworks for analyzing this you've got post colonial identity issues you've got post colonial border mobilizing this you've got post colonial identity issues you've got post colonial border mapmaking issues that are still plaguing places like the middle east all the way back from making issues that are still plaguing places like the middle east all the way back from the old war one you've got neo liberal policies elian of neo liberal palm world war one you've got neo liberal policies elian of neo liberal policies you have u.s. meddling which would go under the banner of imperial seas you have u.s.
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meddling. which would go under the banner of imperialism you could say u.s. foreign policy this is also a big big issue you could say u.s. foreign policy this is also a big big issue how that effects and how it has affected a lot of these countries in regions and you also have how that effects and how it has affected a lot of these countries in regions and you also have the failure of soviet era collectivist social economic failure of soviet era collectivist social economic structures and dependency issues and also dependency issue structures and dependency issues and also dependency issues with all of these countries economically i mean you look at a country like lebanon they have use with all of these countries economically i mean you look at a country like lebanon they have absolutely nothing that they produce they import everything their economic absolutely nothing that they produce they import
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everything they are economically completely dependent on things like foreign aid and in ngo sector akali completely dependent on things like foreign aid and an ngo sector economy that sort of drives the middle class in that country that's just one example of that sort of drives the middle class in that country that's just one example so it's it is very difficult i think hong kong is also has been missed care of so it's it is very difficult i think hong kong is also has been mischaracterized by the press because it's it wasn't just up pricked arised by the press because it wasn't just an uprising. this is just how do. you do this it would had something to do with a change a change isn't just because one is going to have an imported revolution this is indicative of the into individual and ported revolution this is in. it could have
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of the into individualized young middle class global citizen yeah that exists. young middle class global citizen yeah that exists virtually their identity from social media and i think that also drives a change virtually their identity from social media and i think that also drives change drives it but they don't know where to go with this change well the political organizing isn't there the drives it but they don't know where to go with this change well the political organizing isn't there the ideas aren't there to go anywhere with it you know where you patrick you just did a ph d. on t.v. ideas aren't there to go anywhere with it you know what you patrick you just did a ph d. on t.v. in about 3 minutes thing to me let me go to james now you know i get anything about 3 minutes it's amazing to me let me go to james now you know i guess you know that this has a lot to do with expectations and i think that you know patrick was hit the nail on the head that this has
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a lot to do with expectations and i think that you know patrick was hit the nail on the head there and be people being so interconnected is well here we had there and be people being so interconnected is well here but you know what what we have here is we we have global elites that are not deliberate you know what what we have here is we we have global elites that are not delivering they're doing quite well and they don't have any solutions here and at the same thing they're doing quite well and they don't have any solutions here and at the same time you have a lot of people protesting it in more than protesting out of the fact that they don't have a lot of people protesting it in more than protesting out of the fact that they don't see that they have a future here and that is a toxic mixture go ahead james don't see that they have a future here and that is a toxic mixture go ahead james it is that i think those are the maybe some of the factors we see in common with these things and then that's what it is that i think
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those are the maybe some of the factors. we see in common with these things and then as we all know that there are disparate causes like in chile it's transportation prices in lebanon we all know that there are disparate causes like in chile it's transportation prices in lebanon it was communications and cell phones and whatsapp and things like that i can't it was communications and cell phones and whatsapp and things like that i can't help but wonder though peter that what what more is there that meets the help but wonder though peter that what what more is there that meets the eye i always wonder why for example some protests in some countries get very famous always wonder why for example some protests in some countries get very favorable treatment from the global media which sarah shares the same neo liberal verbal treatment from the global media which sarah shares the same neo liberal ideology is what these people are supposedly protesting against in many cases and other ideology is what these people are supposedly protesting against in
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many cases and other cases they don't get such good press for example i've noticed in all of this very case is they don't get such good press for example i've noticed in all of this very few people mention sort of the the granddaddy of all this in the last year or so which is the yellow very few people mentioned sort of the the granddaddy of all this in the last year or so which is the yellow vests in france which i think very much were a working class phenomenon against the vests in france which i think very much were a working class phenomenon against the very things we're describing but they're bad you see because they're there or they're there or they're not really or things we're describing but they're bad you see because they're there or they're there they're not really they're the bad kind of populist as they pose to what's wrong kong that's going to go on the populist either the bad kind of populist as they pose to what the long kong that's going to go on the populace the kids in hong kong are good ok that in the in the yellow vests or are disco yeah exactly kids in hong kong are good ok that in the in the yes. yes or are exactly there to pay for it we
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should say about spain they have. that's right in there to pay for it we should say about spain they have. that's right and if the catalogs are protesting with that's good but if spaniards who want spain and if the catalogs are protesting with that is good but if spaniards who want spain to stay together are protesting well that's bad so i think there's i can't help but to stay together protesting well that's bad so i think there's i can't help but suspect that there's a there's a thumb on the scale and terms of our perception of that but suspect that there's a there's a thumb on the scale and terms of our perceptions i keep waiting for a levee to tell us which ones are the good management which opens out i keep waiting for a levy to tell us which ones are the good times in which the bad ones. but he can keep his mouth shut as far as i'm concerned judge bad ones. but he can keep his
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mouth shut as far as i'm concerned joshua you know. patrick marty mentioned. us and you know. patrick marty mentioned. u.s. involvement particularly in the middle east here where you know constantly putting pressure on the lebanese government particularly in the middle east here where you know constantly putting pressure on the lebanese government to get rid of hezbollah that is elected to office is to get rid of hezbollah that is elected to the offices across the country as a great deal of popularity and then that the in the in the and then like that all across the country as a great deal of popularity and then that the in the in the and then like threatening turkey's economy and things like that i mean this doesn't make things any turkey's economy and things like that i mean this doesn't make things any better i mean constantly using the dollar in the in the financial system to punish better i mean constantly using the dollar in the in the financial system to punish
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countries around the world that just takes more options off the table doesn't it go ahead josh with countries around the world that just takes more options off the table doesn't it go ahead joshua. it does you know look at sanctions is a very brutal brutal response it does you know look at sanctions is a very brutal brutal response to trying to regulate refine to your foreign policy to trying to regulate refine to your foreign policy because it hits people right across the board it is collective punishment in the worst way and worse it because it hits people right across the board it is collective punishment in the worst way and we're seeing that in iran with sanctions on iran which of cause iran to escalate in that in iran with sanctions on iran which have caused iran to escalate violence because they're not going to take it lying down and syria is in desperate straits violence because they're not going to take it lying down
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and syria is in desperate straits and now the united states is eager to take the oil which syria needs in order to now the united states is eager to take the oil which syria needs in order to rebuild and lebanon of course the u.s. has been for to rebuild and lebanon of course the u.s. has been debating whether they should withdraw all foreign aid to lebanon because debating whether they should withdraw all foreign aid to lebanon because hizbollah is part of the government but you know the lebanese elite has hizbollah as part of the government but you know the lebanese elite has been. sucking money out of this system for a long time has been. sucking money out of this system for a long time and and you don't don't. you know even i don't want to be.
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the hope and hold on to a cold a lot of jobs as i think the whole world understands that and nobody wants lebanon to collapse because it really isn't the sort of loans or stands that and nobody wants lebanon to collapse because it really isn't the sort of loans. of the middle east where people can retreat to and find some of the middle east where people can retreat to and find some kind of comfort some kind of a sort of leaven teen playground on one hand it's a playground but on the other hand it said it's a refuge for all kinds of thinking and kind of comfort some kind of a sort of leaven teen playground on one hand it's a playground but on the other hand it said it's a refuge for all kinds of thinking middle easterners who can't find a place in their own countries so it would be terrible easterners who can't find a place in their own country so it would be terrible if that if it collapses if it if it runs into bankruptcy which it could do it well if that if it collapses if it
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if it runs into bankruptcy which it could do at any moment and it's hard to see how they're going to how the lebanese are going in any moment and it's hard to see how they're going to how the lebanese are going to really sort out their economic problems because when we look at the arab spring more to really sort out their economic problems because when we look at the arab spring more generally which was framed of course as we just heard you know frame to turn generally which was framed of course as we just heard you know framed in terms of democracy. it there really hasn't been any signs of democracy. it there really hasn't been any serious economic discussions about how these how the middle eastern syria has economic discussions about how these how the middle eastern countries can get out of this terrible income gap the bad governance countries can get out of this terrible
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income gap the bad governance the corruption and that's what's going to take and if we don't really know the answers to that the corruption and that's what's going to take it is we don't really know the answers to that. and people are desperate but these movements that have been run by social media which are easy and people are desperate but these movements that have been run by social media which are easy to gather together yet don't have a leadership and that is something that's to gather together yet don't have a leadership and that is something that's plaguing the middle east it's good on the one hand because it means that you can't report leg the middle east it's good on the one hand because it means that you can't read press them but it's bad on the other hand because when it comes time to taking control s. them but it's bad on the other hand because when it comes time to taking control they can't do it you know any and i guess let me go to patrick before we go to the break here i mean we can't do it you know any and i guess let me go to patrick
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before we go to the break here i mean we heard the term arab spring i always called the sunni winter and it's only getting worse here how do you when you heard the term arab spring i always called the sunni winter and it's only getting worse here how he would like to bomb that patrick go ahead sure i think joshua just touched on something that is very important to him that patrick go ahead sure i think joshua just touched on something that is very important needs to he's talking about you know no leadership with these virtual movements that really needs to he's talking about you know no leadership with these virtual movements that really exist are driven by social media no and so you have ideological people just are driven by social media no and so you have ideological people in old political elite reminisce from the the previous old left screaming in the corner of poland old political elite remanent from the the previous old left are screaming in the corner for attention saying over here over here i want to be leading this and the no one's for attention saying over here over here i want to be leading this and that no one's
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paying attention because that's not what young people are looking for what they want what they were looking for was visiting attention because that's not what young people are looking for what they want what they were looking for was visible . it's what the old left was looking for as well of a voice for the voiceless they found that ability it's what the old left was looking for as well of a voice for the voiceless they found that voice online but unfortunately it's individualized and it's reflective of an attaboy so online but unfortunately it's individualized and it's reflective of an atom an atom and eyes to society and this is what the united states has exported this come an adamant ised society and this is what the united states has exported this kind of corporate ties to political identity that replaced class identity in the us and nato is in a corporate ties to political identity that replaced class identity in the us and nato is out on this is all that i have to jump in here we're going to go to a short break and after that short break we'll continue working out on this is all that i have to jump in here we're going to go to
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a short break and after that short break we'll continue our discussion on global instability statement on. this question on global instability stay. joined. join me every thursday on the alex simon show and i'll be speaking to guest of the world every thursday on the alex simon show and i'll be speaking to guest on the world of politics sports business i'm showbusiness i'll see if that takes small business i'm show business i'll see that. theme. seems wrong. but i.
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just don't call. me. just don't call. me. to get to shape out these days to come out to the world to get to shape out these days to come out to and in detroit because of the trail. and in gaining strength because of the trail. when so many find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground when so many find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground.
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welcome back to crossfire where all things considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing global instability. were all things considered i'm peter lavelle to remind you we're discussing global instability. ok let's go back to james here. ok let's go back to james here you know there was a great song i think the clash there saying that you know you you know there was a great song i think the clash there saying that you know you should i stay or should i go ok and i think that's becoming the motto of the should i stay or should i go ok and i think that's becoming the motto of the trump and ministrations attitude towards syria which i this the trump and ministrations attitude towards
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syria which i. admit it's a dismal policy i mean we could do talking about it he did it's a dismal policy i mean we could do talking about it here but i think there's broadly speaking i think there is a sense that there but i think there's broadly speaking i think there is a sense that the u.s. will and will withdraw from the middle east if the u.s. will and will withdraw from the middle east you know of course they'll be the the grahams out there and they'll be the tom or still be the the grahams out there and they'll be the tom cotton's and people like that they want to keep the united states in the middle east but i think the writing is on the wall here and people like that they want to keep the united states in the middle east but i think the writing is on the wall here that itself is creating instability because so much dependency the you that. itself is creating instability because so much dependency
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the u.s. has created among many elites in the middle east that and they're going to have to start thinking west is created among many elites in the middle east and they're going to have to start thinking twice and they have social movements that see. twice and they have social movements that see that are disenfranchised rising up and they are you going to have elites not being able to be clocked disenfranchised rising up in there are you going to have elites not being able to be clients the same kind of clients that they have been for decades go ahead james well i it's the same kind of clients that they have been for decades go ahead james . well i i think you're a little more optimistic than i am that we're actually going to get out of the middle east we i think you're a little more optimistic than i am that we're actually going to get out of the middle east we so i think that and i must know my mind my time frame and narrow my time frame is likely so i think that that i must know my mind my time frame and on
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my time frame is like 1015 years ago and it's not in this administration i'm sorry to keep going. and 15 years old and it's not in this administration i'm sorry to keep going. the ok you're right you're a right about that although what that looks like at the end of the the ok you're right you're a right about that although what that looks like at the end of the day i don't think anybody can say. you're right i don't know how to say i don't think anybody can say. you're right i don't know how much that relates to elites versus people you know one thing i notice about these protests much that that relates to elites versus people you know one thing i notice about these protests is that these are largely an urban phenomenon and you sort of wonder how representative the test is that these are largely an urban phenomenon and you sort of wonder how representative they are of the rest of the country you know everybody's making the comparison to the arab spring are of the rest of the country you know everybody's
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making the comparison to the arab spring very few people are making the comparison to the color revolutions we've seen over the last couple decades were very few people are making the comparison to the color revolutions we've seen over the last couple decades were which were largely i would say in many cases an astroturf phenomenon they really were which were largely i would say in many cases an astroturf phenomenon they really were not representative of the country at all although western governments were quick to say the ukrainian people of cho not representative of the country at all although western governments were quick to say the ukrainian people have chosen this the georgian people have chosen that so i do wonder sometimes about what is in this the georgian people have chosen that so i do wonder sometimes. it's about what the outside meddling in these things are as well as the underlying the outside meddling in these things are as well as the underlying goal between the elites and as patrick has pointed out and atomized especially between the elites and as patrick has pointed out and atomized
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especially younger people but you're right if we do end up getting out of the middle east and i think the younger people but you're right if we do end up getting out of the middle east and i think the really the big question is going to be what happens in saudi arabia yet if we really really the big question is going to be what happens in saudi arabia yet if we really and up withdrawing from the middle east because if you're looking for a powder keg there's one well and up withdrawing from the middle east because if you're looking for a powder keg there's one well james i can tell you is that what happens in saudi arabia i can tell you right away i don't know what it will be but it will james i can tell you is that what happens in saudi arabia i can tell you right away i don't know what it will be but it won't be good ok that's for sure ok joshua you know it's been it's been already been good ok that's for sure ok joshua you know it's been it's been already been brought up here night and i think it's important to discuss here i mean you're an expert on lebanon you lived there for many murat up here night and i think it's important to discuss here i mean you're an expert on
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lebanon you lived there for many many years i mean the one hand i do see the legitimate protests ok in the years i mean the one hand i do see the legitimate protests ok but you know james in washington does bring up the issue of outside meddling and we've seen it but you know james in washington does bring up the issue of outside meddling and we've seen this in hong kong and particularly how the media frames it so a tough question i suppose this in hong kong and particularly how the media frames it so a tough question i suppose but you know how legitimate is it and how much outside influences but you know how legitimate is it and how much out. right influence you think is possibly there because there are people are saying sure us is in lebanon right now others think is possibly there because there are people are saying sure us is in lebanon right now others are saying this is grassroots this is legitimate people are sick and tired of it how do you ways are saying this is grassroots this
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is legitimate people are sick and tired of it how do you weigh those things joshua i think this is legitimate and i think people are sick and tired those things joshua i think this is legitimate and i think people are sick and tired and part of the right way you can tell it is that it's not sectarian there are aired and part of the right way you can tell it is that it's not sectarian there are of course everybody is trying to spin it as a sectarian yet you know spin their sectarian force everybody is trying to spin it as a sectarian yet you know spin their sectarian view and so you know a lot of the western press is is trying to highlight if you and so you know a lot of the western press is is trying to highlight the role is a lioness in that there's criticism of his ball and it's the reason that the role is a lioness and that there's criticism of his ball and it's the reason that it's taking place is because hizbollah is to has gained such a predominant that it's taking place is because hizbollah is to has gained such
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a predominant part in the government and so forth but you know i think the lebanese most people are in the government and so forth but you know i think the lebanese and most people realize you know most people are just worried about where they're going to get enough money to live you know most people are just worried about where they're going to get enough money to live expenses has gone through the roof you know electric is irregular you can't get good at it expenses has gone through the roof you know electric is irregular you can't get good internet all the services that lebanese want whether it's picking up the garbage or internet all the services that lebanese want whether it's picking. the garbage shirt just keeping the streets clean and not making sure people don't park on the sidewalk or just keeping the streets clean and not making sure people don't park on the sidewalk all those little insults that overwhelm you when you're in lebanon after a while i think of all those little insults that overwhelm you when you're in
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lebanon after a while i think of piled up and that's why you're seeing people joining hands from one end of the country piled up and that's why you're seeing people joining hands from one end of the country to the other it's symbolic and it's course it can be you know it can be twisted to look to the other it's symbolic and it's course it can be you know it can be twisted a little bit but i think at heart the lebanese really want their government to split but i think at heart the lebanese really want their government to spend some snow to solve some of these economic problems which have not been solved same question bend sums to solve some of these economic problems which have not been solved same question you patrick is you know how do you how do you put the scales there of you know people intentionally wanting to interview patrick is you know how do you how do you put the scales there of you know people intentionally wanting to inflame it from the outside and then these grassroots grievances that we were just numerated by clément from the outside and then these grassroots grievances that we
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were just numerated by joshua go ahead i think lebanon is actually a good example back to joshua go ahead i think lebanon is actually a good example back to and i agree with everything joshua said and i think it's clear this is a genuine it's very much and i agree with everything joshua said and i think it's clear this is a genuine it's very much resembles the occupy movement in the sense that the young people in lebanon regardless of resembles the occupy movement in the sense that the young people in lebanon regardless of their sect or their affiliations religious affiliations agree that there's an oligarchy their sect or their affiliations religious affiliations agree that there's an all or. arche and the problem is an oligarchy kind of privileged in a hereditary class on fortune and the problem is an oligarchy kind of privileged in a hereditary class unfortunately it's also a sectarian all of our key and that's a result of the confessional system that's been only it's also a sectarian all of our key and that's
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a result of the confessional system that's been imposed on lebanon and we might see the end of that perhaps by the end of this and imposed on lebanon and we might see the end of that perhaps by the end of this to mulch of this period but i think more than that there's this issue to mulch of this period but i think more than that there's this issue of the united states meddling you have to address the fact that during the cold war there were the united states meddling you have to address the fact that during the cold war the number one priority of the us was to thwart or to move out of power the number one priority of the u.s. was to thwart or to move out of power any left leaning government around the globe and that was number one priority that any left leaning government around the globe and that was number one priority that was in central america south america in the middle east including arab nationalist was in central america south america in the
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middle east including arab nationalist governments that were seen to be going in a socialist direction so governments that were seen to be going in a socialist direction so. really disempowered a lot of countries over the years and i think the u.s. has one really disempowered a lot of countries over the years and i think the u.s. has won that cold war it's one that imperialist war globally and it's now ex that cold war it's one that imperialist war globally and it's now exported it's atomized and individualize societies to the point where i don't think they have supported it's atomized and individual i societies to the point where. i don't think they have the political direction or where with all our ability ideological ability to have the political direction or where with all our ability ideological ability to find out what's better what's a better option than neoliberal economics it's the people i know what's better what's
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a better option than neoliberal economics it's people are pains to find the answer to that question right now and so it turns and or cable or pains to find the answer to that question right now and so it turns anarchic in and our kids are seems to be expressed more than political organizing and rick in anarchism seems to be expressed more than political organizing and real solutions this is the problem that they're all facing right now many of them oh that's not a good solutions this is the problem that they're all facing right now many of them oh that's not a good message at all is go back to washington here if we could bring up the case of iraq message it all is go back to washington here if we could bring up the case of iraq here where you know the some of the troops that are withdrawn from syria american troops are being back here where you know the some of the troops that are withdrawn from syria american troops are being sent to iraq without the permission of the iraqi government and the whole issue of an american sent to iraq without the
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permission of the iraqi government and the whole issue of american troops in iraq or is hotly contested here how does that add to a lot of can troops in iraq or is hotly contested here how does that add to a lot of the protests because there's been a lot in iraq and a lot of people actually died go ahead james of the protests because there's been a lot in iraq and a lot of people actually died go ahead james. yes that's right and you raise the issue of people dying. yes that's right and you raise the issue of people dying you know we've had people being killed in chile over what over over bus prices i mean it we've had people being killed in chile over what over over bus prices i mean it is one of the things i can't help but notice it again not only in the in the arab spring but also in the color one of the things i can't help but notice again not only in the in the arab spring but also in the color revolutions is how the media covers the question of the use of illusions is how the media covers the question of
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the use of force that i say well you know you see for example i remember in kiev in 2014 there was force that i say well you know you see for example i remember in kiev in 2014 they were saying oh look at the police beat up the demonstrators in a fact if you look at the footage it was actually to demonstrate oh look at the police beat up the demonstrators and in fact if you look at the footage it was actually the demonstrators beating up the police what's the what's what is the the ratio of strangers beating up the police what's the what's what is the the ratio or the or the or the equities between what kind of force or restraint is being no or the or the or the equities between what kind of force or restraint is being used by the authorities on the one hand and how militant violence are and even using deadly if used by the authorities on the one hand and how militant violence are and even using deadly violence you're seeing sometimes from people in the crowds and you wonder look i my lenz you're seeing sometimes from people in the crowds and you
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wonder look i'm not i'm not a believer in the whole marxist paradigm that you know once the once the oppressed mass a lot i'm not a believer in the whole marxist paradigm that you know once the once the oppressed masses reach a certain level of misery they rise up as one in russia's righteous indignation faces reach a certain level of misery they rise up as one and righteous righteous indignation things to. don't happen that way people don't behave that way and still has to be some kind don't happen that way people don't behave that way and still has to be some kind of there has to be some kind of a even if they don't have leaders in the way that joshua revolve there has to be some kind of a even if they don't have leaders in the way that joshua refers there's somebody somebody ends up organizing this somebody ends up taking the there's somebody somebody ends up organizing this somebody ends up taking the lead and there's usually fairly small groups of people that sort of set the tone to lead and there's usually fairly small groups of people that sort of set the tone and get other
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people involved and i get i guess i'm a bit of a cynic i and get other people involved and i get i guess i'm a bit of a cynic i i always wonder who is the hidden hand behind the scenes and of course this is also i always wonder who is the hidden hand behind the scenes and of course this is also an accusation that's used by a by the american side you see there's an american diplomat so an accusation that's used by a by the american side you see there's an american diplomat saying that the problems in chile are being fed by who else by vladimir putin the russians are saying that the problems in chile are being fed by who else by vladimir putin the russians are causing it so that's more russian battling so i i don't know i always what causing it so that's more russian battling so i i don't know i always want to look at the different layers of the onion here and see what all is going on all the way through the different look at the different layers of the onion here and see what all is
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going on all the way through the different layers joshua you know blaming russia for everything is like going to the under layers you know joshua you know blaming russia for everything is like going to the onion website but anyway joshua you know you're you're a well renowned well known website but anyway joshua you know you're you're a well renowned well known. and one highly respected middle east expert here how how do you see all known one highly respected middle east expert here how how do you see western media coverage of what's happening in the middle east with these protests here do they have do they have the right optic go ahead. you know i think western media coverage of what's happening in the middle east with these protests here do they have do they have the right optic go ahead. you know i think the western media has gone through a real education over the last the western media has gone through
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a real education over the last 15 years trying to figure out the middle east and they really bought it 15 years trying to figure out the middle east and they really bought into. they bought into george bush's original or into. they bought into george bush's original argument that that america could scrape off these governments argument that that america could scrape off these governments and create democracy in the middle east i think today americans and create democracy in the middle east i think today americans are much more a bit more sophisticated and more cynical about what's going on they're much more a bit more sophisticated and more cynical about what's going on in the middle east or exhausted a yeah there are exhausted and they've spent you know in the middle east or exhausted
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a. yeah there are exhausted and they've spent you know president trump is hitting that. very hard meat he keeps on reiterating when president trump is hitting that hitting that very hard meat you keep on reiterating we've spent 7 trillion dollars i think he said a trillion the other day but we spent a lot of money spent $7.00 trillion dollars i think he said 8 trillion the other day but we spent a lot of money and americans haven't paid for that they've just put it on the credit card it's going to come due and americans haven't paid for that they've just put it on the credit card it's going to come due and and i think there they are feeling exhausted they want and and i think they're they are feeling exhausted they want to get out they don't they realize that this is not a place that america can weigh they do want get out they don't they realize that this is not a place that america can wave a wand and fix we're seeing this attempt to get out of afghanistan get out of said fix we're seeing this attempt to get out of afghanistan get out of syria there are
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plenty of forces that are pulling us right back yeah and syria there are plenty of forces that are pulling us right back yeah and and americans don't want to abandon of course a position like afghanistan and just but and americans don't want to abandon of course a position like afghanistan and just but they are realizing that this is a complicated region i think that we are they are realizing that this is a complicated region i think that we are going to see america withdraw a lot more because they are more cynical about these forces and to see america withdraw a lot more because they are more cynical about these forces they realize there's not an easy answer that underneath the surface they realize there's not an easy answer that underneath the surface of language like we all want a better shake there are of language like we all want. better shake there are
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a lot of sectarian forces there are really actual forces and they're ethnic for sectors that are not hairy and forces there are we actual forces and their ethnic forces that are not easy to contain us and then be to can even terry one and the eloquent can be very and and and a strong and decisive strong end and then end them and then america can't commit pantilimon them we've seen them to sweep the kurds trying to us which side with the kurds then trying to side with the currents that dumping the kurds now is something that the kurds very crass crap now about for us instead of very crass grab for oil in syria which is which is i think to a certain degree reflective of the experience which is which is i think to a certain degree reflective of. the exhaustion of americans and now this sort of money grab we're just going to go for the oil satirise option of americans and now this is sort of money grab we're just going to go for the oil sattar rabia grab the
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oil and syria it is it undermines grab the oil in syria it is it undermines. whatever principles america can bring to the table and it really should whatever principles america can bring to the table and it really shows an ugly face to the power in the middle east today shows an ugly face to power in the middle east today that. that doesn't have the answers yeah but i mean that. that doesn't have answers yeah but i mean you will have to end on that point here but you know the lack of principles stealing someone else's now through will have to end on that point here but you know the lack of principles stealing someone else's now to resources so they can't rebuild i mean i don't know how more pathetic back can be to resources so they can't rebuild i mean i don't
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know how more pathetic back can be ok but unfortunately it's not really part of that way in western media gentlemen that's all the time we have ok but unfortunately it's not really portrayed that way in western media gentlemen that's all the time we have many thanks to my guests in washington plymouth and in norman and thanks to our viewers for watching as many thanks to my guests in washington plymouth and in norman and thanks to our viewers for watching us here darkie see you next time and remember. here darkie see you next time and remember.
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i'm going to fulfill the repeated promises of politics to the people i promise i'm going to fulfill the repeated promises of politics to the people i promise to be you know it's all bots. to be you know it's all bots be. ready for a. place ready for a. pretty
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good burka now you want to 1st read that. now you want to 1st read that. no. longer. no. longer. bald. bald. big. big day.
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all across the middle. all across the middle east and beyond there are large scale protests and growing political instability in many countries east and beyond there are large scale protests and growing political instability in many countries the old ways of doing business but only in rich privileged elite while the prospects was the old ways of doing business but only in rich privileged elite while the prospects for the many are few and far in between the elites have answers to the many are few and far in between the elites have the answers for today's growing problem. growing problem. what politicians do. they put themselves on the line what politicians do.
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they put themselves on the line they get accepted or rejected. so when you want to be president they did accept the reject. so what you want to present. some some want to. have to do i think the press has allowed the full story of the morning can't be good for. the press to say what the full story of the boy can't be good. i'm interested always in the waters about how. i'm interested in the waters about how. this should. or should.
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u.k. inquiry into the deadly 2017 grand for the tower block u.k. an inquiry into the deadly $2700.00 grand for the tower blazes called out significant systemic failings in the london fire brigade of the days has called out significant systemic failings in the london fire brigade and little spotlight placed on city and government to authorities have told us the focus is misplaced the spotlight placed on city and government to authorities have told us the focus is misplaced. far as it did not call for the foreign town. far far as it did not call for the foreign town. did not return or response or
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sponsor for free. from from. the outside of the sas how are. they really hitting new report by human rights watch said the u.s. sanctions are preventing ordinary iranians from accessing like human rights watch has said the u.s. sanctions are preventing ordinary iranians from accessing lifesaving medicine. saving medicine. with the hungry and pm 'd irritating western allies to the very same day hungry hungry and pm irritating western allies to the very same day hunger.

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