tv Cross Talk RT December 13, 2019 4:30am-5:01am EST
hello and welcome to cross talk where all things considered i'm peter lavelle the u.k. general election with a predicted large majority this would be the biggest majority for the tories since the days of margaret thatcher and labour's were showing in about 80 years it would seem getting breaks it done did the trick this is a big win for bojo but is it for the u.k. . crosstalk in the u.k. general election i'm joined by my guests john white and bro he's a political commentator and writer in london we have much fire saying he's a candidate for the u.k. parliament fund manager and author also in london we cross who he is a professor emeritus of international history at the london school of economics or across the uk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i always appreciate me go to you 1st in london what happened to the polls told us something very differently going into this here i have to say in my opinion from my
distant perch to be honest i found both the tories and labor ran a lackluster campaigns but i have to admit one thing is that took the tory message get briggs it done did resonate because i still i don't even remember what the the labor slogan was it was that muddy a muddled and vague ok why this result and bojo boris johnson the sitting prime minister must be a very happy man go ahead mich. you know i think there are a lot of interesting components to what happened today i mean you know i was on campaign on the campaign trail for probably 5 or 6 months going into this with the braids of party and getting braids it done was an important message that boris got out the problem that we had was bragg's exhaustion and people didn't want to hear about bragg's yet the bigger issue was after 3 and a half years like 1278 days ago. the 17400000 of the
country voted to leave and 75 percent of the parliamentarian said we really don't care what you voted and we're going to usurp democracy and not let you have brags it and then boris came up with a bunch of sharp soundbites like i'm going to get braids it done i'm going to do it right away i'm going to die in a ditch he didn't die in a ditch he didn't get braids it done on october 31st he's made a lot of promises and his latest ones were that got him over the line were we have a new oven baked bragg's it deal now a couple of things that i would say about that his deal is not new it's 95 percent to reason may's terrible treaty it's not ready it's half baked and it's not brags that it's for current form so i you know i think that those are the topics we can start out with and you know if you want to get into into the weeds on what happened with the election i can get into as much detail as you like with the
strategies but nigel farage handed the tory party $317.00 seats we actually diminished labor's seats and we got rid of pretty much the liberal democrats ok so what are. the let's look at the results here i mean is this a protest vote because it is unprecedented here i mean and how do we explain labor's utter devastating defeat in this election year i mean this we're going back to the 1930 s. here with this kind of result how do you explain it alan go ahead in london. well i think there are 2 reasons 1st of all colgan had no policy on pricks it it didn't want to say we'll do this for or against and people did want the results of the referendum to be implemented secondly his policies the sort of neo muxes marxist leninist view of the economy we see it is absolutely frightening or incredible and people didn't pay much attention to it and this ought to backfire and probably ruin
the economy so. whilst fronts the economic front and the bricks and. nobody was willing to listen to him luncheon he ended up with his daughter coming for labor which goes back to 1905 yeah. he was the 1st speaker though about the brics a party should never have student election its campaign promises were holo and if it didn't cross the loop. it is ended up giving liberal seats the conservatives in the conservative party should have go all sold just that ego trip by the leader not true with any luck will love be consigned to history ok i will talk a little bit about that later in the program john jump in here how do you explain this outcome here because i tend to think too that i want to talk about how the media framed this entire election because i think the media but it's thumb on the
scales as usual go ahead john. well peter the result of this election entirely hinged on whether carbons message of what his mission is the condition of working class people did not have to be purgatory of hell that cruelty did not have to be a virtue of compassion of race after 10 years of tourist entity where that message mellish to penetrate the fog of a motion surrounding east particularly in northern and little ends. are marginal was unfortunate for him and for his supporters it did not resonate but when you consider you had to know but john gell but why didn't it resonate i think that's an important why didn't it resonate because basically boris johnson was running on almost a decade of tory rule so this should have been a change election but it wasn't explained that go ahead joe well i differ from your . rock itoshi don't break shit corbett quarterback's it was the most politically
and intellectually honest of any party because it started with the recognition of the country was split on rimadyl 52 percent vs 40 percent wanted and needed 2016 you referendum but breaks emotional bricks it was far more powerful than a carbon and rebar actually recognised because it's a question of identity it's a question of what it means to be british it's a question of democracy and also and this is something that is very important every saying you of that rancid to reestablish was brought to be hit against corporate media political security and economic but it was to us every single day the character assassination this man has been so great to have been known for if you do it's not remarkable that he would go down to such a crushing defeat in this election ok alan you wanted to say something there do you agree or disagree with what you just heard from john go ahead eleanor colbert's policy it was thought to be ridiculous i mean he said he wouldn't go see it that deal which the e.u. didn't want to renegotiate he said he would then put it in
a rigged referendum to the people but he wouldn't actually back the deal. they're a friend to move on and he had most to be said to get split peter. which isn't into literally owns this it so that the stupid and again you know the reason why the. us wouldn't believe his claims all. he wants that. it came into the mess. lift the cup to did 2015 so 2010 and any labor leader of the cup shouldn't britain with a leftwing muxes call that all was ready to be defeated haven't much food happened to. the british people i'm interested in will end up communism ok go ahead jump in you're about to say something oh yeah i think yeah i think that's a bit i think that's a bit of an oversimplification and i would disagree with alan's point mostly on on
the way that he said the things rolled out nigel farage is the only reason why we had a referendum to begin with the bigger problem is we don't have democracy in the united we don't have democracy i didn't interrupt you so let me let me speak we don't have democracy in the united kingdom we have an old darky the problem with corbin's platform was he was offering free stuff and it just wasn't credible at all whatsoever and if you look at all of the things that they were offering it would have run the economy into a ditch a lot faster than boris's the reason why we had austerity was because it back in 2008 the bank of england decided to bail out our banks and that's when the currency dropped 34 percent so that's why we have austerity because they cut back on the spending and that's why they cut the police force by 22000 that's why they implemented all these other cuts and then you have an increase you've got an increase in the population and
a decrease in the services so that's going to end in disaster and then the the new . media kept pounding and pounding away crash out brags it no deal brags it yet crash out brags it brags it brags it so people were fed up and exhausted and he came up with the perfect soundbite created in america get brags it done i'm going to get it done it's oven baked so they just said ok get it done and get it off the plate let's move forward the problem and a bigger issue is he's promised a magnificent economic recovery which is just not going to happen and people are going to realize down the road i don't know if there is a year when he to default on his promises again that well he's not going to talk about the promises in the 2nd half of the program here john i want to make it very clear on this program and i want to hear from you do you think how do you feel the media treated labor and jerry during this campaign because it looked like one smear after another ok and it looks like again they had their thumb on the scale go ahead john well. let's go to talk let's go to john in admiral go ahead john
demonization of the enemy corporate has been oppressed. even worse than any. liberal leader including how to wilson the $74.00 we've usually don't be aware of that will suit what we're looking for to actually talk while i don't watch a. lot of ballots into their prime minister in chicago who got even worse treatment than this he was treated to a real enemy of the people stuff and to the press he was seen as an enemy within the spacious camp. depend to him is an anti semite a lot meant tending jamey quakerish socialist was depicted as the 2nd coming of rain hard it should the media she rejected because it was utterly despicable over these past 2 years it was incitement and despite us movies of people still supported the actual need for me to wonder is that equal as many was as he received
in this election but let me just caution the union jack weaving rupert. now you're down buster so. much because as i speak pizza chain of scottish independence has already led ok ok now i would i want you to hold on i want you to hold on to that thought because that's exactly what i want to do in the 2nd part of the program all right gentlemen we're going to go to a short break and after that short break but there's so much more to cover on this election to talk about scotland and what i talk to is boris johnson can actually affect brags that after a short break we continue our discussion of the u.k. general election stay with.
us. it's a let me. ask i wouldn't will. take i could not predict that could not provoking. this show more than. you love to be in another. 10 to make it a c because don't want to. do what they were over the kook on the standards of the last night as you dunks bush. did most of the difficult. i knew of those damone. much of this news through learning nightly news from the. so would you hire the model he tried to use into a good. joke. budget cut and then.
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we're tough. so you're going. to go. try to get a. good son. welcome back across like we're all things are considered you were discussing the u.k. general election. ok let's go back to allan in london and in the introduction of the program i said this is a big win a big victory for boris johnson but is it
a big victory for the u.k. because at a lot of part of the 1st part of the program me we talked about the specter of another scottish independence vote and. boris johnson after he replied shuffles the his cabinet on monday has said the task of bragg's it ahead which he ran on can he affect that and how difficult will it be with the europeans because it takes 2 to parlay go ahead alan. oh you could certainly do it he has the part of it to be jory to to come to. the europeans and if you post of noises there they want a quick deal because they're fed up with bricks it is well some europeans are saying different things but on the whole you could certainly get a basic free trade treaty done almost immediate it wants to change. it will flexibility today might take a little bit longer oh you might just go for the new deal so it will certainly happen. you mentioned scottish independence the latest opinion poll in
scotland says that 56 percent want to remain in the in united kingdom and 4 to focus and want independence so i didn't think we need way too much about that woodwind i'm sculptured we would win the referendum again nicolas sturgeon would lose again and in any case this could have a huge trial in scotland and start again munch of the former s. and p. the leader in 1st minister who is accused of attempted rape in 13 other sexual assault charges and his defense is going to be assisted chop cause by nicholas sturgeon so the s.n.p. movement is about to divide choppy when that trial starts so boris will just say no we don't once in a lifetime expectation of the 1st result and there's no evidence of opinion has shifted and nicholas duggan has to keep militants happy since he talks about
a 2nd referendum all the time but choose not going to get it ok john weigh in on that scott another independent vote go ahead john. well the basis for good 1st for support for abortion appears according to the pool crucibles that are not for peace which is historically and i suppose a little sort of you know if you consider that when alex somebody then we that obvious and b. called the referendum a 2040 what he called it would be there to basically forget as war of independence was just over 30 percent there you're looking at something that there's quite remarkable happening in scotland yes that is a very controversial. case coming down the tracks with a sippy and much jelly like summit but scottish independence is far bigger than the s. and p. and this result is the biggest boon to the fortunes of scottish independence that hers if i threw it at you. and i don't really have a lot well and this country can longer be it can no longer be
superceded by anything to do with it is a case of you created scotland the inevitability of scotland independence cannot be gainsaid peter it's coming down the track it's happening and less than effective bridge that is still a sense of where you are i don't know how i got 8 out and say it said 2016 just expect the unexpected ok and don't believe the polls ok the polls you know i mean you know that they they they fail us time and again and that's why i stay away from them let me go to mitchell you know we've got image right now. the fate of jeremy carbon right now i mean he's the he's definitely on the out ok this is a deplorable outcome for his party but let me give you an opposite observation again from my far away perch here there obviously he never really led why isn't that why wasn't he able to lead the labor party ok and i actually have personal
sympathy towards him i don't agree with his policies i think he's an a straight up guy honest guy all school ok someone a conservative like me could understand someone like him a lot of other people in politics have no clue what they're talking about so i'm trying to be gentle here but at the same time he didn't he didn't lead and i think that is one of his greatest failures let me go to mitch on this one go ahead mitch . yeah i think that's a big problem we don't we have a lack of leadership in the united kingdom right now and i don't think there has been a clear and decisive leader and we've had sound bites and and we've had we've had sound bites from everybody but we've had no decisive leadership we've had people telling making lots of promises but a lot of them are under 4 double and undeliverable and not going to be on the time frame or the scope scale and magnitude of which they were promised going back to corbin when he was asked what he was going to do about brags that he had one foot in one foot not putting a commitment on because he didn't want to alienate the 5000000 labor voters who he
had to throw under the bus to say he was going to have a 2nd referendum where your choices would be remain or remain so you know that wasn't really giving people an option and people were a little fed up and i saw it tonight when we were counting ballots tonight i saw so many spoiled ballot papers where people had written in on the ballot papers i can't trust any of you you're all a bunch of liars you don't trust you don't represent us the people are fed up there are unprecedented levels of anger across this country there is intolerance and this is the most extreme polarization we've seen in this country ever and i think the media has whipped up that frenzy to even higher levels you know alan and if they had i mean i don't rest were rapidly running out of time now and you know during this whole brags that somehow we saw the failings of both parties we saw that the
problems that the the jeremy corbin had with labor in keeping his party united and we also saw that with a resume with the tories but it looks like boris johnson has will have a united party but that it's labor now that's going to be in a leadership contest that will tear it apart ok so boris johnson a lot of man standing go ahead alan that's absolutely. party without the solid united forests who thought i could a political be recouped in light led to this little of 2 or 3 different ways the lib dems are irrelevant the breck support is even more rather than. a huge opportunity to remake the british political scene in his own image and he will he said historic figure ok john how do you reflect upon that because we're in a new era right now i have to say and it's because i have no choice but to look at the polls but i'm so disappointed again with the polls because it looked like it was a lot tighter but it looks like
a genuine mandate from the people that did vote go ahead john your sentiment inform the people of england and we should meet that's your point that's fair point but when your opinion calls aleisha do with measuring public opinion more to do with trying to influence it peter only should be constrained to the dustbin of history have got it kind of struck catastrophic. and the last few years really me but if people are doing well for all and they voted for despair and never learn another long day of 40 barbarism to say that and the last 10 years of a steady 120000 people have died as a direct result and you seem dechen it seems decades i suppose in richer people so there can be wealth increased by one of over 180 percent and boris johnson is the most people figure to ever occupy this man is a serial liar these are shall attend and he saw a lot that he could get under snake's belly waiting to talk to get still people voted for this man and why because as i see the emotional breaks it sure powerful that no other kind of program could penetrate out for joe to be club and i think
it's a dream and i think he has been he has been treated as such even as i see my friend an extremist irish that was meant to say that because he was a threat just a disk war war against the poor all and war against poor countries overseas i'm going to be. getting the ok the dust is settling right now what does boris johnson have to do to succeed give me a checklist 3 things go ahead mention. he's got to he's got to get rid of the stinking problems with the with the withdrawal agreement he's got to get the braggs it done free trade agreements negotiated as he promised by the end of next year which the european union says they won't get done and he's got to deliver on improving policing because crime is a real big problem in this country 111 thing that i must add here is scotland although you want to have independence i don't know how you're going to pay for it because the european union has said that they your finances won't allow it without
westminster support so boris is in a unique situation i think what we've need to do also is have proportional representation and this vote showed that 1st past the post is garbage and it doesn't really represent all of the people and it's a nonfunctioning archaic system that needs to be changed ok now it is turned out to be the mr contrarian on this program that's why i like having them on you were shaking your head go right ahead. yeah i mean that the 1st pass of course system means that britain has they only call it went to new europe hasn't gotten a stream of student parties in the world with the exception of colgan and he's marxist leninist 60 this look at d.c. might so run to the top of the labor party but we don't have the right wing extremists in our parliament which is unique in europe parliaments all over europe are full of extremists but not the british one and that's 2 to the 1st past the post system if we've got p.r.
god knows we don't dub fool of loonies just like the european parliament ok john what does labor do now ok as the desk settles here when will jeremy step aside assume he will stay in parliament but when and when will he step aside in what do you who do you think will replace him or who is in the running at least go ahead john or is already knows that in taste of his own or think right resigned would immediately the liberal party towards the center and it will be taken a character of what people have been accustomed to expecting from is that is that it's had a winning proposition going back to the center because i know a lot of people in the labor party that's not what they want to do it's very much like the democrats in the united states they're tearing themselves down the middle keep going john absolutely not the center of the political center grow peter has collapsed it collapsed because the new liberal economic model a sustained has collapsed in the wake of a 2000 economic crash by the surely girl with
a crash but liberal party will move towards a said the bill through us will be should be bleed actual come to the fore again and hope will be removed from british politics truly people register to vote peter when this election was called s. a record in british politics many of the more young people and many of them were inspired to register to vote by jeremy corbett so as i say i think hope has been removed from british politics the n.h.s. is no peril to anything good. miskolczi is never adult movie got go back to the business as usual when it comes to both if you go back to the. spun politicians or people about take. any chance of what they just eat oversteer politics has never been great but i got it i've been here when it comes to boris johnson it's never business as usual all right that's all the time we have many thanks to my guests in edinburgh and in london and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at r.t.c. next time remember rolls.
but. boris is big when the conservative party secures a majority in the british parliament as labor suffers in the polls and a highly disappointing night for them our live coverage from westminster returns in less than one minute. plus other news later this hour at least $71.00 soldiers were killed in a militant attack on a military base in the shadow exposing a deep crisis for french foreign policy in its former colony and the. protests sweep across india after it passed a controversial belligerent based citizenship that excludes muslims at least 2 people have been killed.
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