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tv   Going Underground  RT  July 13, 2020 3:30am-4:00am EDT

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all that could save students from the violence of the united states immigration and customs enforcement agency accused of multiple abuses at the u.n. claims may violate international law all the civil coming up in today's going underground affairs is pharmaceutical johnson a race to be the 1st to peyton de coronavirus vaccine subsidized by the taxpayers of superpowers back in the so-called cold war the united states was paying big drug companies for a very different reason to manufacture l.s.d. for the cia mind control project known as m.k. ultra the new book boys are in chief by former new york times foreign correspondent stephen kinzer sheds light on m.k. ultra and the man behind it sidney gottlieb he joins me now from cape cod in massachusetts stephen welcome to going underground before we even get to this amazing book your reaction to this 40000000000 dollar pentagon money appearing to go into the next coronavirus relief package apparently your country needs to have $35.00 b.'s of a junior class attack submarine whatever that is and some kind of directed energy weaponry to target china there seems to be no aspect of public policy including how
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care in the united states doesn't become somehow the property of r r. it's true that in being built for so called response to a coronavirus and we find all these military programs the horrors that playbook talked about you know they were justified. this concept that everybody seemed to share the united states that the world the freedom loving people everywhere made an imminent threat that was so dangerous how horrific in its scope that we might temporarily one of our of our priorities or some of our ethical and moral principle but we'll certainly get back to those very similar is right over the crisis never seem to end although communism is over as of now it's all here is the china problem . for enemies of the united states israel as well as just tell me who sidney
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gottlieb is given the directors of the cia maybe your current secretary of state pompeo that alone as jeanne aspel now running the cia may not even heard of sydney going to leave before this book came out so they got was running one of the most important secret projects in the history of the united is identity was totally unknown or to the outside world even inside the i.a.e.a. there are only a vague idea of what i'm doing actually this guy had a license to kill issued by the us government i concluded after doing all the research the way into this book that he not only was the poisoner in chief. have but he really was the most powerful under a lot of american of the 20. now you make a lot of allegations against him i'm going to say although we can't defame the dead . he said in a court case he couldn't remember things going to remember any of kinds of things
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you talk about in the book back in 83 died in 1909. over here the statue of churchill is being attacked by black lives matter protest has just take us back to when churchill one to bio weapons so during the 2nd world war they knew what it for sure joe became convinced by intelligence reports which were later proven job involved the nazi government was planning to arm some of it the missiles already wasn't with biological warfare weapons there or churchill not having the silicon to radiate out their weapons that frankly raw. for him tens of thousands of interact. he would hold in ready to counterattack against germany
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russia's not agreed to do that and he ordered the us army to begin a secret project to create the anthrax and they were being built in a factory in indiana when the war ended so it was sure urgent request to roosevelt based on what turned out to be false information that put the united states and really the western world on the path for biological weapons and i'm going to get to the cia's recruitment of nazis nazi doctors in a 2nd but again the context here we're talking about is. korea britain the united states maybe have killed a 5th of korea's population in the korean war you say in the book that the cia thought. release us soldier is this supposed to communism their apparent support could only be explained by mind altering drugs so i was working through the of this
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project m.k. ultra the cia mind control project at the center of my book one of the questions it kept emerging in my mind was what led these people in the early cia to believe that mind control was real why did they spend 10 years destroying so many lives in the effort to try to find a way to destroy human minds and number and place it there. i think there are 2 reasons one of them has to do with cultural conditioning that of all the books in the movie sherlock holmes story the end around post story about mind control and note that i think subconsciously a lot of these people that generation the generation that ran the early cia were affected by the other and began to lose the order between fiction and reality but then there were a couple of specific episode. that felt sort of as seen on that already fertilized
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soil was the one you mention in which. american prisoners of war are returning from korea after the end of the war or in many cases to assign statements criticising aspects of life in the and i ate some has confessed to going to many more crimes in korea a few have said they have dropped by a logical pov the north koreans of the united states is always never happened how could they have been the same the only explanation that the cia come up with was somehow their minds and even. by a hostile communist forces and therefore we see we're not speaking for the valves somebody was the root and therefore since we now have. evidence later proved to be un true that the communists have a mind control capacity or are developing it is absolutely urgent that we as
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a defensive project become involved in the search or mind control and it was simply gottlieb's and i said before you can find a way to insert a new blood into somebody's brain you 1st have to find a way to destroy the mind that is in there he spent 10 years experimenting on most important addictive trying to find ways roy's a human mind the human spirit the human body human to the cultural context i mean these ivy league white middle class people there's a class dimension to it but even they out on earth did they agreed to hiring nazis people implicated people who were involved in experimentation and the death camps i mean specially sidney gottlieb himself. his grandparents who by all of course eleven's it really is a fascinating part of this story so during at the very end of the 2nd world war.
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head of our u.s. secret service the o.s.'s. wrote a memo to president roosevelt saying that as the nazi regime was collapsing it would be important for the u.s. government to try to hire nazi spies and bring them into working for the u.s. government rather than rejected this you know we're not going to hire any of those . but after a few months roosevelt with that through that was in power and that process went ahead after the very immediate lee after the 2nd world war american intelligence officials were arresting many people in germany and they had files if you had a scientific background they would put a paper on your file. therefore operation paperclip became the name of the project by which nazis were brought to the united states had to be placed all
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references to membership in the net after the gestapo had to be dyes it would be ab little entries made into a want to go to family ground as part of the law so the 1st group that came were by then the 2nd group was the rocket scientist that was very blunt then came the p.c. bio warfare people the people who wanted to know how to control human money thought to themselves who is out there that has information that we don't have who's been experimenting people that find out exactly what portions of our kind that we're kind of back on the human mind of the human by well if but not because inspiration doctors and the bio warfare experts will work for the 3rd reich the part about godly is particularly intriguing as you say gottlieb was jewish his parents immigrated from that go to europe at the beginning of the 20th century if they had not emigrate and you know sydney might well wild up being the victim of one of
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those horrific so-called medical experiments in a nazi concentration camp but in the event that didn't happen he grew up in the united states any didn't seem to have any problem working shoulder to shoulder with the nazi doctors who carried out the various maybe the senate says it worked on that committee on torture about guantanamo about abu ghraib maybe they should definitely read this book because ironically i suppose predictable that they then these nazi doctors this stuff engage in a pulling torture injecting l.s.d. into african-americans and the tricity drugs you you talk about mass poisonings in san francisco you're absolutely right that project when it comes. clearly off the rails largely due to gottlieb himself so does the san francisco bay it was just one example you're right it involves car wrecks experiments on human subjects and
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numbers of people die by god we also had all sorts of other interests one of them was the making 53 in the godly persuasions of the day to buy the entire world's supply of l.s.d. and use that for 2 purposes one was these horrific lee course an experiment into trying to destroy human minds but the other for less course of experiments including this bizarre program that he set up in san francisco he wanted to see if there was a connection between drugs like l.s.d. and other one and. so we got a guy in san francisco to work for a minute hire a ring of prostitute. job was to go out to go guys bring them back to earth bestially equipped apartment they were very bad l.s.d. and their reactions would be monitored by that drug agent who had no scientific
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background and was just sitting on a portable toilet drinking marking you out of a pitcher this was called operation midnight a while back and so this national security whorehouse was part of america's efforts at the spend itself against communism in the 850 this is how crazy m.k. ultra well it seemed kids are all stop you there more about and gail join the boys are in chief after this break plus on thin ice despite black lives matter protests over alleged murders by u.s. security forces on the next to feel the force of u.s. no one force meant a 1000000 overseas students we'll tell you how you might escape the clutches of the immigration and customs enforcement agency as plans for mass deportations begin only civil coming up in part 2 of going underground.
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seemed wrong. why don't we all just don't. let me. get to see pal it just comes to educate and in detroit equals betrayal. when something you find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground . yes i get it only i suspect. people also want to pay for school if you're born into a poor family if you're born into a minority family if you're born into a family that only has a single parent that really constrains your life chances people that i am a stiff 10 years old a whining to generational poverty. it's a. fight every day you meet your needs and the needs of your family.
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welcome back i'm still here with stephen kinzer discussing the cia's so-called mind control program m.k. ultra tell me about the unintended consequences the cultural consequences in terms of the 60s counter-culture well the irony of this has to do with the next government. carry out of ordinary people so in addition to the users of l.s.d. on prisoners or on people who are unaware that we've also wanted to see how an ordinary person would react to it. in a clinical setting knowing exactly what was happening so almost overnight
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a whole new market research grew up people did become involved here one of them was easy. what went on to become the green card of your classic one flew over the cuckoo's nest actually he took it in a hospital and loved it so actually he got a job in the hospital in the veteran's administration hospital and well. that's what gave him the material purpose. i have to go arlen ginsburg the radical poet was another of the very 1st volunteers to use the method of understood that the l.s.d. they were using came from the new gottlieb and the i a clearly also then go on to quote john lennon who said thank the cia if not to gottlieb i understand the assassination program was pretty lifing tell me about the press there better known the castro if you don't castro castro che guevara's assassination attempt by both labor and also patrice lumumba so the title of my
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book poisoner in chief refer to the i was does that you're talking about that is the campaign by the united. way. for a new leader it me god. was the head of the chemical branch of the cia there was a logical that when the cia needed poison or any purpose including killing a foreign leader he would be the person they were turned in it was sydney got the. poison that was supposed to have been used to poison the chinese leader joe and why that plot was thwarted later on he dealt castro became the target and it was godly who created all those elaborate devices you read about not only al pill that the phrase i learned while reading the file i wish dealt ill health as for lethal help it was a little kill you he made those for castro but he also made things like
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a poison fountain and with an ultra fine so you wouldn't feel it went into your leg he made a poison wetsuit so that if castro put another and we need a way to get him alive you think none of these plots were successful then when the cia decided at the order of president eisenhower to assassinate patrice lumumba prime minister of the congo not only did godly make the boy it carried from washington to the congo which i think makes him the only person in history at its best ever of carry government may poison to another country intended for the use in the fascinating the leader of that country you know we don't know if you believe these assassinations go on in your book you quote richard helms as saying the principal driving force was attorney general robert kennedy and you say there's an irony that actually a cia asset in paris was receiving
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a poison pen on the same day as as malcolm x. said the chickens came home to roost and j.f.k. roberts a brother was killed whatever you believe about the kennedy assassination all of the reasons in some way didactic you. if it was oswald alone it was because he was a very we know of the fact the us is making again that it was castro it was revenge that was the end after it was because they didn't like any giving up on. the us it was because if you missed it with the i am right out rogue elements of the national hero it was because they were angry were going to be over hear about it she'll the 2nd has never left the us government actually died when i. went to work the persian thanks to you but you know it thinking we're still angry don't castro but we don't know how many hundreds of millions of lives may be affected by all these foreign policy decisions just finally what's happened to camp dietrich which reaches so
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much in this book is associated with plum island because of course there is a conspiracy in fact law some of us representative from the republicans because it was smith said lyme disease could have been created by camp dietrich it's a disease 300000 americans a diagnosis annually off what is kind of the trick now well 48 you're going to now call was the center for development of u.s. biological weapons and biological agents in general it's now used for example purpose as a storage facility for. and dotes to possible disease. it was rare that cindy got we maintain a secret well in which cia scientists concocted there or the area out there other work. now it's not clear what kind of research is going on behind some of the closed doors or people but it's certain to say that. all we don't know
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how deep the u.s. government is going into research for biological warfare some of which is going to buy us or whatever or us government is doing in this area it's happening behind closed door on that base in maryland same base that was the center m.k. ultra the place where the forces were fabricated. where there is the most. research anywhere in the world waiting weapons right here you know are defending against record weaponization. of vital and very obscure role in the art harbor of bio warfare and the investigation and biological tools if it be used a little. stephen kinzer thank you. well
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away from the cia now to another arguably in from his u.s. government agency ice or immigration and customs enforcement has grown a virus in black lives matter protests continue to rage it is threatening to deport maybe every overseas student from the usa but a leading immigration lawyer and former international student is fighting back you know mcentee joins me now via skype from chicago thanks for coming on more than a 1000000 international students given the u.s. student visas nastia what on earth is being threatened against them. thanks for having the apps and i were kind of messed up hide by by this and that was actually earlier on this week at my i changed course with regard. for foreign students that were made kind of hands and essentially they said that if foreign students were go in to be studying online and morris had an online only course that's for the false master and they would not be able to do that while maintaining their their student visa status here in the u.s.
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now i know harvard and mit have already said they're going to sue the trumpet ministration i mean this could really mean the mass deportation of say all u.k. students from the united states. well i mean that was certainly what i had put in their direction of that they issued a essentially last foreign students that we're going to be attending online only courses with a few options and i don't think any of the options are grace and the 1st is leave the last 2nd to try to scramble to transfer schools and a few weeks' notice assuming they can find a course in a school that is not online only and force the schools to to go on to kind of change from online only to in person or face deportation so they're the options that they were left with the law it is to say that harvard's and mighty have already say northwestern university in chicago and recently just joined in support of harvard and mit position as well and i know you tweeted out a loophole
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a possible loophole i don't know whether you're being humorous about it i'll get to that in a 2nd 1st of all do you think this seriously is a recognition by those in power in the u.s. that students they consume is but they don't contribute anything to united states society when they're there i mean it's certainly a slap in the face to the foreign students who come over and i just don't understand it from an economic point of view all the economic data goes to show how much foreign students contribute just like even living here you know $41000000000.00 as they've put into the u.s. economy in the 2829000 academic year and just by being here their presence alone created over 450000 jobs here in the you asked so in the middle of a pontiac when the economy is suffering on so many ways i don't know why it makes sense to try to expand a huge population of emmer and thought are clearly contributing so much let's get
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to this loophole that could save students watching this program around the world they could be something like a one credit course that could save them from deep. you know their ability to return to the us to resume studies well i know that the colleges and universities are looking into the office and there was provision for as a hybrid type model where it's not online only as potentially codes foreign students and to stay but i think if that administration trumpet ministration ice were trying to force schools to open i think their plan hasn't really worked because instead of doing that they've actually seen the administration so i would advise foreign students to terry and communicate with your university and sit and watch this space to see what happens with this lawsuit but technically if the university has gone to online because of corona virus and they have just one tiny
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little course maybe half an hour long that is face to face that that would mean that they would not be deported by ice well they're trying to figure out those details so there was provision for it you know that the directive spoke about online only so i think they're trying to figure out exactly what that means and and kind of what are the promises of costs and so still being i think and investigated by the colleges and the universities but i know that i had rather. i think you know almost every professor from some of these big universities had volunteered to coleman to teach at n.p.r.'s lynn class because they know important foreign students are both economically but also these are these are people's lives and i used to be a foreign student myself so advocating for current foreign student something that i'm really passionate about you can just tell that the professors you know they care a lot about these students that are from all over the world and it's just not right and the possession that ice is taken given that the grown
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a virus is you know absolutely not under control in this country and aside from the nearly half a 1000000 jobs lost perhaps 41000000000 down to the u.s. economy 100000. maybe affected in terms of a student accommodation in the us yeah actually that was one of the things. i had done an entry on almost immediately multiple landlords got in touch with me directly to say that they were rantings that they were releasing their places to foreign students and that if they were deported as you know they're asking me what's going to happen to their their apartment so i actually recommended that they consider writing a letter to the added or their local newspaper just from their point of view because you know it's not just it's bad enough that it's directly on the foreign students but there's a huge ripple effect from this on some of that includes the m. packs that it would have on landlords utterly saying to foreign students at the time of this interview joe biden hasn't issued anything from delaware about what he'll do if he wins the white house in november obama and biden deported many more
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than trump more than any other president in history or all the presidents put together obama was known as the deporter in chief maybe more than 2 and a half 1000000 i mean any sign that actually could be worse than trump on these overseas students issues. no i don't think that there's any there's absolutely no way the biden is going to you know implement these types of policies. and i think that i've actually looks at that with online but i brads through. vice president biden's plan for immigration he's made a commitment to immigration reform to put it on the agenda in the 1st $100.00 days his plan is very comprehensive addresses that the humanitarian aspects of immigration like the asylum seekers you know in addition to looking ass so reform in the business immigration and so addressing you know just the fact that the system is a dated and doesn't necessarily match up with the needs so there is no doubt in my mind there's no way we would see something like this from for biden if you know my
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country thank you. thank you for having me that's of the show will be back on wednesday in the mafia eighty's 1st democratically elected leader aristide overthrown by u.s. backed death squads that want to join the ongoing you through twitter site but instagram the facebook. guys are survival guide book station just like all the stores simply have all the servants to. be sure it's not going to get a. call it's no good says a repatriations would get arrested 7 years. ago of the separate march kaiser report
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. oh my one lives in my. brain to bounce of a time about what was it was a bit. more. when we were in the same. scene that i'm going to fit in but i'm before. the body i'm not. just the people don't trust the government and the government doesn't trust. me come to this decision the legitimacy and more importantly is there
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a way out is doc. i. am also time this is in the headlines fresh blood. descended to violence in new york while. elsewhere to off to new video shows a police officer restraining a suspect by pressuring his neck. florida records another record daily increase in covert infections also the country's biggest surge too since the start of the break on the russian a critical care doctor talks to us he's working in new york he says the crisis is of a scale that health workers they have never seen before. many of my colleagues including .


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