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tv   Cross Talk  RT  August 3, 2022 10:30pm-11:01pm EDT

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ah, dumb the full me at that a bull upright beaten this is emily apples goody. from sheila this is kim sylium. shes thought city assist the worth. eula. any bianco? yes, my thought or janine did it again, the lord orchard, buddy up my bill out about this morning after search financing. ah ah ah hello and welcome to cross stock. were all things are considered on peter lavelle. the so called collective west is at war with russia using ukraine as
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a proxy. the west has made it clear at once a russia that is weaker and isolated on the world stage. to date, these attempts have ended in failure. in fact, the opposite is happened. the west is weaker and isolated. ah cross sucking the wes miscalculations. i'm joined by my guest, john verola in new york. he is a political analyst, as well as a former foreign correspondent in russia in washington we have michael maloof. he is a former pentagon, senior's security policy analyst, and america. we crossed to martin jay. he is an award winning journalist and commentator or a gentleman cross sack rolls in fact that music and jumping in time you want. and i always appreciate, let me go to my michael in washington 1st. i me the soft my introduction. i kind of wanted to focus in on russia bed down the news flow is kind of interrupting this error. china is very much a in the news flow. i won. i'm so michael e,
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it's go do a little bit of history. remember in december, i think, december 17th, the, the russian said to know to diplomatic note, to nato, into the united states, say, do watch your step. i'm going to borrow some chinese words. you know, you could get burned with ukraine. now let's talk about right now. you know, the, a, nancy pelosi, i suppose as we speak right now is approaching, or maybe even be in taiwan and the chinese sworn don't do this. they'll be consequences. is there a parallel here and who's not understanding the world? go ahead, michael. well, well, thanks for having me, peter. yeah, there's an extraordinary parallel here. i think the chinese have learned from the ukraine lesson. they saw that mister putin, as you pointed out, i put down a red lines and a and wanted to negotiate or they were ignored. and now he's on the same thing. a jeep ping is now done the same thing. isa is issue or bread lines. and he's told
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them don't cross it or else and the and for some unknown reason our people are so fick added. they just cannot get the message and clearly administer so that they don't, they don't understand what it's like to have a, a 2 front war going on, all of a sudden, once again. and, and in this case, we're not prepared for it whatsoever. i'm not even prepared to to help you ukrainians a very much longer given given how quickly they're going through the logistics. so this whole thing is just total madness and be in august. i am very, very concerned about a possible war. and historically wars have have occurred in a, in many cases during august. and i was, you pointed out and it was what, it was gushing the guns of august and they got them august. okay, absolutely. martin way in there and i in on this here be because
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a parallel with ukraine is quite remarkable. ukraine is a small country, relatively poor, very badly govern. i don't think anything you can say anything like that, about china. go ahead. no, you can't. i'm in that respect, did you put it that way? you know you're talking about of david and goliath situation. we can't afford a war or anything close to. and it resembles war, a state of war with china that would just be simply suicide. i think the links between china and ukraine, the button family and iraq, there's extensive, i think they look russian analyst stories. that agenda is just simply on getting to and you know, i can't be the 1st commentator, the 1st skeptical commentator to say that i really believe that either who thinks he's going to be really against the ropes come them in terms, is looking for a massive destruct distraction and you know, he's certainly not the 1st us present to look at the globe and see where can we have a dust up somewhere and, you know, bring on the train by tomorrow. but martin,
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this is china. it's not phantom by. this is not grenada. we've got to john, get new york, joe, go in, just jump in, john. i mean, one common thread i'm seeing throughout all this is that the democrats of the party of chaos. domestic. they were behind the insurrection, the violent insurrection in summer 2020. when our city is burned for 2 months and now abroad, we see that the party of chaos ignited this. busy war reagan reignite in this war and ukraine. another person for war in china, so i get the fuel, they just want more chaos. more chaos brings that more power, more conscious. they can justify more contracts, whether it's spending at home or spending for defense. well, defense spending for war abroad, and that's the only common courtesy, the party of chaos, of course, as in other respects, respectful guest said they, the democrats are also very much interested in provoking china,
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broke in russia. i think they do want the 2 front war because this is their moment in history, where they're going to teach the other great powers of the world and teach them a lesson. and they're going to show them who, who's bought they, i mean, they think their boss, the democrats, think their boss on the planet, and they're promoting their vision, their global vision for new world order. oh my coat, if you correct me if i'm wrong here, but i mean if the u. s. it seriously is considering some kind of conflict with china, they have to get there by ship. right. i mean, you have that move now is and then 1000 on these big aircraft carriers. um, china is very well prepared for something like that. i mean, i, i just, you know, russian ukraine that, you know, they're right next to each other. okay. that's a land war. okay, this is something very different. i'm losing 3 of aircraft carriers in 90 minutes is good to be. how is that going to go down? go ahead, michael. well, it's not going to go down very well. so players are al carriers. i'm sorry,
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go ahead. yeah. yeah, the chinese have warning. you basically that they, they can knock out those aircraft carriers and i think that they're prepared to do that. they got the, the book that a specific type of logistic missile that will come if they're called carrier killers. i think it's the df 21 and so it and, and they also have a they also can introduce into their warfare scheme. another thing that we don't even talk about not select, electromagnetic pulse, weapon weaponry. and they practice for that. we do not. and i think that that is something else that they can use against our, our, our combat um, a carriers and our in our ships, by the way, they have a greater a much larger navy and than, than, than, than the united states. and the only way the united states can get there is by ship . and if they were coming half, half way around the world. and as a consequence, the, the chinese just have to lie and wait in. and it's because it's sitting,
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it's their domain, their territory. so it's, it's, this once again shows aggression. i'm very concerned that what you still have people at the top of the state department in the, by the administration. who are the near cons that are, that are calling these shots. they're unrelenting, they want, they want containment, both for china and russia. that's a sequence we have driven both china and russia into a much greater military alliance. as a consequence, john in new york, you on the jump in, go ahead. yeah, just we, we have military bases in the region, so certainly we have the power to project. there are quite easily, i mean of course we do have to bring a lot by ship, but we already have a lot of. busy much assets in the region, so we could fight a war. yes, we could find a war with china. it's going to be extremely destructive, but we could fight it in, in the, in the region. well, i don't know that japan. i don't know that japan and the other countries and south korea that the host are basis, want to get involved in a war in china that that's
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a really good point. let me go to martin right now that they, you know, the, the, the entangling alliances, the u. s. has, which is inherently dangerous. you know, if there is an attack on japan, then that's one thing. if there's an attack on australia, it's another thing, but taiwan is a very different thing because even the us recognizes that taiwan is part of china. that is the very basis of establishing diplomatic relations back in 79. martin go ahead. which is why i don't, i don't think don't, i don't personally, i don't think that going for war and i'll stand aside to, to with your other committees. i think they're looking for a state of emergency and i think this is going to be a huge public relations exercise where they ha, but martin, but that, that's what the us in these hot heads want. the chinese may react very, very differently to that. don't lose me. yes, unless it was a great danger that was great, changing new crane with russia, and the great danger with china is miscalculation in how much confidence do you
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place in the biden administration, not. well then this calculation is great because there was no interaction is great because you also have the chinese wanting good. they're going to have their communist party or a big brouhaha coming up and is using pink needs to get there reelected for a 3rd term. so he's definitely gonna take a very hard stand i like, but i think, i think i think that we will this, this thing is going to happen over a few weeks. and i actually believe being british a believe that the americans are also waiting for this trust to be voted in is conservative leader, sometimes september. she's very gun her on china. foolishly. she really believes that, you know, we can really take a belligerent, very bellicose attitude militarily, with the chinese, which is hilarious, frankly. but i think, wonder if this is all something was to be planned over several weeks in several months. you mentioned earlier about was in the summer, you know, as a journalist,
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i was find it somewhat ironic, somewhat amusing that so many was a planned over the summer. and if you've ever wondered why is my theory, i think the plans are in the sun because they get maximum press coverage because all the parliaments around the world shut down during most of august, the 1st or 2nd week of september. so there's lots of space in the newspapers for stories for inclusive correspondence. when we go to the mention, when we go to john in new york, i mean, this is another elite agenda here. ukraine has been a manufactured, elite agenda. we all have to care about your grade, even though most people don't. okay. and now the same thing here with, with china, and with really bizarre for me is that this is nancy. pelosi is farewell to where she's saying good bye. you've been traveling a lot lately. you know, when she has time off from january 6. okay. but i mean, she saying good bye and the by the administration is not on the same page for the house. i've never seen such a hardship in my life. go ahead, john. i mean,
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this situation, the american political impacts reminds me of the soviet political and best in the early eighty's that geron accuracy can keep a very, very old we're really not aware of what was happening in the country or in the, in the wider world. so it's maybe this whole problem, a large extent. i think they're working with the wrong information, specifically about ukraine. i had a conversation recently with people who are pro ukrainian for the war and ukraine. and they really believe that, oh, we just fight a little bit longer. russia will collapse, crushes in the week, rushes the giant with the feet of clay. they really believe that they're working with false information. and i wonder what information the white house and con, congressional leaders are working with regarding china, maybe it's something similar. maybe they think china is weak. now is the moment to strike. let's push them. let's humiliate them. let's show them who's boss or maybe, or maybe these people just audi involving. all right, i'm going to jump in here gentlemen. we're going to go to
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a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on the west miscalculation staying with in in a city with
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madison both both the models you need to deal with a with a lot of them, but i can't afford them by a lot quicker. yes. is deval with eating and he's out because tanya is normally new to stay with. he's here with, i'm says audio is if i'm dish with this isn't that was the 1st floor number give you know, doesn't with a ah,
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welcome back across stock. we're all things considered. i'm peter level to remind you. we're discussing the wes miscalculations. ah. okay, let's go back to michael in washington. the unipolar moment just didn't last long enough apparently for these neocons here. and the i've been thinking for a very long time. i'm watching what happened in a with, with a libya. what happened with syria now with ukraine and maybe on the menu is now china. is that the unipolar moment and had gemini, it's dissipating for the united states? do you think it's possible that they're seeing this? is that a certain juncture where russia is very preoccupied? obviously with ukraine and the chinese. they only see them getting stronger and
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stronger and stronger. it's the, it's considered east trap, and the u. s. as could possibly think we'd have to take them on now or least intimidate them. does that make sense to you? go ahead, michael. yeah, i think we're, i think the what the, the near constant in the, in the, by the ministration. see this says or less desperate effort to, to, to, to contain both russia, china, they, they say that this is the grand span, last grand stand of, for the, to, to preserve their unipolar world order. because they see this multi polar world order emerging. and it's emergency very rapidly, and i might add a think celebrating because of actions by the united states itself, through the sink, through the weapon ization of sanctions. a gets everybody out there these days seems even against our allies and their companies. so it's, it's, it's turning the world into a whole different world that we knew just
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a few years ago. and as a consequence, this multi polar world order now is beginning to accelerate. for example, the bricks, countries, they're, they're, they're, they're, they're going to be getting new members here shortly. i was just informed this morning by a very reliable source that some of the air of countries now want to join bricks. that's quite significant. that's in addition to saudi arabia and, and, and, and, and by, by bricks i mean, brazil, russia, india, china, south africa. they that, you know, when you bring those countries together, they constitute more than half the population of the world. yeah. and that's the merchant emerging, a multi polar world order, the united states now seeds itself competing against economic play a politically and militarily well in the end. and martin is, is a complete lack of trust and faith in the west. any more, i mean, using the, the dollar, it's a weapon. i mean, it's one of the stupidest things i've seen in my lifetime and you,
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you should cherish that as the global theat currency, but no, they denigrated, people don't want it. why get involved in these institutions where you could be held hostage, hey, look what they did to venezuela's gold for goodness sake. all right. it seems to me that china has learned very rapidly what the, with the, the, the west, under the leadership of the u. s. will do in the case of ukraine and china's learn what to do and what not to do, and they're prepared. one thing, i will say the russians have repaired for what had happened in ukraine, and i truly believe the chinese are prepared. i don't see anybody in washington, other than bluster being prepared, go head martin, you know, showing off repair and when they have been prepared for a long time because they've seen from the offset this relationship between the western china and his limits. i mean, the west can't decide whether it wants to make china master trading partner or a g, a political enemy, or a mix of the to, you know,
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the little confusion that but i think as more, more as this trade deficit with america broaders and china sells much, much more trade goods in america, the american exports to china, that's going to obviously become a problem. a certain point to the mentioned before. bricks is very relevant. what we're seeing is shina having much more competence. now, as these country just on a line are to join bricks so that you know, if there is ever such a threat to china, the big question is, we're trying to even stand alone or would other countries quickly, rosters defense in the regions? well, such as iran, for example, which has massive military capability. so i think the world is changing, you know, and we're living in a new age where america on the west has to accept that there's a new world order emerging. and it is from the east, and it's, you know, it's a room full. we've insisted on creating this new on coast, which is going up. and if you look around the world, you'll see more importantly, in my view, there's a number of non aligned countries. countries in the old days,
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in the cold war, who were forced more or less by the west to sign off to western germany. a lot of countries in africa for example, that had to form a european masters these days. those countries in africa don't follow what the west tells them to do anymore. and very, very interesting ukraine war, we saw something like 35 countries, abstained to the vote to basically kick russia. and 16 of those countries were african countries. another 6 didn't even vote a tool, so that was a very, very clear indication right from your set that the world is changing. and a lot of these african countries will stay on the line because they believe that this new world order is with the log in to get tricked by it. again, i'm not going be forced into position whether you have to choose one side of the other. they want to stay neutral, but i think many also when they see what's going on with the west, china will start also to look at ways of how they can impress bricks and so not to
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be become members of bricks as well. so the east is growing and everything the west us just seems to be like, shooting itself in the foot. every minute of wow, it said it really is. this really is an extra moment here, john, because there's a continuum. what would martin was saying here? that the, the west cannot accept that the world is changing in ways that they can't control. and that is really the dilemma right now. when you look at joseph parales blog. mean, he's just a madman. he has no idea what's going on in the world. and he's running the u. s. foreign policy list truss. i mean she, she couldn't fight her way out of a paper bag. okay. and then you have your joe biden, the king of them all. i mean, and the world is changing in a rapid pace and they have no comprehension of it. and that's what makes them truly dangerous. go ahead, john. what does the west have to offer the world they go war struction they go.
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let's look at the past when years. it's been war and destruction. iraq, libya, syria, ghana, stan, what is the main organization for the collective west? it's nato. it's a military alliance. what's the main organization? let's say for the other side, it's bricks. it's an economic development organization. so we see on one side is a highly, militaristic, dangerous organization civilization the west rung, as you said by very old and unhinged people on one side. on the other side is a block that wants economic development to respect national sovereignty. and to foster mutually beneficial economic relations to nuff. i'm and i'm not align country. who am i going to choose the unhinged militarist or the side that wants economic development and national sovereignty. john: yeah, you should. you should be very careful with your words, john, because you're going to be cancelled very, very quickly for is talking pragmatic sense. ok. sovereignty. oh, my god,
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i haven't heard bad on the mainstream media for decades now, but that's exactly michael, that, that's really what's going on here. is that you it the, the, it's a whirl and then there's a literature on the world beyond the west. it, and not only is, it was a literature 20 years ago, it's a reality now. and that is something europe in the americans, and they're in their friends, in nato world, in japan and australia, et cetera. they can't seem to find their way how they can fit into it. i mean, we, we, we had some of the u. k coming out. you know, they're going to be definitely, i'm sorry, was a german chancellor. well, i refer to a sergeant schultz condemning my china and supporting taiwan. i mean, no surprise there. no, and, and i, i can tell you that the, the i saw this when i was at the defense department. im when central asia 1st opened up, it was like a whole new world, a whole new universe out there that i had never known about and,
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and when at and that was the that constituted the east that the, the east, the eurasia. i a accent here that we have is, is something that we, the west has no concept of. and we're seeing that today. i might add that in addition to bricks, we're also seeing the belt and road initiative. yeah. it has begun to spawn. and, and now it's reaching into latin america, it's into africa, it's all across eurasia. and that combined with the eurasia economic union bricks, belton road, i mean, that's formidable economic engine that, that the united states now is very, very concerned about and finds very threatening. and that's what they can't go up against it. i think it's like michael michael. the juxtaposition is, i guess, want more bases around the world. i mean, if we could take africa, for example, you know, the us shelves, it's my building, you know, bases, you know,
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the chinese economic development. now we can argue and debate that what kind of economic development, but they're far more interested in prosperity becoming rich. and let me go back to martin americans. you know, that's what the west stood for security dignity, the rule of law prosperity. all of those are going away right in front of our eyes . so what kind of model is it for any one in the world now, go ahead america. did they really stand for those values? i mean, perhaps they did. there was a tiny moment perhaps in the early sixty's, when most of those countries in africa became independent on they clung homes for the tutor, relationships they handled their colonial masses, but i'm not sure if any of these values mean anything any more to these countries. you know, i mean, when the african leaders often complain when you comes to visit them, that he gives a speech about human rights when china comes to visit them, open schools and hospitals like us really basically got to sum it up. you know, these, most of these countries on looking to china now to be the new lead to invest money
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. you know, some like $3000000000.00 or for an investment just last year in the african continent from china is pretty impressive. seneca got this much less than the americans. you know, the china is really the real player in africa now, and i think this is going to be real, a determination, a tipping point. now in this new, well let me finish off what time are almost out of time. do you think the chinese are afraid of a walk pentagon? no, not at all. i'm sure they welcome it very much. so i do not think the u. s. is unable to fight where we're trying to, we will lose. we do not have. we might have a technology in the, in the armaments, in the weapons. we do not have the will. would you not have the mind that we do not have the brilliance like we used to have we will lose. yeah. when i and john, you know, where is public opinion here again, another major comp a nobody is consulted. no, there's no debate, but just the elite debate on,
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on the networks and that's it cable. and that's all the debate and people we may be going into a major conflict. and no one consulted the people. and they say the debate is between the talker. see and democracy. it's rubbish here, gentlemen. that's all the time we have. i want to thank my guest in washington, new york and america. and what i think our viewers for watching is here to see you next time. remember i spoke with ah, a no show dumbly new industry to restore can just look up some of natalie mussels runyan noon. she kitty doesn't being in the green shield on
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a nurse to me as close to mamma coquettish. 6th grade to somebody to look up to his ashley of dc. wanted to work with one of the cool position with you, but not, not looking for the chino drawings to network for furnished or something like that . and then we got that void that i see with them with ah,
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a nozzle you while div easy while for a new one slide yet if south. yeah. rush with a new got carson. it's an orchard done for me at that i'll pull up right. people in the zimmerman boulevard, from shelby schemes room should sort video a yes my thought or jan in that again. do you watch any of my be a lot about this more than just financially. ah .
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when with you, with warner, china not to escalate the taiwan crisis off to policies, visit to the region that says beijing begins large scale military exercises and hopes trade with ty pay this rocket is called hurricane and it landed right here in this playground ukrainian army attacks civilian areas, internet reportedly suffers step back from the towns of pesky and i bid, which i used as firing positions to target the dumbass and an exclusive interview with our team, former austrian foreign minister, kevin, can i so.


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