tv PBS News Hour PBS December 30, 2009 7:00pm-8:00pm EST
captioning spoored by cneil/lehrer productions >> ifill: good evening. i'm gwen ill. the late on the investigation into the faid bombing of a u.s. plane from authories here and overas. >> brown: d i'm jeffrey brown. on the "newshour" tonight,utch ofcials called the preparation of the plot "fairly profsional, "but its executn, "amateurish." >> ifill: why didn't anye connect the dots a can anything be done to il future attacks? we'll explore that with membs of the 9-11 commissi.
>>rown: and we'll get the views of two repsentatives on what congress did and did nodo in t past and should do noto prevent more terrorist incidents. >> ifill: also tonig, from san francisc spencer michels reporton a battle about putting terature online. >> googlis in the process of digitizing 40 million brooke not everyoneelieves one mpany should conol that much knowledge. >> brown: anmargaret warner talks to autr kati marton about heparents-- hungarian jonalists targeted by the secret police in the 195. >> i think it'really important for usn our country to understand t human cost of the cold warefore all the witness to it disappear. >> ifill: that all ahead on tonight's "pbsewshour." major fundinfor the pbs newshour is provided b
>> whathe world needs w is energy. the energy to get the econy humming again. the engy to tackle challenges li climate change. what if that energy ca from an energy company? everyday, chevron vests $62 million in peoe, in ideas-- seeking, teaching, building. fueling grth around the world to movus all ahead. this is the power human energy. chevron. >> what makes us aengine for the ecomy? plants across america. arly 200,000 jobs created. we see beyond cars. >> ts is the engine that bnsf, the engine tt connects us.
>> and by e bill and melinda gates foundation. dedicated to the idea at all people deserve t chance to live a healthy proctive life. and with the ongoing sport of these initutions and foundations. and... this program was made ssible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by conibutions to your pbs station from viewe like you. thank you. >> ill: officials from shington to amsterdam shed more light tod on the plot to destroy northwest flight 2. ray suarez begins our covera. >>eporter: there was new informion from the dutch concerning umar farouk abdul mutallab and his alleged bbing attempt. flight 253 originatein
amsterdam, and the dut terior minister said initial findings appear to conrm al- qaeda's claim of resnsibility. >> ( translated ): the first nclusions of the investigati are that thereparations for the failed attack wereairly professional, but that t execution was amateurish. secondly, thexplosives used wereeither easy to handle r risk-free to prere. the way it was used d the explosives compa to those used in previous attacks. the spect had a valid visa for e united states. e passenger list presented prior to the flight did not ve the us a rean to ask for additial security measures. >> reporter: the bom- made of the chemical p.e.t.n.-- wa hien in abdulmutallab's clothi, and failed to go off. that lefthe airliner intact on
e tarmac, but it also left continuing questio about what u.s. intelligence knew ahe of time. was widely reported today the had been al-qaeda "chatter" about a "nigian" being prepared for an unspecified tack. that information hasurfaced in a revi that president obama ordered. and made clear yesterday, he's not happy with whate's hearing. >> when r government has information on a knownxtremist and that iormation is not shared and actedpon as it should have been so at this extrist boards a plane with dangerous explosiv that could ha cost nearly 300 lives, a systemic failure hasccurred, and consider that totally unacceptable. >> reporter: as a sult, various u.s. intelgence agcies are trying to figure out what wt wrong. anthey're piecing together a timetablof abdulmutallab's activitiesoing back more than a ye. in junof last year, he is anted a tourist visa to the u.s., go for multiple entries until june 12 2010. it's issued by t american embassy inondon, where abdulmutlab attended college. in may of this year, he refused another british visa beuse the school listed on his application is not governmen approved and, he isarred from re- entering briin. the months later, he begins
taking arabic classes at thi hool in sana'a, yemen-- his second visit there in cent year on novemr 19, abdulmutallab's ther tells the u.s. embassy nigeria he's concern about his son's increasingly radical tk. the embassrelays the informatn to all u.s. diplomatic missionand the state department in washingt. dulmutallab's name is now enred into a terror watch list of 5,000 names. e name is not added to the mu smaller "no-fly" list, and the sa granted in june 2008 is t revoked. th, on december 16, a round tripicket from lagos, nigeria to detroit is purchased in ana, for $2,800 in cash. gerian officials say abdulmallab returns to lagos for one y, on christmas eve, to boa the flight. he checks no bags, and pses through security. he aives in amsterdaon christmas y.
the dutch inrior minister says nothing seems iss before he boards northwest flight 25for detroit. >> ( translated the suspect did not leave the customs ar schiphol during his transfe hepent the usual transfer timea couple of hours as per the norm, in the airport's internationalounge. as p protocol, he had to pass a curity gate within the customs areat schiphol, a metal detector, and this presented no irregularitie >> reporter: hours ler, abdulmutallab's flight was on final proach to detroit, when he allegedly tried to set f the bomb and was overpowered now, as he sits in a feral prison in michan, his ties to yemen and its gring al-qaeda presen have come under intense new scrutiny today, security forcestormed an al-qaida de-out along yemen's weern coast, and arrested at let one suspect. and the deputynterior minister declared h government
"will continue its strikes against the grp until it is totally elimated." and officials in somalia reported a somali nation tried to board commercial airliner there last month wita bomb that close resembled the one the northwest flight. that's aed to the urgency in the u.s. andther countries to improve screening. today, the dutch announcedhey will begin using fulbody scanrs on all flights to the u.s. >> ( transled ): however, serity gates currently used only detect metal, which iwhy body searches e carried out sporadically. this combination is, of urse, not watertight whi is why the decision has been madeo introducfull body scanne at schiphol forlights to the united states. >> reporter: andigeria said it will purche the 3d scanners as well. ck in the u.s., the preliminary fiings from the investations ordered by the presidenare due tomorrow. >>rown: ray's recounting of the timetable events raises
questis that investigators and officials are now asng: where were the gaps innformation and action? why weren't various dots connecd? d what's to be done going forward? these are, ocourse, similar estions to those raised afte september 11, 2001 and we ask them noof members of the 91 commission. richarben-veniste, now an attorney in washinon and former one of the lead prosecutors inhe watergate case. james thomon, former republic governor of illinois d chairman of president geor h.w. bush's intelligen ovsight board. and susaginsburg, who served on the commission's staff, cusing on how the hijackers enred the u.s. >> jefey: richard, you look at the chain of events what jumps out at you as to whayou you want to know. >> i would likto know what this man father told the i.a. agent in nigeria. whatoncerned him about the radicazation of his son.
did he have inntion to strike against the unit states. why did he go to the.s. embassy and c.i.a. if we had preexisting inrmation that "a nigerian" was entified as a nigerian to be employed in a plot against the united states overhristmas why these twfacts of a nirian young man in men that his father saw as a dical threat to nofy the united ates why his status was not chged and why he wasn't selected for secoary. >> what jumps out at yous a key part of the chain events. >> two things we'rawaiting a report from prident obama on what did we know, wh did we know it, whonew it. o was responsible for the
decision on the no fly lt and the revocasion of the aoes. >>anthony: secondly, thi bears a eerie remblance of what happened before 9-11 minneapolis when the lal fbi agent questions a man o was taking fght lessons and appeared to reprent some kind of threat to the united stat anthe local fbi agent tried his besto get his superiors in washington to authize a foreigintelligence search warrant of moussauoi's poessions, could not get national f to cooperate. nobody told the cia and we wl never know whether the information at could of been obtained for moussauoi bore september 11th could of prevented the attack. so it's happened again.
>> jeffrey: san, let's go to at issue. there was inte intelgence on ths yog man. wasn't shared or decisions were made t to follow-up. >> i thinke need to try to unrstand the nuts and bolts, reverse en near at happened. >> the first question i wod ask apart om the questions of the actualnterview is when the group t to discuss this in the embassy. what information, what additionalnformation were they ab to obtain by going back to their agencies to learn to, brinto bear on that discussion. yes, if there was infoation that was not shareat that time, that is troubling. we would want look at why. whether when the reque went back, assuminghere was a request at went back, it reacd the people who actually were concerning emselves if there were such people. >> jeffrey: chard, the
president referred tthis as systemic failure. it's abovehat was investigated last time around. >> onef the things that most troubled us was the stove piping of sring information, from varis industries. let'see what develops from the investigation on who was tol what. now ere is characteristic finger pointing ing on. here is wh we have. we have a ticket boughwith cash, d flag. we have it boughin a remote location, red flag we have a individual ches no baggage, red flag. nouestioning. secondary screening. we know he h been to yemen. we know he has been radicalid. thesare all red flags. if he was subjected secondary screeng at the airport there is a likelihoogiven the reports of his demear and so
forth at perhaps he would of cracked or perhapshey would of probed further to dermine the puose of his visit and whether in fact he had been inemen what he was doing there, a the questions at trained professionals ow to ask to rays suspicion. >> jeffrey: gornor, some of these things wersuppose to have been fixed afte9-11 because of theequests you all de. escially sharing information. doeshis mean the system has not be fixed and it's still flawed? what does it mean? >> cgress adapted many of the recommendationwe made about a rector of national inteigence, making the direct of cia work with that director and sharing information. congress can't make su that the huma in the bureaucracy,
no matter how go they are as telligent professionals carr out the sharing of intelgence. that's the problem. the bias of aring intelligence and acting together still exts today. one of the mosdisappointing failures was the comple disregard of o urgent recoendation that some way be found to dermine whether passengers are caring exploses on their body. that was a expcit recommdation of the 9-11 commission more thanive years ago. what we have had in the terim is an attempt to use the by scanners that could dermine whetheexplosives are being rried and yet the congress, the administration, and the ws media have beespooked by the privy extremists to say no, no, no. we can'tave body scanners.
even though e chnology exists to ghost the phapbl, e phbl is a knowledge tpheus, it can't be stod, the person usinthe screen doesn't know who its. you can fix e technology not to know if it's a man or woman, yet we wi ex utility e tourist privileges of this guy from nigeria and ex ha those who say can't have the slightest -- pvacy for those coming to th country. >> jeffrey: right, susan, you want to jumpn here. >> yes i wld like to go back to what point uld decisions of be made differently. ceainly one is to ask the question whether there could of been a secondary inspection i skippel. that
pends on who is there to do that and what tools thehave to acquire that formation. the united states has a ogram. dhhas a program that places cdp d custom border protection offices in foreign aports in a resip owe cal basis. there was such a officer at the aiort. howevethe individual by the time he reached th point had been through physical screing, ha already ge through the firsround of ccks and nothing was fod problematic. you there haveo go back and say what informati could of been brought t bear. do that you go back to the national tarting center that los like the names of the lists two hos before flight. the tional targeting center reives information on whos
going fly and have opportunity too some search. again we have to look athat waavailable in the system. the cash paymentrom geria would not necearily be considered a indicater many airlines require ca paymen in africa. because the amount of fraud. , cash payment in and of itself a lot opeople fly without baggage cause of the hass. the trip w short. he had a round trip tick. again we need look closely at wh was available to whom at at point. point. >> jeffrey: you know we talk last nig on the program about privy concerns governor thompson raid. you can weht in on that. i also want ask you will the list questions. do those need to be xed? >> yes.
one thing recommended is the tsa to take charge andntegrate it on thlist. no fly list is a excluve list of 400 the is a shrebt list of 14,000 to 15,000. >> jfrey: then a bigger list. >> half a million inviduals with some connection to terrism. now, i think, th review may increase theist for selecty or secondary screening. for individus who pop up. this man's name s added to the larger000 list we are told. the technology should ext to matcthose names quickly even though there areroblems in terms of spelling and soorth. tuing to privacy. there has to ba balance of civil libeies, privacy and curity. here i think the position is
extre in terms of the ritancal view of the human body. people go to doctors. doctors look at their bodies. people skr- to balce on the one hand what individuals e trying to doo kill them while they go through thmundane process of goi from one place to anoth by airplane, and certain kindof technologies as jim hamentioned that enable screers t to detecthings hiddenn the human body. >> jfrey: just in the short time left i want to ask govern thompsonstarting with you. it possible if these things were donthere are still cases like this. we talketoday to paul pillar, a long timintelligence profsional. said we're seng a monstration. no matter w hard we try to fix
thgs we have inherent challengesnd likely to have incidents like. this what do you think? >> se. that remds me of the argument of pple who say because cancer screenings only save twor three ouof a hundred people and promote false positis we should eliminate or down py screenings. if i'm going to be saved ba cancer screening i want e scening no matter what the statistics say. look we're a wide en country. anyoneho wants to hurt us can dot they don't skr- to get on an airane and set off a bomb. theyould park four or five ucks around the united state d there will be mass panic. they can poin foods and have has manic, financial pic, they can bl up railroad lines. have to take those risks.
we're lucky since 9-11 there ven't been domestic incident on o soil. god knows w many incidents have been stopped by o agencies. th do a good job, professional job. mebody made mistakes. we have to find t who and why. jeffrey: do you think this will galvanize? >> y the president has taken this very seriouy. he hasaken mediate charge of e situation. he has dermined there will be accountable. if therere systemic problems they need to be dressed. if there has en human error we need to find out why a who. this is a serious incident. nearly 300 livesay of been lost because of. th we got lucky. they were incompetent in cerin reguards here. 9-11 we didn't take ad skrapbtage of the mistak al qaeda ma. need to be smarter.
>> jeffrey: have to leave it there thank yo all, very much. thank you. >> thank you. thank you. >> ifilland still to come on the "newshour": the litical fallout the christmas day bomb plot; theebate over google's projecto digitize books; anduthor kati marto chronies her family's cold war story. but first,ith the other news of t day-- here's hari sreenivasan in ourewsroom. hari >> sreenivasan: at least eht american civilns were killed in a suicide bombing today i afghanistan. the bomb exploded at ailitary base in khost provce, near the pakistani boer. the base supports reconstrucon and otr civilian programs. hard-line governme supporters turned out in force in iran day. and, graphic video footage emerged om sunday's ti-government protests >> the video could not be independently verified but they sh two polictrucks with large bars on e front plowing into groups protesters. the screams of
bystanders gro louder as one ns over a person lying over the seet. one ofhe trucks had been taken fromolice. >> about thear that ran over the rioters both of skraoe and owr have been identified and interrogated. it's clear the caras stolen from him. he wasit by a stolen car. >> at the sa time the chief warn protesters they will show no mercy if there are ne demonstrations. >> the time moderateness is over. thi said thabefore, they thought i was joking. from now on if anyone participatesn such demonstrationsnd gets involved in sucactions will see no leniency. >> to unter the protest the iranian government ge all
employees off to attend ma prests today. thounds chanted "tkraegt to americans." they accused wesrn nations of accounting unres >> theimagine they can set a stag celebrate and have exaggerad news and high person and re. the nation is faithful, ited, a zealistic, integrateand unified living it's fe. they should fear the day this ocean turns into a boyling and roarinocean. >> the ptestsers gained support in paris andondon today ere tkpwroudz rallied outside of iran's embassies . >> sreenasan: in western iraq, at lst 23 people died in twin bombings in ramadiin the worst vience there in months.
thk plumes of smoke could be seen moments after t attack, as emergency vehicles shed to the scene. policemen were among those lled. thprovincial governor was one of the wounded. a british man held hostage i iraq for more than two yearsas released today. peter moore was woing as an information chnology consultant when iraqi milints seized him imay of 2007. british foreign seetary david miliband spoke with m by phone, after his release. >> peter is in good health, despite many months of captivity. he's undergoing careful mecal checks and he's going to be reunited with his familys soon as possible back in the u. he's obviously, to put i mild, absolutely delighted at his release. >> sreenivasan: thmilitants gave no reason for moore's relee. four of his bodyguds were abducted with him. three were kild. the fourth is presumed dead. leaderin western australia declared a natural disaste today as a pr of massive wildfires raged. the fires bre out tuesday in a wheat ansheep farming district, rth of the coastal city of perth.
since then, flames have orched more than 33,000 acres of rest d farmland, and destroyed roughly 40 homes. the u.s. goverent has injected more aid into thauto financing giant, g.m.a.c. the new assistance will tota around nearly $4 billion the companalready received more than $12 billion. it w a slow day on wall street. the dow jones dustrial average gained three points to close at 10,548. the nasdaq rose more tn two points to close at 2,291. those are me of the day's main stories. i'll be back at the end ofhe program with a preew of what you'll find tonighon the "nshour's" web site. bufor now, back to gwen. ifill: and now, to the potics of national security, especially theole congress plays. for that, we are joid by new jersey democrat bi pascrell, jr.-- a member of the hoe homend security committee. and utah republin jason chaffetz, who rves on the house coittee on oversight and government reform. >> gwe congressman, i want to start with you. you were the spons of the bill
in congress at forbade e use of the whole bod scanrs. you hed governor thompson that said you andthers were spooked privy extremists. do agree with him on that? >> you have to understand th actual bill. the bill was n a ban on the use ofhe machines. they sd they couldn't use it as a primary screeng but use it osecondary screening. this cason the 25th. this guy was a pter child of who should of gone thrgh the sendary screing. absoluly the machines could be deployedation wide, inteationally. we have reason to use them, absolute use them. 99% of of ericans you don't have to use on every peon. govenorperson.
>> bard on the administrion. would you vote for it day. >> i vot for the amendment and legislation that didass, an authoration not an apprriation. since the time we have had t vote in the ngress i've leard a lot more about what maines we're talking about, the very expensive machis. i think we can find a wato protect peoples privacy ther by putting another observein the room, number one. having gender orieated machinery, and obviously destroying themage afterwards. whatever we ne to do to protect american citizs is very criticalgwen. i uld revisit this particular amendment. i think it was offed in good faith and i have ery reason to reexine. it passed with orwhelming suppor
>> gwen:ingers are being pointd in every ich way in the wake othis attempted terrorist attack. who uld you say needs to be first up on exaining what happened and didn't happ? >> wl, i would like to bring in the secretary of home ld security. i think she needs to explainhy initially everythi worked and then khaeubgd her mind. there are many risfactors. how was the gentlen able t get to the airpo. imine a father coming into an embassy and explain to the ce officer the problem has had with hison and why the informion was not pass ad long. i think the secretarmore than anyone suld come before congss sooner than later and explain where thbreakdown occurr. >> gn: congressman, there is an out fitalled the counter terrorism center. do you havquestions for them? >> yes, what i resnded to is the ct everyone in home land
securi should be under the glass, nobody escapes here. remeer secretary does not have control over all of the intelligent agencies. th are lucky to talk to one another. we have tried to force thessue home land security, i have been on the committee, in e committee nce it's inception. if you don't he cooperation you don't ve anything. if can have l the apparatus in the world. we don't have corol over the screening in other parts othe couny. there is no estion this character om nigeria should been allow on an airplane. hehould of been on a no fly list. we'rtrying to find out as we speak why was allowed to get on an airplanethe visa he. will have a hearing in home home land security the last wk of january and ing people before e committee. i think our chairman fm mississippi is on coursef ing this.
we have bipartisan support o home land securi since 9-11. wh i have heard is i rember reprehensie. you have a senator from soh carolina who stood in thway of the tsa director bei appointed for political reasons. th's not right at all. there are plenty of fings and plentyf blame. the point is we shou be on that and defendi american people together and pport american pple. that's whai'm about. govenor: >> gwen: congressm i want to ask you what youhink about the intelligence piece of thiseing a problem. particular the central intelligent encies being alertd in august about a unspecified gerian they were keeping an eye o nothe pieces show the cia is under the magnifying glass a well. >> well we're going need to
lower the bar onho gets on the li to identified people who need secondary screening i think the secondy screening woulhave caught these guys. there were wholeody imaging machines in nigeria d amsterdam. weave to ask why those were not used. we need re from our internional partners on screening. ke sure they're communicatin of the 550,000 people onhe watch list who is watching the people on the watch listt seems we maybe little too politically corrt on the way and we neeto trar get the tar reufts. we're at warthey want to kill us. >> gwen: you tnk profiling should be as abase. >> whave to be careful. we don't want ofiling on race, ethnicity or religion. t we can profile potential teorists and go through a rigorous screeni.
i don'see any other way around it. >> gn: congressman, do you think the administration i acting quick enough and thoroughly enougto address at is turning inta bigger anbigger problem. >> the predent son this case. no question iny mind. talk to people on intelligen with t president in hawaii now. he doesn't he to be in washington to ben top of. this we ed quick answers. the president willet answers tomoow on who dropped the ball. support our intelligence agenci but we haven't gone over the bump or the hurdlto get them to talk with e another. obvisly someone dropped the ball here. point fingers at the cretary i think is short ange. if she blew this i would be e first tosk for her signation. we can not have seco chances. i'm glad jason said what he id out profiling.
the on thing we should do with priling is beha i don't havior profiling. i believe behavior profing is acceptd and ould be followed in every sense of the term. >> gwen: congressman, m curious wh you think about what the administratiois doing. you maybe aware of fmer vice vi president eney's criticism that the administration s inform slow. >> the day aft the event the home land director of secuty saidverything worked okay. >> gwen: wt about now. >> have a estions. i don't wa to take a chea shot at them i want them to comto capitol hill and answethe questions and i think that's the pror politicaway to do it without just throwing political
barb at eh other. >> gwen: thank you allor joining us. >> tnk you. >> thank you, son. >> brown: xt, putting all the rld's books on the internet. "newshou correspondent spencer michels los at the controversial plans of onle giant,oogle. >> rorter: just before 9:00 mo mornings, a truck belonging to google pus up at the stanfo university library. it's load with books that google cheed out and is now returng after having scanned them, so they can be read by a computer. overdue fines here. as soon as the truck is emy, library workers lo it up again, with more books to digitize-- pt of an ambitious ogram that so far has scanne 12 million books at many libries, the goal is to scan up to 40 million.
google said oumission is to that's aall order for daniel clancy, an engineer and th director of google boo. >> google said our mission ito organize all t world's inrmation. >> reporter: he says therimary purpose of all theigitizing is to makes books searchae. >> the reposity of our cultural and societal and history really embodied in books. but when you search the we you're n searching books-- many of these books were not e not digitally available. >> reporr: clancy showed me how books are now pearing ever morerequently on google searches. >> eve time you search google, you're searching 12 miion books. they were looking for this arcane, it's called-- ourt of admiralty." so this is a very obscure yo know... you can e how many
reporter: stanford, the university of california berkeley, and the iversity of michigan have signedgreements with gooe-- authorizing the rm to scan their books. michael keller, the stanrd librarian, says its a valule program. >> the indexing every word in every one of the books wld allow us to get more out of e books. another goal was to make more accessible the contents of tse braries to others around the united stateand indeed around the rld. >>eporter: while snford digizes some books on its own, for speciaprojects, using a irly slow and complicated swiss-made snner, google use its own proprietary system whh it wouldn't allow us to film. >> reporter: the gooe project has proved loud criticism among somecademics, authors and rival high tech companie some of whom have suedo halt or at least modify it. gary reback is a silicon valy
torney who represents the op book alliance, whose members include microsoft d amazon.com. he predicts that google ll starwithout charging for what it digitizes, t eventually will iose hefty fees. >>hat google is proposing here is not likany library you've ever been to. it's not aublic library, it's a privatlibrary. and it's being run for prot. big prits. google igoing to charge universitycholars, ordinary peop, even school children to get acce to books that google copied withouthe permission of the puisher or the author. >> repter: current books, whose copyrights are in ct, and thcopyright holders are known are not inispute. publishe must give permission for those books, or portns of them, to be t on line. books inhe public domain, whose copyghts have expired, are fa game for any digitizer,
and currtly you can download many of them forree. the problems arisever so- called "orphanooks"-- out of print, but still in coright, wherthe current holder of that copyrighis unknown. while there are a loof them, theyon't get read very often. >> whahappens when you digize these books and make them accessible on the net i th they get a lot more u. people can find the stuff, 1 times mo use than formerly was rerded. >> reporter: selling digit copies of those books then cld become protable, and the fight isver who gets the money. but ogle insists its plans-- and its investmentwhich it won't sclose--are not based on profits. >>oogle hopes to benefit from it bimproving our search and we expect thate will make some money as we sell the books, t the tivation is not e money we're going make from selling books, because if you lo at what we investing, it's far greater than that. >> repter: attorney reback doest buy that at all.
heays google reached a tentative exclusive settment with ahors and publishers-- giving them part of e profits -- that ves google a lucrative monopoly. >> the pblem is the way google has gone about this, to ke themselves the exclusive supplier. we have proposed that we tak google's set of digital coes and we have them licensed to four or five other compaes and that wouldean there'd be competitn. >> reporte google's alleged monopoly alsdisturbs pam samuelson, a law pfessor at the unersity of california rkeley, who teaches copyrigh law. she coends that the agreement reached last october bween google andublishers and thors doesn't prect the public ouniversities who use those books. >> there really are not chks and balances in thagreement out, about pricing strategie anit seems like more books that googlscans, the higher the pres can be. the entire thi transformed
itself into a commcial enterprise. it's basically turng this project into a bookstoreather than a library. reporter: google argues it has no monopoly; it welcomes competition: microso, amazon and othe could be doing the same thingbut have decided not to. >> microsoft useto have an initiative and they cided not ntinue pursuing it. there's nothing 're doing that prevents anyone from doinghe exact same thing. the one thing that i strgly think is the wrong answer that wshould, you know, lock all th stuff up so that nobody can diover and nobody can... can e these books. >> reporter: google's insience it is acting altruistically,ts reliance on its "don't bevil" motto drew scoffs from attory reback. >> people no longer seany big difference betweenoogle and google's competitors. they're in it for money. and we need to depend on t compitive system to protect us. >> reporter: does th go for
people in your association, including amazon and mrosoft? >> oh, it absolute does. it absoluty does. in ts case for example, amazon was digitizing boo long before google was. microsoft wanted to digiti books. ither of them got the same deal that ogle got... got secretly, but if they d we'd be alle better off because of it. >> repter: questions like those are beindebated around e world. at stanford, t librarians met rently to wrestle with how to adapto the new on-line book resours, and whether to cooperate with digizations of theicollections. and bostores like berkeley's pegasus-- already in competion wi discount booksellers-- have to apt as well. this store now sellsigital books through its b site. besides the compition from on- li books, store owner amy thomas also rries about privacy of digital boobuyers. >> they ve a right to read without being having their reading recordsubpoenaed for
whatever reason. theyave a right to this privacy and we will pe that google will mainin, zealously maintain, dend those rights. >> reporter: pamamuelson is equally sktical of google's privacy polies. e puts her trust in librarie foits part, google says it has been a hugadvocate for user privacy. anti-tst concern copyright law, competition and pvacy are all at issue in flurry of lawsuits, friend othe court briefs and ierest from the department of justice. they will come to head in february, when aederal judge holda hearing on the google case in new york. >> ifill: finally tonit, a conversation about a booyou can hold in yourands-- this one the human cost of the cold war. margaret warner has our ory. >> repter: not long after world war ii, andre d ilona maon were leading glamorous liveas journalists in budapestworking for "the associated press" another
western news outlets. but in the 1950s-- as e soviet-backed communts tightened their contro- the martons became t objects of surveillance. they were tried as ses and imprisoned. freed in 1956, they we allowed to emigrate to the uted states a year later. now their dahter author and journalist kati martonas written their story, mucof it bad on hungarian secret police archives. we talked recently with rton about henew book-- "enemies of the people: my family's urney to america." >> ki marton thank you for doing this. you paint a ve sreufed picture inhis book of your parents. the were correspondents for two american news organitions t there is more that made th taets. >> they were aost recklessly prwestern. in their appearae. they drove engsh clothes.
th drove a white staoud a bakeconvertible. th were a major thorn in the de of the regime. there was something almostyou know, seif we can't do this and get away with it, about them. which is still hd for me to understand why, y they at a time when mo hungarians crossed to thepposite side of the street to avd americans my parents went to thamerican bassy weekly and walked in t front door aif. they livedn an "as if" world as if it was perfectly aobg septberrable for two american journal i wato cover the bad news, call it as ty saw it and rook and act as ifhey were americans, w they were not. >> your father's repting was
honest aut the oppression going on. >> yes they coved every manger show trial until the own, which they couldn't cover. they covered every piece of d news behind the on curtain. ey were the last remaining source for aricans of news of the her world now captive to moscow. >> you begin the book thnight befo you read the secret police files. u were scared of what you would discover. you did discovery information about thoswho worked with the secret pice. >> watching clerksn white coats wheeling in supermarket carts of marton fami files i was panicked. the head archiverlooked at me and said yours is e of the biggest les. terrifying. what theiles contained were
shking at times. everyonerom our inner circle, even our baby sitt, the most treacherous of all. >> you never likeder. >> no she always liked msister better. was right, she was wrong. shwas a full time agent reporting on our every me using me. i was 6 years old at the tim and my older sister as her ief sources. everyo, all of our cleaning ladies, our dentist,he guy at the grocery store, erybody was informinon my parents. >> and there was someone ithe american embas. th was shocking. >> that was -- i think f pants this must of been the most painful thing. en they were finally arreste the evidence wasr provided someone in the eassy. someonwhom himself was blackmailed by the communi, secret police. >> you ao learned some tngs the course of this, things
they didn't wantou to know about your family background. >> there were regions of my hiory walled off by my parents. when ty reached safety in american they decidethey were done with europe they never talked out the fact my father was active in e anti-nazunderground. theyever talked about my grand parents parishing in otuwz. i ner knew we had a jewish background. i was raiseds a roman cathic. i ver knew they tried deerate means to get out of huary failing every time. they we desperate people. i was ob liveious toheir did he ha desperation d also their marriage was very ch on the brink.
>> in prison they d finally break your fathein a certain way. >> y, yes. is was hard reading. my fatr was interrogating for weeks on endn what i have to describes abbukpwraeufb style interrogation. head to stand against a wall with endlessbscene ities yelled atim and more. he koon ed to being an american agent which he wanot. it's proof everyonhas a breaking point. i thk, margaret, more painful for than that which was horrible to read was to diover that he frie tried not oe but twice to commit suicide. he tried to my oddly collect the sleeping pills whichere --
>> in the lini of his coat. >> yes. here it was his cell me also informing on my father w actually saved mfather's life. threof the pills fell out of the lining of s pocket. the ent, cell mate immediately reported that. if he carried that out he uld have never seen me or my sisr grow up tsee who we have come. he would of missed o on our whole life after that. it's a hearteaking prospect. >> then when they got the u.s. and your father actuall became aiplomatic corresndent. discovered the ste department, the surveillance rumed you learned? >> yes. >> very bizarre. >> this was anotr shock the fis held. once my faer made a biline for him to the united states t hungarians decidedhis guy
could be useful r us. the watchers resumed their watching. total surveillan while me as a little american gi living in suburban maryland pitcd headlong into my aricanization we were surrounded by communist agts who tried to figure out who woulbe a better agtd my moth or father and how to blackmail them. the watche took up their wahing. >> finally, to whadegree, this is a particular story out you and your family, a universal story of what life was le for central ropeans after world war ii, liberad from the nazis but ll on the wrong side of t iron curtain. >> as weelebrate the 20th anniversy of the end of communm and fall of the berlin wall i tnk it's important to
hear not onlfrom the historian perspective what the colwar was all abt but the human rspective. what it en tailefor thousands, millions of people w live undethat system of total fear, total terror, anhow it can makehe whole population part of the dirty business. i thk it's really important for usn this country to derstand the human cost of, the cold war before althe witnesses to it disappea and that why i moved as fast as i did toind as many of the peop who played either a negative or a positi role in my own famils saug. anthony: margaret, this isn't st about my family. this is how people we forced to le. 's important for us to rememberhat. >> kati rton, thank you. >> thank you margaret.
>> brown: agai the major developments of the day: dutch officials announced probe of t airliner bombing plot appearso confirm al- qaeda's involvemt. the acsed bomber board the plane in amsrdam. at least eight america were kied in a suicide bombing in afghanistan. the "newshour" is alwaysnline. hari sreenasan, in our newsom, previews what's there. ri? >> sreenivasan: we he a coersation with presidential historian michl beschloss, who dropped by the rundown ttalk out obama's first year. yocan watch more of margaret's intervw with kati marton. that also on the rundown. finally, on rt beat," a remembrance illustrator david levine. see slideshow of his work and hear an intervw with the editor of "the new york revi" of books. all at and more is on our web site, newshour.pbsrg. gwen >> ifill: and that'she "newshr" for tonight. i'm gwen ill. >> brown: and i'm ffrey brown. we'll e you on-line. d again here tomorrow evenin thanyou and good night. major funding fothe pbs newshour is provided by:
>> chevron. this is the por of human energy. and toyota. and by the alfred p. sloan foundation. supportingcience, technology, and improved economic performance and financl literacy in the 21st cenry. and with the ongoing suppo of these institions and foundations. and... thisrogram was made possible by the corporation for public broadcasting. and by contributions tyour pbs stion from viewers like you. thank you. captioning sponsored by macneil/lehrerroductions captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org