exactly exactly how they say something is including israel and you know why israel is a country that only became independent in one nine hundred forty eight and was under british colonial rule and was in exile as a people until the mid nineteenth century managed to come up very well democratically i would even say a little bit too democratic with its pluralistic system and the proportional representation but how is it possible that israel in the middle east is the only country that really has maintained democratic model to the extent that many of our local arabs are learning much more about democracy from us than they are from their fellow arab states why do they have to learn from anyone why can't they just do it on their own ramzi do you want to finish up before we go to the break i had. yes yes please i think you know this really example is a very interesting example because it's constantly constantly prided self-will being the only democracy in the middle in the middle east but it's also tries to constantly suffocate any attempts at genuine democracy in the middle east as of this

israel believes that the global community must demand that any egyptian government preserve the peace treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that in the new usual demand i mean here's a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable turns on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was sup

exactly exactly how nice it is including israel and you know why israel as a country that only became independent in one nine hundred forty eight and was under british colonial rule and was in exile as a people until the mid nineteenth century managed to come up very well democratically i would even say a little bit too democratic with its pluralistic system and the proportional representation but how is it possible that israel in the middle east is the only country that really has maintained democratic model to the extent that many of our local arabs are learning much more about democracy from us than they are from their fellow arab states why do they have to learn from anyone why can't they just do it on their own ramzi do you want to finish up before we go to the break i had. yes yes i think you know this really example is a very interesting example because it's constantly constantly prided self-will being the only democracy in the middle in the middle east but it also tries to constantly suffocate any attempts at genuine democracy in the middle east as of this is some sort of a br

point here i mean a is israel's model of democracy worth exporting or just should israel not comment and not get involved in the internal affairs of another country egypt is trying its best it would seem to get its house in order but then you have netanyahu come out in basic praising mubarak is a great partner and friend etc etc he's not seen in that light in his own country so why should the united states why should israel be so under all of this because the have you ever seen democracy ally and through his dictatorship or democracy to support dictatorship have you seen people like that ok if i don't see him people. please jump in democracies jump in and go because the market has a nice jumping ahead i under i understand the concerns i understand the deep concern of come out for democracy i realize that i understand that he's supporting the ops talked government of. from the in in gaza i don't think much more the boss is very. happy about that situation in fact it's probably broken up a future palestinian state into two small statelets one in gaza. we can call the calmest on and the

i mean a is israel's model of democracy worth exporting or just should israel not comment and not get involved in the internal affairs of another country egypt is trying its best it would seem to get its house in order but then you have netanyahu come out in basic praising mubarak is a great partner and friend etc etc he's not seen in that light in his own country so why should the united states why should israel be so involved in and because the have you ever have seen democracy alliance who is dictatorship or democracy to support dictatorship have you seen people like that ok as i don't seem people. please jump in democracies jump in and go as the markets at least jumping ahead i i understand the concern i understand the deep concern of come out for democracy i realize that i understand that he is supporting the. upstart government of. india in in gaza i don't think mahmoud abbas is very. happy about that situation in fact it's probably broken up a future palestinian state into two small statelets one in gaza. we can call that calm a stun and the one in what i called you day and sce

exactly exactly how i said it was the including israel and you know why israel is a country that only became independent in one nine hundred forty eight and was under british colonial rule and was in exile as a people until the mid nineteenth century managed to come up very well democratically i would even say a little bit too democratic with its pluralistic system and the proportional representation but how is it possible that israel in the middle east is the only country that really has maintained democratic model to the extent that many of our local arabs are learning much more about democracy from us than they are from their fellow arab states and why do they have to learn from anyone why can't they just do it on their own ramzi do you want to finish up before we go to the break i had. yes yes i think you know this really example is a very interesting example because it's constantly constantly prided self-will being the only democracy in the middle in the middle east but it's also tries to constantly suffocate any attempts at genuine democracy in the middle east as of this is some

israel believes that the global community must demand that any egyptian government preserve the peace treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that in the new usual demand i mean here's a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable terms on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was sup

israel believes that the global community must demand that any egyptian government preserve the peace treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that in an unusual demand i mean here's a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable terms on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was suppos

more cooperative attitude on israel's part but there's not very much israel can do i think at all to influence you know the regime change in egypt not at all in fact i would be probably the worst thing israel could do ok well thank you very much for your comments dalia shamblin international political consultant david tel aviv. well we're giving you updates on what's happening in egypt as well as analysis in-depth analysis what's behind the uprising at what lies ahead for egypt these are explored in the latest edition of crosstalk that's coming up on our program next hour. the future of the mubarak regime is not so much being decided on the streets of egypt but mainly. they are certainly hald talks going on behind the scenes between egypt and indeed the americans and what is staggering is that we haven't heard from the obama administration a clear and unequivocal damone for mubarak to step down abilify could just interject right here i mean you can lay this at the doorstep of the u.s. but you know at the end of the day the only world leader who's been unequivocal about this is prime

treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that in an unusual demand i mean here's a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable terms on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was supposed to be along with the treaty a resolution of the palestinian israeli conflict and then israeli prim

i mean a is israel's model of democracy worth exporting or just should israel not comment and not get involved in the internal affairs of another country egypt is trying its best it would seem to get its house in order but then you have netanyahu come out and basic praising mubarak is a great partner and friend etc etc he's not seen in that light in his own country so why should the united states why should israel be so under all of this because the have you ever seen democracy ally and through his dictatorship or democracy to support dictatorship have you seen people like that ok as i don't seem people. please jump in democracies jump in and go is there more cuz he's jumping ahead i understand the concern i understand the deep concern of come out for democracy i realize that i understand that he is supporting the op start government of smear from the in in gaza i don't think mahmoud abbas is very. happy about that situation in fact it's probably broken up a future palestinian state into two small statelets one in gaza. we can call the calmest on and the one in what i called you did a

israel believes that the global community must demand that any egyptian government preserve the peace treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that an unusual demand i mean here's a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable terms on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was supposed

as a group of rabbis, in support of the israel we all love. it was not an accident that that is the way it played out. >> it wouldn't have happened without akivah and the way he lead us and helped plan the the trip. >> you know we have believe it or not just a minute left but alan you have a very poignant story i think encapsulates on a personal level this trip. >> as we were leaving the west bank settlement one of our colleagues said if i make aliah this is where i want to live. i will understand if you don't want to come and visit me here. i said to him if this is where you are, this is where i will come. our friendship is far more important than any considerations. it is about our relationship and how much we have come to appreciate each other not political stances. >> what a wonderful way to end our conversation. i hope we have had a formative insight about the rabbinic trip to israel. thank you for being here with us on mosaic ,,,,,,,,,,,, >>> welcome everyone to bay sunday i am your host sydnie kohara. i am joined by an amazing set of gu

exactly exactly how something has been clearly israel and you know why israel as a country that only became independent in one nine hundred forty eight and was under british colonial rule and was in exile as a people until the mid nineteenth century managed to come up very well democratically i would even say a little bit too democratic with its pluralistic system and the proportional representation but how is it possible that israel in the middle east is the only country that really has maintained democratic model to the extent that many of our local arabs are learning much more about democracy from us than they are from their fellow arab states why do they have to learn from anyone why can't they just do it on their own ramzi do you want to finish up before we go to the break i had. yes yes i think you know this really example is a very interesting example because it's constantly constantly prided self-will being the only democracy in the middle in the middle east but it's also tries to constantly suffocate any attempts at genuine democracy in the middle east as of this is some sor

i mean a is israel's model of democracy worth exporting or just should israel not comment and not get involved in the internal affairs of another country egypt is trying its best it would seem to get its house in order but then you have netanyahu come out in basic praising mubarak is a great partner and friend etc etc he's not seen in that light in his own country so why should the united states why should israel be so involved in the end because the have you ever seen democracy ally and through his dictatorship or democracy to support dictatorship have you seen people like that ok as i am simply. saying please jump in democracies jump in and go because the market has a nice jumping ahead i i understand the concerns i understand the deep concern of come out for democracy i realize that i understand that he is supporting the op stark government of smell from the inn in gaza i don't think mahmoud abbas is very. happy about that situation in fact it's probably broken up a future palestinian state into two small statelets one in gaza. we can call that hama ston and the one in what i calle

go ahead and filibustering last five minutes john wright the libel that's been directed against israel by the past two in the past five minutes really is reprehensible and it's a diversion the revolution in egypt is not about the so-called peace process it's not about israel it's not about the palestinians i don't think you gentlemen on this program or not one person on this program has said that it's not about them now i'm not wearing any of the reds we're having a laugh line is really meaningless to me an issue that's not an issue here of course is not it was real it's not very it's about the egyptian people for the. people the egyptian people don't want the blockade on gaza job this is a popular revolution this articular hurricane he was not as bad as terrorists or if you mention. the rally. and this is a diversion it's a diversion let's talk about the egyptian revolution that was then terrorism didn't attack the terrorist you can't blockade civilians it's not allowed to have starved children if you have a problem with terrorism is really is are not storming in these areas already e

israel believes that the global community must demand that any egyptian government preserve the peace treaty with israel joel if i can go to you first i mean is that in an unusual demand i mean here is a country israel demanding that a sovereign country and hopefully an elected government out to get through all of this violence. keep to a peace treaty that that is genuine generally not popular in egypt right now. it is an unusual demand but it's very much in line with the kind of demands that israel routinely makes israel doesn't see itself as a country that has to live in the middle east with its neighbors on mutually acceptable terms on the other hand even though the peace treaty is unpopular in egypt i don't believe that any government that might be installed as a result of a genuine democratic transition would actually abrogate the treaty the treaty is unpopular in egypt not because of anything having to do with egypt's relations with israel but because when the outline of the treaty was negotiated at the camp david summit in one thousand nine hundred seventy eight there was suppo

israel this was a social explosion and that's the way we should view it. but this process is slightly different in different countries. take bahrain for instance twenty percent of the country's population is sunni eighty percent a shia the leadership all sunny shia muslims consider themselves oppressed now they want to be represented in a coalition government they're in talks now and they may find a modus vivendi rain water in other countries the phenomenon is purely social i'm sure islamic groups will take part in a box we have to differentiate between a minute we shouldn't paint everybody with the same black stick take the muslim brotherhood in egypt financed and over and it is a movement that now wants to become the political party they already have twenty percent of seats in the parliament they are proposing a social program with the movement is actually a combination of different over forces there was a very interesting story in a local newspaper about the muslim brotherhood having a youth wing and a women's way in the brig these two groups just hatch

hope i found in israel. seems to me almost the most important thing that could cross over through that panel and out through the israeli wall are palestinian children, gaza children, to talk to israeli children. what you have got to have in the end is a meeting of minds. i know it sounds we are at the bottom of a terrible place in israel and palestine, but hope has to start somewhere, and it will have to start with the children. is starting with the children. >> terribly depressing situation. >> it is depressing. the children are the victims of a war, but i do not think it is possible to understand what is happening here. without understanding, too, that the problem is, as, who use these children as human shields, who give the children explosives or sometimes force them to have an explosive belts and send them to blow up israeli civilians. they have a terrible responsibility for this dreadful situation, and that really has to be faced up to. >> as far as the siege that the israelis are imposing on this commu

five minutes john write the libel that's been directed against israel by the past two in the past five minutes really is reprehensible and it's a diversion the revolution in egypt is not about the so-called peace process it's not about israel it's not about the palestinians i don't think you just went on this program not one person on this program and said that it's not about them now i'm not whining that he avoided somehow going to have my nose really meaningless to me an issue that's not an issue here of course is not i was real it's not very it's about the egyptian people for the. people the egyptian people don't want the blockade on gaza job this is a popular revolution it's up to the hurricane as it was posed as terrorists or if you mention. the rally and cade and this is a diversion it's a diversion let's talk about the egyptian revolution as it was with in terrorism didn't attack the terrorist you can't blockade civilians it's not allowed to have starved children if you have a problem with terrorism is really is are not stored in these areas and i'm just seeing a. game right now

five minutes john right the libel that's been directed against israel by the past two in the past five minutes really is reprehensible and it's a diversion the revolution in egypt is not about the so-called peace process it's not about israel it's not about the palestinians i don't think you gentlemen on this program or not one person on this program has said that it's not about them now i'm not wearing any of the reds we're having a laugh line is really meaningless to me an issue that's not an issue here of course is not i want israel it's not a very it's about the egyptian people for the. people the egyptian people don't want the blockade on gaza job this is a popular revolution this articular hurricane as it was called as bad as terrorists or if you mention losing to the rally. and this is a diversion it's a diversion let's talk about the egyptian revolution that was. an attack the terrorist you can't blockade civilians it's not allowed to have starved children if you have a problem with terrorism is really is are not storming the news there is already everybody i'm just seeing a. g

we spent a month in egypt, a month in israel, more time in jordan and damascus and turkey, iran. you know, we went all the way across through afghanistan, and part of this was me trying to show my young wife where i had grown up, and i tell that story in the book, and i tell the story of how this was in 1975-76 we were in israel, the west bank, and we were freelancing as young journalists in our 20s and sharing a by line and sharing stories like with the science christian monitor, and at the time we interviewed an israeli official or an academic, and then go and talk to a palestinian mayor or novelist, and it seemed to us at the time that the conflict was solvable and that was right around the corner, and the two parties really were not that far apart. i take about that in the book as well. i explain, well, alas, we were wrong. it's gone on 40 years since that time. >> there's maybe a parallel trajectory in the book. at a number of points you write about, you write sympathetically about various visions of a binational state, and george was a factor of one, and you approvingly see

israel this was a social explosion and that's the way we should view it. but this process is slightly different in different countries take bahrain for instance twenty percent of the country's population is sunni eighty percent a shia the leadership all sunny shia muslims consider themselves oppressed now they want to be represented in a coalition government they're in talks now and they may find a modus vivendi rain water in other countries the phenomenon is purely social i'm sure islamic groups will take part in a box we have to differentiate between a minute that we shouldn't paint everybody with the same black stick to take the muslim brotherhood in egypt finster it is a movement that now wants to become the political party they already have twenty percent of seats in the development they're proposing a social program with the movement is actually a combination of different over forces there was a very interesting story in a local newspaper about the muslim brotherhood having a youth wing and a women's women but of these two groups just hatched themsel

issue of the new what do you mean it diverts attention from israel that israel too is now facing serious problems due to the riots for instance they've opened the rafa crossing in fact it was opened some time ago they just closed it during the crisis so now israel doesn't know what the new egyptian leadership will do whether they'll maintain the gaza blockade only sin eyesight along the egyptian border of you know i read an article in the wall street journal that said the military and intelligence communities in israel are in favor of preparing for re occupation of gold at the same time many experts say that would put israel in a position where a large scale bloody war would be inevitable. so we can't say the situation was instigated by israel or that its purpose was to divert attention from israel this was a social explosion and that's the way we should view it you more would that this process is slightly different in different countries take bahrain for instance trying to percent of the country's population a sunni eighty percent a shia the leadership all sunny shia muslims consider th

nowhere is it commented on more sparingly than in neighboring israel. israeli policy toward this region, toured egypt, has been bound up for more than 30 years now with a peace treaty. israel has grown used to seeing mubarak as the living embodiment of that treaty, and its guarantor. if he goes, there is huge anxiety here about what will come next. everyone in israel knows the peace treaty is unpopular with the egyptian street. the future regime, under more democratic pressures, might want to amend or repudiated. it is for that reason that israel says as little as it can in public about what sort of outcome at once. it wants manage change, of course. it accepts that change is coming in egypt. it did have a stake in the way things work, the of decrepit nature of the old regime toward foreign policy. there is little israel can do to influence or create the outcome it once. the cannot comment on individual contenders for the future of the egyptian presidency. an endorsement from jerusalem would be the kiss of death. israel waits and watches in silence, lik

israel is already there. we will get up an enormous amount. >> i did include great britain and russia in the peace that i wrote. -- piece that i wrote. it would be wise to invite them and hope they would participate, shaure. >> i met whether they would have 1.5 or 2.7. the issue is the principal. it is less important than whether there will be an agreement. it is the principal. when you talk to people who are involved in the negotiations, they more or less disagree. we will take it as light as we can. they will continue to say positively. we now they can understand it. they are waiting to get it up. this is the reason why they resign. it shows that they understood the point. we know what it says for the public. it is up to the people that are involved in negotiations. they know what the solution would be. >> thank you. >> i agree in part. i do however think in fairness the security requirements of the state of israel have been dramatically changed in the past several weeks. the events that are unfolding has c

five minutes john right the libel that's been directed against israel by the past two in the past five minutes really is reprehensible and it's a diversion the revolution in egypt is not about the so-called peace process it's not about israel it's not about the palestinians i don't know thank you gentlemen on this program not one person on this program is said that it's not about them now i'm not wearing any of the reds we're having a laugh line is really meaningless to me an issue that's not an issue here of course is not a rise real it's not a very house demands it's about the egyptian people for the. people the egyptian people don't want the blockade on gaza job this is a popular revolution this articular hurricane was it was not as bad as terrorists or if you mention losing to the rally. and this is a diversion it's a diversion let's talk about the egyptian revolution that was. an attack the terrorist you can't blockade civilians it's not allowed to have starved children if you have a problem with terrorism is really is are not storming through and those areas already agree with me

in israel, as the doctor has correctly pointed out, israel has seen its bedrock relationship with egypt being twisted upside-down. what is happening in sinai i terms of lack of rule of law i terribly it unsettling to the israelis. the israelis are cautiously hopeful, but rightfullyo wonder what will be in jordan three months from now and two years from now. prime minister netanyahu, who had already stressed the security of his nation in the context of any negotiation with the palestinians as doubled down and although he would not put it in these terms he is going to build a fortress israel. who could blame him and the israeli people for not having that desire? having more recently lived through the -- now witnessing turmoil thats definitely unsettling to israelis, who would engage in some bold initiatives that causes the israeli public to have to pay a significant price. -these circumstances i could not imagine the political commercial he would run to support such a position. in ramallah, president abbas still reeling from disastrous political consequences having seceded to president ob

but israel is already damaged. it -- it will give up an enormous amount for peace. >> i did include great britain and russia in the piece that i wrote. i think it would be wise to invite them and hope that they would participate. sure. question think those misunderstood. whether israel would have to compromise on 1.5 or two 0.7 -- >> i think i was misunderstood. whether israel would have to compromise on 1.5 or two 0.7, the issue is the principal. whether the armenian court will be part of israel or it will be part of palestine, that is less important than whether they will have an agreement between the two sides. so the principles -- when you talk to people who are involved in the negotiations for the last 20 years, they have always agreed. take the right of return. every palestinian will continue to -- we know in track to that knows really would accept it. they're not willing to give it up. this is the reason he had to resign. he showed there that he understood the point. we know what he says to the public. unfor

states whose name will be israel or is israel, and an arab state named palestine. they will live securely beside one another in good neighborly relations and will fight against terror. this will enable the palestinian state to be demilitarized. this will enable a complete and to the conflict and will open a window or perhaps an update to regional activity. the sides of the territory will enable the establishment of a palestinian state and agreed upon sensible borders will give israel security. the end of the conflict will enable our regional and global economy. the palestinians will be able to benefit from a growing global economy, and israel will benefit from relations across the borders. peace will bring the momentum of tourism, the opening of joint modern ventures in the area -- energy, water, environment, free-trade. in fact, in every area of life. the younger generation will be able to buy an iphone in stead of stones. i am turning to our palestinian neighbors and saying to them, come, but as a compromise, let us reach a compromise that can serve as a model fo

is to tighten noose around israel's neck. if they are seeing a great opportunity in egypt, a strong supporter of the peace with israel. if egypt falls, jordan and hezbollah and lebanon in the north and a real noose on israel. chris mitchell was in cairo and they know they are at a cross roads. >> they are saying tht a tipping point in egypt's spiritual and natural history. it is important people are praying and fasting for 2 nation of egypt not back to islam but it turns more to freedom, more democracy, so the gospel, these prayer movements, these people coming to faith in jesus can change egypt, but the middle east and eventually the world. >> john waage cbn news. >> joining us now is joel rosenberg, the founder of the joshua fund, ministry to help christians, jews and muslims in the middle east. joel, pleasure to have you on the broadcast. for those that are watching around the world, christians, why should we care about what is going on in egypt? >> obvious reasons, instability there, largest country, 80 million mostly mus

mind including the nine hundred seventy nine treaty with israel. so it's hard to judge the situation right now and i can give a direct onset i think it will become clearer after time has passed in any case i think it might force the israeli leadership to give up their policy of maintaining the status quo in the middle east so far the israeli leadership has been leaning towards preserving the status quo and abandoning the idea of a peaceful settlement despite numerous un security council resolutions and president obama's cairo speech israel kept building new settlements in the west bank and east jerusalem sabotaging all attempts at negotiation i think recent events may cause them to reconsider their policy because global trends and not in favor of israel's anik sation policy would in fact they cannot really an exe the west bank or not. if they were to annex the west bank israel will cease to be a nation state it will become a state of two nations and they realize that that's why they want the status quo they want to preserve the current state of aff

live with such a thing absolutely without a question of a doubt is iraq obsessed with israel right now you never hear about it because they're with themselves which is what they should be ok you know if i get her and if i can ask both of you harder croquet supported by western governments wait a minute and i to ask you the minute you think it's here when we watch so i give you a chance harold please don't shove in our other guests it's an unfair excuse of not being fair skews your not being feature you're not being fair and we should go to our other guests right now just and these young literate johanne and the thing country every so many people in the world were very very happy to see the uprising against these tyrants in the middle east should the palestinians now have the right to show the same kind of free expression. again. yeah they're broke and he. can not leave weeden expansionist states that we'd ever expanding settlements importing russians to do it where they could easily accommodate people in northern israel they can live with their way in which he has cooperated with the s

people out to die john israel no this is not the jews you know this is you gentlemen we have to move on we're wasting too much time please susan i'd like to go to you on a good note here look at al qaeda people and therefore i think and therefore let me finish and their friends they must be so red faced right now but it must be so angry that the people could make political change their terrorism doesn't work but people's power can work not dictators supported by washington not bought. asked by washington but people people most people pulled off an amazing event. in the whole thesis of al qaida it's been shown to be absolutely five salute go ahead absolutely i completely agree and for all of the united states lofty proclamations that they that we are exporting democracy to the middle east in fact you know what we've exported has been has been devastation of entire societies and here we have a country with with five thousand years of recorded history of syrians and for sylar assume the worst people please stop interrupting please stop interrupting and and this is and this is this has c

against israel. can. can not believe we didn't expansionist this that we'd ever expanding settlements importing the russians to do it where they could easily accommodate people in northern israel they can live with their way and of egypt has cooperated with the surveillance starving gaza that kind of leverage that all that has to change and they expect this middle east then thing you're call it north africa that's quite right that's very much in the neighborhood my good have much luck i expected to come to like it came to the us to madison wisconsin and suddenly you have a live voltage in madison wisconsin how far that goes i don't know but it is about inequality and one instrument that can settle some inequality namely collective bargaining it's a human right and it is enshrined in the human rights so you see this is a general tendency this is not restricted to north africa and to the middle east the increasing inequality under the economics is.

what about the problem of israel here because in the new a new middle east were democratic governments eastern harold i'm sorry johann how do we the israeli question come into play because you mention that in the beginning of the program two can a democratic arab middle east have peace with israel. absolutely you know i'm can you answer first go ahead you know and you say you and i understand that i have i have the floor going i think it's very difficult think that of st this definitely against an avid expansionist zionist israel and they have expressed the seventh time saying again and again they would to be content and could believe read a for june nineteenth sixty seven israel would somebody be actions that study other agreement their legal agreement that is the one that iran has signed up by doing their job has done that so i would say the side. if we want stability the basic point would be for the west the u.s. european union and these threads to stop interfering to stop building their political systems propping up their autocrats and their enormous inequality economically you see

it of a threat from israel. they fought several wars with israel. this was an opportunity to recover the suez canal, which is a big money earner. it gave them the oil fields. it gave them a tourist mecca. half of the tourist sites are owned by ex military people. so long as the military is involved, i do not see any effort to undo that treaty. that treaty is pretty substantial. it has survived incredible stresses. as the population reacted to israeli actions. that is not to say that israel cannot help the process. as a new government forms -- i am sure one will form. if there is a way that israel can open up the dialogue with the palestinians, that will help. it will give people in the region encouragement. it does not mean they have to give away the store, but it does mean they have to be reasonable in terms of listening to other positions and making compromises where compromises can be made. that is what happened at camp david. it was coming together to find common interests. there are plenty of common interes

. >> israel feel's bit isolated? >> it feels very, very nervous indeed. first of all, it is isolated. don't forget there really isn't a leader in the region who has a relationship with netanyahu. ding abdullah of jordan refused to meet him. >> a conversation with the distinguished scientist who is leaving as president of rockefeller university to go back to london will be seen next week. tonight. tonight we devote our attention again to libya when we continue. funding for charlie rose was provided by the following: ( in a business like ours, personal connections are so important. we use our american express open gold card to further those connections. last year we took dozens of trips using membership rewards points to meet with the farmers that grow our sweet potatoes and merchants that sell our product. we've gone from being in 5 stores to 7,500. booming is using points to make connections that grow your business. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >

american spokesperson here in israel israel's looking from the sides as i heard with another interview just before me i think that the policy is egypt has to decide the people of egypt have to take their own fate into their own hands and really this is a battle for democracy the question we're asking here in israel is at the end of the day when a new government presumably is going to be created will it still be willing to hold out its hands for peace with israel and i think that that's a major concern both here in jerusalem and in tel aviv we have a generation today of his rabies by the way who only remember peace with egypt we have a generation who don't even remember nine hundred seventy nine and that handshake between sadat and menachem begin so the issue is can we carry on despite the changes which are taking place which despite the democracy within the arab world can we carry on and guarantee the continued peace between the two countries on the two people and would you agree with. jeff that this international support for israel is parts of the problems that we're seeing in egypt a

it goes way beyond israel. if there is any chance for a nuclear free zone in the middle east, at last i checked that was not in the immediate future. the time line for iran's nuclear program is moving far faster than any diplomacy. that is the danger. this hope that whether it is a regional diplomacy or more narrowed the policy is going to solve this problem for us is unlikely. the iranians are busy in their laboratories with their centrifuges. >> richard thinks it is not going to happen soon. i think it is not going to happen soon because the western powers do not want it to happen cent, not because israel does not have the security. it could be an incentive for israel and the arab countries to reach the kind of peace that we all seek if you have the zone with the sanctions. it is from that context, i think, that the zone should be an issue that takes precedence over other alternatives when it comes to the issue of nuclear threats in the area war between iran and israel and other arab countries. >> taking the

not solely but predominantly around the issue of israel i think if you're dealing israel which some of the new foreign policy establishment like j. street new america foundation are trying to do that actually a democratic egypt is not so misaligned with u.s. interests i think that's something that other people in the media and foreign part in the foreign policy community need to push at the same time i need to emphasize this both the pro-american and anti american regimes in the middle east or anti democratic syria and iran are by no means pro us but they're still anti-democratic so i think we just need to keep that in mind so we don't lose the nuances of the situation in the region hiring it that you know but nonetheless i mean it's i mean you can you can you can dislike hamas or hezbollah and things like that but by by international definitions they do practice democracy the people voted for them ok maybe there needs to be new elections but nonetheless i mean again you know to go back to my original point here is it's quite pathetic that the u.s. is worried about losing its dictator

israel's security the safety of their border with gaza for example and. they're very nervous and the egyptians are very upset to see that the americans are keeping very close tabs on the situation as it unfolds on the ground they see this thirty year old relationship thirty years the relationship between egypt mubarak and the u.s. as very damaging as far as the their relationship with other countries in the region is concerned and let's not forget that they're very angry about the financial aid given by the u.s. to the egyptians because it goes into security matters and who and the egyptians are the first to suffer from it let's not forget that the crackdown that we've seen over the last few days. with police forces resorting to tear gas but also rubber bullets and live ammunition while all these weapons all the as you were provided by the american the americans. you know really hit the nail on the head there i mean americans are nervous to see a vicious dictator leave that's a pretty sad state of affairs because other dictators in the greater middle east

israel's prime minister benjamin netanyahu repeatedly voiced concerns over the possibility of an anti-israel administration taking over after a power shift. >>> the u.s. government is urging the egyptian army not to use force following wednesday's clashes between anti-government protestors and supporters of president mubarak. >> the president's administration strongly condemn the outrageous and deplorable violence that's taking place on the streets of cairo. if any of the violence is instigated by the government, it should stop immediately. >> gibbs said u.s. defense secretary robert gates, chairman of the joint chiefs of staff admiral mike mullen and other u.s. military officials at all levels are contacting their egyptian counterparts. the egyptian army's moves are being closely watched amid the deepening confrontation between mubarak supporters and opponents. the u.s. government provides more than $1.2 million in annual aid and helped to train senior officers for more than three decades. >>> we'll be back with more news in 30 minutes. i'm gene otani in tokyo. -- captions by vitac -- www.v

what about the problem of israel here because a new a new middle east were democratic governments a certain harold i'm sorry johann how do we get the israeli question come into play as you mention that in the beginning of the program two can a democratic arab middle east have peace with israel. absolutely you know i'm can you answer for. you when you say you. have i have the floor i think it's very difficult think of st this definitely against a very expansionist desire and it's this rare and they have expressed seven times again and again they would to be content could leave a fortune one hundred sixty seven israel with somebody missions that's thirty other agreement their legal agreement that's the one that iran has signed and i do the job has done it so i would say the science educator or if he wants the ability the basic point would be for the west the u.s. european union and israel to stop interfering to stop building their political systems propping up their autocrats and their enormous inequality economically you see these people are fighting against that they are perfectly c

live with such a thing absolutely without a question of a doubt is iraq obsessed with israel right now you never hear about it because they're obsessed with themselves which is what they should be ok you know if i could have irony if i could ask both of you heart of a case supported by western governments anyway minute and i to ask you how the minute you think that still when we watch so i give you a chance harold please don't shove in our other guests it's unfair it still isn't being fair skews your not being seizure you're not being fair and when you go to our other guests i noticed and things you learned illiterate johanne and the thing country every so many people in the world were very very happy to see the uprising against these tyrants in the middle east should the palestinians now have the right to show the same kind of free expression. again. they're broke and. can not leave then the expansionist. we'd ever expanding settlements importing russians to do it where they could easily accommodate people in northern israel they can live with their way and ties cooperated with. being

we also bring doctors from these developing countries for training here in israel and it's a vision that's paying off not only is saeed eternally grateful to the israeli doctors that saved. daughter's life she's now brave enough to tell her neighbors back home to home what i will tell everyone we were in israel and how they saved my daughter's life i'm no longer afraid to say because my daughter is alive and so while the politicians continue to have a go at each other and israel and her arab neighbors will further a pox on the ground at least in this spot a very different story is unfolding policy r.t. hon. be back with a recap of our top stories in less than fifteen minutes from now and next it's time for a culture show must go out in this week modern andries discovers how to make life more affordable here in the russian capital known to be one of the most expensive cities in the world. hello and welcome to the program now moscow is famous for being one of the mess expensive cities in the world. and we'll see just how low we can find prices in the us and capital there are hundreds

the position of the new what do you mean it diverts attention from israel israel too is now facing serious problems due to the riots for instance they've opened the rafa crossing in fact it was opened some time ago they just closed it during the crisis so now israel doesn't know what the new egyptian leadership will do whether they'll maintain the gaza blockade only sin aside along the egyptian border with i read an article in the wall street journal that said the military and intelligence communities in israel are in favor of preparing for re occupation of gold at the same time many experts say that would put israel in a position where a large scale bloody war would be inevitable. so we can't say the situation was instigated by israel or that its purpose was to divert attention from israel this was a social explosion and that's the way we should view it more with this process is slightly different in different countries take bahrain for instance twenty percent of the country's population is sunni eighty percent to shia leadership all sunny shia muslims consider themselves oppressed now th

israel not be the only democracy in the middle east. there will be others, so there will be a new power balance, and i think it will be difficult for israel to continue not making any compromises with the palestinians. >> thank you. the internet is filled with pictures of women on the front lines of the protests. this is truly exceptional. egypt is a very conservative country and the voice of women often goes on her there. the image last week of a woman on the street kissing a soldier to show unity is revolutionary in and of itself. we spoke to women who are daring to stake their claim and fight for their rights. >> the site of women taking part of political demonstrations in egypt is unusual. they have been shunned from political events in the past. egyptian society has become increasingly conservative as to the role of women. men increasingly sexually harass women. but this time, men and women i standing side by side, making their demands together. >> i was afraid of being harassed, but nothing happened. people are looking out for eac