al qaeda was in charge. now the taliban are in charge. but the people who had me and everybody i talked to along the afghan/pakistani border all those many years i worked there said that there's really no difference at a fundamental level between the views of the pakistani taliban, and al qaeda. they will both will continue to fight. >> all right. cbs news consultant jerry van dyke. thanks so much for being with us. and his book "captive: my time as a prisoner of the taliban" is available in stores and online. >>> when we return, more of our special coverage on the death of osama bin laden. this is the "cbs morning news." moms love tulips. any second now, they are going to place me at the center of the table. edible arrangements bouquets beautiful like flowers, but unforgettably delicious, any second now... visit, call or go to ediblearrangements.com now you can brew over ice for delicious iced coffee or tea. hot or cold, keurig is the way to brew everyone's favorite cup in under a minute. choose. brew. enjo

with al qaeda. this man agreed to arrange a meeting and take him into al qaeda territory. >> narrator: the journey would be complicated. they were instructed to change taxis several times on the road in. ( horn honking ) then, a long walk into the hindu kush mountains. >> according to... to the middle guy, we have to cross those mountains you can see on the camera here. >> narrator: at times, najibullah would hand his camera to his companion. >> according to them, they say... they say first four and a half hours, then five hours. now, they say it... it's probably another three hours. >> narrator: they walked about six hours a day for several days. >> it's horrible, it's crazy. it's really hard to walk in the mountains like this. >> narrator: finally, the middleman brought najibullah to this valley. this was where he said the al qaeda fighters would meet them. >> narrator: they waited. >> then, the middlemen said, "this is them, this is them." i was behind the camera, and i saw the third one, the fou

with al qaeda. this man agreed to arrange a meeting and take him into al qaeda territory. >> narrator: the journey would be complicated. they were instructed to change taxis several times on the road in. ( horn honking ) then, a long walk into the hindu kush mountains. >> according to... to the middle guy, we have to cross those mountains you can see on the camera here. >> narrator: at times, najibullah would hand his camera to his companion. >> according to them, they say... they say first four and a half hours, then five hours. now, they say it... it's probably another three hours. >> narrator: they walked about six hours a day for several days. >> it's horrible, it's crazy. it's really hard to walk in the mountains like this. >> narrator: finally, the middleman brought najibullah to this valy. this was where he said the al qaeda fighters would meet them. >> narrator: they waited. >> then, the middlemen said, "this is them, this is them." i was behind the camera, and i saw the third one, the fourt

>> al-qaeda is al-qaeda. and it's the group that he formed and it is the problem that we have had to deal with now as you note here for many years. the distance between us and the muslim world or in particular in some cases the arab world continues to grow. it has not narrowed arab spring as not won us great friends anywhere. and it's somewhat seen in the way that this killing has been reflected in arab thinking. you have many container activities to our narrative being developed. some say he wasn't killed, that's a minority view. many say he was assassinated, that he was executed, and it was ready to surrender. there are others who say that he was set up because zarqawi had a counter-approach to al- qaeda and wanted to assume leadership. all of it reflecting the fact that we are not trusted and we are not believed in the region we have a big problem in the region. it's not just al-qaeda, but it's also not the other muslim groups. it's our credibility and i think that to some degree the way this story has pla

>> al-qaeda is al-qaeda. and it's the group that he formed and it is the problem that we have had to deal with now as you note here for many years. the distance between us and the muslim world or in particular in some casesethe arab world continues to grow. it has not narrowed arab spring as not won us great friends anywhere. and it's somewhat seen in the way that this killing has been reflected in arab thinking. you have many container activities to our narrative being developed. some say he wawa't killed, that's a minority view. many say he was assassinated, that he was executed, and it was ready to surrender. there are others who say that he was set up because zarqawi had a counter-approach to al- qaeda and wanted to assume leadership. all of it reflecting the fact that we are not trusted and we are not believed in the region we have a big problem in the region. it's not just al-qaeda, but it's also not the other muslim groups. it's our credibility and i think that to some degree the way this story has pla

who do you see as taking over the al qaeda command structure? how big a blow is this for al qaeda? can anyone step into his shoes? >> there is also another potent symbolic force. he is not in a command position. there are forces in yemen and other places that do not take hierarchical instructions from them but were nonetheless inspired. the question is whether the various separate cells -- i would say in yemen you have the most potent franchise operating without the direction. it continues to be extremely important. it is trying to take advantage of the tsunami of change in the middle east and position itself to maximize its ability to create regional and global have oc. the command center is decentralized. bin laden.was in londo you have groups modeled after them. they will continue whether they are around or not. >> thinks you for your insight. let's speak to general keane. he is a former u.s. army vice chief of staff. he is on the line from washington. give us your insights. obama said the operation had been in the works for a while. how do you capture and kill osama bin laden?

>> al-qaeda is al-qaeda. and it's the group that he formed and it is the problem that we have had to deal with now as you note here for many years. the distance between us and the muslim world or in particular in some cases the arab world continues to grow. it has not narrowed arab spring as not won us great friends anywhere. and it's somewhat seen in the way that this killing has been reflected in arab thinking. you have many container activities to our narrative being developed. some say he wasn't killed, that's a minority view. many say he was assassinated, that he was executed, and it was ready to surrender. there are others who say that he was set up because zarqawi had a counter-approach to al- qaeda and wanted to assume leadership. all of it reflecting the fact that we are not trusted and we are not believed in the region we have a big problem in the region. it's not just al-qaeda, but it's also not the other muslim groups. it's our credibility and i think that to some degree the way this story has pla

of al qaeda. and now the infrastructure's going to come tumbling down and we can see what else we can do. >> you think the infrastructure of al qaeda that bin laden was so important as the linchpin or is that based on the fact that we got intelligence from where we killed him? >> both of those things. first off, osama bin laden is the ideological glue to what al qaeda believes. al qaeda was not just the man, it was the entire infrastructure that he had built about this philosophy of taking over the muslim world and then the world and creating this clash of civilizations where islam will defeat democracy. not only was he overtaken by events recently in the middle east with democracy throughout the muslim world, which had nothing to do with al qaeda. not one word of his philosophy was used in that. he's dead. now his followers, the hangers-on, the people under him, his lieutenants, they have to justify their very existence in an islamic world that proou proved that islamic democracy does not need vi

but two other al qaeda operatives were killed, we are told. all part of a stepped up campaign to go after al qaeda leaders around the world. this american-born cleric, it's believed he inspired the times square attack and may have been behind the failed underwear bomber attack christmas day in the united states. ellio? >> is it fair to say he's been part of al qaeda in the arabian peninsula and they've been plotting nor attacks over the last year or two years? >> he's pretty much seen to be the operational leader of al qaeda in the arabian peninsula. twice now, they have demonstrated the actual ability to reach out and touch the united states, if you will. in the airline attack and even though the times square plot failed, said to be the inspiration behind it. and that puts their power right on u.s. soil. elliot? >> that's exactly right. and they're operating in a failed state, which makes it easier for us to open rate there, but fewer constraints on them. now let's go back to the president. he discussed the osama bin laden attack while addres

driven by an al qaeda ideology. not bin laden personally. >> there's every reason to believe now they're operating under their own banner. >> reporter: today al qaeda satellites are active in yemen, somalia, iraq, pakistan, jordan, indonesia and even the ungoverned western sahara desert. the most dangerous to americans, experts say, is the one in yemen. the u.s. backed yemeni government is so weak it can't control its territories. al qaeda in yemen also has a track record of attacking the united states. the underwear bomber in 2009. a computer printer bomb shipped to chicago a year later. al qaeda in yemen also has a charismatic recruiter, anwr al awlaki. his sermons are widely distributed online. he could become the new voice of al qaeda with an american accent. awlaki considered so important the united states tried to kill him thursday with a drone attack but missed. somalia is another powder keg. when we visited last year, it was clear that al qaeda inspired militants have more than a safe haven here. they contro

we worry because al qaeda has ma metastasized. it's a great row leaf to know this man is no longer walking. >> when you saw the president take the podium, was it what you thought? >> no. i thought it would come years ago and the announcement would come from president bush. but i have to say, i was thrilled and i was rooting for him tonight, the way i rooted for the president on that day because we are one country. and i think that our military deserves -- deserved the credit he gave them tonight. i was very happy to hear him say that because these guys have wanted him so bad. i mean, i'm talk about bin laden. so, i was thrilled that they could do an up close and personal attack rather than getting him from the skies with a predator. >> and i don't know if you saw as we were on earlier tonight, you must have been thrilled to see that spontaneous scene at the white house have hundreds have started to gather and sing the star spangled banner. >> i actually became very emotional hearing that. i wish i could be with them. the american

what it tells us about al qaeda, al qaeda had this vaulting ambition, a caliphate from indonesia to spain. now, with the waves of modernity sweeping the middle east, there sits this old man with a tv remote, and "the new york times" reported early on that one of the notebooks, handwritten in his handwriting, i gather, his project was to derail an american train on a bridge, perhaps coinciding with the state of the union address, you don't build a caliphate derailing american trains. it's a pathetic ambition. >> so are they kind of pathetic? i know everybody is worried. people want to know whether there are any real threats to american interests and other interests out there. was osama bin laden really, really the mastermind still as the narrative is telling us right now, organizing, operating? >> it's very hard to imagine that in that compound where you see how pathetic it was and how carefully controlled the entry was to have it as a nerve center. it seems to -- it stretches the imagination. i think the fact is al qaeda hasn't been able to operate very well for the last eight years and b

al qaeda. (laughter) >> stephen: and you know who i blame? al qaeda. (laughter) >> stephen: just listen who they want to replace bin laden with. >> this is the man who many consider likely to get the job al zawahiri but also known as a pretty divisive figure within al qaeda. >> we are told that zoo what wir-- al zoo qa heri is not that popular in the organization. >> he is not charismatic. >> he is a prickly guy, unpleasant human being. >> stephen: come on. if one thing to be a mass murdering terrorist but do you have to be such a dick about it? (laughter) >> stephen: evidently, evidently being a terrorist leader is like anything else, you got to motivate the people below you, you know. hey, nice try on the underwear bomb. we'll get them next time. (laughter) >> stephen: grandpa's crabby beard over here is losing them the key demo. >> i was struck recently looking at a poll down in yemen and for al qaeda was more popular among older people than it was with people in their teens and 20s. >> step

not al qaeda." in fact, al qaeda has lately taken a more subordinate role in the fight here. while some taliban funding may come through al qaeda channels, much of it from the marketing of narcotics produceed in the afghan poppy fields, the al qaeda presence is down by u.s. estimates to perhaps 100 fighters. the death of osama bin laden was an opportunity for the taliban to distance itself from al qaeda if it had wanted to. thus far, it has not, and this war in the post-bin laden era is looking a lot like the war when he was around. but the killing has inflamed other internal afghan passions over whether to try to entice the taliban to the negotiating table. president hamid karzai has called the insurgents brothers and said there could be talks if they laid down their arms. it's a suggestion that has infuriated his political opponents, who say proposing talks makes the government look weak and the taliban strong. >> what we are against is any method, any process, which can lead to the strengthening of the taliban without getting us any closer to achieving peace. >> reporter:

driven by an al qaeda ideology. not bin laden personally. >> there's every reason to believe that now they are operating largely under their own banner. >> reporter: today al qaeda satellites are active in yemen, somalia, pakistan, iraq, jordan, indonesia and even the ungoverned western sahara desert. the most dangerous to americans, experts say, is the one in yemen. the u.s. backed yemeni government is so weak it can't control its territory. al qaeda in yemen also has a track record of attacking the united states. the underwear bomber in 2009. a computer printer bomb shipped to chicago a year later. al qaeda in yemen also has a charismatic recruiter, anwar al awlaki. a native of new mexico, al awlaki's sermons are widely distributed online. he could become the new voice of al qaeda, with an american accent. al awlaki is considered so important, the united states tried to kill him thursday with a drone attack, but missed. somalia is another powder keg. when we visited last year, it was clear that al qaeda inspired m

they say america had no right to kill the al qaeda leader. now they promise to avenge his death. >> i don't think this will and the jihad. -- i don't think this will end the juhad. >> the confirmation of its leaders death could dispel growing doubts and conspiracy theories in pakistan and elsewhere. at the same time, the terror network about to continue its campaign against the u.s. and its allies. and washington is taking those threats seriously. when u.s. special forces stormed the hideout, they seized computers and documents that contain details of the ongoing danger. the terror network was reportedly considering targeting the u.s. rail network this year, 10 years after the september 11 attacks. washington says it is examining the evidence, but says there is no immediate threat. >>> the u.s. is continuing to launch missile attacks inside pakistan against suspected al qaeda and taliban fighters. up to 17 people have been killed near the afghan border, the first such attack since the raid that killed osama bin laden, which pakistan condemned

they say america had no right to kill the al qaeda leader. now they promise to avenge his death. >> i don't think this will and the jihad. -- i don't think this will end the juhad. >> the confirmation of its leaders death could dispel growing doubts and conspiracy theories in pakistan and elsewhere. at the same time, the terror network about to continue its campaign against the u.s. and its allies. and washington is taking those threats seriously. when u.s. special forces ormed the hideout, they seized computers and documents that contain details of the ongoing danger. the terror network was reportedly considering targeting the u.s. rail network this year, 10 years after the september 11 attacks. washington says it is examining the evidence, but says there is no immediate threat. >>> the u.s. is continuing to launch missile attacks inside pakistan against suspected al qaeda and taliban fighters. up to 17 people have be killed near the afghan border, the first such attack since the raid that killed osama bin laden, which pakistan condemned as

qaeda central and was recently the home to the leader of al qaeda. this president was very determined as you remember when he ran for office and since he came in here to refocus our attention on that region, on al qaeda, and as you recall in the very carefully deliberated upon plan that the president put forward for afghanistan, that the number one objective was to dismantle and veeventually defe al qaeda. getting bin laden was very much a part of that plan. but it is not the only part. as john brennan and others have said, the president has said, we are continuing the fight against al qaeda every day, and the focus of that operation, of the u.s. personnel in afghanistan, is on al qaeda. the operation continues. the july 2011 transition date for the beginning of a drawdown remains very much in place. the pace of that drawdown will be determined by conditions on the ground. >> final question, any updates from the plans to release video or images? >> i don't have any updates on that except to echo what john brennan said this morning, which is that we a

we now have these al qaeda franchises not directly under or tied to al qaeda along the afghan/pakistan border, particularly popeyed in yemen. they still have considerable capability. it's a great moment and a great victory, but the war and the threat continues. >> this is also from the associated press this morning spiri. what do you suspect is going to be happening at the cia over the next few days? >> there's going to be a real sense of satisfaction, quiet smiles, congratulations. these people know more than others that this is not over. they are just going to go back to work. >> what questions do you have about the role of pakistan or any other questions coming out of this news? >> based on what the president said last night and what some of your colleagues are reporting, it's clear the pakistani or not informed of this operation prior to its taking place. i understand that. i cannot conceive of it happening any other way. this is not the kind of thing that you want respect by widening the circle too large, too quickly. i understand keeping it quiet. the question people are asking m

al qaeda central is still a threat. had been to an al qaeda training camp and was getting direction from the core leadership of al qaeda. but that's an exception and the kind of threat we have looked at here in the u.s. over the last several months and years as not so much directed by bin laden but by either splinter groups or home grown terrorists. you won't see any change in the threat othe u.s. and no threat in the response. >> pete williams in washington for us tonight. thank you very much. i want to go ahead and replind all of you. this major development in the hunt for the moist wanted man in the world, osama bin laden announced dead by the president this evening, killed by u.s. special operations forces. saying president obama called to inform me that u.s. forces killed osama bin laden. i congratulated him and the men and women of our military and intelligence communities who devoted their lives to this mission. this achievement marks -- the fight against terror goes on but america has sent an unmistakable messag

al qaeda likes chaos. that is what they benefit from. they benefit from leadership that they cannot manage their own government, and they benefit from outrage. those are the two things that this document is clearly playing with, and then this final thing, of course, is alluding to potential attacks against us. >> and we know that bin laden was there. their quintessential leader and one nugget that imka oucame outt he was not a figurehead, and he was involved in future plots and tactically, et cetera, and al qaeda says that he did not build an organization that will vanish or fade away with his departure, and with him gone, all of the partner groups did not pledge of allegiance to al qaeda, but to bin laden, himself, so with his death, what does this do to al qaeda? >> well, a couple of things. the documents like you said, they are interesting, because they show his historic operational interest and tactics. it has been ongoing for osama bin laden's life, and i remember in the 1990s with the african embassy

qaeda affiliates in the remainder of al qaeda's senior leadership. but today the world knows, once again, that wherever al qaeda lurks, wherever they lurk, we will find them. it may not be days from now. it may not be months, but those who plot harm to innocent americans and our allies will be captured or killed. for them justice will be done. anyone who lived through the horror of 9/11 remembers exactly where they were on that terrible september day. now they will remember where they were when they first heard the news that the man behind it had been killed by brave american forces inside pakistan. we'll remember where we were when, after year of effort, we finally got our man. america didn't seek this fight. it came to us. but ever since 9/11 we've been determined to fight al qaeda to the end. we knew from the start it would require patience and great sacrifice. and that effort has paid off. thanks to the skill and perseverence of many brave men and women we have done what we said. america has not wavered, it has not lost sight of the mission, and

it is still al qaeda. it is still the extremists, the jihadists, who, you know, haven't shifted from their position because bin laden's been killed. i think always safer because of the operation to take down bin laden. i think we are in a number of respects. in part, it will be due to this information that we were just discussing. there is the potential, we don't know that, but there is the potential for enormous amount of actionable intelligence directed toward individuals that perhaps before now we didn't have a lead on, understanding of their financial issues, communications patterns, training and safe house locations. there is a lot of information that could ultimately make us much safer because it will lead to a speedier takedown of al qaeda as an organization. >> do you think, mike, we would have learned anything farther had osama bin laden been taken alive or was he the kind of al qaeda operative leader that would never have given things up? >> that's a great question. it is one of those questions t

steve call, the author who knows al-qaeda so well, asked about what al-qaeda is still capable of. this is what he said in part. >> al-qaeda is a resilient organization but it is not stredistred i spreading or growing so it has the capability of carrying out attacks that we saw christmas before last where al-qaeda almost blew up an american airliner with several hundred people on board. once in a while it could kill hundreds of people. that ought to get our attention but it need not be the basis for organizing every aspect of our national life or our national defense. >> do you agree with that or not? >> i don't know if i were to agree it's not spreading. i think if you look over the last few years, you've seen a greater presence with al-qaeda or affiliation with al-qaeda in north africa, obviously in yemen and somalia and even parts of central africa. we don't know what the strategy of going for the big attack, which we always assumed was a core element of the strategy, was delivered by bin laden personally. now that he's gone, there may be an opportunity for others who have diffe

qaeda significantly if it's an important blow to al qaeda. and it's an important blow in a. stream of events that has been good for us and bad for al qaeda we've had some really important mentum against al qaeda over the past couple years we've. killed a large number of al qaeda leaders in pakistan thanks to their bomb administration's very aggressive campaign involving intelligence personnel and drones and this has really. just mantled a large portion of al qaeda central leadership in pakistan but al qaeda remains very dangerous globally the most dangerous part of al qaeda now may not be in pakistan but in yemen and in other places where there are i don't want to germany spain and the united states i mean they might be in las vegas. as well as guys who are. right there anyway fortunately i think we've been pretty effective at keeping . outside of united states where there are of course certainly would be people in the united states but what does this what does this mean for our relationship with august on and frankly with afghanistan on cars

training in al qaeda camps. of course, there are still al qaeda groups around the world, thinking of yemen, somalia maybe, some other places, too. do you think they'll respond to this? >> i don't know if they'll respond directly. they may make some statements, but it's interesting you mention yemen, where a much younger cleric, american-born, actually, yemeni-raised, all sorts of interesting things about him that could bring him into a great deal of prominence in the years to come now that bin laden's out of the way. but al qaeda was always part of a general movement, part of a broader phenomenon of a militancy. bin laden brought it to great prominence, won it great prestige in a sense, make it the market leader of international jihad. now he's gone. we'll have to see how that evolves t. may not not emerge from al qaeda. somebody may emerge from outside al qaeda. >> a final quick thought, pakistan is central to this story, isn't it? of course, a place where osama bin laden has been killed, but do you foresee rea

al qaeda brand? >> well, that's the question, george. there's a debate in the intelligence community, has been for a long time, as to whether or not he had any ongoing guidance role or management role. i think the bottom line is, it shouldn't make any difference in the operations of the organization because he really wasn't doing micromanagement. it is going to hurt their reputation at a time when it has already been hurt badly by the arab spring. most rebellion has been taking place on arab countries have not involved al qaeda, at least not visuall initially. have involved a more youth rejecting al qaeda and succeeding in placing the government al qaeda tried for years to replace, like the government in egypt and couldn't. >> okay, richard, i want to go to martha raddatz right now. you've learned the united states actually has bin laden's body? >> security sources are saying they do have his body in custody. that is, of course, why they had to do the dna testing. they had the body. they wanted to do

he was the face of al qaeda terror. he was important in fund raising, recruiting, and clearly a master mind in terms of operations. now obviously he had to spend a lot of time not being caught. so he wouldn't get down into the nitty-gritty one would think. but clearly a critically important factor in the success al qaeda's had. >> schieffer: what do you think of the fact that here he was right in the middle of this town right next to a military facility and the pakistanis didn't seem to know about it? do you think that's possible or did they know? >> i think it is possible. i don't know whether they knew. i think we ought to be asking the questions that you're asking and that senator kerry is asking. however, if you go from the pentagon up the potomac river and look at those big estates up there with gated walls and trees and hidden from sight, we don't know what's going on there. it is possible that someone like that with a support system al qaeda support system in my view very likely could hide in plain sight. i mean

al qaeda after bin laden. a warning from the c.i.a. director. >> i can assure you, whoever takes his place he will be number one on our list. >> couric: and not even the neighbors knew that in the house down the block lived the most- wanted terrorist in the world. captioning sponsored by cbs from cbs news world headquarters in new york, this is the "cbs evening news" with katie couric. >> couric: good evening, everyone. from the site of the deadliest terror attack ever on u.s. soil. president obama will be here later this week to mark the end of the hunt for the man who ordered it, osama bin laden, killed sunday night in his hideaway in pakistan in a raid by u.s. navy seals. pulling the trigger on that operation was one of the toughest decisions the president has ever had to make. david martin is at the pentagon tonight and, david, based on what the president knew and didn't know, this was a very big gamble. >> couric: katie, the more you find out about this mission, the more you realize what a roll of the dice it was and how close it

the al qaeda narrative was playing out. interestingly, in egypt and north africa, i do see growing strength of for the kind of islam that bin laden embraced. you see when women wearing the full veil in a way they never would have before. that kind of faith is very much alive. >> that is an interesting complexity. is it possible that the arab spring might have prepared much of that part of the world for the message and ideals that bin laden espoused? >> what we saw during the tahrir square revolution was a country come together to see the divisions of religious, economic, political not the way and a national self assertion. if that spirit remains strong in egypt and these other countries, you can be hopeful that the al qaeda idea that that notion about change would be defeated. if that democratic revolution falters, if there is economic chaos in egypt, if there is insecurity in the streets, the world will have an appeal. just as the taliban had an appeal. these fundamentalists will have an appeal in egypt. >> the detailed --

ten years ago two passenger jets hijacked by al-qaeda terrorists crashed into the buildings of the world trade center new york killing thousands of people the man who claimed responsibility for the attack topped the u.s. most wanted list from then on u.s. military finally hundred in down and killed him but his death has raised many questions was it necessary to kill bin laden rather than capture and try him and what will the world be after osama and there are no easy answers. hello mr curtis i welcome to the show thank you very much for being with us thank you thank you for the well first of all the u.s. celebrated the killing of bin laden as a major major victory do you consider the assassination of al qaeda leader. the turning point the u.s. war against terror so. first of all i believe the killing of a solo was a major success and a victory not just for the united states but for the region at the same time i don't think it's. turning point for the global war on terrorism or for anything. what osama bin laden created in one thousand eight hundred eight as a as an organization has gone

the al qaeda operation? >> i had a conversation with an official who reiterated what john brennan was saying, and he said this was strategically important, not just symbolically important. the official i spoke to said they do believe that osama bin laden was involved in the long- term strategic planning in the direction of al qaeda and was useful as a recruiting tool in a way that ayman al-zawahiri, the no. 2, is not. zawahiri did not have the bona fides of bin laden. they went at considerable risk to american forces and at to relations with pakistanis as well. >> he mentioned it has agreements with pakistan, but he also gave reassurances -- he mentioned it disagreements with pakistan, but also give reassurances. >> the white house still recognizes the significance of a very troubled relationship with pakistan, but keen to give credit pakistanis. they have detained, he said, way more terrorists than any other country, and the pakistanis have been a close ally with terrorists internally. while there are quest

qaeda and al qaeda activities. we have not been successful in dismantling, much less defeating, al qaeda b. these types of intelligence resources and resources will allow you to go forward and start to dismantle a lot of the command and control networks in al qaeda. that could be potentially devastating for them. host: houston, texas. george, republican. caller: i could not agree more with this gentleman about reviewing our policies with pakistan. i think part of the problem with the united states is that we have that a failure to recognize that you are not really dealing with a state, you are dealing with a collection of tribes that were left in power by the british empire as it pulled out. you have to the critics that the

officer who said that the unit was respble for trying to track down al qaeda al qaeda al qaeda. he's now a professor of security studies at georgetown university and the author of the book "osama bin laden." he says osama's death is a success to the current u.s. administration. >> i think the men and women involved in the ground in this operation deserve high praise, and it couldn't be -- there couldn't be better news at the moment, but i think we all need to keep in mind, as your last clip said, that bin laden is an idea as much as an organization, and it's very much much more difficult to kill an idea than it is a man. unfortunately, for us and the americans and their allies, we still have a very long hill to climb. >> explain to us the kind of obstacles that you and your team met in trying to track down osama bin laden. after all, this search has taken over nine years. , it's taken 16 i was very fortunate. i ran operations very early in our effort against osama bin laden, and between may of 1998 and may of 1999, we were able to pinpoint him on 10 different occasions, and mr.

and they tell us we could gather all of the known al qaeda at al qaeda and afghanistan in this room yet we are spending ten or $12 billion a month in a war with the taliban which i've asked this basic question can we achieve what we want to achieve in afghanistan without defeating the allin? >> we can achieve that if we have a stable government in afghanistan that includes part of the taliban and that doesn't post al qaeda. if we can get an agreement where the taliban can meet certain basic conditions the can be part of the government and they do not host al qaeda than our interests are served. >> we are in the position we've pushback our troops and the have succeeded in pushing back enough but we are now in a strong enough position to enter the negotiations will not be the karzai government. it will be a coalition government with a set of conditions allow us to dramatically pulled down our forces. but we have had to push back for counter insurgency because of what we lost through the pure counterterrorism strategy and we need to move to the political face. >> i couldn't agree more. >>

in yemen, al-qaeda in the arabian peninsula. in north africa, a group involved in the kidnap and ransom. and here in britain, mi-5 are still tracking several al-qaeda- inspired plots. >> he is sort of a spiritual leader. at the operational level, he had already given over to ayman al- zawahiri. >> in yemen, al-qaeda has set up a new base. it presents a serious threat to the u.s.. it's ideal of addresses his followers in some english, radicalizing impressionable young britons and americans alike. their operations have failed, but the group is already planning the next one. on the other hand, the so-called arab spring on the front month. it has played no part in a mass movement where young, mostly secular arabs successfully over through the regime's that al- qaeda tried to topple. >> i think al-qaeda is a build of the week organization. it has suffered huge setbacks as a result of being seen to be behind the agenda in the middle east revolutions. >> but here in britain, where the national threat level is at severe, the terrorist a

if you look at the al-qaeda statement he's a hero because he was a martyr. >> al-qaeda has actually released a statement because of course, there was a big debate and we'll talk about that about whether we should release -- the united states should release the picture of him with the bullet wound in the head. now al-qaeda has released a statement. saying without the photograph saying that indeed he is dead. so how do we interpret that. should we now understand that there is going to be more -- that there is going be retaliation? that there -- we need to be worried about this? >> well, of course, i think u.s. intelligence agencies are very concerned about that. i think, you know, the chances of some kind of target of u.s. or western installations in pakistan itself is very high. i mean, i don't think that al-qaeda would want necessarily if they attack a cricket match that can inflame the pakistani people. but if they can attack some kind of western installation make it seem like revenge for osama bin laden. >> what kind of intelligence we're getting out of this compound? everyone is calling i