the mormon church. >> you mention that had cooperation. and you also mentioned the forum you held. every time you organize a forum, they're responsible for who they invite. i was talking to him. it is no seek that he said these things in the past. so when you introduce mike perry, you know what you might get. another gentleman asked to speak was from the american family association. governor romney even before mr. fisher spoke, criticized him. let's listen first to mr. fisher. >> every advance of the homosexual agenda comes at the expense of liberty. the greatest long range threat is not radical islam. but islam itself. not a single one of our unalienable rights will be safe in the hands of a president who believes that we evolved from slime and we are the descendants of apes and baboons. >> governor romney spoke to us before that and he seem to know what was coming. >> we should remember that decency and civility are values, too. one of the speakers who will follow me today has crossed that line, i thi

do you consider mormonism a cult? >> you know, my role here, john, is not from a -- to analyze theologically but i will tell you this -- >> do you view evangelicals to be a cult? why is that a tough question? >> john, i do not see mormonism the sim as christianity. whether it's defined as a cult, i don't know. i would say it's not christianity the way evangelicals view christianity. there's a distinction. there's no question there's a theological distinction between mormonism and christianity. but what we're focused here at the values voters summit is values and values issues. what people are looking for is where candidates stand on issues, where they stand on the life issue, where they stand -- wait a minute -- where they stand on marriage, where they stand on the family, as well as the other issues. and mitt romney has articulated positions consistent on those views and that's why he's comfortable in coming here to speak to value voters. >> he's coming there to speak tomorrow. now he's coming there in the middle of

for mitt romney. >> is the plan broadway -- more mormonism in defense of mormonism? >> it's a comedy! musical comedy. >> is it re departmentive of mormonism? >> i think it invites humor. they make fun of some are decisions. >> mormons making fun -- >> you could do it for every religion. and there's some leaps of faith in every religion. >> what do you make fun of in catholicism? you make fun of the mope. >> the problem with mormonism, it's a cult, one thing, with a problem in the south, although he should win because obama in the south. but here's what will happen, john. the media will do specials and other things, on mormonism and beliefs in mormonism that are extraordinarily controversial, and i think they will highlighted those and people don't know anything about it, and i think they can use those to damage romney. >> we haven't had a jewish president. we haven't had a hindu president. what about an athiest? >> i don't think -- >> could be elected. >> wait a minute. i thought that religion was a private matter, and the separation of church and state is -- >> anyo

mormonism is not christianity. it has always been considered a cult by the mainstream of christianity. so it's a difference between a christian and a nonchristian. >> pastor, thank you so much for coming on. and i guess my only role here, since i'm a secular person involved with political discussions, to find out what you meant by that in a secular context. in other words, we're in the middle of a campaign, what relevance is it. the word "cult," would you use it again if you were asked the same question? >> yes, but i would clarify, like i did in that clip later on, i was talking not about a sociological cult, i'm talking about a theological cult. it's a fact, mormonism came 1800 years after jesus christ and the founding of the church. mormonism has its own human leader, joseph smith, its own set of doctrines, its own religious book, "the book of mormon," in addition to the bible, so in that way, it's a cult. i believe mormons are good people. but i don't believe that they are christians. and by the way, chris, my

it is mitt romney is a mormon and embraces the mormon faith, mormonism is not christianity. mormons have said all along that they were not a part of historic christianity. they say that the christian church was corrupt from the time of the apostles. 1829 when joseph smith came. they have never embraced historical christianity by their own admission. >> what will happen to mr. romney when he dies? >> i have no idea. if he is trusted in jesus christ, the jesus christ of the bible, to save him from his sins, he will be in heaven. if he has stressed it in some other god or no god, he will spend eternity separated from god. all of us are sinners, not just mormons, baptist, anglicans. we have all sinned. we have all fallen short of the glory of god. we all need to jesus christ to be our savior. >> can you imagining america tolerating an atheist president? >> absolutely can. i think that is very possible. >> aia jew? >> yes. >> a muslim? >> yes. >> all these things are possible? >> absolutely. article 6 says there shall be no religious test to hold public office. i'm quick to remin

mormonism is not christianity. it has always been considered a cult by the mainstream of christianity. so it's a difference between a christian and a nonchristian. >> pastor, thank you so much for coming on. and i guess my only role here, since i'm a secular person involved with political discussions, to find out what you meant by that. in a secular contest. in other words, we're in the middle of a campaign, what relevance is it. the word "cult," would you use it again if you were asked the same question? >> yes, but i would clarify, like i did in that clip later on, i was talking not about a sociological cult, i'm talking about a theological cult. it's a fact, mormonism came 1800 years after jesus christ and the founding of the church. mormonism has its own human leader, joseph smith, its own set of doctrines, its own religious book, "the book of mormon," in addition to the bible, so in that way, it's a cult. i don't believe that they are christians. and by the way, chris, my view is not unique. "usa today" today

himself from mormonism. but do you think this is going to force him to talk more about it? >> well, sure. the timing of that speech, during the last cycle, there was a theory of a friend of mine, finally realizing that they needed to put some kind of frame around his mormonism and his faith. people want to know what you believe. mormonism is a religion in this country. people watch maybe "big love" on tv or "sister love" on cable. at the beginning of his campaign, during his announcement speech, he talked about freedom of religion and we can respect one another. clearly they've laid their foundation and they will have to come back to it at some point. >> we're going to go to him live right now. this is the value voter summit. let's listen to what he is saying. >> and now i bask in the joy of 16 grandchildren. [ applause ] >> for the last 42 years, ann has been my partner and joy. and she's done those things which have brought more happiness to our lives than anything that i have done. for she took the lead i

most non-mormons. >> i think americans have a very poor understanding of mormon faith. they don't understand it. they don't understand a lot of the vagaries of the mormon theology. and in fact the theology is fairly complex and outside the main stream of general protestant or christian beliefs. >> reporter: mormons believe jesus christ was the savior, the son of god, but unlike protestants, catholics and other christians, mormons also believe in a prophet named joseph smith. it holds that he saw a vision of god and jesus who told him not to join existing churches. later he translatedly the book of mormons from an ancient text. in addition to the bible, it is considered the complete word of god. >> mormons believe the book of mormonmormons is a canonical sc, has the same status as the hebrew bible and the christian new testament. they often refer to it as another testament of jesus christ. >> reporter: but another of joseph smith's revelations also led to a practice the mormon church has since denounce the, polygamy, when the church ended in 1890. >> i think the practice

but mormonism is not christianity. it's always been considered a cult by the mainstream of christianity so it's the difference between a christian and a nonchristian. >> rick perry was asked about the comments last night in iowa. >> is mormonism is cult? >> no. >> you don't think so? >> i've already answered that. >> in addition to denying that mormonism is a cult, his campaign said that he did not choose pastor jeffress to introduce him at the conference. >> ron paul addressed the faith in the republican party. >> this language, how is it going to advance our cause? it's never softened a heart or changed a mind. the task before us is to focus on the conservative beliefs and the values that unite us. let no agenda narrow us or drive us apart. >> krar rooe, another good morning. you heard him discussing religion in a broadway. how was it received at the summit? >> well, it was sort of interesting because there was a lot of subtley going on and mitt romney's comments that we just heard, about poisonous language, that ref

. >> he is a mormon. that much i know. i am not going to do an analysis of mormonism versus christianity for the sake of answering that. >> twef religious tolerance in the country and we understand that people have different views on their faith. >> reporter: the other mormon in the republican race, jon huntsman dismissed the entire debate. >> here in new hampshire that is seen as the most ridiculous side show in recent politics. >> reporter: romney also faced questions about his religion during his first presidential run in 2008, responded to it by pulling a page from the kennedy catholic book. he mentioned the word mormon just once. >> if i'm fortunate to become your president, i will serve no one religion. >> reporter: but in 2012, even evangelical leaders say most christian conservatives won't fixate on romney's faith but not

he was critical of the mormon church and told our jim acosta and other reporters that mormonism is a cult. >> reporter: you don't mind me saying, you created a bit of a stir coming out of that speech. you said in strong language what you think of mormonism. you described it as a cult. and you said that if republicans vote for mitt romney, they're giving credibility to a cult. do you stand by that? >> absolutely. i think more smr a good moral man but those that are born again followers of christ should always prefer a competent christian to a competent -- to a competent nonchristian like mitt romney. so that's why i'm enthusiastic about rick perry. >> what do you say to the voters that say religion, mormonism shouldn't be an issue in this campaign. he's just as american as everybody else. >> i agree he's just as american as anyone else. and article six of the constitution -- >> and mormons say they are christians. they believe in jesus christ. >> a lot of people say they're christians and they are not. they do not embrace historical christianity. and i believe that as christians we ha

do you think mormonism is a cult? i mean, this could be a problem for perry because there are quite a few evangelicals who think mormonism is a cult. if perry is going to say, no, mormonism isn't a cult. then indeed that could be problematic because he's going against many of his evangelical base. >> woodruff: what do you see as the immediate effect on the campaign what this pastor said and how the other candidates are responding? >> well as it reals to the perry campaign, i think they're going to address it straight on. there was a statement as you mentioned put out. but i think at some point rick perry-- and there is a debate in new hampshire tomorrow night and one in las vegas the next week-- at some point rick perry is going to have to be pretty strong about it and say whether he uses the word distance or whatever word he decides to use he's going to have to make that break if he wants just to put this behind him. i say him because at this point with jeffress tied to perry sms this is something the perry campaign

mormonism is not christianity. it has always been considered a cult by the mainstream of christianity. >> jon: i mean, if y'all want to vote for a cult leader, i'm not going to... that is is the sweetest, most good-natured, pleasant (beep) on an entire religion. i have ever seen. bless his heart. he deserves to be in hell but certainly on a different floor than hitler. are we ready for a mormon president or should mainstream republican cristians still be suspicious. for more we go to samantha bee and wyatt cenac. nice to see you guys. ( cheers and applause ) let me just start here. wyatt. >> wait. >> jon: i'm going the start with wyatt. >> just a second here. why is wyatt team normal? okay. that implies that mormons aren't normal. >> please, it's just semantics. i'm not sitting here complaining that your shirt doesn't say team team cult on it. >> we are not a cult. mormonism is a proud religion founded by a great man who was guided by the angel moroni to golden plates buried in upstate new york that he placed in a

the whole world will come out in the mormon. -- and the mormon. it is just not a religion or a cult, it is big business. they own a ton of stuff -- coca- cola, all sorts of businesses. if you think that that does not matter, boy, i think you people should wake up and really looking at what the mormons are and study them before they both of mormon into office. because it does make a difference. you get out of their religion and see what happens. it is almost worse than being the devil. host: tom davis will be joining us and a few minutes. later we will look back at past democrats seeking re-election. jimmy carter and bill clinton, are there lessons for barack obama? we're covering michele bachmann in her town hall meeting. you can watch that on c-span. tomorrow, john huntsman with remarks on u.s. farm policy at 11:00 a.m.. mitt romney's town hall meeting scheduled to get underway tomorrow night, columbus day, at 6:30 p.m. eastern time. this is all on c-span and hosted online at c-span.org. as is usually the case, saturday night live taking aim at t

. >>> in texas in october 1974 two mormon missionaries disappeared. they were last seen heading to a taxidermist. the remains of their body were found on the blade of a saw. the man they were supposed to meet was robert elmer kleasen, a man who claimed to be a spy and war hero. a man who traveled under several aliases, and man sentenced to death on the grounds of strong circumstantial evidence for murder. >> i'm not the monster that i was portrayed. if they dig a little deeper, why they'll find out i'm just an average sort of guy. >> he's different. he's got a certain glow about him that's not your typical everyday person. >> maybe the most dangerous man i've ever met. >> robert kleasen's connection to these murders is only the beginning of the story. kleasen was found living in a house full of weapons with access to another motorized saw, but this time he wasn't in texas. he was in the heart of a terrified british community. >> he is deranged. he must be. he's frightening. >> he was essentially a madman. he really was. >> for almost ten years, the no

representative and he became the head of the mormon church in hawaii. the mormon sainh t settled on te island of lanai which is -- walter murray gibson's dream was to build an empire in the pacific that he would lead. so his journals and diaries are so tingscinating, he is in this meadow and thinks he will rule the pacvesic ocean. he sees these poor mormons where they try to live as this 3 saters fdrled with babies and odr and memories of me. eventually the higher-ups' in sat c lake got wind of what he was doing and self-absorbed ideas what the mormons should be accomplishing but sent representatives to hawaii to re he was premier of the government and he corepissioned the statue in honolutat. he ended up having an impact on hawaiian history but the mormons recovered from his leadership and went on to a sot ong religious presenc ba the brigham campus is one of the main colleges and at they also run the cultural center which might be the main tourist attraction on the island. they did quite well for themselves in hawaii. >> for those who didn't get throu

because of romney's mormon beliefs. our jim acosta caught up with this pastor and asked him what do you say to those voters who think mormonism shouldn't be an issue? >> the southern baptist convention, which is the largest protestant denomination in the world has officially labeled mormonism as a cult. i think that mitt romney is a good, moral man, but i think those of us who are born-again followers of christ should always prefer a confident christian to a confident nonchristian like mitt romney. >> and our jim acosta who was talking to the pastor there joins me now from the values voters summit in d.c. jim, can we start with giving our viewers some perspective about who pastor jeff jeffers is? this isn't just some guy. >> no, he has a very large mega church in downtown dallas, first baptist church of dallas, part of the southern baptist convention, which is a very large group of evangelical christians. millions of evangelical christians, an important part of the republican party. and, you know, we were trying to get

in blue, brigham young university, established by and for mormons. brigham young's fans are out in force, and they say that while religion is becoming more accepted, there's still a gap between mormons and mainstream america. >> i think the mormon religion is getting more well known. people know more about the church. as far as being more mainstream, i think people still consider as different and not christian, but i think they appreciate our values and what we do for the country. >> if romney becomes a candidate, even the president, does that change things forever? >> i do not know if it will change things forever. people will still have their perceptions. they may just think romney is weird if they think we are weird. >> weird is how to many republicans saw mitt romney's religion when he ran for the republican nomination four years ago. he tried to tackle the problem head-on. >> i believe that jesus christ is the son of god and the savior of mankind. that the four years on, his faith is still alive. a close family friend speaks. >> as long as peopl

. ♪ today there are 14 million mormons. the core in utah where smith's followers fled after years of persecution. aggressive recruitment has always been key to the more properly named church of jesus christ of latter-day saints, yet the faith remains mysterious to many americans. so much so that mitt romney, perhaps the country's most famous mormon at the moment, was attacked even in his first run for president. >> hello, sir, how are you? >> i'm one person who will not vote for a mormon. >> oh, is that right? can i shake your hand anyway? >> no! >> reporter: the resistance is toughest from evangelical christians. >> those of us who are born again followers of christ should prefer a competent christian to a competent non-christian like mitt romney. >> reporter: mormons say they are absolutely christian. at vanderbilt university kathleen flake teaches religious history. >> the voters who are vetting him want religion in politics and they want a particular religion in politics. they want jesus and they want a particular kind

on the other hand, who knows where he would be without his mormon faith? >> it will be in south carolina that mitt romney's faith will face its first electoral test. >> south carolina is particularly dangerous territory. i was here in 2008 that he was unceremoniously crushed. it is home to some of the darkest of in republican campaigning and home to an evangelical christian community that has little time for mormons.

what is wrong with mormonism? >> well, mormonism, first of all, has another revelation, the revelation of the book of mormon. came 1800 years after christianity. it uses a lot of the same language, chris, as christianity does. it talks about jesus christ. it talks about faith. but it's the jesus christ who came to north america, you know, in the 1800's, not the jesus christ of the bible. chris: one of the most recent nbc news, "wall street journal" poll, 47% say they're comfortable with a mormon being president, namely mitt romney. in a new poll, voters had to come up with one term or phrase that comes to mind for each leading republican. for herman cain it was 999. for rick perry, it was texas. and for romney, it was the single word, mormon. it's come to be so salient, david, and this is tricky business. i don't want to talk about religion but the old question comes back, does he have to clear the air? does he have to play offense or can he simply say it's my business, it's my religion, focus on my politics? >> p

and he called mormons a cult. romney, while not addressing yesterday's controversy, directly told the gathering, quote, poisonous language does not advance our cause, unquote. we have a live interview with pastor robert jeffers in a minute. >>> legendary coach, commissioner and owner al davis died. over the years his oakland raiders won countless championships including three super bowls, and who can forget that saying, just win, baby. goodell says his impact and legacy will forever be part of the nfl. al davis was 82. >>> two days after his death steve jobs was laid to rest in a private funeral. services were held yesterday at an unnamed location. the source says that the funeral was a small, family affair. he died wednesday in california from pancreatic cancer. >>> now, back to that controversy that's overshadowing the values voters summit in washington. prominent baptist pastor robert jeffers who backs republican rick perry told reporters at the event that mitt romney shouldn't be the gop nominee because he's m

take a listen. >> he's a mormon. that much i know. i am not going to do an analysis of mormonism versus christianity for the sake of answering that. i'm not getting into that. >> i think what the real focus is here, again, is -- on religious tolerance. that's really what this is about and i think, again, to make this a big issue is just ridiculous right now because every day i'm on the street talking to people. this is not what people are talking about. i was very open about my faith, very clear about my faith. it is very important. >> so, will, will this eventually become an issue that even the candidates kind of sink their teethes into? their teeth into? >> eventually it may become -- it may become more of an issue eventually. what we're seeing here is these kaentds a candidate are going to have trouble attacking romney or catching romney in pointing out his palau flaws and principles. everyone has their spikes and valleys. herman cain is having his right now. i guess as we see this go forward and mitt romney, it becomes inevitable

. ♪ today there are 14 million mormons. the core in utah where smith's followers fled after years of persecution. aggressive recruitment has always been key to the more properly named church of jesus christ of latter-day saints, yet the faith remains mysterious to many americans. so much so that mitt romney, perhaps the country's most famous mormon at the moment, was attacked even in his first run for president. >> hello, sir, how are you? >> i'm one person who will not vote for a mormon. >> oh, is that right? can i shake your hand anyway? >> no! >>. >> reporter: the resistance is toughest from revangelical christians. >> those of us who are born again followers of christ should prefer a competent christian to a competent non-christian like mitt romney. >> reporter: mormons say they are absolutely christian. at vanderbilt university kathleen flake teaches history. >> the voters who are vetting him want religion in politics and they want a particular religion in politics. they want jesus and they want a particular kind of je

mormonism to here's just a quick clip of the reverend jeffers speaking to reporters at the event. southern baptist convention which is the largest protestant denomination the world has officially labeled mormonism as a cult i think mitt romney's a good moral man but i think those of us who want to get richer christ should always prefer a competent christian to a competent competent non-christian like mitt romney so that's why i'm enthusiastic about rick perry what do you say to the good values which is their catchphrase for fundamental christian christianity and voters and when i see those two juxtaposed i think these guys have never read the constitution well they have their own reading of the constitution bryan fischer who was. the american family association and i fishel who appeared on the stage after mitt romney actually has said that the constitution applies to only christians really yes he has said. ok well you know i mean he lives in his own universe but there's other people who want to buy into that because it's you know it's a real kind of cultural a very particular cult

is mormonism a christian faith? >> no. most evangelical protestants and most conservative catholics would say no, it is not. it is another religion. it does not have an orthodox view of the trinity and the full and complete detee of jesus christ. one sentence says it all. as man now is, god once was. as god now is, man may become. now, they have every right to believe that, and we should protect that right under the first amendment, and it shouldn't be a disqualification for office. don't have a test for the office. >> does that mean it is a cult? >> some define it as a cult. he is a pastor. you ask a pastor a theological question, you get a theological answer. the answer i have given when asked is that perhaps the best way to look at mormonism is it is the fourth abrahamic religion. joseph smith playing the role of muhammad, and the book of mormon playing the role of the koran. >> does that mean you think mitt romney doesn't believe in jesus christ? >> he doesn't believe the way orthodox christians believe in jesus christ

john, you feeling heat because of your mormonism? is it something that only comes out in presidential election sessions when there's a mormon candidate? what's going on in your mind? >> you know, i honestly think it's a case where for so long, mormormons have tried so hard to get their message across that we're just like everybody else. the interesting thing about, you know, whatever religion it may be, it's such an intangible concept. you have people saying moses talked to a burning bush and noah built an arc and jesus walked on water but we're not going to buy what's mixed with so much half truths and lies. the nice thing about the age we live in is people have access to information and can distinguish the truth from the false hoods. we don't necessarily believe in some things, but one thing we can agree on is that mormons are very committed to being good humahuman beings, good members f the community and uphold the standards of jesus christ. >> geraldo: john, sorry. we're having a little disruption here. don't worry about that. bu

, is mormonism a cult? >> you don't think so? >> no. i've already answered that. >> i am joined by former u.s. congressman from texas, democrat chris bell who ran for texas governor against rick perry in 2006. good morning to you. thanks for joining me. >> good morning, alex. thanks for having me. >> it was the texas pastor robert jeffers who called the mormonism a cult at the voters summit. does any of this controversy over the pastor's words surprise you? >> well, it doesn't really surprise me because obviously, republicans have been having that conversation privately. but i think what rick perry is finding out, that a private conversation one thing. but when it's a public conversation, it's a whole different animal. i don't think they were prepared for the backlash they're facing right now after the pastor's remarks. i think a lot of people were wondering if that was a complete accident. >> ultimate will you, do you think it might do more harm than good for rick perry? >> i think so. it makes people very