in 2002, when mitt romney moved back to massachusetts from utah, to run for governor in massachusetts, that residency requirement was a big problem for him. he maintained publicly until june of that year when he was running he had always paid taxes as a massachusetts resident. this was going to be no problem. clearly he meant the residency problem, he had been paying massachusetts taxes. but that june, that year he was running, june 2002, under pressure from the democrats in the state and under scrutiny from the boston press, that story fell apart because it turns out he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident like he said he had. he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident. he had been paying taxes as a utah resident. he said that was not the case, but high got caught. after he got caught, he admitted, yeah, he had been filing as a utah resident, but he was retroactively, now that he was running for governor, he was going back a few years and was going to change that. retroactively, but it was a huge mess. i mean, mr. romney had told a local newspaper repor

you failed as the governor of massachusetts. you can look at what mitt did in massachusetts. he was number 47. >> massachusetts was fourth from the bottom in job creation. >> if his record was so great, why didn't he run for reelection? >> governor romney as governor raised taxes and massachusetts was 47th in job creation. fourth from the bottom. >> that was how mitt romney's fellow republicans attacked him in the primaries this year. that's part of why you haven't heard a lot from the romney campaign since about his time as governor of massachusetts. by the process of eliminating other options, though, it looks like that may be about to change. joining us now for the interview is the last governor of massachusetts to run for president of the united states, winning the democratic party's nomination in 1988. it's michael dukakis. thank you so much for being here. nice to have you. >> thanks for having me, rachel. >> mr. romney says his private sector experience makes him the right person to turn the economy around. you are on record saying his record and the economy of massach

in 2002, when mitt romney moved back to massachusetts from utah, to run for governor in massachusetts, that residency requirement was a really big problem for him. he maintained publicly until june of that year when he was running he had always paid taxes as a massachusetts resident. so this residency requirement was going to be no problem. clearly he meant the residency problem. he'd been paying massachusetts resident taxes. that's what he said all along. but that june, that year he was running, june 2002, under pressure from the democrats in the state and under scrutiny from the boston press, that story fell apart because it turns out he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident like he said he had. he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident. he had been paying taxes as a utah resident. he said that was not the case, but high got caught. after he got caught, he admitted, yeah, he had been filing as a utah resident, but he was retroactively, now that he was running for governor, he was going back a few years and was going to change that. retroactively, but i

you failed as the governor of massachusetts. you can look at what mitt did in massachusetts. he was number 47. >> massachusetts was fourth from the bottom in job creation. >> if his record was so great, why didn't he run for reelection? governor romney as governor raised taxes and massachusetts was 47th in job creation. fourth from the bottom. >> that was how mitt romney's fellow republicans attacked him in the primaries this year. that's part of why you haven't heard a lot from the romney campaign since about his time as governor of massachusetts. by the process of eliminating other options, though, it looks like that may be about to change. joining us now for the interview is the last governor of massachusetts to run for president of the united states, winning the democratic party's nomination in 1988. it's michael dukakis. thank you so much for being here. nice to have you. >> thanks for having me, rachel. >> mr. romney says his private sector experience makes him the right person to turn the economy around. you are on record saying his record and the economy of massachuse

in 2002 when mitt romney moved back to massachusetts from utah to run for governor in massachusetts, that residency requirement was a really big problem for him. he maintained publicly until june of that year when he was running that he had always paid taxes as a massachusetts resident. so this residency requirement was going to be no problem. clearly he meant the residency problem. he'd been paying massachusetts resident taxes. that's what he said all along. but that june, that year that he was running, june 2002, under pressure from the democrats in the state and under scrutiny from the boston press, that story fell apart because it turns out he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident like he said he had. he had not been paying taxes as a massachusetts resident. he had been paying taxes as a utah resident. mr. romney said that wasn't the case, but he got caught. after he got caught, he admitted, yeah, he had been filing as a utah resident, but he was retroactively, now that he was running for governor, he was going back a few years and was going to change that retro a

you failed as the governor of massachusetts. you can look at what mitt did in massachusetts. he was number 47. >> massachusetts was 44th from the bottom in job creation. >> if his record was so great, why didn't he run for reelection? >> governor romney as governor raised taxes and massachusetts was 47th in job creation. fourth from the bottom. >> that was how mitt romney's fellow republicans attacked him in the primaries this year. that's part of why you haven't heard a lot from the romney campaign since about his time as governor of massachusetts. by the process of eliminating other options, though, it looks like that may be about to change. joining us now for the interview is the last governor of massachusetts to run for president of the united states, winning the democratic party's nomination in 1988. it's michael dukakis. thank you so much for being here. nice to have you. >> thank s for having me, rach. >> mr. romney says his private sector experience makes him the right person to turn the economy around. you are on record saying his record and the economy of massachuse

so it's not just massachusetts. the guy's living in indiana and she says he'd be better off if he had the plan from massachusetts helping him there. she said that. >> well, i suspect she picked a fight she regrets. >> let me ask you about bill clinton. because you tussled with him. but you got charmed by him until they put on the wrong end of the plane that time. but here's this guy. is he really out for obama? has he decided in his calculation that if obama gets re-elected it creates a better environment for his wife to be elected president '16 because the next four years are economically going to be better no matter who the president is? that's what i believe it is. we're on an upswing in the cycle. it's going to come back because of inventories and other things. housing's going to get sold. we're going to get better off. so who gets to be president and have a good time for the next four years? if romney gets in, you won't get him out in four years. that's my theory. if you're hillary. >> i think it's very hard. f

he believes in massachusetts, in romney care. the problem are the contortions he's had to go through to get right with the right. this thing is going to come back to kill him in the debates. you know president obama is going to say -- he's going to cite this instance when it comes up in the first presidential debate and romney's not going to have a very good answer that i can possibly conceive of. >> many conservatives said they felt betrayed today. eric erickson tweets that omg, this might just be the moment mitt romney lost the election on this very comment today by a spokesperson. he says wow. and rush limbaugh had this to say on his radio show. >> i don't know the people at the romney campaign, but i'm going to tell you. your candidate is accused of killing a woman. because -- that's -- this isn't about health insurance. they're out there saying that your guy killed this woman. and your answer is? well, she'd have had health insurance if she lived in massachusetts? >> there you go. it's unbelievable. there he is saying if she

he did this in massachusetts in 2002. massachusetts democrats said in 2002 that mitt romney was not eligible to run for governor in the state because the state constitution says you have to have been a resident of massachusetts for seven years before you can run for governor. in trying to prove that allegation, they asserted that mr. romney's tax returns would show that he had not filed his taxes as a massachusetts resident. they thought that should disqualify him from being able to run for governor in the state. >> we believe that mitt romney is not qualified under the massachusetts constitution to be governor because he declared himself to be a nonresident of massachusetts. >> so for their own reasons, because they were trying to get him kicked off the ballot, massachusetts democrats asserted that mitt romney's taxes showed him declaring himself to be a nonresident of massachusetts. the romney campaign denied this. they went to reporters and denied that allegation from the democrats. romney filed his taxes as a resident

he did this in massachusetts in 2002. massachusetts democrats said in 2002 that mitt romney was not eligible to run for governor in the state because the state constitution says you have to have been a resident of massachusetts for seven years before you can run for governor. in trying to prove that allegation, they asserted that mr. romney's tax returns would show that he had not filed hitaxes as a massachusetts resident. they thought that should disqualify him from being able to run for governor in the state. >> we believe that mitt romney is not qualified under the massachusetts constitution to be governor because he declared himself to be a nonresident of massachusetts. >> so for their own reasons, because they were trying to get him kicked off the ballot, massachusetts democrats asserted that mitt romney's taxes showed him declaring himself to be a non-resident of massachusetts. the romney campaign denied this. they went to reporters and denied that allegation from the democrats. romney filed his taxes as a resident

based on my health care plan up in massachusetts. well, you see, the problem here, but if it's hard being the candidate who at least gets to call the shots day to day, imagine trying to be a spokesperson for this guy. how would andrea saul know how much trouble she'd get into by saying today that the man in the latest obama ad who lost his wife to cancer after getting fired in a bain capital operation would have gotten health care if he were living in massachusetts? did you hear that? that poor fellow's wife might be alive today if the whole country had what mitt romney built up in massachusetts. that presumably the country would be better off if it took the lead from what mitt romney had up in mass. how is miss saul to know it's not right to say what mitt romney the candidate said years ago before he was a candidate, that the country should take massachusetts as a model when it comes to health care? how could she know that such a public admission is in the words of a late nixon spokesperson inoperative? so what a day this has been.

more than 98% of everyone in massachusetts has health insurance. about 99.8% of children have health insurance. but i think that the real litmus test is to do some political shorthand. so senator scott brown, our republican u.s. senator, strongly opposes the affordable care act, and strongly supports massachusetts health reform. in 2006 and 2010, we had two hotly contested gubernatorial elections with well financed republican contenders in boejt of those elections, those candidates supported massachusetts health reform. there was a group in massachusetts last year that tried to gather signatures put on the ballot a question to repeal the individual mandate in the massachusetts health reform law. they had to abandon their effort because they couldn't get the signatures. more than two thirds of people in massachusetts support this law and want to see it continue. and there's no credible group in massachusetts that is advocating repeal or scaling it back in any significant way. you know, we're on the other side. the rest of the country is looking towa

more than 98% of everyone in massachusetts has health insurance. about 99.8% of children have health insurance. but i think that the real litmus test is to do some political shorthand. so senator scott brown, our republican u.s. senator, strongly opposes the affordable care act, and strongly supports massachusetts health reform. in 2006 and 2010, we had two hotly contested gubernatorial elections with well financed republican contenders in both of those elections, those candidates supported massachusetts health reform. there was a group in massachusetts last year that tried to gather signatures put on the ballot a question to repeal the individual mandate in the massachusetts health reform law. they had to abandon their effort because they couldn't get the signatures. more than two thirds of people in massachusetts support this law and want to see it continue. and there's no credible group in massachusetts that is advocating repeal or scaling it back in any significant way. you know, we're on the other side. the rest of the country is looking towar

so it's not just massachusetts. she says he'd be better off if he was in massachusetts helping them there. she said that. >> i suspect she picked a fight she regrets. >> let me ask you about bill clinton. you tussled and got charmed by him until he put you on the wrong end of the plane that time. here's this guy. is he really out for obama? has he decided in his calculation if he gets elected it creates a better way for his wife to be elected in 2016 because the next four years are going to be economically better no matter who the president. it's going to come back. housing's going to get sold. we're going to get better off. who gets to be president gets to have a good time the next four years. if romney gets in, you won't get him out in four years. >> i think it's very hard. first of all, i don't think most politicians are quite that calculating. >> bill clinton? >> from the stand b point i think bill clinton knows you can't guess 2016. >> what's your instinct? to go to for the win? >> first of all, his wife works

i felt very strongly that the people of massachusetts needed him. why should saturday night have all the fun? get two times the points on dining in restaurants, with chase sapphire preferred. yeah, maybe not. v8 v-fusion juice gives them a full serving of vegetables plus a full serving of fruit. but it just tastes like fruit. v8. what's your number? why not get buried inlike fruit. something other than work? get two times the points on travel, with chase sapphire preferred. >> it's great to be back on massachusetts soil. >> in major, 2002, still basking in the glow of the salt lake city olympics, mitt romney is beck couldn't by the bay state gop to run for governor, despite the fact that a republican already was in the job. >> jane swift was the governor but weakened by political missteps and there were a lot of republicans nervous that she was going to lose if she ran. so you have mitt romney out in utah sort of eyeing the political landscape knowing he wants to get into politics. >> within 48 hours of romney's return, governor jane swift tearfully

the romney message has always been that he passed a law as governor of massachusetts for massachusetts, not for the nation at whole. she said nothing that contradicts that message. but apparently the rules for the republican party is, you can't even talk about romney care, and i think that's absurd. >> you can't tell the truth. that's their message. and here's the thing. if governor romney had any credibility on any of these issues, if it wasn't for the fact that we've been talking about all the various things that he either won't answer, won't respond to, won't show us, you know, is trying to be -- is being very, you know, nontransparent about, he would have more credibility, and therefore this problem of the lack of trust that the base of his own party actually has with him, would be less of an issue, and a single comment by a spokesperson would be r less damaging. so mitt romney really needs to bear the brunt of this. but i think sam's right, they're going to make andrea probably take the hit for it, but the candidate himself should take a lot of the responsibility. >> it's almost l

the romney message has always been that he passed a law as governor of massachusetts for massachusetts, not for the nation at whole. she said nothing that contradicts that message. but apparently the rules for the republican party is, you can't even talk about romney care, and i think that's absurd. >> you can't tell the truth. that's their message. and here's the thing. if governor romney had any credibility on any of these issues, if it wasn't for the fact that we've been talking about all the various things that he either won't answer, won't respond to, won't show us, you know, is trying to be -- is being very, you know, nontransparent about, he would have more credibility, and therefore this problem of the lack of trust that the base of his own party actually has with him, would be less of an issue, and a single comment by a spokesperson would be far less damaging. so mitt romney really needs to bear the brunt of this. but i think sam's right, they're going to make andrea probably take the hit for it, but the candidate himself should take a lot of the responsibility. >> it's almost

more than 98% of everyone in massachusetts has health insurance. about 99.8% of children have health insurance. but i think that the real litmus test is to do some political shorthand. so senator scott brown, our republican u.s. senator, strongly opposes the affordable care act, and strongly supports massachusetts health reform. in 2006 and 2010, we had two hotly contested gubernatorial elections with well financed republican contenders in both of those elections, those candidates supported massachusetts health reform. there was a group in massachusetts last year that tried to gather signatures put on the ballot a question to repeal the individual mandate in the massachusetts healtheform law. they had to abandon their effort because they couldn't get the signatures. more than two thirds of people in massachusetts support this law and want to see it continue. and there's no credible group in massachusetts that is advocating repeal or scaling it back in any significant way. you know, we're on the other side. the rest of the country is looking toward

i said mitt, it's incredible in massachusetts because i was involved with massachusetts how all these people are coming in without health insurance to the most extensive teaching hospital 40 in the world to get flu shots and take care of their kids grippe. this money is being paid for by the insurance company by mandate. if we diverted that money and used it to provide people health care it would be a much better solution. didn't hear about it for a couple years until all of a sudden he called me up and said "you know that idea you've told me about? we've decided to go do it." that's the kind of guy mitt is. he absorbs everything, stud dooez dees everything and has the unique ability to surround himself with highly talented people to get things done. he did it at the olympics, as massachusetts governor and he'll do it as president of the united states. fill. >> woodruff: it was a few years after staples, governor leavitt, you were state of utah and you were reached out to mitt romney during a crisis? >> we had received a bid for the olympics games, we were in the midst of preparing an

the romneys set until massachusetts. and mitt serves in higher and higher official positions in the mormon church. first as a bishop and then as head of the boston state which is similar to a diocese. mitt romney might be one of the mohr devout major party presidential nominees in american history. >> he spent up to, they say, 25, 30 hours a week being the volunteer bishop. their religion is their lives in many ways. >> but in addition to attending to religious matters, mitt romney is also in the process of building a major business. one that would make him a millionaire many times over. >> during the 15 years that i was there and mitt was there, i believe bain capital probably had the most successful track record of any investment firm ever. throughout our entire lives. ♪ one a day men's 50+ is a complete multi-vitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. ♪ it has more of seven antioxidants to support cell health. that's one a day men's 50+ healthy advantage. to support cell health. chase scene netflix comi

since massachusetts, it's a liberal and strongly democratic state. one advisor he seeks out is rich tadfill. you'll have to be better than ted kennedy. what would it take for me to be better than ted kennedy. >> in august, 1994, romney gives an interview to gay windows, boston's gay newspaper. >> well, i think we ought to have health care to anyone. >> other issues, health care, romney takes similar to moderate positions. >> he was pro-choice, as everyone knows. i believe toez were his views. gh he declares that he was not a regular republican, or even a republican at all in the '80s. >> look, i was an inpendent. i'm not trying to return. it was actually the smallest he ever had. he was a politician on the rise. >> how can you take on a kennedy in massachusetts? but if you do and you're at all successful, everybody in the states could know who you are. we had done a survey to see who had heard of my name. 1%. and, of course, they were the liars. rich tadfil remembers a call from a friend who worked for romney's campaign. he said romney had called him

i felt very strongly that the people of massachusetts needed him. why not use all your vacation days this year? get points you can easily redeem for your vacations, with chase sapphire preferred. but proven technologies allow natural gas producers to supply affordable, cleaner energy, while protecting our environment. across america, these technologies protect air - by monitoring air quality and reducing emissions... ...protect water - through conservation and self-contained recycling systems... ... and protect land - by reducing our footprint and respecting wildlife. america's natural gas... domestic, abundant, clean energy to power our lives... that's smarter power today. domeget two times the points eneon dining in restaurants. with chase sapphire preferred. >>> it's great to be back on massachusetts soil. >> in march, 2002, still basking in the glow of the salt lake city olympics, mitt romney is beck couldn't by the bay state gop to run for governor, despite the fact that a republican already was in the job. >> jane swift was the governor, but s

the romney message has always been that he passed a law as governor of massachusetts for massachusetts, not for the nation at whole. she said nothing that contradicts that message. but apparently the rules for the republican party is, you can't even talk about romney care, and i think that's absurd. >> you can't tell the truth. that's their message. and here's the thing, if governor romney had any credibility on any of these issues. if it wasn't for the fact that we've been talking about all the various things that he either won't answer, won't respond to, won't show us, you know, is trying to be -- is being very, you know, nontransparent about, he would have more credibility, and therefore this problem of the lack of trust that the base of his own party actually has with him, would be less of an issue, and a single comment by a spokesperson would be far less damaging. so mitt romney really needs to bear the brunt of this. but i think sam's right, they're going to make andrea, probably, take the hit for it, but the candidate himself should take a lot of the responsibility. >> if she's

massachusetts was uniquely able to deal with this. there are far fewer uninsured people in massachusetts than other states. he viewed it as a signature the achievement that help them run for president. right after he signed the legislature, he walked across boston, to go to the ritz carlton hotel to meet with advisers from iowa that he hoped would run his presidential campaign in the iowa caucus. it is something he thought would be important and he thought would be helpful politically. >host: does the massachusetts constitution require a balanced budget in the state? guest: he talks about the balanced budget but i don't want to say a wrong answer. host: did he more frequently choose to balance it by cutting government programs and services or by raising taxes? guest: there was a lot of controversy over some statements about fees because he raised a number of fees and does not like to call them tax hikes. same deference. he did a combination of both. it is fair to say. he worked with the legislature who were 85% democratic. you have to

right, that is true, but they were not in massachusetts, and so tragic outcome. if only something like massachusetts health reform was in place for the whole country, right? with its individual mandate and government subsidies and everybody having insurance. it would be awesome if there was health reform for the whole country instead of just in massachusetts, right? so imprlicitly, the message is o that. re-elect president obama, everybody. do not vote for the guy who would repeal national health reform and leave it only in massachusetts. re-elect president obama. four more years. do not vote for mitt romney says the romney campaign chief spokesperson. if there's one thing the mitt romney for president campaign should be good at talking about by now, it is this issue, right inthis is an issue that really should not be screwing up. i mean, they're trying to run against health reform when their candidate is the health reform governor. sensitive subject. they know they have to be sensitive to it. they know they have to be super attentive to this whenever it comes up

massachusetts, rhode island. when are massachusetts and rhode island good republican pickups seats? jackie in indiana. we have a good number of people and they will be you need people. this is not going to be a wave elections. it will be an election of individuals who are better candidates with better ideas in specific seats with mitt romney on the ballot. >> how do you expect them to line up with the other new members? >> quite weel. we must-- quite well. we must repeal the affordable care act which will cost this country 800,000 news jobs if we do nothing. secondly, not raising taxes. thirdly, an agenda that john boehner would preside over and would give us the opportunity to make sure the bills that we put on the four are read and that members of congress have a chance to amend those bills and that members of congress make sure we get an agenda done for jobs in this country, and that is what they are all about. defense talk about the and make sure you protected people that are already there. >> there is a big argument in our conference about whether we were just going to do exact

massachusetts is in the vanguard of that now. we just passed a bill that aims to usher in payment refor wi -- with how providers are compensated you have this achievement that is pretty successful, and yet he is not talking about it at all, because he thinks it is is radioactive. they are similar, and the plantects of the o obama drew very heavily on massachusetts' experience. i don't know if we will hear about it tonight. my hunch is that he probably will, given that this is a pension hall full of republicans who have been caught again every possible criticism of government intervention into their lives. at the same time, there is a good story if he wants to tell it, particularly to a general election audience. this is one of the things that would give clues as to who he is talking to. host: jeremy is an independent caller. welcome. caller: thank you. by guy earlier was saying how romney's work history and background plays out -- hearing about bain capital and how a lot of people have got out of work, and even think about both s