i spoke to mark kelly yesterday about his testimony. he said that we're both -- he and congresswoman giffords, are moderate gun owners. they own guns. they have been supporters of gun rights for a long time. he also said that he hopes that they can do something about the safety of our kids and our communities. one tidbit he told me is that he and gabby giffords used to go together to the nra practice range just outside of washington. he almost joined the nra himself but never got around to it. that's their perspective. and then of course on the other side of the witness table the last person we will hear from will be wayne lapierre who will say a lot of familiar things that we've heard from him over the years but even more specifically since the shootings at newtown he's going to say in fact his prepared remarks say that he's going to say law abiding gun owners will not accept the blame for acts of violence of deranged criminals. expect him to be as combative and defiant for people who own guns as he has in the past. >> i'm sitting here

and mark kelly joins me now. welcome back. i always think of you and gabby and other victims of these shootings when there's a new shooting. and it flashes up on the screen. what goes through your mind? what did you think when you heard another school shooting today? >> well, you know, just like you, piers, i often think about what happened to gabby. what happened here a little over two years ago and how horrific an event that was. now i also think about what happened in newtown. we certainly can't allow ourselves to continue down this road where this happens almost now on a regular -- as a regular occurrence. >> and the problem, it seems to me, you have the nra today coming out, utterly defiant as normal, really apart from potentially allowing some kind of debate about background checks, not interested in any discussion about gun control whatsoever. what is your reaction to that? >> you know, i was optimistic that after today's meeting in the white house, there would be some statement that they could find some common ground.

americans responsible solutions, mark kelly joins us now. mark, welcome back. i always think of you and gabby and other victims of these shootings when there's a new shooting. and it flashes up on screen. what goes through your mind? what did you think when you heard another school shooting today? >> well, just like you, piers, i often think about what happened to gabby. what happened here a little over two years ago and how horrific an event that was. but now i also think about what happened in newtown. and you know, we certainly can't allow ourselves to continue down this road where this happens almost now as a regular occurrence. >> and the problem it seems to me, you have the nra today coming out utterly dede -- defiant as normal. not interesting in any discussion about gun control whatsoever. what is your reaction to that? >> you know, i was optimistic that after today's meeting in the white house that there would be some statement that they could find some common ground. gabby and i like you said we're gun owners. strong supporters of the second amendment

and mark kelly joins me now. welcome back. i always think of you and gabby and other victims of these shootings when there's a new shooting. and it flashes up on the screen. what goes through your mind? what did you think when you heard another school shooting today? >> well, you know, just like you, piers, i often think about what happened to gabby. what happened here a little over two years ago and how horrific an avent that was. now i also think about what happened in newtown. we certainly can't allow ourselves to continue down this road where this happens almost now on a regular -- as a regular occurrence. >> and the problem, it seems to me, you have the nra today coming out, utterly defiant as normal, really apart from potentially allowing some kind of debate about background checks, not interested in any discussion about gun control whatsoever. what is your reaction to that? >> you know, i was optimistic that after today's meeting in the white house, there would be some statement that they could find some common ground.

mark kelly is being asked questions by the panel. >> possibly been in the national instant background check system about him that would have prevented him from buying a gun through a background check. that's part of the solution. the other problem, let's say he was denied, denied the purchase of the gun which he purchased in november of 2010, it would have been very easy for him to go to a gun show and purchase a gun without a background check. so you know, there are several things that need to be done and in my opinion and in gabby's opinion, this is one of the most important things we must do to prevent criminals, terrorists and the mentally ill from having easy access to guns. closing the gun show loophole and requiring private sellers to require a background check before they transfer a gun is -- i mean, for us, i can't think of something that would make our country safer than doing just that. >> thank you. >> and mr. lapierre, in 1999 you testified by the house judiciary committee and you testified quote, nobody is more committed than we are to keeping guns out of criminals hands

mark kelly is in "the situation room." come on in, mark. we're going to talk about what happened today and where you stand on all of this right after this commercial break. ...tax time can ofbe...well...taxing. so right now we'll give you... ...$10 off any turbo tax deluxe level software or higher! find thousands of big deals now... ...at officemax. delicious. but say i press a few out flat... add some beef sloppy joe sauce... and cheese fold it all up and boom! i just made an unbeatable unsloppy joe pillsbury grands biscuits. let the making begin. until i got a job in the big apple. becoming a fulltime indoor cat wasn't easy for atti. but he had purina cat chow indoor. he absolutely loved it. and i knew he was getting everything he needed to stay healthy indoors. and after a couple of weeks, i knew we were finally home! [ female announcer ] purina cat chow indoor. and for a delicious way to help maintain a healthy weight, try new purina cat chow healthy weight. when the doctor told me that i could smoke for the first week... i'm like...yea

mark kelly's testimony was very, very powerful about how he and gabrielle giffords are gun owners and believe in the importance of guns and owning guns. what i find most frustrating of the testimony from mr. lapierre and others is, there is no solution they appear willing to accept, unless it is guaranteed to stop every single incident of gun violence, and, of course, that's just not going to ever happen. but his argument about background checks and that conversation with senator durbin, for example, criminals won't go through background checks, so, therefore, we can't get rid of the background check loophole. then why do we have background checks at all? is that what the nra is arguing for? it's just very frustrating, because this is a terrible phrase, there is no silver bullet when it comes to gun violence, but there are a bunch of reasonable, rational steps, and the first two i would point to are expanding background checks and dealing with the magazine questions so the 9-year-old girl might still be alive. >> and ruth and chris, the other argument that wayne lapierre made from the

our first witness is mark kelly. he's -- our first witness is mark can kelly, retired astronaut and co-founded americans for potential solutions. thsz an advocacy that promotes to prevent gun violence and protect responsible gun ownership, with his wife, former congresswoman gabrielle giffords. please go ahead, sir. >> thank you chairman leahy and ranking member grassry for inviting me today. i look forward to an instructive dialogue with your committeeant want to take the opportunity to congratulate gabby's friend jeff lake on new role as arizona's junior senator. as you know, our family has been immeasurableably affected by gun violence. gabby's gift for speech is a distant gg? news breaks to yet another tragic shooting. after 20 kids and six of their teachers were gunned down in their classrooms at sandy hook elementary, we said this time must be different. something needs to be done. we're simply two reasonable americans who have said enough. on january 8th of 2011, a young man walked up to gabby at her constitue

our first witness is mark kelly. he's -- our first witness is mark can kelly, retired astronaut and co-founded americans for potential solutions. thsz an advocacy that promotes to prevent gun violence and protect responsible gun ownership, with his wife, former congresswoman gabrielle giffords. please go ahead, sir. >> thank you chairman leahy and ranking member grassry for inviting me today. i look forward to an instructive dialogue with your committeeant want to take the opportunity to congratulate gabby's friend jeff lake on new role as arizona's junior senator. as you know, our family has been immeasurableably affected by gun violence. gabby's gift for speech is a distant memory. she struggles to walk and partially blind. a year ago she left the job she loved, serving the people of arizona. but in the past two years, we have watched gabby's determination and spirit and intel lekt conquer her disabilities. we're speaking to you today as americans. we're a lot like many fellow citizens following this debate about g

the president can act by executive order on some things, including what you heard mark kelly talking about, the issue of background checks and streamlining those background checks. not going as far as he wants to go, but improving the process. >> all right, jon karl in new york, and thank you so much for bringing us up to date. >>> and now, we turn to aurora, colorado, and that other american town marked by a mass shooting, that time, in a movie theater. today, we learned the stunning story behind these pictures we saw at the time. law enforcement entering the booby trapped apartment of the alleged gunman, james holmes. fbi agents have testified today that holmes had homemade napalm inside his apartment. remote-controlled triggers hidden in a garbage can outside. the trap was meant to injure police officers as holmes fired his guns in the movie theater five miles away. >>> and now we turn to other big news today. it is official. 2012 was the hottest year in the united states since weather scientists started keeping records. and hotter, not by a little, but by a landslide. tonight, ab

our first witness is mark kelly. he is a, first witness is mark kelly. he is a retired astronaut in u.s. navy captain. captain kelly recently cofounded americans for responsible solutions. this is an advocacy group that promotes solutions to prevent gun violence, and protect responsible gun ownership. did it with his wife, former congresswoman gabrielle giffords. so, captain kelly, please go ahead, sir. >> thank you, chairman leahy and ranking member grassley for inviting me here today ? . >> we are simply two reasonable americans who have said, enough. on january 8th of 2011 a young man walked up to gabby at her constituent event in tucson, leveled his gun and shot her through the head. he then turned down the line and continued firing. in 15 seconds he emptied his magazine. it contained 33 bullets and there were 33 wounds. as the shooter attempted to reload he fumbled. a woman grabbed the next magazine, and others restrained him. gabby was the first victim. christina taylor green, nine years old, born on 9-11-2001 was shot with the 13th bullet or after

our first witness is mark kelly. he is a, first witness is mark kelly. he is a retired astronaut in u.s. navy captain. captain kelly recently cofounded americans for responsible solutions. this is an advocacy group that promotes solutions to prevent gun violence, and protect responsible gun ownership. did it with his wife, former congresswoman gabrielle giffords. so, captain kelly, please go ahead, sir. >> thank you, chairman leahy and ranking member grassley for inviting me here today . >> we are simply two reasonable americans who have said, enough. on january 8th of 2011 a young man walked up to gabby at her constituent event in tucson, leveled his gun and shot her through the head. he then turned down the line and continued firing. in 15 seconds he emptied his magazine. it contained 33 bullets and there were 33 wounds. as the shooter attempted to reload he fumbled. a woman grabbed the next magazine, and others restrained him. gabby was the first victim. christina taylor green, nine years old, born on 9-11-2001 was shot with the 13th bullet or after.

. >> giffords and her husband after not mark kelly cup -- astronaut mark kelly started an organization called americans for responsible solutions. >> in alabama a six-year-old boy is in danger him a being held hostage by a man who already shot and killed a school bus driver. >> swat teams and police have descended upon midland city, alabama, trying to save a child's life and defuse an ongoing hostage situation. a gunman boarded a school bus killing the driver and kidnapping a boy with special needs. >> he said he needed a kid and then he shot the bus driver. the driver's foot was on the gas, and we went back rent -- backward. >> parents scrambled to find their children. >> nobody told me anything. i went to look for my son. >> radar traffic capture the chaos. >> just had a boss trevor shot possibly deceased. >> suspect is on foot. white male, sunglasses. >> police sources described the suspect as a military veteran in his 60's, recently charged with menacing. he might be due in court today. he is thought to be holding the young boy in an underground bunker with no easy way to plan a re

kelly yeah i disagree with mark kelly the fact of the matter is this whether you have a five seven fifteen he would have pulled off at least five of those shots now with odds going to be that he might have hit five for five three four five we don't know but for the comments that i gave to believe that they cut bait am just another magazine size and that's going to change any deaths it's just not not statistical so i think if you look for example new york city police if i remember correctly they typically have fifteen rounds and there's i mean there's nothing magic but there's they have fifteen rounds which seems to say well why do some people need fifteen and other people need ten and who's a better marksman such because i'll tell you those cops but i'll tell you this i think the trend is right now those of you who are pushing to say well let's not get down to ten if you got that then you'd say let's knock it down to seven then five business or related to seven or nine that barney fife used to keep in his pocket in the andy griffith show works quite well for him ok senator durbin asked la

in fact her husband mark kelly broke the news of today's gunfire in phoenix to everybody at that hearing. the national rifle association's executive vice president wane lap peer also testified there. we will hear from both sides coming up inside fox report. first though a u.s. senator denies any role in a case involving hookers, a private plane, and a wealthy eye doctor. fbi agents raided that doctor's clinic last night in south florida. sea long-time friend and donor to the democratic senator bob menendez of new jersey. he is the chairman of a powerful foreign relations committee. it's still not clear whether the raid involved the senator but it would not be the first time the two men have been linked. back in november, the conservative web site the daily caller interviewed prostitutes who said the senator paid them for sex in the dominican republic. the article claimed the senator flew to that country on the doctor's private jet. late today the senator's office acknowledged that he has traveled on that jet, but says that he paid for the trips properly. his office released a statement t

astronaut mark kelly and his wife gabby giffords came here recently. came away more determined than ever to stop gun violence. you'll hear from commander kelly. i talked to him earlier. and also, kenny chesney as our special report, united in newtown, continues. ♪ amazing grace how sweet the sound ♪ ♪ that saved a wretch like me anyone have occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas, bloating? yes! one phillips' colon health probiotic cap each day helps defend against these digestive issues with three strains of good bacteria. live the regular life. phillips'. looks like you're in a pickle. yeah. can you get me out of it ? just so happens i know a chap... book any flight and hotel together and get access to our free personal concierge service. any need, any question, we're on call 24/7. >>> the fire house where children were taken after the shooting for safety and to be reunited with their parents in the hours after the shooting, now on the roof ottheir fire house, 26 stars, one for each life taken at sandy hook elementary a month ago today. tomorrow

mark kelly, the husband of former congresswoman gabrielle giffords, joins us next. and former adviser to the romney campaign, dan senor, is here. keep it right here on "morning joe." [ woman ] ring. ring. progresso. i just served my mother-in-law your chicken noodle soup but she loved it so much... i told her it was homemade. everyone tells a little white lie now and then. but now she wants my recipe [ clears his throat ] [ softly ] she's right behind me isn't she? [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup. in the middle of the night it can be frustrating. it's hard to turn off and go back to sleep. intermezzo is the first and only prescription sleep aid approved for use as needed in the middle of the night when you can't get back to sleep. it's an effective sleep medicine you don't take before bedtime. take it in bed only when you need it and have at least four hours left for sleep. do not take intermezzo if you have had an allergic reaction to drugs containing zolpidem, such as ambien. allergic reactions such as shortness of breath or swelling of you

astronaut mark kelly and his wife gabby giffords came here recently. came away more determined than ever to stop gun violence. you'll hear from commander kelly. i talked to him earlier. and also, kenny chesney as our special report, united in newtown, continues. ♪ amazing grace how sweet the sound ♪ ♪ that saved a wretch like me ♪ [ male announcer ] don't just reject convention. drown it out. introducing the all-new 2013 lexus ls f sport. an entirely new pursuit. and his new boss told him two things -- cook what you love, and save your money. joe doesn't know it yet, but he'll work his way up from busser to waiter to chef before opening a restaurant specializing in fish and game from the great northwest. he'll start investing early, he'll find some good people to help guide him, and he'll set money aside from his first day of work to his last, which isn't rocket science. it's just common sense. from td ameritrade. nothing. are you stealing our daughter's school supplies and taking them to work? no, i was just looking for my stapler and my... th

tonight, she and her husband mark kelly open up to abc world news anchor diane sawyer about their emotional journey to the scene of another senseless tragedy. and how it inspired their new call to action. >> in the two years since it's estimated more than 57,000 adults and 5,000 children have died from a gun in the united states. including the 20 children in newtown, connecticut. last week, giffords and kelly went to try to console the families. >> the first couple that we spoke to, the dad took out a cell phone and showed us a picture of his daughter. and i just about lost it. you know, how did we get to the point where 85% of the children in the world that are killed with guns are killed in the united states? that is a sobering statistic. >> so that's what changed for you? >> yes. >> they say it is now time for action, common sense change led by gun owners, too. you have a gun. >> yes. a glock. >> you still have a glock. >> gabby and i are both gun owners. we are strong supporters of the second amendment. >> so their group is called americans for responsible solutions and it will become a

if going forward gabby giffords and mark kelly follow through to push back against the nra, the slime machine will come after them. what happened to her will not make her immune. sarah braidly got slimed. jim brady got slimed. it's going to happen. i certainly don't have any reason to think they're not but i hope they're ready for it. debralee hovey is just the beginning of itism. >> jennifer: i totally agree with you. gabby giffords took a bullet. i guess she can take the slings and arrows for a good cause. do you think she would be the face of the cause like brady in the 80s, do you think she could be the rallying person? >> one thing that she has going for her that jim brady didn't have going for him. she is a natural politician, she has worked in the milieu before. i think you'll see a couple of organizations pop up. i think you'll see a couple of organizations and i wouldn't be at all surprised if you saw an organization of gun owners pop up. i keep hearing about these millions of responsible gun owners who are does gusted with the nra doing. then a let them take over the nra, or

mark kelly, her husband, adamantly argueded for universal background checks. he believes if background checks had been stronger, the man who shot his wife probably never would have gotten a gun. jim? >> danielle leigh, thanks so much. >>> they argue, they have fist fights, they don't always get along. they gossip about each other behind their backs, from basketball wives to the real housewives of atlanta, are reality tv shows trashing the image of african-american women this it's the talk around town this week. whur's molette green is here. welcome back. your listeners have pretty strong opinions. >> yes, teens to college-age young women, the listeners are concerned, because they're getting the emergency that behaving this way, behaving batly, get along or not getting along with one another is op. >> meme leaks, as we know, appeared on housewives, and on "the apprentice" a while back i asked her about the issue. let's listen to what she said. are you concerned at all about the stereotype of the angry black woman that you portray very well on these shows? >> no

her husband mark kelly, we understand, will be talking about the university server shall background checks and whether or not it's a good idea. he backs it. they have now started this organization that's essentially a lobby effort for gun control and as a gun owner himself, mark kelly said he thinks the nra did a great job when it comes to safety. he thinks they are on the wrong side of the fence when it comes to a weapons ban. we'll hear from the nra ceo wayne la pierre that studies have shown crime didn't go down. he'll say according to his prepared testimony that university server shall background checks target the wrong people. you want to catch a the criminals and they get around the background checks and get weapons. interesting testimony coming up before the senate judiciary committee on the issue of gun violence. >> a lot of them out there on the streets. thanks, tracy. >> among with the gun control congress begins the debate over immigration reform. the two sides trying to sort out differences between their plan and president obama's version. one key issue, how long it will take f

and mark kelly sent e-mails to supporters urging them to attend the hearing today. >> c.h.p. is getting closer in identifying the drivers involved in a dangerous side show in the middle of interstate 880 over the weekend. the crazy stunt could have had deadly consequences. we have the latest on the investigation and the emergency calls that came in during the incident. >> my god. my god. the c.h.p. is getting abundance of information leading to the drivers involved in this sideshow that happened saturday afternoon around 4:00 right in the middle of northbound 880 in oakland. >> someone posted this on the internet and i saw it, i saw a comment saying they knew someone in the video. >> caller who gave crucial information to the c.h.p. spoke exclusively to abc7 news saying he saw postings on facebook implicated the drivers. the c.h.p. also released 9-1-1 calls from people who witnessed this. >> everyone on the freeway is stopped to see what they were doing. it is not safe. i have a baby in the car. >> it involved half a dozen vehicles near the colisieum. >> people are just, like

. >> mark kelly, husband of gabrielle giffords. >> rights demand responsibility. first, fix gun background checks. >> it is not a serious solution for reducing crime. >> the nra is clearly, dramatically out of step. >> lapierre dismissed background checks. >> background checks will never be universal. >> you will never get criminals to go through universal background checks. >> because criminals will never submit to them. >> they will not go to purchase the guns because there will be a background check. >> you missed the point completely. and i think it is basic. >> senator, i think you -- >> let there be order. >> i think you're missing it. >> let there be more. >> if chairman patrick leahy pressed lapierre. >> if you're a dealer, that is already the law. >> please, mr. lapierre, i'm not trying to play games here, but if you could just answer the question. >> rights demand responsibility. law abiding gun owners will not accept blame. >> americans are looking to us for solutions and for action. >> this time must be different. >> the senate judiciary committee toda

former congresswoman gabrielle giffords of arizona was led by the hand by her husband, mark kelly. it was two years ago this month that giffords was shot through the head during a meeting in tucson. 18 others were shot and six died. a day of testimony began with this: >> speaking is difficult, but i need to say something important. violence is a big problem. too many children are dying. too many children. we must do something. it will be hard, but the time is now. you must act. be bold. be courageous. americans are counting on you. thank you. >> pelley: giffords, who is partially blind, resigned from congress last year. the rest of today's hearing featured gun control advocates and opponents, and our nancy cordes was there. >> reporter: at one end of the witness table was gabrielle giffords' husband. at the other was the c.e.o.st national rifle association, wayne lapierre, who argued new gun laws are nun necessary. >> the fact is we could dramatically cut crime in this country with guns and save lives all over this country if we would start enforcing the 9,000 federal laws we have

. >> reporter: and with that, giffords left, leaving her husband, mark kelly, to take on the national rifle association's wayne lapierre. kelly argued for better background checks for all gun sales. >> my wife would not be sitting in this seat, she would not have been sitting here today if we had stronger background checks. >> my problem with background checks is you're never going to get criminals to go through universal background checks. >> reporter: and kelly said if the man who shot his wife had been limited to an ammunition clip with just ten bullets, a little girl killed that day might still be alive today. >> the first bullet went into gabby's head. bullet number 13 went into a 9-year-old girl named christina taylor green. >> reporter: lapierre said that new gun laws would only punish those who don't break the law. >> law-abiding gun owners will not accept blame for the acts of vie violent or deranged criminals. >> reporter: when it was over, kelly went over to shake lapierre's hand. the two had only agreed on one thing -- the need for stronger measures to keep guns out of the

. >> reporter: and with that, give fords left, leaving her husband, mark kelly, to take on the national rifle association's wayne lapierre. kelly argued for better background checks for all gun sales. >> my wife would not be sitting in this seat, she would not have been sitting here today if we had stronger background checks. >> my problem with background checks is you're never going to get criminals to go through universal background checks. >> reporter: and kelly said that if the man who shot his wife had been limited to an ammunition clip with just ten bullets, a little girl killed that day might still be alive today. >> the first bullet went into gabby's head. bullet number 13 went into a 9-year-old girl named christina taylor green. >> reporter: lapierre said that new gun laws would only punish those that don't break the law. >> law-abiding gun owners will not accept blame for the acts of violent criminals. >> reporter: when it was over, kelly went over to shake lapierre's hand. the two only agreed on one thing -- the need for stronger measures to keep guns out of the hands of the

. >> giffords husband mark kelly says expanding background checks should be a top priority but the nra's chief executive yesterday refused to give any ground. >> we know from what happened in tucson that if there was an effective background check which includes having the mental health data and the person's drug use in the case of the tucson shooter into the system and if, in fact, there was no gun show loophole, i would contend he would have had a very difficult time getting a gun. if background checks are good enough for somebody who is a federal firearms licensed dealer like walmart, for instance where i just purchased a gun a couple months ago, a hunting rifle and i had to good through a background check, why isn't that good for other sales? >> my problem with background checks is you'll never get criminals to go through universal background checks. i mean, all the law abiding people. you'll create an enormous federal bureaucracy. >> we're not going to prosecute the bad guys if they do catch one. and none of it makes any sense in the real world. >> that's the point. the criminals won

. >> giffords was joined by her husband mark kelly. he explained why the couple decided to start an organization devoted to gun regulation. >> gabby is one of roughly 100,000 victims of gun violence in america each and every year. one of our messages is simple. thebred and complexity of gun violence is great, but it's not an excuse for inaction. >> president obama would later meet with giffords and kelly at the white house. but the rest of washington has not been as welcoming. nra chief wayne lapierre who's expressed some sympathy for the victims also told the senate he has no interest in collaborating even on laws that restrict the gun access of convicted criminals or the mentally unstable. lapierre resit rated that the nra still opposes basic background check rules. that puts him at odds with the constituency he claims to represent. nine in ten gun owners support background checks. >> let's be honest. background checks will never be universal because criminals will never submit to them. >> many policy makers, however, object to that

the national rifle association exutive director will be going up against mark kelly. kelly is the husband of former congresswoman gabby giffords who survived an assassination attempt. coming up why kelly is saying this is not about the second amendment. >>> bp has been ordered to pay $4 billion in criminal fines and penalties for the 2010 gulf oil spill. a federal judge in new orleans approved the plea deal yesterday. it's the largest criminal penalty in u.s. history. the company faces billions of dollars more in civil penalties. >>> the state of california is expected to fine chevron today for the richmond refinery explosion last august. that fire sent heavy smoke in the air. making some 15,000 people sick. cal osha oversees -- show on paid $10 million so far. the company hopes to return the refinery up to speed by march. >>> time now 5:04. new this morning in less than two months from right now, toll takers on the golden gate bridge will be replaced. ktvu claudine wong is at the golden gate bridge toll plaza right now where a new automated is is being tested today.

the newtown families, gabby giffords and mark kelly, folks in aurora, i -- you know, the power of these victims' families that could have on this political debate don't underestimate them. >> i know he was a hero to both of you. first to you. chuck todd, this is such a horrible loss. talk to me about what it takes and what that book means to all of us. >> well, i mean, look, when i first read the book in 1992 and you couldn't put it down. it was to me like the waet way to find out how -- what made -- how to figure out what makes pole tigs tick. i know chris is that way too. these folks that want to seek power, that want to run government, ewe just trying to figure out who they are, and he did this in a way that many of us, i think, have always been tempted to try to strive for. he set a bar so high. i don't think anybody has even come close to meeting it. in many ways maybe they never will because of just the nature of what we do to politicians and how politicians scrub their own backgrounds to this day, but it was -- that book, you know, if you -- if you finish reading that book and yo

her husband, captain mark kelly, also testified. kelly's message, demanding change is not the same as taking away people's guns. >> we take that right very seriously, and we would never, ever give it up, just like gabby would never relinquish her gun, and i would never relinquish mine. but rights demand responsibility. >> giffords and kelly are pleading on behalf of common sense here. this is why gun safety opponents like the nra's wayne lapierre need to create multiple straw men instead of talking about the facts. the gun lobby will do anything to keep all guns free from restrictions. fewer restrictions means more sales, which means more money for gunmakers and manufacturers and guys like wayne lapierre. >> if you try to do this universal background check, which sounds whatever, it ends up being a universal federal nightmare imposed upon law-abiding people all over this country. criminals will ignore it. so what is the point of the whole thing? >> this is lapierre's newest argument. a universal background check won't do anything, h

in a moment, astronaut mark kelly, who nearly saw his wife die during gunsha gun incident, be here. and right now we're remembering how the community is coming together and how the parents are dealing with such loss. matt and jennifer hubbard, lost their daughter, who loved people and animals. i know it is not easy, thank you for joining us. it is a dumb question, but how are you holding up? >> it is hard, we're going day by day, at first it was hour by hour, day by day. >> sometimes minute by minute. >> sometimes minute by minute, it changes. >> it comes in waves? >> it does, and every day for us is a new first. you know, we're doing new things with the three of us. and it is a new first. >> getting through the holidays must have been -- so hard. >> yes, and no. at first we thought how are we going to do christmas? but christmas is about hope and it is about peace, and i think through the entire situation there was a hope that some day we're going to see krist cather again, she is safe, and so we made christmas what christmas is about. and christmas in our house is not going to be

in a moment, astronaut mark kelly, who nearly saw his wife die during a gun incident, will be here to talk about what they're doing to end gun violence. and right now we're remembering how the community is coming together spiritually and how people, parents are dealing with so much loss. matt and jennifer hubbard join me. they lost their daughter, catheri catherine, who loved people and animals. i know it is not easy, thank you for joining us. it is a dumb question, but how are you holding up? >> it is hard, we're going day by day, at first it was hour by hour, day by day. >> sometimes minute by minute. >> sometimes minute by minute, it changes. it changes. >> i always thought of grief as it coming in waves. >> it does, and every day for us is a new first. you know, we're doing new things with the three of us. it's a new first. >> getting through the holidays must have been so hard. >> yes and no. at first we thought how are we going to do christmas? but christmas is about hope and it is about peace, and i think through the entire situation there was a hope that some day we're going t