the irs. the irs by statute is critical that we ask the questions about the nonpolitical appointees, not the council, not the commissioner. what are their actions. not what are their politics or their leanings or self stated intentions. people are not to be judged at the irs based on how they vote. they are to be judged based upon the job they do and how they do it. with that i recognize the ranking member. >> just one question. what are you talking about? >> we were told that we were handed these by our personal attorney. they are pictures of past presidents. the minority leader requested them. >> what is the big deal? >> do we want to see a witness with president bush? >> mr. cummings and people up and down the day is to try to paint republican versus democrat. somehow if somebody is a republican or was appointed by a republican that somehow any claim of targeting conservatives is not there. the fact is this committee's docket will include extraneous material but not material designed to for

in the irs? >> i've been informed that it's roughly 90%. >> 90%. who is left? >> a small number of people trying to keep essential things moving. >> do you think the government shutdown will impact the agency's ability to carry out your mission to enforce the tax laws of our country in a fair and -- process with great integrity? >> overall comments on issues about shutdown and budget i need to did he ever to the folks back at the irs. >> well, i want to focus on one area that the irs plays a critical role in our economy, and that's approval of mortgage loans. and regretably, due to the recession, home ownership is at the lowest level in 18 years. but home sales are finally beginning to tick up, until we got to this shutdown, and now they have again fallen backwards. even though housing finance is considered by some economists to be as high as 20 to 25% of our economy, with the related industries, so this slowdown in the approval of mortgage loans is going to have a dramatic effect on our economy.

the irs piece. i think that could be arranged. >> that's something i would like to do. but you do agree as accessed to the information more difficult security gets. >> why which is why in the arrangement how we share data in the insis stance we -- it not be displayed to individuals looking at the screen or people helping them. >> all right. i want to get something the ranking member said. heft talking about government shut down. you mentioned you furloughed quite a bit of people. my understanding is that the report of 91% of the irs is fur loid. -- furlough? >> i'm not an expert on the detail. it sounds roughly right. >> my understanding, again is that the people who take the checks and cash them for people to be filing last minute october 5th are there but the people who process the refunds for the people who are owed them are not. are you aware of that? >> i'm not an expert on the criteria for which people stay are not. there's a life and properties a foact that. >> i fleesht. i promised i would g

ople are scared of the irs. so you're kind of coming in with a, you know, ss kikind of organization to enforce this. i think it's going to becary for a t of people. i think it wl be vindictive for a lot of people. this administration makes su that they are, quote, unquote, right. >> jonas, do you think there ar rse alternatives? >> first o all, let's just say we're a few days away from the extension deadline. if you think i'm going to say anything bad about the irs right now -- >> you're the only one whoon't get audited, jonas. >> they are not t ss. they are hard-wororking, good govern servants. but look at -- how else he federal government going to enforce this? do you not the dea? plan a drone strike over you? how about the fbi? who's left who's better than the irs to enforceit? if it was my ball to play, i would said you're not eligible for medicare until you're 70 and get the irsut of it. t, yay, irs. october 15,ook for me i love you. >> i don't know, larry. maybe nobody should be in charge of enforcing it.

people are scared of the irs. so you're kind of coming in with a, you know, ss kind of organization to enforce this. i think it's going to scary for a lot of people. i think it will be vindictive for a lot of people. so this adminiration makes sure that th are, quote, unquote, right. >> jonas, do you think there are worse alternatives? >> first of all, let's just say we're a few days away from the extension deadline. if you think i'm goingto say anything bad about t irs rit now- >> yore the only oneho won't get audited, jonas. >> they are not the ss. theyre hard-working, good government servants. but lo at -- how else is the federal government going to enforce this? do you not the dea? plan a drone strike over you? how about the fbi? who's left who's better than the irs to enforce it? if it was my balto play, i would said you're not eligle for medicare until you're 70 and get the irs out of it. but, yay, irs. october 15, look for me, i love you. >> i don't know, larry. maybe nobody should be in charge of enforcing

people are scared of the irs. so you're kind of coming in with a, you know, ss kind of organization to enforce this. i think it's going to be scary for a lot of people. i think it will be vindictive for a lot of people. so this administration makes sure that they are, quote, unquote, right. >> jonas, do you think there are worse alternatives? >> first of all, let's just say we're a few days away from the extension deadline. if you think i'm going to say anything bad about the irs right now -- >> you're the only one who won't get audited, jonas. >> they are not the ss. they are hard-working, good government servants. but look at -- how else is the federal government going to enforce this? do you not the dea? plan a drone strike over you? how about the fbi? who's left who's better than the irs to enforce it? if it was my ball to play, i would said you're not eligible for medicare until you're 70 and get the irs out of it. but, yay, irs. october 15, look for me, i love you. >> i don't know, larry. maybe nobody should

she is the director of the irs affordable care act of this. before overseeing obamacare implementation for the address ms. hall ingram was the commissioner for the irs tax exempted government entities division serving full time in that role from 2009 until 2010. the illustration is already delayed a revised several parts of the law and in many cases unilateral action was correctly at odds with congressional law. many americans have been cut easy feeling that the administration is flying a locker by the seat of its pants. there are some sobering recognitions that executive orders not contemplated seem to be an everyday occurrence where changes seem to be, by definition, and possible. it is our hope ms. hall and will spell of the challenges being face so that we stop reading this uprising, yet still unsurprising news of how the implementation is going poorly. in closing, it is that going to be the committee's final heat on obamacare petition for. the ranking member has indicated he was to hear more from iras witnesses. i do, too. our intent is t

start tomorrow about the irs doing. this the irs doesn't care. the irs is going to continue to do. this byron thank you. >> thank you. >> coming up, what last minute change to the obama administration made to the healthcare web site. why did they do it? and did it add to the chaos. congressman trey gowdy is here next. former florida governor jeb bush offering president obama some surprising advice. will it w >>> listen to this one. the member of congress comparing the tea party to kkk. taking heat for latest fundraising detail it. burning cross used as t in tea party. in the caption now you know what the t stands for. calling on democrats to condemn the grayson email. in a statement grayson defending the email saying the tea party is long racist and terms imagery to refer to african-americans and president obama. so now you be the judge. is congressman grayson off his rocker or is this just free speech and political fundraising? go to gretawire.com and vote in our poll. >>> coming up, the obama administration demanding last minute change to the web site did. >>> this is a fight tha

by chief counsel of the irs. the chief counsel, of course, is actually appointed by the president. it's one of two appointments the president makes within the irs, the commissioner and the chief countries counsel. in those two cases you have evidence pointing upwards. you have the famous e-mail from lois saying everybody is clamoring for us to clamp them down and do something. we know what she does, she stops granting the exemptions. this is looking like -- go ahead. >> no, you go ahead. it's looking like what? >> it looks like that's what's happened is the irs and its higher ups were reacting by the statements made by the commander in chief, by the president. we don't have a memo from the white house to the irs, but we do have a situation where statements made by the president resulted in actions taken by the irs. why he should be shocked that there was targeting going on is a bit confusing at this point to say the least. >> so in this amendment that you're filing, you're adding new names of people associated wi

so serious the president rushed out to the microphones when the irs scandal broke and head of the irs got booted and so on. yet now, a couple of months later it's a laugh riot and investigation into it is compared to the salem witch trials. your thoughts as somebody who was targeted yourself by the irs? >> it's not terribly surprising. if you read "rules for radicals" it uh talks about the need to ridicule. it talks about never having a real conversation with your adversary. that humanizes them and your job is the demonize them. we see people saying about those who oppose obama care for instance that they want older people to die. they want kids to be deprived of food. you know, all these things are just straight out of the text. what's interesting is, you know, vladimir lenin said socialized medicine is the keystone of the arch to the socialist state. in other words, you've got to get the socialized medicine as the foundation because it gives you control of the people. >> it's a serious question . >> once you have control of them you can do what you want. >> one of the reasons the vi

top bosses at the heart of the irs scandal. we'll ask dr. ben carson if he's laughing after the tax agency targeted him. plus, a guy takes out a gun in a large crowd of people and no one notices. all too glued to their cell phones. really? a story you must see tonight. good evening, everyone. i'm megyn kelly. breaking tonight on "the kelly file," a search for answers from the white house on a story we first brought you last night. exactly when and how did president obama learn that the families of dozens of fallen troops were denied so-called death benefits because they died after the government shutdown hit. the benefits are meant to help grieving families bury their loved ones including these five american heroes who died in afghanistan over the weekend. earlier today our chief white house correspondent tried to get answers from jay carney. >> he asked for the omb and his lawyers to take action. >> why didn't he have action taken before today though? >> you have to work out a process. unless you are willing to write the check

the woman who led the irs tax exempt division behind the targeting scandal is now in charge of the irs obama care office. and today, she got a grilling from lawmakers and she also got one from us at "on the record." that confrontation you have to see. plus, congressman tr  >> greta: now it's time to show what you we are watching. we put together the best videos out there tonight. take a look. first a bridge demolition caught on camera. dozens of people gathering to watch the implosion of the amelia earhardt bridge. demolition of the old bridge making way for a new one. watch out indiana jones, does this scene look familiar? improv group recreating the iconic indiana jones scene at new york central park. watch as the bold erroled after the fake indiana jones. spoiler alerted the bolder gets stuck and indiana jones is saved. finally tell me the dog loves his owner so much he has to hold hands or paws when he he goes for a ride. no chance i could get my dogs to do that that's what we are watching tonight. hotel mogul may have found a remedy for businesses trying to get around obama car

start tomorrow about the irs doing. this the irs doesn't care. the irs is going to continue to do. this byron thank you. >> thank you. >> coming up, what last minute change to the obama administration made to the healthcare web site. why did they do it? and did it add to the chaos. congressman trey gowdy is here next. former florida governor jeb bush offering president obama some surprising advice. will it work? president bush's helpful hints coming up. bold has a huge imagination. a playground of innovation, color, and design. showing up where we least expect it. and taking inspiration from our wildest dreams. because kohler doesn't see the world in fixtures and faucets. it reimagines. coloring our lives in ways only bold could do, it's no wonder the world can't wait to see what kohler does next. >>> listen to this one. the member of congress comparing the tea party to kkk. taking heat for latest fundraising detail it. burning cross used as t in tea party. in the caption now you know what the t stands for. calling on democrats to condemn the grayson email. in a statement grayson d

coming up, the latest irs bombshell. the irs is actually sending our confidential taxpayer information to the white house. these people should be? n. jail. instead, they are running obama care. and, later, congress and the president continue to drop in approval ratings. what can be done to fix our sinking ship. ne. to justice with judge janine. this a fox news alert. new york city police made an arrest in the 22-year-old cold case killing in the child nicknamed baby hope. in july of 1991, the child was discovered dead inside a picnic cooler in manhattan. police say the girl's 52-year-old cousin has admitted to the crime. the murdered girl is finally identified as angelica casteel. for more than two decades, investigators never stopped serving to bring her killer to justice. is he being arraigned in manhattan criminal court this evening. now back to the mess in washington. she has avoided appearing before congress for five months. this week lawmakers finally got a chance to question one of the top bosses at the irs, sarah

banks will soon face sanctions for refusing to report to the irs. the new rules are due to start next july and are prompting many to give up their u.s. citizenship for good. we have more from toronto. >> he formally became a canadian. >> it is the biggest threat. >> new laws aimed at taxing foreign income and assets are causing americans to divorce their mother land. it is more than seven times the number for the whole of 2012. >> they are busy constantly. >> the u.s. has one of the most intrusive tax policies in the world. that will be strengthened by the tax compliance act. next year, banks will be forced to report american owned assets or face sanctions. >> other than wait until this new berlin wall is built to try to keep u.s. citizens in the country, i decided, it is better to get out before the wall is built. >> divorcing america can be expensive as well. they must pay an exit tax. >> they continue to be liable for taxes. the fact that they renounce their citizenship does not save them from having to pay their taxes. >> they've been asked to d

to news in the irs haseting scandal. new evidence the targeting went even higher up in washington than earlier reported. and now the tea party expanding its lawsuit against the irs. joining us kevin, president and founder of linchpins and liberty. executive director of the linch pin tea party. let me go to you first. how high up do you have good evidence to prove or how high up does this scandal go and what's your evidence in support of it? >> well, hi, greta, thanks for having me back. i think it's pretty clear that the evidence leads all the way to the top. the president. >> what's the top? the president? >> the top with the president. >> okay. >> yeah. the president had a meeting with william wilkins his political appointee to the irs on april 23rd, 2012. just two days later, orders were issued to new guidelines were issued in this tea party cases. i think there -- it's clear though that this started as far as back as 2009, the president began intimidating those of us from being involved in the political debate by his

to news in the irs targeting scandal. the tea party says it has new evidence the targeting went even higher up in washington than earlier reported. and now the tea party expanding its lawsuit against the irs. joining us kevin, president and founder of linchpins and liberty. executive director of the linch pin tea party. let me go to you first. how high up do you have good evidence to prove or how high up does this scandal go and what's your evidence in support of it? >> well, hi, greta, thanks for having me back. i think it's pretty clear that the evidence leads all the way to the top. the president. >> what's the top? the president? >> the top with the president. >> okay. >> yeah. the president had a meeting with william wilkins his political appointee to the irs on april 23rd, 2012. just two days later, orders were issued to new guidelines were issued in this tea party cases. i think there -- it's clear though that this started as far as back as 2009, the president began intimidating those of us from being involved in t

coming up, the latest irs bombshell. the irs is actually sending our confidential taxpayer information to the white house. these people should be? n. jail. instead, they are running obama care. and, later, congress and the president continue to drop in approval ratings. what can be done to fix our sinking ship. i'm beth... and i'm michelle. and we own the paper cottage. it's a stationery and gifts store. anything we purchase for the paper cottage goes on our ink card. so you can manage your business expenses and access them online instantly with the game changing app from ink. we didn't get into business to spend time managing receipts, that's why we have ink. we like being in business because we like being creative, we like interacting with people. so you have time to focus on the things you love. infrom chase. so you can. i took my son fishing every year. we had a great spot, not easy to find, but worth it. but with copd making it hard to breathe, i thought those days might be over. so my doctor prescribed symbicort. i

the irs unit in cincinnati that, you know, screwed things up. we have been looking for politic political. >> when a democrat or liberal administration screws up it is always bungling. if a republican does it, it's evil. you know if this would have happened under a republican administration you guys would be uh on top of it. smotheringing it with a giant pillow. >> congressman issa is doing the thing the party out of power does which is use the investigation's congressional subpoenas -- i mean, there is a dangerous weapon. congressional subpoenas, congressional investigations. you can turn people's lives upside down and darryl issa has an appetite for that bare knuckle combat. that's an abuse of power that goes far beyond anything we saw in cincinnati. >> who has more power is the irs uh. they can turn anybody's lives upside down by auditing them which is why i think they are the greatest organization ever. you would agree with me i think that the irs is the greatest. we have nothing against them at all. even president obama won't dismiss the sca

coming up, the latest irs bombshell. the irs is actually sending our confidential taxpayer information to the white house. these people should be? n. jail. instead, they are running obama care. and, later, congress and the president continue to drop in approval ratings. what can be done to fix our sinking ship. (dad) just feather it out. that's right. (son) ok. feather it out. (dad) all right. that's ok. (dad) put it in cond, put it in second. (dad) slow it down. put the clutch in, break it, break it. (dad) st like i showed you. dad, you didn't show me, you showed him. dad, he's gonna wreck the car! (dad) he's not gonna wreck the car. (dad) no fighting in the road, please. (d) put your blinker on. (son) you didn't even give me a chance! (dad) ok. (mom vo) we got the new subaru because nothing could break our old one. (dad) ok. (son) what the heck? let go of my seat! (mom vo) i hope the same goes for my husband. (dad) you guys are doing a great job. seriously. (announcer) love a car that lasts. love. it's what makes subar

center of the irs scandal and the irs obama care implementation. "on the record" grills her next. we helped sydney manage her debt and prioritize her goals, so she could really turn up the volume on her dreams today... and tomorrow. so let's see what we can do about that... remodel. motorcycle. [ female announcer ] some questions take more than a bank. they take a banker. make a my financial priorities appointment today. because when people talk, great things happen. she pretty much lives in her favorite princess dres and she's not exactly tidy. even if she gets a stain she'll wear it for a week straight. so i use tide to get out those week old stains and downy to get it fresh and soft. since i'm the one who has to do the laundry. i do what any expert dad would do. i let her play sheriff. i got 20 minutes to life. you are free to go. [ dad ] tide and downy. great on their own, even better together. [ dad ] tide and downy. customer erin swenson ordebut they didn't fit.line customer's not happy, i'm not happy. sales go down, i'm not happy. merch come

many of the conservative groups targeted by the irs. how can the american people trust obama care with the irs involved? >> you can't. ifs fair to say the irs is incap capable of enforcing obama care. with every week that passes we are getting a new revelation about the irs. last week it was dr. ben carson giving the speech. never had an issue with the irs before they got on it by the speech before the president. you could say coincidence. i don't say coincidence any more. >> they are going to decide whether you get a mastectomy which kind of healthcare you are allowed to get which triment. obama care is not ready for prime time. they are at the benefit of all of the people from twitter, facebook. do they refuse to hold themselves accountable to anything? >> i think the reality is if we don't have the government shut down issue that is in the media this last week if we didn't have th the story would have been launching obama care with all of the tech savviness were not able to do it. you mention the enforcement of obama care being handl

way the irs handled tax thing, your issue with s. it's the some odd financialound. responsibilities. you can't just drop that on someone else. >> you can't. frankly our clients are struggling with the affordable care act they don't know what too we do with the full-time employees? make them less than full-time. do we give them stippen? here is the money you go buy your healthcare? there are a lot of questions. without a regulatory agency to guide them, they are completely lost. frankly you don't want to be in a situation where they do certain practices and then they get penalized later. >> i think hhs should probably take over for now. >> neil: just planted the seeds. the president will argue i'm going to delay this not because republicans are demanding it and tieing it to a debt ceiling and budget thing but because there are some problems here. ipso factor we get a budget deal. we get a debt ceiling deal and in the end on this he will say i didn't do it for them he will say there are serious problems these two ladies raised on the n

we have to separate the people who work in the irs. we can't blame them for the orders that come down from the bosses and the political stripe. and that's the problem we have right now, bill. and then we go to the issues of data verification and not ready for market. this is an agency that is supposed to coordinate all of the data and information and share with other agencies. >> you are suspicious. that's where you are? >> i am very suspicious. >> christen are you? >> after what we learned about the irs is doing we should be suspicious. it is not specific to obama care. we all file taxes and so they have our information. i don't think there is added power that they necessarily v. hay have access to the w2s. >> and how dow feel about that. you personally are you cool with that? >> and they have access to the information and so it is nothing new. >> it is not the issue. >> and so yeah, i think that the problem is that in the testimony of the irs official was basically saying if anybody mishandles the information and there are civil and

communications by members of congress to the irs. things that are documented now with senator baucus and senator dick durbin. sending letters to the irs asking them to look at and target different organizations. very curious about the political process used by the senators to force the since looking at organizations. but really a lot of the stuff around lois and her communications and communications between the irs and the executive branch, who are they talking to over the white house? charles: representative darrell issa's typically put in nazi bonus kind of stuff. as he dropped the ball? have they become so busy with other things that you had to step in our? >> they have a different process and a different agenda and a different set of tools available to them. as i mentioned, we make use of the open records law and we mitigate. it's a very powerful tool and we have used it successfully from us for years or are they compelled to testify it was a bunch of people pleading the fifth? >> there will be a lot of paperwork about what they

eamon javers joins us with the latest. >> it inspector general of the irs said the irs is still having major problems cutting down on improper payments to individuals. tigta estimated that 20 to 25% of 2012 payments were improper and that the irs makes over $11 billion in improper payments each year. they say no significant improvement has been made in the eitc area and the irs is not in complains with high dollar eitc reporting. they said the irs will continue to work on the problem and try to seek improvements. larry, this particular inspector general agency is the same agency that set off a furor earlier last year about improper alleged irs political targeting of political entities and nonprofits. so this agency has a history of beefs with the irs. >> thank you, eamon. america's new energy boom has one effect we all like, lower gasoline prices. we'll show you how low they could go in the next month next on the "kudlow report" . at a ford dealer with a little q and a for fiona. tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? your ford dealer. who has 11 major brands to choose from? you

i would instruct the clerk to get a call into the irs. i would like the documents delivered before this hearing is over so we could at least can test the witness detailed about her own e-mail she does not seem to be able to recognize. >> jack lew will testify tomorrow morning about next week's debt ceiling. fromll take questions members of the senate finance committee. live coverage gets underway at 8:00 eastern on c-span two. on c-span three, the senate committee will hold a hearing on the debt limit and the potential impact the u.s. default could have on the global economy. of theoklahoma governor american bankers association will testify. live coverage at 10:00 a.m. eastern. >> doing book tv's coverage of this year's national book festival, david spoke about joseph kennedy. >> finally, kennerly -- kennedy could not figure out churchill is playing this mind game with them. whether churchill was accusing him or so drunk he forgot from the day before kennedy did not drink. one another intensely but the war was over here they had intense s

party this morning was floating the idea of increasing the intrusiveness of the irs into people's income. now we know the ransom note was paired back even further. all of this pain and misery and cost and drama, the whole thing just so we can get a health pay cut for our staffs. joining me now is former senator blanch lincoln, former governor of arkansas, is the principal of lincoln policies saying that lobbyists on behalf of walmart -- and the just launched no more about washingtonpost.com. tim carney, i will begin with a little bit of rare praise for the tea party caucus in the house of representatives who i have been beating inon throughout the shutdown, which i find -- however, john boehner wanted this medical device tax repeal and the house conservative caucus balked at it and i think they balked at it in part because you have been railing against it in your columns as essentially a give away. i want to hear in you, what the dynamicings were from that, i want to hear from you former senator lincoln, right after you thought it went down right after this break. to treat my low testost

the irs unit in cincinnati that, you know, screwed things up. we have been looking for politic political. >> when a democrat or liberal administration screws up it is always bungling. if a republican does it, it's evil. you know if this would have happened under a republican administration you guys would be uh on top of it. smotheringing it with a giant pillow. >> congressman issa is doing the thing the party out of power does which is use the investigation's congressional subpoenas -- i mean, there is a dangerous weapon. congressional subpoenas, congressional investigations. you can turn people's lives upside down and darryl issa has an appetite for that bare knuckle combat. that's an abuse of power that goes far beyond anything we saw in cincinnati. >> who has more power is the irs uh. they can turn anybody's lives upside down by auditing them which is why i think they are the greatest organization ever. you would agree with me i think that the irs is the greatest. we have nothing against them at all. even president obama won't dismiss the sca

party this morning was floating the idea of increasing the intrusiveness of the irs into people's income. now we know the ransom note was paired back even further. all of this pain and misery and cost and drama, the whole thing just so we can get a health pay cut for our staffs. joining me now is former senator blanch lincoln, former governor of arkansas, is the principal of lincoln policies saying that lobbyists on behalf of and the just launched no more about washingtonpost.com. tim carney, i will begin with a little bit of rare praise for the tea party caucus in the house of representatives who i have been beating up on throughout the shutdown, which i find -- however, john boehner wanted this medical device tax repeal and the house conservative caucus balked at it and i think they balked at it in part because you have been railing against it in your columns as essentially a giveaway. i want to hear in you, what the dynamics were from that, i want to hear from you former senator lincoln, right after you thought it went down right after this break. the son picks up the chec? [thinking]

the lawsuit seeks the irs interpretation. the judge denied that. connell: you know enough enough about it to say it is a good argument? >> i can say that the irs rarely loses at this stage. it is a judge trial. i think the irs will lose. i think they will lose big time on this one. this will actually help a lot of poor people in the united states that are only obliged to buy that bare-bones policy. as much as i disagree with the statute, the irs is frustrating congresses intent. dagen: can i ask you something about the irs? we keep talking about young people. they are essentially being taxed in a hidden way. >> that is not the irs's fault. dagen: the irs will be charged with going after these people. if they do not by this health insurance, how aggressively will the irs go after them? >> as aggressively as it goes after everyone else which is uber aggression on the scale of aggression. dagen: now the young people will have the irs breathing down their necks in a way they probably have not felt before. >> i think you are right. that is congresses fa

. >> they will be feeling the sting now that the irs plans to delay the 2014 tax season. lauren simonetti has more on the news and other business stories this morning. >> the government shut down could delay your tax refund by one week maybe even two weeks. the final season was set to begin january 21st but the government shut down pushed that back to at least january 28th and possibly the 24th. some rely on time lie refunds to make ends meet. they need time for the program to test the new processing system in place. so they need an actual week or two. we will find out for sure in december. this does not effect your tax return. that is still due as always april 15th. number two, this refund situation can be delayed again if the government shuts down again when the budget talks resume in january. not good. if you are planning to do holiday shopping on amazon.com you are not going to like this story. customers must make purchases at least $35 to qualify. i love free shipping. for those college bound and writing tuition checks. tuition is up but it is rising at the slowest p

what did the irs want? >> well, they wanted to investigate some property, some investment property that i had. and they came and found that all the eyes were dotted and all the t's were crossed and they said let's just do a general audit of everything and that was okay. let's look at another year. and that was okay. fortunately. >> bill: maybe it's a coincidence though. >> well, let's put it this way. i have never had anything before this with the irs. and nothing has changed. so, they. >> bill: you didn't have to pay any penalties or anything. yourjust went through stuff? >> exactly. >> bill: you really believe because you criticized some of the president wants policies at the prayer breakfast that the irs was given a hey, why don't you give him a little jazz? do you think that happened? >> well, whether that was the case or not, you know, the fundamental issue here is the freedom of our citizens is being threatened. you know, i think this is a much more serious thing than watergate or iran contra or even

what did the irs want? >> well, they wanted to investigate some property, some investment property that i had. and they came and found that all the eyes were dotted and all the t's were crossed and they said let's just do a general audit of everything and that was okay. let's look at another year. and that was okay. fortunately. >> bill: maybe it's a coincidence though. >> well, let's put it this way. i have never had anything before this with the irs. and nothing has changed. so, they. >> bill: you didn't have to pay any penalties or anything. yourjust went through stuff? >> exactly. >> bill: you really believe because you criticized some of the president wants policies at the prayer breakfast that the irs was given a hey, why don't you give him a little jazz? do you think that happened? >> well, whether that was the case or not, you know, the fundamental issue here is the freedom of our citizens is being threatened. you know, i think this is a much more serious thing than watergate or iran contra or even

party this morning was floating the idea of increasing the intrusiveness of the irs into people's income. now we know the ransom note was paired back even further. all of this pain and misery and cost and drama, the whole thing just so we can get a health pay cut for our staffs. joining me now is former senator blanch lincoln, former governor of arkansas, is the principal of lincoln policies saying that lobbyists on behalf of walmart -- nand the just launchd no more about washingtonpost.com. tim carney, i will begin with a little bit of rare praise for the tea party caucus in the house of representatives who i have been beating inon throughout the shutdown, which i find -- however, john boehner wanted this medical device tax repeal and the house conservative caucus balked at it and i think they balked at it in part because you have been railing against it in your columns as essentially a give away. i want to hear in you, what the dynamicings were from that, i want to hear from you former senator lincoln, right after you thought it went down right after this break. effect of many medicati

it the management of the vast enterprise is -- >> these payments by the irs under the program is one with of raid attention. we will get people to work. it tells you one thing, government does not do a good job of correcting his problems. >> that is a great point. today, lou, the irs actually said, we made all of these problems. all of these mistakes, but we're not going to fix it. they came right at today and said. we're really not going to fix it. lou: the issue of accountability here is critically important. it has been suspended under this administration. there is no accountability within the administration. there appears to be no accountability, but within the government itself, whether it be the, the internal revenue service, here last night talking about the expanded lawsuit against the internal revenue service for conservative targeting. they have not even talked yet to a single one of his clients. but is going on here? , for good sense,a sense of accountability achieved for the american citizen? >> when you have an agency like that, the irs, it is not audible, it is not cont

of the film unfair exposing the irs. you are shooting now what percentage of production? >> 80% done with the primary photography in we will wrap up a 32 day nationwide bus tour from location to location finding the stories of the people affected by the irs. not just political hour two-party. lou: then what is it? >> people who adopt children overseas they are targeted. churches that have been silenced since the 1954 bill clinton by lyndon johnson. >> talk about the internal revenue service the adp would have any agency so corrupt with his management that they would do what they have done targeting conservative groups and churches. why have those victims who have been contacted by the fbi any other? >> we have not seen any kind of collusion nothing with the nsa or the irs but the real story is why have the american people tolerated the assault on their liberties. this is the tip of the iceberg and we need to melt that iceberg. lou: have you talked to anybody who has been investigated the investigative officer of the scan

she once headed the the irs division that targeted the conservative groups. does that give you reason for pause here because she was part of that and then moved over to the health care side? >> no. we didn't fine out about this until six months after she left. she worked in the bush administration. she was actually awarded by president bush and received the largest bonus by president bush. not by president obama. she worked with both administrations, and because she is now heading up a new agency -- remember also this irs investigation showed they were target north just tea party people but people from both -- >> the fact that we didn't hear about it until six months after the fact is no excuse. >> i don't -- with all due respect, what its this conspiracy? i don't understand what -- >> the issue is that whether or not she was corresponding in e-mails with private taxpayer information -- so when we have our taxpayer information, we shouldn't have our name and e-mails in. >> what law? >> look at the e-mails and look at them closely and see where they're redacte

let president obama defend the irs. i think that should be what they do after they get this debt ceiling deal. >> it's an interesting idea except that the republicans in the congress are perceived to be worse than attila the hun. >> you actually like that idea. >> i think that's not a bad idea, but i don't think the republicans can carry anything. i don't think they can carry water. >> i think they could. >> terrible. not quite as terpible as republicans. >> they would win with that idea. >> the number one story that we were doing for two weeks was the irs story which got blown out of the water by a number of other scandals. too many scandal balls in the air. and i do believe conservative republicans let that thing get away the same way they let benghazi get away and fast and furious because he's able to keep pushing a new problem in front of us. >> but that one's coming back. if drudge -- there was a headline in drudge. >> that's why the republicans need to bring it back. >> it was the white house. they actually tied i

to call the irs and the irs is closed. they aren't answering. >> at the construction in rockville. >> you cannot facilitate us, it's really hard out here. we are hanging on by our fingernails. >> the sisters who own this three generation, $60 million, 250 employee road building company, worry about whether the feds will keep paying the bills if the shutdown continues. >> are we not going to get payment prospects? are we going to be able to afford paying our employees? >> we are planning on having shotguns and rifles mounted on the wall. >> and at united gun shops in rockville, it's the lack of a license that was supposed to have arrived from the bureau of alcohol, tobacco, firearms, and explosives. >> the office that mails you your -- >> it printed out and mail it. >> is shut down. >> is nonoperational. >> bruce leshan, wusa9. >> each day, we have been getting dozens of messages about the shutdown from viewers like you who are going over the wusa9.com to make their feelings known. if you haven't had time to check out the b