gabe sherman. the new eye popping reporting on the white house and "vanity fair" tonight and then, and then, this same reporter turns up live with my colleague lawrence o'donnell in the very next hour on this network. so that does it for me tonight. we'll see you again tomorrow and meantime you must stay because "the last word" starts right now and he is talking to gabe sherman. good evening. >> good evening. it's what we call team work here in prime time. >> yeah. >> rachel, i was watching your coverage of the latest in the harvey weinstein thing and this story is now mushrooming and every day. >> yeah. >> just moving in directions that you couldn't even anticipate a couple of days ago and it's hard to say where it is next week. >> well, just the number of women coming forward, you know, hour by hour, especially om

gabe sherman. the new eye popping reporting on the white house and "vanity fair" tonight and then, and then, this same reporter turns up live with my colleague lawrence o'donnell in the very next hour on this network. so that does it for me tonight. we'll see you again tomorrow and meantime you must stay because "the last word" starts right now and he is talking to gabe sherman. good evening. >> good evening. it's what we call team work here in prime time. >> yeah. >> rachel, i was watching your coverage of the latest in the harvey weinstein thing and this story is now mushrooming and every day. >> yeah. >> just moving in directions that you couldn't even anticipate a couple of days ago and it's hard to say where it is next week. >> well, just the number of women coming forward, you know, hour by hour, especially prominent women in the showbiz industry saying it happened to them, too. when the number -- we saw this a little bit with the cosby situation of very brave women came out at the outset and

gabe sherman reports tonight, quote, trump vented to his long-time security chief keith shiler, quote, i hate everyone in the white house. there are a few exceptions but i hate them. also citing several people close to the president, who have recently described the president as unstable, losing a step and unraveling, gabe sherman says, quote, west wing aides have also worried about trump's public appearances. one trump advisers tells gabe sherman that white house staff were relieved when trump cancelled his appearance on "60 minutes" last month. quote, he's lost a step. they don't want him doing adversarial tv interviews. also in light of thenbc news report from early this morning that trump randomly and out of the blue insisted at a pentagon meeting in july that the u.s. should add tens of thousands of nuclear weapons to our stockp e stockpiles and increase by a factor of ten the number of nuclear weapons that we have on hand nsh light of that reporting from nbc news, gabe sherman quotes a former administration official who was willing to speculate to a reporter about what the nation

joining us now, gabe sherman for "vanity fair." david frum. jason johnson at the root.com and msnbc contributor and david k. johnson who founded the d.c. report.org, a nonprofit news organization that covers the trump administration. and, gabe, i first -- i think this might have been the first program where the 25th amendment was discussed this year. and it seems when i look at -- it's hard to pinpoint exactly in your article when the president had that conversation with bannon but it feels to me like maybe he missed that night of watching this show when we explained it very early in his presidency. >> too busy clearly watching fox news but, you know, lawrence, where i think we are is at an inflection point. the sources that i spoke to close to the president concerned that about his stability. the calling the white house an adult day care and were royed that the president was putting us on a path to world war iii gave sources around the president comfort to come forward and talk about what people at the highest levels of the republican party a

gabe sherman is with us, special kcorrespondent for "vanity fair" he wrote that piece. also an msnbc contributor. what are your sources telling you about the tension between the president and general kelly? >> yeah, i mean, this is a relationship that was set up to be fraught from the start, but in the wake of actually nbc's report on moron-gate, tillerson fiasco in recent days, this is something kelly has been trying to contain the crisis inside the white house. trump sees that as trying to rein him in. anyone who tries to -- destined to clash with trump. one of the details i found really surprising is that john kelly is worried about what happens when trump goes to mar-a-lago later this month. he's going to be returning to palm beach for the winter white house. as the fall season progresses. and kelly's whole thing is keeping trump away from unofficial policy advisers, but as we know, trump loves to hold court and mingle at mar-a-lago. kelly is trying to keep trump out of the dining room at mar-a-lago, trying to keep a guy out of his own dining room is going to be ver

gabe sherman's piece if accurate -- and i have no reason to doubt it. he's a strong reporter -- is that he has gotten worse. it's unraveling. this is deterioration of the president's mood and ability to function in the job. i do think first of all his behavior is worsening and secondly i think the concern of people around him is certainly worsening and that's why you have people in the military who you could never imagine in any other circumstances leaving what is called the tank where these very high level discussions take place and going to the media with their concerns about the president. and the questions that i have are fist where are the rest of the republicans -- >> other than corker. >> telling him just to make nice with the president. and secondly, where is the vice president of the united states. he has a constitutional obligation to the country. he shouldn't be running around to football stadiums making political gestures. he needs to get in there and satisfy himself that the president is incapacitated or kpas tated and proceed from there. >

gabe sherman's piece if accurate -- and i have no reason to doubt it. he's a strong reporter -- is that he has gotten worse. it's unraveling. this is deterioration of the president's mood and ability to function in the job. i do think first of all his behavior is worsening and secondly i think the concern of people around him is certainly worsening and that's why you have people in the military who you could never imagine in any other circumstances leaving what is called the tank where these very high level discussions take place and going to the media with their concerns about the president. and the questions that i have are fist where are the rest of the republicans -- >> other than corker. >> telling him just to make nice with the president . and secondly, where is the vice president of the united states. he has a constitutional obligation to the country. he shouldn't be running around to football stadiums making political gestures. he needs to get in there and satisfy himself that the president is incapacitated or kpas ta kpas tated and proceed from

gabe sherman, thank you so much. maybe we'll see you tomorrow. mark lotter is a former spokesman for mike pence, he was a spokesman up until just last month. good to have you, sir. thanks for being with me. >> thank you for having me. >> mark, as we heard there, folks close to the president telling reporters that he is unraveling. his secretary of state told folks in july that the president is a moron. how would you character lize th mood inside the white house when you were there? >> it's filled with people who are dedicated to fulfilling the president's vision, the president's mission and agenda to make america great again. what i'm reading coming out of "vanity fair," it's about vanity of the liberal elite and it's anything but fair. this is just not what is going on in the white house. the white house that i worked at -- >> so it's just -- >> the first nine months h-hf--- >> so it's made up? >> you are getting people saying things, their own voices and it's not what is actually happening in the white house right now. today was a big success f

gabe sherman broke the story for "vanity fair" and he joins me now. what have you learned? even the fact that there is a mar-a-lago strategy says something about where things are right now. >> yeah, i think you put it really well. i mean, this is -- we're in uncharted waters. we have a white house where the staff views the president, let's be blunt, almost as a national security risk. and their job as senator corker said on the record is to prevent world war iii. and i've heard people at the highest levels talk about how general kelly and secretary mattis and others really view their job as keeping trump from putting us into some sort of conflag race. >> i want to take a moment to just absorb how insane all this is. >> it is, it's mind blowing. >> almost an open secret in washington that bob corker's now saying --py want to put in context the conversation i had with a prominent republican who literally was saying they imagine general kelly and secretary mattis have had conversations that if trump nunch are lunched for the nuclear football, what would they do, would they tac

with gabe sherman, you could easily have either denial or context. you could have the white house adviser saying here's the context about that vote. there's nothing like that. it is fairly clear. we're having this discussion as the white house is trying to sell trump's tax plan on the road as you can see it on the screen. and several people close to the president recently saying, in private, trump is unstable. losing a step. and unraveling. >> it has been remarkable. from senator bob corker on the record, on to a number of people speaking for some big kind of attribution. you have seen' rash of press articles saying that he is not a smart man. there's only so much longer the republican party can be complicit in allowing this person, supporting this person, being in control of the nuclear codes for the country. the rest of us are becoming increasingly terrified. that's why you're seeing his poll numbers go so far. it is very clear he is eroding from his own base. this is an unprecedented frightening situation that somebody like that has so much power.

gabe sherman, thanks so much for your time today. really appreciate it. >> yep. >> we'll be right back, but first, president trump is quick to defend tossing paper towels into a crowd of people at a hurricane relief center in hurricane ravaged puerto rico. >> they had these beautiful soft towels, very good towels, and i came in and there was a crowd of a lot of people and they were screaming and they were loving and everything. and i was having fun. they were having fun. they said throw them to me, throw them to me. >>> do you know how to network like a champ? and when is a good time to have some fun in the office? i've got some great answers to all of these questions which might help you run a better business. check out the your business page on nbcnews.com for an exclusive online video series to help you work smart, grow fast and go further. hat's the idea. what do you think? hate to play devil's advocate but... i kind of feel like it's a game changer. i wouldn't go that far. are you there? he's probably on mute. yeah... gary won't

let's bring in gabe sherman, special correspondent for "vanity fair," also an msnbc contributor. always good to have you, my friend. let's start with how this alleged behavior continued apparently unchecked sgit roughly 30 years of accusations. how does that happen? >> i find the contrition by the weinstein board questionable. in "the times" report, an executive wrote a memo detailing the alleged harassment, no action was taken. in hollywood and media circles this behavior was whispered about for years. so the idea they didn't know about this really strains belief. and i think once again we're in a situation where a powerful individual was protected because whether he made money for the company or had relationships and i think the board needs to ask themselves why did they sit on this information for years? yes, they took action but only after it became public in the pages of the "new york times." >> it's hard to believe folks didn't know what was going on. >> for folks not familiar with harvey weinstein's work, is this a guy who was so powerful, he could make and break careers?

>> it's a gabe sherman piece. listen, i don't want to have a fight with you about the media because i'm guessing you came on this network because you at least were generous to share your insights. but i want you to respond to steve bannon possibly warning the president. he's not the only one. there's plenty of reports out there. >> i'm a subskriesh of vanity fair. i read it cover to cover. all i can say is i know their point of view well. steve bannon has never raised that with me. you're right he's a close ally of cpac. i have heard steve talk about with his typical gusto and passion that this president is taking on so many powerful forces that, you know, the reverberation is going to be substantial. so i can see him talking in these apocalyptic terms that when you do this, it can result in some pretty bad political options. but i don't think -- i have never heard him say that's a viable option. i do think, look, he's at logger heads even with some prominent republicans, and this is the way donald trump's going t

joining me now, msnbc contributor and "vanity fair" special correspondent gabe sherman. first this accusation by rose mcgowan. she sent this directly to jeff bay asbestos of amazon. i told the head of your studio that hw raped me. over and over i said it. he said it hadn't been proven. i said i was the proof. what are you hearing? >> well, you know, i'm hearing that this -- people in hollywood are really worried and talking about it is just the tip of the iceberg and are we going to see, like we saw in the case of amazon, a floodgate of more allegations coming forward from actresses and others who are alleging sexual misconduct by very powerful people in the entertainment industry. >> when we first were -- when this story was first breaking a lot of analysts were saying, you know, there are statutes of limitation. >> sure. >> having said that, we're learning police in lon didn't are investigating, police in new york who once investigated an accusation are also looking into it. the nypd. we should point out that weinste weinstein's spokesman has said repeatedly any allega

joining me now are "time magazine" contributor jane newton small, jonathan altar and gabe sherman. i want to come to you on this first, jay. you mentioned while we were in the break it's not just the academy. he's also out of bafta. >> it was literally the day after the report came out bafta wasted no time. they ejected him almost immediately. the academy gathered its time, bafta was like, no, we're done. >> scotland yard is investigating further claims of section uxual assault, this time u.k. the washington post story which is the latest after ronan's harrowing story and "the new york times" got to the story first, you're talking about somebody's pattern of neediness, begging, a saugs, gross behavior goes back so long. why didn't it come out, we were talking about before the break about the interrelationship there is between what we do in the news media and what hollywood does. you have a best selling book, journalist, suddenly you have a movie deal or tv deal. it is all very interrelated as is the political world. is it the fact that it's all one interrelated world that people al

gabe sherman sets up the piece with the comments that the white house is a adult daycare center, and these are gabe's words, that the president is unraveling. is this a real thing? >> well, you know, it's interesting to see members of congress really not come out and say what corker has been saying because a lot of them are up for re-election next year and are trying to get tax reform done and are trying to walk this delicate balance they have had to do. is it telling what we heard earlier this week in the report with a long-time president of the president going through the media trying to convey his message about the president's behavi behavior. that was a telling it ration of all of this. we have also seen him go after the press, which we all can acknowledge it's concerning for the president of the united states to be questioning the first amendment in those ways, but i think it's part of a strategy that we have seen before where he comes from a point of defense trying to undermine the credibility of reporters and people involved in various investigations, for example, we have seen

thank you for your reporting on this, gabe sherman. >>> stand by, everyone. chairman devon nunes is minutes away from making an announcement on capitol hill. his committee is the one investigating russian meddling in the election and whether the trump campaign colluded. you're watching "velshi & rhule" lye on msnbc. when a fire is going on, you're not thinking clearly, so they called the fire department for us i could hear crackling in the walls. my mind went totally blank. all i remember saying was, "my boyfriend's beating me," and she took it from there. our first truck was on the scene within five minutes. i am grateful we all made it out safely. people you don't know care about you. it's kind of one of those things where you can't even thank somebody. to protect what you love, call 1-800-adt-cares >>> i believe with my heart and soul and my father does and this administration does that no one can best the american worker. >> all right. that was first daughter and adviser to the president ivanka trump. last night speaking to fox news while she may believe

. >> gabe sherman on the latest sexual harassment scandal at fox news. >> the silencing of them after the fact, it has to stop. >>> and today's bill o'reilly explosion.

sherman story was fake news, but at the same time while i was speaking to them they also confirmed the basic these of gabe's story, which is that the white house really does have a sense that it's spinning out of control, especially their inability to keep trump focused on tax reform. he gave the speech today and yet he's been fighting on twitter with nbc, with bob corker and doing all sorts of things to distract from the task at hand. >> yeah. >> don, i just wanted to jump in here very quick and note that i think bannon's relationship with trump is all about trump -- bannon's vision forth the republican party and i don't think his loyalty to trump has been about trump and what he brings to the table so much as looking at trump as an avatar to try and bring a caught ral nationalism to the republican party to try and remake what the center right means in politics in america. less about trump more about that, and that's why i could see bannon prone to talking about trump as somebody that might not stick around simply because it's not about trump for bannon but about what he has represent

gabe sherman's piece reads like a 20-count indictment repreparing for the 25th amendment to be invoked. it will likely never happen. what's important is john kelly. and we know that john kelly is a barometer for the seriousness of this administration. he is a sober leader. if john kelly were to ever leave, that's an independence occasion. as an attorney they call it noisy withdrawal, if your client is committing fraud, you have to withdraw. if john kelly decides to leave i think there's something there. >> you're talking about an milita milita milita military koups. you're saying that aren't you? >> this is a president who's declared war on north korea twice through a tweet. if you're john kelly, the former commander of u.s. southern command, mattis and mcmaster, yes, this is a worry. >> we need them to tell the president what to do. >> i actually think what we're seeing with the vanity fair story, tom barrack, people conducting a public intervention for the president. a president who has -- you know, he's unravelled, unhinged. they don't know any other way to get through to him than t

i just want to squeeze one more thing in here, which is accord to gabe sherman writing in "vanity fair," steve bannon has told people that he thinks trump has only a 30% chance of serve ing full term. okay. let ta sink in for a second. here's the full quote. several months ago according to two sources with knowledge of the conversation, steve bannon told trump that the risk to his presidency wasn't impeachment, but the 25th amendment. the provision by which the majority of the cabinet can vote to remove the president. when bannon mentioned it, trump said, what's that? according to a source, bannon said he thinks he has a 30% chance of making it the full term. austin, agree? >> the 25th amendment is about the mental state of the president. i am not in the president's head and if i were, i would evict myself. i know they are trying to do something with this tax plan that is going to massive cost the american people money. they've outlined about $5 trillion of tax cuts and they have outlined virtually no pay fors and if they do that, he probably doesn't deserve to finish his term. >> beca

. >> i'm joined right now by gabe sherman, ruth marcus and former republican national committee chair michael stale. gabe, give us a sense of how this whole mushrooming of rage seems to be getting together, coming together. >> yeah. well, chris, you know, this is a president who is completely isolated, cut off from his friends, the donor and if new york confidents that he's used to speaking with going back decades with his time at trump tower. and the consequence of that is he is lashing out. advisers, i think you're seeing the leaks represent this. people are troubled by his mental decline and unstable behavior and we've seen tremendous leaks, especially to nbc news about the a idea that he wanted to increase the nuclear stoke piles tenfold and then the leaks i received this week from his inner circle that talked about his mental decline. so i think this is really an inflection point and what bob corker said publicly brought into the forewhat republicans in washington have been talking about privately. and i think really freed up some sources to start talking about what is going on i

. >> gabe sherman on the latest sexual harassment scandal at fox news. >> the silencing of them after the fact, it has to stop. >>> and today's bill o'reilly explosion. >> we have physical proof that is bull [ bleep ]. >>> plus, as the gop's civil war continues -- >> the highest income level found a doctor that would say they had a bone spur. >> president trump's war on government inside the epa. >> if you look at these cabinet appointees, they were selected for a reason. and that is the deconstruction. >> when "all in" starts right now. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. this probably could have been predicted sadly a week ago, the moment donald trump took a press conference question about an ambush of u.s. troops in niger and turned it into a debate about the treatment of gold star families. but here we are. today the president of the united states is in a feud with the pregnant widow of a fallen american soldier. two days after burying her husband, 25-year-old army sergeant la david johnson, this morning myeshia johnson responded publicly for the first time to reports she

gabe sherman, thank you. good talking to you. >>> up next, live to california's wine country where wildfires have taken 21 lives. hundreds of people are missing. give up, skeletor! you're finished! curse you, he-man, you interfering imbecile! give us one good reason we shouldn't vanquish you to another dimension! ok, guys, hear me out. switching to geico could save you... hundreds on car insurance. huh, he does make a point... i do like to save money... catch you on the flip, suckas! geico. because saving fifteen percent or more on car insurance is always a great answer. (avo) but you also have a higher risk of heart attack or stroke. non-insulin victoza® lowers a1c, and now reduces cardiovascular risk. victoza® lowers my a1c and blood sugar better than the leading branded pill. (avo) and for people with type 2 diabetes treating cardiovascular disease, victoza® is now approved to lower the risk of major cardiovascular events such as heart attack, stroke, or death. and while it isn't for weight loss, victoz

first of all, you know, just responding to gabe sherman's piece in "vanity fair" quoting a lot of people close to the president thinking this is different, this is a different moment, he does not have it together on all of these issues, you're speaking to your republican sources how true does that ring to you? >> so, i think we should start by saying we have thought for a long time that there were watershed moments that it couldn't get any worse, that something was going to change. i'm not sure personally that we are there. but what i am hearing over and over againwith north korea, the great concern about national security. a very senior republican who's been around washington, d.c., a long time, said i have never been so concerned about national security and not just because of north korea, because you never know what the flashpoint is going to be and they're concerned does he have the temperament, is he going to tweet about it? words do matter. so there is no question there's a growing concern about what's going on. >> and among some in the establishment or these insirsds there was a s

now some new reporting by "vanity fair's" gabe sherman. it is quite the attention g getter, starting with the headline, "i hate everyone in the white house." sherman site kroociting half a public advisers, they all describe a white house in crisis, his words, as they struggle to focus a president consumed by dark moods. david axelrod with us, also former carter white house speech writer and current "atlantic" magazine national correspondent, james fallon. david, do you think the president is serious about getting the fcc to take action against news organizations or is this just him, you know, venting? >> i don't know whether he's serious or not. and i don't know if he really knows what his authorities are. he often makes these comments, sort of, without knowledge of how the system works. it's interesting, i heard him earlier on your air on tape, saying about north korea. well, i get to decide, and that's the way the system works. the way our system works, also, is he doesn't get to pull licenses, because he doesn't like what's being said.

now some new reporting by "vanity fair's" gabe sherman. it is quite the attention getter, starting with the headline, "i hate everyone in the white house." trump sees as advicers fear the president is unraveling. sherman citing half a dozen public advisers, they all describe a white house in crisis, his words, as they struggle to focus a president consumed by dark moods. with us now, two white house veterans, david axelrod with us, also former carter white house speech writer and current "atlantic" magazine national correspondent, james fallon. david, do you think the president is serious about getting the fcc to take action against news organizations or is this just him, you know, venting? >> i don't know whether he's serious or not. and i don't know if he really knows what his authorities are. he often makes these comments, sort of without knowledge of how the system works. it's interesting, i heard him earlier on your air on tape, saying about north korea. well, i get to decide, and that's the way the system works. the way our system wo

gabe sherman in "vanity fair" kag unstable, unraveling. when things are going well in a white house do leaks like this happen? >> they do, but not at this pro penny and as vicious and we're seeing right now. you will always have a disagreement in the white house about direction and policy but this has gotten very, very personal right now and for good reason. when donald trump, president trump, took office, he was lauded for someone who likes to bring chaos in, he likes to create rivals to get the best results. however, let me just go over a list right now, kate, this is why we're in chaos right now. national security adviser, chief of staff, senior adviser, two communications director, a press secretary, and your director of advance have all left the white house. those are all your top aides. they are integral to trying to get things done and they have all left -- well not all of them, because the nsa director left for other reasons, but the others left because they couldn't get along with donald trump. >> josh, sharon also citing bannon c

sherman story was fake news, but at the same time while i was speaking to them they also confirmed the basic thesis of gabe's story, which is that the white house really does have a sense that it's spinning out of control, especially their inability to keep trump focused on tax reform. he gave the speech today and yet he's been fighting on twitter with nbc, with bob corker and doing all sorts of things to distract from the task at hand. >> yeah. >> don, i just wanted to jump in here very quick and note that i think bannon's relationship with trump is all about trump -- bannon's vision for the republican party and i don't think his loyalty to trump has been about trump and what he brings to the table so much as looking at trump as an avatar to try and bring a cultural nationalism to the republican party to try and remake what the center right means in politics in america. less about trump more about that, and that's why i could see bannon prone to talking about trump as somebody that might not stick around simply because it's not about trump for bannon but about what he has represented

. >> gabe sherman on the latest sexual harassment scandal at fox news. >> the silencing of them

gabe sherman. that closes out this busy hour for me. i'll see you back here at 11:00 a.m. and at 3:00 p.m. "deadline:white house" starts right now. >>> hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. we're going to begin with breaking news at this hour. amiss d an eight-day firestorm the way the president handled calls to military families, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, the highest ranking military official in this country, general joseph dunford is about to take questions at the pentagon about what went wrong in that ambush that left four american soldiers dead in niger and what u.s. troops are doing there. pentagon correspondent hans nichols is in the pentagon briefing room waiting for that to begin. >> we expect to get some sort of timeline from general

gabe sherman. that closes out this busy hour for me. i'll see you back here at 11:00 a.m. and at 3:00 p.m. "deadline:white house" starts right now. >>> hi, everyone. it's 4:00 in new york. we're going to begin with breaking news at this hour. amiss d an eight-day firestorm the way the president handled calls to military families, the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, the highest ranking military official in this country, general joseph dunford is about to take questions at the pentagon about what went wrong in that ambush that left four american soldiers dead in niger and what u.s. troops are doing there. pentagon correspondent hans nichols is in the pentagon briefing room waiting for that to begin. >> we expect to get some sort of timeline from general dunford. he is coming to the podium. i'll sit down and we'll listen to general dunford. >> ladies and gentlemen. thanks for the opportunity to speak to you about the recent events in niger which claimed the lives of bryan black, la david johnson, jeremiah johnson and dichustin wright. i begin by offering my sincere con

gabe sherman, eric bowler, we'll be back later in the hour. >>> up next, the bombshell report on breitbart's connection to white supremacists and neonazis. stay with us. is that whole thing still dragging on? no, i took some pics with the app and... filed a claim, but... you know how they send you money to cover repairs and... they took forever to pay you, right? no, i got paid right away, but... at the very end of it all, my agent... wouldn't even call you back, right? no, she called to see if i was happy. but if i wasn't happy with my claim experience for any reason, they'd give me my money back, no questions asked. can you believe that? no. the claim satisfaction guarantee, only from allstate. switching to allstate is worth it. only from allstate. w...i was always searching for ways to manage my symptoms. i thought i had it covered. then i realized managing was all i was doing. when i finally told my doctor, he said humira was for people like me who have tried other medications,... but still experience the symptoms of moderate to severe crohn's disease. in clinical studies, the majority o

why does he continue doing things that everybody close to him are now saying suggests in gabe sherman's piece quotes people suggesting he's not well. tom barrack saying he's shocked and stunned by his behavior and he's known him for decades. >> it's a hard job, and when he confronts adversity in this job he's reacted to make things worse. and there's no one offering a different course except for kelly which is not to his liking. >>> the deadline is approaching for president trump to make a decision regarding the future of the u.s. involvement in the iran nuclear agreement. yesterday he discussed his options while updating the american people on his plans. >> what's your thinking on the iran deal? >> you're going to see very soon. we'll be announcing that very shortly. >> why decertify and not just scrap it? >> you can do both, to be honest. i know exactly what i'm going to do it, but i can't give it away tonight. but i'll be announcing it shortly. we'll see what happens soon. a lot of people are guessing. maybe there's not so much guessing. it's a horrible em barbarrassmeo our country.