and jared kushner does not have a security clearance. and the reason he cannot get one is because apparently, he cannot get one. there was controversy from the outset about his security clearance two days before the inauguration, jared kushner made his initial application for a security clearance. he reportedly listed zero contacts on that application with foreign governments. this is after his meeting with the chinese and secretly meeting with the emiratis, and the trump tower russians. all of those foreign meetings, he disclosed zero foreign meetings initially on his security clearance application. mr. kushner then repeatedly sent new updates, supplements, each time, listing more and more foreign contacts, he had previously neglected to disclose. there has been controversy around his security application already. but jared kushner's process of trying to get a security clearance started a year ago, started in january. quote, as months passed, some members of the white house received their permanent security clearances, but kushner conti

and jared kushner does not have a security clearance. and the reason he cannot get one is because apparently, he cannot get one. there was controversy from the outset about his security clearance two days before the inauguration, jared kushner made the initial application and reportedly listed zero contacts on that application with foreign govr governments. this is after his meeting with the chinese and secretly meeting with the trump tower of russia. all of those foreign meetings he disclosed zero foreign meetings initially on his security clearance operation and mr. kushner sent updates, supplements to the application each time listing more and more foreign contacts. there has been controversy around his security application already. but jared kushner's process of trying to get a security clearance started a year ago, started in january. quote, as months passed, some members of the white house received their permanent security clearances but kushner continued to wait for high level appointees like him, the process is normally expedited

jared kushner has been waiting over a year. he received a interim clerns but yet to receive a full clearance. it hasn't been fully ajud indicated is the way they described it. his lawyers and aids have not been told what it is, but there's something in the process slowing it down. so it's become an interest in the national security community. was it his failure to list his meetings or dealings with the russians or his meetings with the chinese officials. these are the questions now. >> i have never heard of a year delay for someone in that position, or, in fact, any position. what are your sources telling you about that? is there any other precedence for a one-year delay for someone in jared kushner's position? >> there's been delays, i can't say there's been one this long. most importantly nobody has ever been in the position he's in now, experts say, which is waiting for more than a year and also a recipient of the presidential daily brief, he's included in this list which is 14 members of the white house, and the president,

and jared kushner for some time. they're still startling to be on the record and in the statement about donald trump jr. saying he believes they're going to crack him like an egg is certainly something that didn't sit well with the president. we're waiting for a response. this is quite the response from the president. >> the fact he used the word treasonous talking about donald trump jr. and the decision to have had meeting and not call the fbi. give me your thought. >> that is a charge that is clearly what donald trump's reacting to. that is a charge and a carrieization that has the potential to stick. obviously, steve bannon may have -- i think he says he wasn't in touch with russians, shouldn't be a witness in this investigation. these are his personal characteristicizations what he saw at that meeting. having somebody who did work in the white house attach that kind of description to that meeting is politically damaging. it's also worthy of noting, when steve ban be lesteve bannon lef white house he was careful i

and jared kushner. it's as plain on the hair on your face. the president blasted bannon, his former adviser, saying he's only in it for himself. the book written by journalist michael wolff also has strong words for the president's daughter ivanka and her husband jared. they accepted roles in the west wing over the advice of almost everyone they knew. if some time in the future the opportunity arose, she'd be the one to run for president. the first woman president, ivanka entertained, would not be hillary clinton, it would be ivanka trump. >> and that right there is summarizing what is bad blood to put it mildly between steve bannon and ivanka and jared kushner. no question about that. it was obvious here during all of steve bannon's time at the white house. now one lingering question here is did michael wolff interview the president directly or not? he says he had inside access, and, in fact, we have seen michael wolff here repeatedly over the first year of the presidency. he is here as often as some white house reporters are. sarah sanders

now, the kushner companies and jared kushner himself have said that they have been able to separate him from the business. he resigned as ceo after january 9tht january 9th, but this points up the fact he remains difficult to untangle from his family business. he retains assets and as long as he does he is vulnerable to the possibility of being compromised. and this is what counterintelligence officials wanted to talk to him about when they briefed him in march. they held a closed-door briefing in jared kushner in which they said to him, they identified him as one of the leading targets of an influence operation in the united states from china but also from other major intelligence services including the russians and the israelis and they wanted him to be on notice this would be an ongoing concern. >> why is this dangerous? why should americans, chinese, europeans care about this? >> you know, in some sense this points to the challenge that the trump administration faced when it came into office under the banner of throwing out the best practices of american governance. what they said w

but what they found in jared kushner, to their surprise, attention. he met with the chinese ambassador four times and met again with him immediately after the oath of office and met with him a number of times beyond that. so many times that mr. kushner can't recall how many times they met. and during the meetings he was without the assistance of china specialists in the government, he didn't want them to be part of the meeting. and from the chinese perspective, they got the key thing done, they wanted a summit, where they would focus on chemistry, and that's what they achieved. >> i know people are thinking, so jared kushner had a meeting with some chinese with the chinese ambassador he was alone in the room with the ambassador, what's the big deal? what could happen as a result of not having china experts present? >> well, this is sort of national security 101. as many people will tell you in government, when you meet with a foreign country, particularly someone that's not an alied country, you want a lineup of if i recalls with you, expert specialis

your report is titled jared kushner is china's trump card. so how did kushner exactly become china's go to man? >> the broker originally was during the campaign and it was kissinger, henry kissinger decide d to help jared get to know the chinese ambassador here in washington, an old hand, a real pro. because the chinese were trying fig oure out how to get closer people in trump's orbit. in their view considering some of the others around trump like steve bannon, jared kushner steams from a chinese perspective, a more reason bable interlocketer. >> you write kushner handled some of the meetings differently than past administrations. we mentioned meeting one-on-one with the chinese ambassador at least once. why is this so concerning to national security officials? so the way it works is generally speaking, the chinese always bring no takers, other staff to meetings because they're concerned that there maybe accusations that things were disclosed during those meetings that then would be discovered by chinese security services. you have a similar

. >> and so was the president's son-in-law, jared kushner. >> do you have any comment, mr. kushner? >> kushner hasn't been charged with any crimes but troubling questions have been raised about his connections to russia. >> jared kushner is incredibly important for several reasons. he's a witness to virtually all the central issues in this investigation. he is also important because he's an independent actor. he is someone who had contacts with russian representatives. >> kushner has not been forthcoming about those contacts. he was required by law to disclose them to the fbi to get a security clearance. but he has repeatedly admitted foreign contacts and had to submit his forms four times, sparking tough questions from both parties. his reasons for the revisions range from forgetfulness to a clerical error. >> there have been stories that have been appearing for months about jared kushner's meetings. >> december 1st, 2016, kushner meets with russian ambassador sergey kislyak in trump tower. >> that russian ambassador came to new york. jared kushner met with that russian ambassador.

. >> and so was the president's son-in-law, jared kushner. >> do you have any comment, mr. kushner? >> kushner hasn't been charged with any crimes but troubling questions have been raised about his connections to russia. >> jared kushner is incredibly important for several reasons. he's a witness to virtually all the central issues in this investigation. he is also important because he's an independent actor. he is someone who had contact with russian representatives. >> kushner has monot been forthcoming about those contacts. he was required by law to disclose them to the fbi to get a security clearance. but he has repeatedly admitted foreign contacts and had to submit his forms four times, sparking tough questions from both parties. his reasons for the revisions range from forgetfulness to a clerical error. >> there have been stories that have been appearing for months about jared kushner's meetings. >> december 1st, 2016, kushner meets with russian ambassador kisly kislyak. they discussed setting up a back channel with moscow at russia's own embassy. >> you have to say that raise

there's been no shortage of headlines about jared kushner. the new yorker reports on his china ties. bloomberg reports on the tenant troubles. and "the washington post" reports on jared kushner's dad who apparently is not concerned at all about the kushner facing any charges from robert mueller's investigation. let's bring in bloomberg reporter caleb melbie and tim o'brien still with me. tim, to the new yorker's report. in one part, it says while kushner was planning a mar-a-lago visit with the president, chinese officials said -- chinese official and jared kushner in meetings to prepare for the summit, discussed kushner's business interests along with policy. now, jared kushner has denied this, but i think about that mar-a-lago visit and xi jinping and the day they had dinner, the night ivanka sat next to xi jinping, her company got four licenses to sell handbags, spa services and jewelry in china. licenses that take forever to get. >> right. i am shocked, shocked, shocked by the notion that the trump -- >> by shocked you mean -- >> not shoc

. >> and so was the president's son-in-law, jared kushner. >> do you have any comment, mr. kushner? >> kushner hasn't been charged with any crimes but troubling questions have been raised about his connections to russia. >> jared kushner is incredibly important for several reasons. he's a witness to virtually all the central issues in this investigation. he is also important because he's an independent actor. he is someone who had contact with russian representatives. >> kushner has not been forthcoming about those contacts. he was required by law to disclose them to the fbi to get a security clearance. but he has repeatedly admitted foreign contacts and had to submit his forms four times, sparking tough questions from both parties. his reasons for the revisions range from forgetfulness to a clerical error. >> there have been stories that have been appearing for months about jared kushner's meetings. >> december 1st, 2016, kushner meets with russian ambassador kislyak. in trump tower. that. >> russian ambassador came to new york. >> jared kushner met with the russian ambassador. >>

., don junior and jared kushner, claiming theyor going to crack donald trump jr. on tv. >> it's a total and complete farce. >> reporter: in a statement, the president questions bannon's sanity. saying when he was fired he not only lost his job, he lost his mind. steve was rarely in a one on one meeting with me and pretends to have influence. with no access and no clue. he pretends to be in opposition to the media yet spent his time in the white house leaking information to the media. >> i think furious disgusted would fit when you make such outrageous claims and false claims against the president, his administration and his family. >> reporter: writing in new york magazine, he writes the president and his team were shocked he won. don junior said his father looked as if he had seen a ghost. milania was in tears and not a joy. the first lady slammed that statement. the book illustrates how the feud between bannon and the president has escalated. >> i like mr. bannon, he's a friend of mine. but he came on very late, you know that. i went through 17 senators, governo

that meeting also attended by paul manafort and jared kushner. bannon later said he was referred to manafort, not donald trump junior. in that book he also says there was a zero percent chance that then-candidate trump did not know about the meeting, did not meet with any of those russians afterwards and did not discuss that with donald trump junior. as we know, donald trump jr. testified under oath he did not inform his father about that meeting afterwards. now, bannon was not in the trump campaign at that time, so lawmakers are going to ask why did you make that assertion in michael wolff's book. he's not the only person, wolf, who we should look for to testify this week. another former campaign official, corey lowe endewendow expected to talk largely about contacts he had with the trump foreign policy advisor, george papadopolous, who we know pleaded guilty to the fbi after lying about his contacts with russians during the campaign season, wolf. >> interesting. the house intelligence committee moving forward with these interviews. paul manafor

he doesn't like jared kushner. we all know this is a duel to the death between those two. >> going back to what jim was talking about, the idea that these guys -- and i think what you were saying, was that these guys did not expect trump to win. >> no. >> and that includes people inside the campaign. >> right. >> i think that is a theme that we keep coming back to as we've been covering this story now for the past year, which is that it drove a lot of the decisions which is coming back to bite them. >> they did not -- for instance, they talk about michael flynn accepting this $45,000 payment for going to russia. on the expectation that trump wouldn't win therefore it would be a problem if he was setting up business contacts for -- >> right. >> he supports that theory, exactly. and, you know, also the fact that, as you pointed out, evan, this was authorized. he made repeated visits to the west wing. what does that tell you about just the administration allowing a writer to come in in these early days and have free a

so if jared kushner gets on -- i'll be generous. jared kushner gets onboard and the koch brothers onboard, can they find a way to move the needle in their direction, rather than jeff sessions'? >> this is something that has to be done by congress. so can jared kushner -- >> can their influence matter more? >> -- influence the senate majority leader mitch mcconnell and the house speaker to actually move legislation that, and have, hold hearings, committee hearingsened and get a bill to the president's desk he will actually sign. as we have seen with any -- any number of issues. all the president wants is a win. it does not matter what the bill says. so jared kushner can actually push through a bipartisan bill that gets to the president's desk, that he can sign, the president will sign it. >> the other story i was interested today is climate change. another report talking ways the federal government scrubbed climate change from all websites. how insidious is that? is that really going to have a negative effect on the fight against cli

steve bannon has never been in business with jared kushner and is not a real estate guy. if an insider was saying, this is money laundering, they could know something. could steve bannon know something that is helping mueller or is this palace intrigue? >> i don't know that bannon knows something specific but he is reflecting things other people said, as well. that is, seeing the links between the trump family, the kushner family and russia, how are those links made? were they made through loan arrangements, to what extent the russian banks own interest in trump loans? who was buying apartments? what investments did they want? a lot of what you're seeing if you're mueller is, okay, what are the connections? it doesn't have to be quote, unquote, money laundering. just as it didn't have to be quote, unquote, treason. sometimes we get caught up in some of these words, as opposed to focusing, as you were saying before, this is a meeting that was set up in order to give dirt by a foreign power. that in and of itself is a bad thing. so i think what mueller trying to do is look

he calls jared kushner greasy. quote, what has he gotten himself into with the russians? mostly says bannon he went to russia and thought he was going to meet putin but putin couldn't give a bleep about him so he kept trying. let's go to white house correspondent jim acosta. ahead of the briefing. many questions to be sent to sarah sanders. what's the response to the president to all of this? >> reporter: well, brooke, i think this book, fire and fury has lit trump world on fire. that is what we are seeing today this war of words between the president and chief strategies steve bannon is nothing short of stunning and perhaps capable of what was over shadowing a tweet twrt president less than 24 hours talking about the size of the nuclear button. but just in the last couple of hours president has put out a statement with respect to what steve bannon had to say in that book, fire and fury, and so has the white house press secretary sarah huckabee sanders saying that former

he doesn't like jared kushner. we know this is a duel to the death between these two. >> going back to what jim was talking about, the idea that these guys, i think what with you were saying that these guys did not expect trump to win. >> no. >> and that includes people inside the campaign. >> right. >> i think that say theme that we keep coming back to as we've been covering this story now for the past year, which is that it drove a lot of the decisions which is coming back to bite them. >> they did not -- for instance, they talk about michael flynn accepting this $45,000 payment for going to russia. on the expectation that trump wouldn't win therefore it would be a problem if he was setting up business contacts for -- >> right. >> he supports that theory, exactly. and also the fact that as you pointed out, evan there are was authorized. he made repeated visits to the west wing. what does that tell you about just the administration allowing a writer to come in in these early days and have free access in the fact t

we have seen jared kushner. lo there is a part of united states is no longer part of a middle east dialogue. we need to have a president who employees people, whether they are relatives or not, experience matters. >> one of the things in this is the small world donald trump occupies. image of him sitting in his room basically making calls to people, right, sometimes complaining about people, inner circle, whether it's jared kushner or kellyanne conway, being obsessed with rupert murdock approval. so it gave me sort of citizen cane, home alone, roger dangerfield feeling from this whole thing. >> if i can offer one piece of literary criticism. michael wolf previously wrote a biography of rupert murdock and he seems to be a source for a lot of stuff in here, including the conversations late at night. so i think the credibility of the book depends on credibility of murdock. he has had a complicated up and down relationship with trump over the years. a lot of contempt for him as real estate. but as he became the winn

but hopely jared kushner can get him more invested in the process. >> does jared kushner have what it takes? now you'll pylon criminal justice reform. he doesn't have any tangible power, does he? you may have heard him speak before but public doesn't know. >> a lot of it has to be done by law where enormous resistance. and the tragedy of this -- >> jared kushner is not a lawmaker. >> he's not. all he can do is bring attention to most of these issues. this needs state, some is admin stra . >> if are you a prisoner and need to call home, you shouldn't have to pay 40 bucks to make a collect phone call. thangs are human justice issues that jared kushner could have impact. but jeff sessions wants behind bars, doesn't want to lessen any offenders, any nonviolent offenders charges. >> is it a blow to jeff sessions who wasn't invited to camp david? >> who knows. he's been so publicly flailed by donald trump consistently, hanging on by a thread. >> he has more than jared kushner. >> it is. >> no matter what is happening here, i frmly believe there is good news somewhere. and i end the show alw

how does tony blair know jared kushner, that's a fascinating little piece in and of itself that we'll have to save for another time. or just buy the book. >> i was -- when that happened, so much happened, i'm sitting on the couch in the west wing and there is jared kushner and tony blair caming out -- >> you see them together. >> i overheard -- i'm over hearing the discussion in which i obviously immediately take a note on, and they're talking about the difficulties of the middle east situation and jared says to tony blair, damnit, we can solve this problem. >> and that's in the lobby of the west wing? >> yeah. >> it's kind of like a hotel lobby, and people pass through from each side of it. and that kind of moment can occur. i remember working in the senate finance committee going up for a tax meeting, there's the cia director sitting in a chair. you have these encounters that only happen in that lobby. >> they pass you in, you go there, the appointment drifts. it drifts. >> you wait and you wait and you wait. >> and you think, this is really annoying, and how can they do this to me?

if he is imperilled who would jared kushner choose between? his father or father-in-law? >> the -- in the book steve bannon calls don junior freido. the weak son in "the god father." we have seen steve bannon come out with a statement in which he says that his comments in the book, now famous comments about the don junior meeting at trump tower in the campaign of russians treasonous, that was not aimed at don junior. he said that was aimed at paul manafort but acknowledge in that statement he does not dispute. he has an opportunity to, he does not dispute a single word in this book attributed to steve bannon. >> no. i think he tries to try angulate the least -- the least revision he can and that's to say it's about manafort. but trust me. it was about -- it was about don junior. it was about freido. it was about as he says don junior will be cracked like an egg on national television. >> and don junior's not the only one. he says that donald trump's long-time lawyer michael cohen to be cracked like an egg and has these complicated relationships. but a lot of the bannon st

jared kushner, hope hicks and others as it pertains to the russia investigation. and what in michael wolf's book is precisely accurate, what is as described and what is not. it was pointed out to me to the degree any of it is relevant to the russia probe, bob mueller likely already knows the answer, or if he is first learning of any of these observations, he soon will. let me read you some of what's in here on the topic of russia. this is quote from bannon. in the book he says, quote, if he fires mueller it just brings the impeachment quicker. why not? let's do it. let's get it on. why not? what am i going to do? am i going to go in and save him? he's donald trump. ashley, any reaction from the white house today in that analysis? >> the white house as we saw privately and publicly in today's press briefing has participated it as patently false and untrue. i think that's an overly broad assessment of the book. it's certainly convenient for them. i will say i haven't read the entire book and i don't have first-hand reporting on every detail of the book. but my sense

some of the revelations about jared kushner. and so i think that was creating a rift in addition to the fact that steve bannon had declared open warfare on the republican establishment and that complicated things for this president. so i think you can't understate how significant this is. and it could, in fact, create more complications for the president and his base moving forward. that remains an open question. but it's something we're going to have to look at. >> peter baker, it seems like bannon is trying to hit the president where it hurts here. we have those excerpts at the top about that june 2016 meeting with the russians in trump tower. bannon basically coming out and characterizing that as treasonous, speculating the president's son is going to be torn apart in the judicial system here, at least potentially. is this bannon just sort of trying to find trump's weakness and go for it? is there something strategic about why he's raising this? what do you make of those particular comments from bannon here? >> good question.

jared kushner. and michael flynn. this is the story of all the president's men. >> i got the best in the world. >> set down, guys. you all right? ready? okay. >> november 10th, 2016. >> we talked about some of the organizational issues -- >> two days after the election, president obama gives his successor a piece of advice. >> that ensures our president-elect is successful -- >> do not hire michael flynn. >> now the oath of office. >> as your national security adviser. >> so help me, god. >> cnn was told something by u.s. officials that was deeply concerning. >> the next president of the united states right here! >> during the campaign, american intelligence picked up the russians bragging that they had a strong relationship with flynn. you have to take some of the conversations we were told with a little bit of a grain of salt, but this set off an alarm for obama administration officials who were quite worried about it. >> you know, people talk about temperament -- >> flynn had worried intelligence officials for mont

jared kushner who says he's a businessman. he's a business heir. >> bannon understands how power works. bannon understands that the mueller investigation, even if it starts and is launched around collusion with the kremlin, is going to expand in many directions beyond that. one of the things that is the most dangerous to the trump family and the kushner families is an investigation into their financial dealings that touches on money laundering. they're vulnerable on this. it's going to have consequences. mueller has a very sophisticated team of financial bloodhounds working with him and they're going to get at this. >> is team trump underestimating the power of mueller? >> yes. >> here you are this morning with the president saying this russian thing is a hoax. you're going, hoax? do you remember what's going on with mike flynn, paul manafort, george papadopoulos? >> he's been very successful, we have to give him, during the campaign and at the beginning of his presidency of denying things that are true. >> yes, for sure. >> a

and jared kushner. he has a story to tell. with regards to the trump tower meeting, he seems to feel very, very strongly about that. he may not have been on the campaign when that meeting actually happened, but he was there directly after. he came on to the campaign in august. he was still advising the trump campaign in a very informal role in june when that meeting happened. and also, he was there during the transition period. and he was copied on many of the e-mails during the transition period where they were discussing the sanctions, the response to the russian sanctions that obama had put in place. so i think that with regard to michael flynn, especially, donald trump jr., and jared kushner, he's going to have a lot to tell mueller during this hearing. >> ken, the timing of. we talked about it in the opening. this comes a couple of weeks after "fire and fury" is out. could a book prompt a subpoena? >> well, look, bannon was always going to be on robert mueller's witness list, but there's every reason to think that some of

when we say jared kushner has a relationship with benjamin netanyahu, when jared kushner was a child, netanyahu stayed in the kushner family home. i think he even slept in jared's room. >> he did a sleepover in livingston, new jersey. the family's relationship with israel goes way back, obviously. jared's ancestors are holocaust survivors. the family's always taken middle east policy in israel very seriously. i think the thing that gets raised here is obviously this sort of guillotine issue hanging over the trump administration for a long time which is financial conflicts of interest. is policy in the middle east being made purely because it's good policy or is it being made because at some level it also benefits the kushner family's financial interests. >> you can question it all day long. but this guillotine hanging doesn't seem to bother the trumps. they keep on. >> i willing. >> i willing through it. >> it's a cloud. and for anyone who is concerned about good government, ethics in government, conflicts of interest, it's an issue that hasn't gone away. events like this only make it

jared kushner knows nothing about anything. jared kushner is only there because he is s married to tru's daughter. he is the son of charles kushner . charles kushner is a real estate hasl, a billionaire w who distinction characteristics of actually having been arrested and spending time in jail. amy: by chris christie when he was a prosecutor in new jersey. >> that is rare in the united states for a billionaire to spend time in jail. among other things, he hired a prostitute and had her photographed in order -- hired a prostitute to have hisis brbrother-in-lawaw phohotographd then presesented the video to hs wife as a family gathering. jared kushner, he got into harvard u university because the year he a alied, his s father ge $2.3 million to o harvard. everybody y agreed he did not he the gradedes or the test scscor. these are people who profit from ththeir parents profits. there is noo knowledge that he popossesses about the middle ea. incicidentally, , it is the same thing with mohammad bin salman. his only interest -- he on

jared kushner knows nothing about anything. jared kushner is only there bebecause he is s married to t's daughter. he is the son of charles kushner . charles kushner is a real estate hasl, a billionaire w who distinction characteristics of actually having been arrested and spending time in jail. amy: by chris christie when he was a prosecutor in new jersey. >> that is rare in the united states for a billionaire to spend time in jail. among other things, he hired a prostitute and had her photographed in order -- hired a prostitute to have hisis brbrother-in-lawaw phohotographd then presesented the video to hs wife as a family gathering. jared kushner, he got into harvard u university because the year he a alied, his s father ge $2.3 million to o harvard. everybody y agreed he did not he the gradedes or the test scscor. these are people who profit from ththeir parents profits. there is noo knowledge that he popossesses about the middle ea. incicidentally, , it is the same thing with mohammad bin salman. his only interest -- he on

jared kushner knows nothing about anything. jared kushner is only there because he is married to trump's daughter. he is the son of charles kushner . charles kushner is a real estate hasl, a billionaire who distinction characteristics of actually having been arrested and spending time in jail. amy: by chris christie when he was a prosecutor in new jersey. >> that is rare in the united states for a billionaire to spend time in jail. among other things, he hired a prostitute and had her photographed in order -- hired a prostitute to have his brother-in-law photographed, and then presented the video to his wife as a family gathering. jared kushner, he got into harvard university because the year he applied, his father gave $2.3 million to harvard. everybody agreed he did not have the grades or the test scores. these are people who profit from their parents profits. there is no knowledge that he possesses about the middle east. incidentally, it is the same thing with mohammad bin salman. his only interest -- he only has one interes

let's also be clear on the fact that jared kushner is an ideal foreign intelligence target. he hat access, he hat influence and frankly the inexperience that makes him ideal target for foreign intelligence services like china and russia. clearances observe get held up because the investigating agency has questions. there are gaps. often this relates to some kind of secret. so this could be anything from a gambling debt or an affair or drug use to undisclosed or misreported contacts with foreign country, a foreign official, financial transactions undisclosed or misreported, or any kind of secret that a foreign intelligence service could use against that person to try to get information or to influence policy. >> so this is interesting just in the overnight hours. president trump retweeted a tweet from the prime minister of israeli, benjamin netanyahu, and here is what it says. what does it say to you that we have a prime minister of israeli publicly thanking jared kushner? does it give more credence to the work that he is doing in light of all the criticism that comes to him?

and jared kushner. it's as plain as the hair on your face. ken delanian is joining me and carol and ken are back as well. taking this broadly, steve bannon is saying, nah, russia is not fake news or a hoax, this investigation is real, right? >> that's how i read it, hallie. for all the anti-establishment tendencies, steve bannon sees the trump tower meeting the way the accomplishment does, which means it is improper for the trump team to meet with a russian they thought was representing the russian government offering dirt on their opponent. so that is number one. and secondly, in terms of the money laundering, he sees the investigation the same way many members of the legal establishment do, which is that even if robert mueller doesn't prove that donald trump xlcollud with russia at the end of the day, trump and those around him face legal jeopardy with how they did business with russians and other developer. no real estate developer would want the fbi combing through their business records. and bannon thinks that donald trump and his son-in

that was not because of jared kushner, josh. that was because of steve bannon doing things like the muslim ban, the transgender bathroom thing, all these crazy things that -- >> well, i think it was the collective ineptitude of the trump white house. certainly bannon played a major role in that, but i don't you can put it all on his shoulder. >> so all of what we got lost was -- we got lost was all the president's great accomplishments. massive deregulation, closing the -- effectively closing the border by staging the immigration laws, upgrading them. the most successful stock market we've ever had in history, records in business confidence, consumer confidence. nobody ever talks about this because we're getting into all of these sideshows and a lot of it comes out of, i think, the breitbart agenda. steve's a patriotic american, but he's an isolationist, he's a throwback on a lot of issues and i think where the president really needs to go forward in a more bipartisan approach if he wants to bring those approval number ratings u

we know jared kushner's sister, and remember, jared divested his investments in the family business and left it in charge of his sister and brother-in-law. and his sister was in china last year, flogging the family business, and oh, by the way, here say picture of my brother who has a very senior position in the white house, would you like to give us some money. so while bannon may be acting as an analyst and not an insider, there is something there. richard, when you think about other things bannon referenced here, he speaks specifically about kushner and deutsche bank, where i worked actually for eight years, and he says, it goes through deutsche bank and all the kushner, curse word here, the kushner, curse word here, is greasy. they're going to go right through that. they're going to roll those two guys up and say play me or trade me. so if steve bannon has a point here, and we should remind our audience, deutsche bank isn't the only one to think about here, former deutsche bank chairman joseph ackerman was put on the board of the bank of cyprus by commerce secretary wilbur ross, ban

then jared kushner would get his turn. your thoughts, david. >> look, there's so much there, joy, listen, this is a perfect snapshot of the dysfunction of today's republican party. while we're focused on trump and bannon today, the important thing is this. for my fellow republicans, you broke it, you bought it. this is what happens when you follow a charlatan. this is what happens when you follow somebody incapable of leading a nation and a party. this is what happens when you follow somebody who is using politics and the white house only for his own fame and to enrich his personal fortunes. look what happened today. less than one year in, look at what today meant for the republican party. we have a president declaring war probably for the second time on twitter against a nuclear armed north korea. we have doug jones taking the oath of a united states senator, a democrat from one of the deepest republican states in the entire country. we have two senior advisers, forget they're steve bannon, jared kushner, donald trump jr.

and jared kushner. it's as plain as the hair on your face. it goes through deutsche banc and all the curer in. they're going to roll them up and say play me or trade me. what do you make of bannon's reading of the investigation? >> we have always known that mueller had a heavy focus in this area and it's important to remember that the public doesn't know everything that's going on in this investigation. it's sort of like a duck swimming across a pond and all you see of said before is the top of the duck's body and in fact what prosecutors are doing are the feet frantically paddling beneath the surface of the water. money laundering has always seemed like a very likely prospect of bob mueller both because he hired people on the team with expertise in the area but also because we heard these little tidbits along the way. real estate sales in florida that appeared to take on large profit margins in very small periods of time. some other interesting tidbits that led you to believe that there might be a money laundering line to the story and, of c

we also know the context of all of this which is that steve bannon hates jared kushner. president. end of story. he is going to say a lot of stuff about jared that jared is clearly going to dispute. we know this from our own reporting. there is a question in today's excerpt, for example, about how involved jared was in the firing in pushing trump to fire comey. we know from our reporting that the jared kushner camp said he just seeded to it and he was not intimately involved. steve bannon said no, he's the driver of this decision which bannon himself says on the worst decision the president has made. >> remember the fact that steve bannon joined late in the game is not going to immunize him from mueller's investigation. george papadopoulos joined late in the game and he has a guilty plea on the record and is somebody who was not going to be enough. the question remains what he knew and when he knew it. mueller will look and he may already look. >> does he have firsthand knowledge. the trump tower meeting, unless he spoke with people about it after the fact two months later. we don'

and jared kushner were thinking. we just learned that the australians, when they learned of some information, picked up the phone and made a call to american authorities about it. so, the question is continuing to be begged, i think, as to why didn't they? >> and if i can just raise one more thing about bannon's comme comments. the reference to deutsche bank is very significant. because it's not just jared kushner who had hundreds of millions of dollars of dealings with deutsche bank. it was donald trump, as well. a lot of the bigger banks, the citi banks, the chase banks, by this decade, wanted nothing more to do with donald trump. so it was deutsche bank that donald trump dealt with a lot. and if the mueller prosecutors are looking at deutsche bank, boy, that is a big, big subject. i certainly don't know if there's any criminal activity to be disclosed there, but that is sympathetic that will certainly give the trump people a lot of pau pause. >> and we have fusion gps, which is the firm that commissioned this doss

and jared kushner. it's as plain as the hair on your face. it goes through deutsche banc and all the cur neser in. they're going to roll them up and say play me or trade me. what do you make of bannon's reading of the investigation? >> we have always known that mueller had a heavy focus in this area and it's important to remember that the public doesn't know everything that's going on in this investigation. it's sort of like a duck swimming across a pond and all you see of said before is the top of the duck's body and in fact what prosecutors are doing are the feet frantically paddling beneath the surface of the water. money laundering has always seemed like a very likely prospect of bob mueller both because he hired people on the team with expertise in the area but also because we heard these little tidbits along the way. real estate sales in florida that appeared to take on large profit margins in very small periods of time. some other interesting tidbits that led you to believe that there might be a money laundering line to the story and,

that includes first and foremost the trump children and his son-in-law jared kushner. and on the other hand, you have bannon's belief in the trump movement and the ideas that trump ran on and this notion that the people that trump represented finally had a voice. and so reconciling those two conflicting impulses was always very difficult for steve. and his frustrations spilled out in a rather impulsive way himself. an impulsive way for steve here by mouthing off to a reporter and saying some very indiscreet things that ended up making the man who is leading the movement that steve sees himself as kind of a shepherd of look very bad. >> robert costa, this is clearly a divorce between steve bannon and donald trump. and i want to know who gets what. who gets the sean hannity relationship. who gets editorial control, political control of breitbart and the other levers of communicating with what has been a powerful really the most fiery part of the republican party. the republican base has been completely altered by the enthusiasm and excitement for trump that was largely c

is jared kushner, is he qualified to lead an effort to reform prisons in this country? is there something perhaps that makes him uniquely qualified that we don't know about? >> no. this is -- you know, we're in year two now and asking the same question we were asking about kushner from the beginning. he's qualified in the diplomatic realm. you could say he's qualified because he's seen by world leaders as someone who really has the president's ear and he's seen as inside player. in the world of diplomacy, that actually is a huge calling card. on prison reform, his background's in real estate. his closeness to the president, who doesn't really seem to care that much about it, doesn't mean that much, so less so. >> we'll have to leave it there. annie karni, matt miller and maya harris as well. as we wait for the prison reform roundtable to get under way, we also are expecting the white house press briefing to start in the next 20 minutes or so. we expect that sarah huckabee sanders will start to respond to the news of a possible dhaa dac deal. woman: i'm a fighter. always

he did this in 2017 and this is when jared kushner and ivanka were complaining about bannon. i did not think we would see the fireworks that we saw today. normally we see fireworks on new year's, not right after. and this has been extremely unusual. saying that steve bannon ahad nothing to do with the campaign or had nothing to do when the white house is like saying david axelrod had nothing to do with the white house. he was there at the beginning of the barack obama campaign -- >> but he was there when the "access hollywood" tape came up and reince priebus was getting off the train. >> and he was seen as the solution and to be fair, the reality is if they had not made that change, all of the trump advisers agree that trump would have not won. he was comfortable with bannon. that was a relationship. he liked bannon. that has dissolved into something else and the comments that bannon made about trump's son -- don jr. has -- and they've been attacking them for a while now but this isn't ban -- bannon's own voice attacking his son, accusing him of treason, saying he must have k

he did this in 2017 and this is when jared kushner and ivanka were complaining about bannon. normally we see fireworks on new year's and not after and this is extremely unusual. safing that steve bannon had nothing to do with the campaign or had nothing to do when the white house is like saying david axelrod had nothing to do with the white house. he was there at the beginning of the barack obama campaign -- >> but he was there when the access hollywood tape came up and reince priebus was getting off the train. >> and he was seen as the solution and to be fair, the reality is if they had not made the change all of the trump advisers agree that trump would have not won. he was comfortable with bannon. that was a relationship. he liked bannon. that has dissolved into something else and the comments that bannon made about trump's son d-- don jr. has -- and they've been attacking them for a while now but this isn't ban kbroe pon's own voice, attacking his son and accusing him of treason, saying there is --syay there there investigating in the russia probe. that is counter the par

she vacationed with ivanka trump and posted a photo at jared kushner's birthday party. they also held talks with a chinese company last year for a real estate investment up to $1.2 billion, which ultimately did not happen, in his new book, david frum explores the dangers of an administration that has rolled back ethical rules. he writes trump ocracy has left americans less safe against foreign dangers, has diverted their money from its proper purposes to improper pocket, has worked to bias law enforcement in favor of the powerful and has sought to intimidate media lest they report thing it is public needs to know. to shrug and say what's it all matter is not only to dismiss the poor and vulnerable but to submit your own interests to the mercy of the greedy and unscrupulous, it is to submit to live as a subject rather than a citizen. joining us now. david frum, the author of the new book, "trumpocracy" the book is published tomorrow available for purchase online at midnight. your reaction to the latest information that the counterintelligence officials are saying to jare