bob mueller is obviously doing this. rob widen, democratic senator, is saying the senate intelligence committee should do this as well. the republican chairman, you're up there all the time, they've shown no interest in going there. but this is -- bob mueller is now -- it started with russia meddling, possible russia collusion, possible obstruction of justice, now trump organization writ large? >> yes, look, bob mueller does not have to listen when trump says don't go there. he doesn't have to say, okay, sorry. he's running this probe. when you're talking about the foundations for what may have been the allegations leading to collusion, i mean, those can't spring out of absolutely nowhere. so if the trump organization, the trump business side builds these relationships over time, whether or not they actually result in profits or in actual constructions of trump towers in moscow, it's people that you know. as we know, politics is a lot based on, you know, personal relationships and international diplomacy is based on pers

we know that bob mueller is using all kinds of tool it. russian defendants and their co-conspirators did not report their activities to the fec or regist register as foreign agents with the doj. i want to answer that, of course they didn't. putin's henchmen aren't good at complying with our paper work law. but that means that bob mueller right here is laying out a case that he is willing to use, even these obscure paper work rules to go after election violations, how could that affect anyone who worked in american with these russians. >> i think they can be indicted for the exact same things, they could be indicted for conspiring with these russians. the fact that there's only one american indicted today doesn't mean that there aren't going to be more americans indicted. you've got this microtargeting that was done by the russians, to suppress the clinton vote. how did they know who to target? i don't believe for a second that this s.w.a.t. team that came in weren't necessarily experts in american politics, they had to have somebody helpin

he thinks, quote-unquote, the reference to bob mueller. he was briefed earlier today by the deputy attorney general rod rosenstein. one white house official told me that is an indication that they see him as a part of the process and not a part of the problem. those are talking points that we're getting from the white house. what we didn't see in that tweet, in that statement, that the administration put out was an acknowledgment of the fact that russia, in fact, did meddle in the u.s. election. and an acknowledgment there need to be next steps. what will this white house do to prevent it from happening again, particularly with the midterms looming. will they, in fact, enact sanctions, something that has been passed in congress and a lot of republicans could like to see this president enact those sanctions quickly. and so there's going to be a lot of pressure on next steps. this is obviously something that has roiled this white house. it has gotten closer and closer to the oval office. we know that the president's former top aide steve ban

steve bannon has not yet met with bob mueller's investigators. that meeting was expected to have happened bijan 31st. but we start with the white house standoff at the fbi over classified information and the president's desire to derail the mueller probe. here's congressman adam schiff on the topic earlier today. >> the president is looking for a reason to fire bob mueller. the president is looking for a reason to fire rod rosenstein. the bigger concern i have right now is for rod rosenstein. this has been true for me for sometime and why rod rosenstein and not bob mueller? the white house knows it would face a fire storm if it fired bob mueller. what's more effective is to fire bob mueller's boss. why is that more effective? rod rosenstein decides the scope of bob mueller's investigation. >> and a brand-new story breaking in "the new york times" in just the last hour says, quote, president trump cleared the way today for the release of the secret memo written by republican congressional staffers and said to accuse federal law enforcement officia

that potentially bob mueller doesn't have. the public should get that information. i hope we have the benefit of his work at the end of the day. i don't know at this stage whether we could move legislation like that. i would love to see something like that coupled with something to protect bob mueller from getting fired or rod rosenstein from getting fired and in the greater concern i've had over the last few months is rob rosenstein. the most effective way to cripple bob mueller is not by firing him. it's by giving him a new boss who says you can't look at this, can't look at that and it's time to close up shop. if the president is given an opportunity to appoint a y yes-man, that's what we might get. what rob rosenstein is telling bob mueller, we don't know and we're not likely to know if he were fired and replaced by someone else. this is a profound concern. it's one of the reasons why i would view the firing of rob rosenstein the same way i would view the firing of bob mueller as its own form of saturday night massacre tha

he thinks, quote-unquote, the reference to bob mueller. he was briefed earlier today by the deputy attorney general rod rosenstein. one white house official told me that is an indication that they see him as a part of the process and not a part of the problem. those are talking points that we're getting from the white house. what we didn't see in that tweet, in that statement, that the administration put out was an acknowledgment of the fact that russia, in fact, did meddle in the u.s. election. and an acknowledgment there need to be next steps. what will this white house do to prevent it from happening again, particularly with the midterms looming. will they, in fact, enact sanctions, something that has been passed in congress and a lot of republicans would like to see this president enact those sanctions quickly. and so there's going to be a lot of pressure on next steps. this is obviously something that has roiled this white house. it has gotten closer and closer to the oval office. we know that the president's former top aide steve ban

>> i don't have an exact date but to add one thing, hope hicks has spoken to bob mueller's team. she spoke with him over the course of two days, and there are contemporaneous text messages between her and other participants in this that bob mueller has. so her version of this, in which this conversation is not -- you know, she takes a very different view of this conversation, has already happened. this is not something she's going to be able to come back around and add to later. >> we have to take a break here. when we come back, major breaking news on the memo that the house intelligence committee intends to release. very important statement about it by congressman adam schiff revealed just moments ago. ways to lose stubborn belly fat. the roasted core wrap. (robotic voice) 3, 2, 1... not cool. freezing away fat cell with coolsculpting? now that's cool! only coolsculpting is fda-cleared to treat and freeze fat cells, non-surgically. diet and exercise alone just shrink those cells. coolsculpting gradually eliminates them, with little or no downtime. visit coolsculpting.com today.

it wouldn't be effective to fire bob mueller, what's more effective is to fire bob mueller's boss. rod rosenstein decides the scope of bob mueller's investigation. >> i'm wondering your opinion on that and on the political side, you come from a more conservative position on policy issues, but you've clearly subjected that you see this -- mueller is a lot more famous than rosenstein, so you can potentially get away with it more if that's all you care about. >> correct. and you have to back up a step. rod rosenstein was appointed by this president. it's not as though he's a democrat. that's not true. he's a republican. trump put him in that role, trump put hhe only put him in that role because jeff sessions recused himself. perhaps he thought he could fire rosenstein, or perhaps he's just trying to discredit the whole thing, perhaps if he throws enough mud up in the air, people will get confused or maybe he'll use that as an excuse not to sit down with mueller, he'll keep the republicans close to him, he's done a good job of keeping paul ryan on a short leash. and in his mind, it's a

>> i don't have an exact date but to add one thing, hope hicks has spoken to bob mueller's team. she spoke with him over the course of two days, and there are contemporaneous text messages between her and other participants in this that bob mueller has. so her version of this, in which this conversation is not -- you know, she takes a very different view of this conversation, has already happened. this is not something she's going to be able to come back around and add to later. >> we have to take a break here. when we come back, major breaking news on the memo that the house intelligence committee intends to release. very important statement about it by congressman adam schiff revealed just moments ago. ve. and at our factory in boston, 1,200 workers are starting their day building on over a hundred years of heritage, craftsmanship and innovation. today we're bringing you america's number one shave at lower prices every day. putting money back in the pockets of millions of americans. as one of those workers, i'm proud to bring you gillette quality for less, because nobody can be

what h what did mueller -- >> bob mueller doesn't need stories, he certainly doesn't need someone making stuff up. it needs to be i know something about somebody bigger and i will tell it. these indictments are stories and they have a strategic role because as i mentioned, mueller holds something for two weeks and then releases when he wants, reading from the indictment of one of the russians here, his or her private email says in september, this recent, after the american media reported on facebook's level of cooperation with mueller, which viewers may remember was a big story, bob mueller is talking to facebook, he's getting information, that's a legal of seriousness. now this russian writes to a family member, thinking it's private, not thinking bob mueller is reading it. quote, we had a slight crisis here at work, the fbi busted our activity, not a joke, so i got preoccupied with covering tracks together with the colleagues. bob mueller doesn't just have the original stuff, he also has the stuff of the people saying they're covering their tracks. and he's saying something in here --

the smartest thing they can do is to let bob mueller do his job. recall a year ago when bob mueller was being appointed, one of the rationales was to take the focus of the russia investigation and put it over here on a quiet shelf and let republicans get back to the republican agenda. they have completely blown that. this politicization has undermined not the credibility of law enforcement but the credibility of the republican party. >> phil rucker, let me give you a quick last word. i know the president thinks this was a clear win but are you picking nip sense from anybopick i ing up any sense from anybody at the white house that they should have picked up a pen and -- so the blowback from the republicans on the intel committee wasn't so harsh and so sudden? >> well, nicolle, some of the concern last week was this memo was being hyped up in the media so much, we were covering it so intensively before its release, that it would land like sort of a dud and wouldn't have the impact that they worried about. and there was also concern at the white hous

if bob mueller gets too close to the president, if bob mueller looks at the money laundering issue and that's too threatening for the president, there's no telling what this president will do. what i'm more worried about at the moment is that he fires rod rosenstein. that he knows the blowback that would accompany firing the the special counsel, so he fires rod rosenstein, puts in his own person then becomes bob mueller's boss and you say to bob mueller, you can't look into this, you can't look into that, you need to end your investigation here. >> but that's not going to apply with bob mueller. >> well, bob mueller will only then have a choice. does he accept these limitations placed on him by the new deputy chief or does he resign? that's not a position the country or bob mueller should be put in. that would prompt a crisis. >> it sounds like we are headed towards a constitutional crisis of some sort. >> i don't know, but i do know that what the house is doing right now makes it more likely not less. , at a time when members of congress should be speaking out both parties and telling

i imagine him being something of sort of a dream witness in bob mueller's hands or the hands of bob mueller's investigators. >> based on my experiences interviewing president trump over the years, you learn a few things, one, he loves to talk on the telephone. he spent most of his -- most decades at trump tower on the phone talking to clichbents and friends. did not use a computer on the 26th floor. as in mike bchaemichael's inter shows, h e likes talking in settings he enjoys especially his properties. one of the most expansive interviews he gave at the woe "washington post" came at his golf club in northern virginia. i found president trump is different at times when there's a camera in the room whereas if you're there as a print report were the pad. he's not playing to the kacamer because there's no camera there when you're doing a print-only interview and sometimes he gives sharper answers. >> that's right. establishing the comfort in the room is part of it, like you said, you don't want to over top flatter. just remember, he plays to the room. once he feels comfortable, he can change his

unbelievable reporting and an unbelievable picture of the specificity with which bob mueller is piecing together the entire campaign. >> his significance in the reporting, it felt like the investigation was moving on to asking not whether donald trump coordinated or colluded with russia, but wloehether or not h obstructed justice once he got into office. those are the threads that we had been following. that's what we had been hearing about. this points us back in the original direction, which is did donald trump himself potentially work behind the scenes to coordinate the release of those e-mails. that july 27th press conference is one that i was at, and that comment, russia, if you're listening, almost came out of nowhere. he was being asked about the dnc hacks and what he thought about them and whether or not he would call on russia not to meddle. and then estopped very abruptly, looked at the cameras, and said that. russia, if you're listening, find those e-mails. now there is one line of questioning that's looking into whether or not donald trump knew about more stuff that was goin

there are regulations under which bob mueller was appointed. those regulations don't provide for any report to the public or any report to congress at all. explicitly or implicitly. >> we try to take it deep into law school mode. you're citing the code of federal regulations. now these important. that what protect mueller for example from being unilaterally fired by the president. but they also say at the conclusion of mueller's work he can provide the attorney general with a confidential report, explaining the prosecution or declination, decisions that he reaches. declination meaning maybe he doesn't want to go after somebody. so when you read that language, and weigh a all know for russia rosenstein is the attorney general with jeff sessions' recusal. under these rules the only option is that mueller hands a report to rosenstein and then what? what does rosenstein do? >> at the end of his investigation, bob mueller prepares a report, gives it to rod rosenstein, the acting attorney general and rod rosenstein, under the regulations, is to keep

she's already spent some time with bob mueller, who knows if she ends up spending more time with bob mueller. yeah, i think the bannon playbook as juonathan put it, wrks part because i think the trump white house isn't particularly concerned about the investigations on the hill. i think they tried to put pressure on house and the senate to wrap these things up quickly and republican leadership of the committees responded and is trying to wrap this up quickly to some extent. they understand there isn't much of a price to be paid, hicks and bannon. understand there isn't a price to be paid in stonewalling the house and senate. going to make the house and the senate mad probably over the short term. we'll see. jonathan's point about how she's the original staffer, i remember i got an e-mail from her probably a month or two, i wrote a lighthearted piece about trump's wall proposal before he was a candidate. i got an e-mail, hi, i'm hope hicks. she's been there the entire way. like, when he landed that helicopter at the iowa state fair, she was the first one off. she's been there every st

it's not bob mueller's prerogative to determine what an impeachable offense is. i did have that responsibility as the independent counsel. and so what we did was to bring the information to congress's attention, and we didn't say it's a crime. we said there's substantial and credible information. so the quarrel i have is, is this a courthouse activity? and i don't think it is. that is, i don't think crimes have been committed. or is it something for congress to consider? and obviously congress has broad powers. >> jeff, let me ask you because you praised robert mueller and you said you think the investigation should run its course. >> right. >> you know, the reporting we have tonight is that he's looking at financial dealings of then-candidate trump and even citizen trump when he was thinking about running for president. do you believe that's fair in his purview because the president seems to think that's a red line. >> i don't know whether it's fair or not, but i do know this. under the special counsel regulations under which bob mueller was reported, there is a

if bob mueller wants, he can serve him with a subpoena, and under us v. nixon, it's going to go up to the supreme court. >> and i want to bring in congresswoman terry sewell here with house intel. i showed rachel's reporting about why bannon seems to be so different. what's important in your view? >> what's important is that steve bannon come before our committee. i think it's unprecedented that he has now cancelled for the third time, and i also think it's really important to remember that we had to subpoena him before he would testify. and i think it's really odd that the white house is asserting a privilege that steve bannon may have during the transition. as you and i both know, there's only one president at a time and during the transition, it was president obama that had that privilege, so for trump to be asserting that privilege, it's invalid. >> if they are overreaching into the privilege during the transition period, and doing all this bobbing and weaving, do you think that bannon knows more than anybody else you've heard of? >> it duds mean that

. >> little white lies aren't cute with bob mueller. seth, mueller's request to dismiss 20 charges against rick gates, that's been granted by a federal court in virginia as part of the plea deal. so what does gates have that's so valuable? >> well, he has a ten-year career with paul manafort, know of their relationship intimately. i would almost assume and can be certain that bob mueller has e-mails, bank records, other documents, and now rick gates as a cooperator can breathe life into those documents for bob mueller, walk him through that relationship, tell him where the bodies are buried, and frankly, that is a huge get for bob mueller, to try to flip one of the three key people in my opinion he's trying to flip, paul manafort, don junior, and jared kushner. he gets one of those three people, he's right there in the room in trump tower and everything else key to that 2016 election. >> yikes. if rick gates is breathing life into those documents, could it be a death sentence for someone el else? could we see paul manafort, chuck, chang

also, bob mueller telling a judge, get this, he's

>> i think we should be thankful for the men and women on bob mueller's team and everyone else on the intelligence community for pulling this together. if you're an american, go on the internet look up this affidavit and read it. this stuff is real and it's happening to our country now. >> julia, what are your biggest questions having been there today and you try to look ahead in the story for a living? >> i think we want to know whether or not this rules out actual collusion. i know we're not talking about collusion being a criminal offense that's not really a statute for collusion but all the people named here, the campaign officials one, two, and three. so are they people who knew what they were getting into, knew they were taking in information about the opponent, information that would help donald trump, who took that knowing who it was coming from and that was the russian government, until we get to that point we have more questions than answers. but we know how incredibly complex and aggressive this entire campaign was. >> jeremy, think about it, last night at this time we knew

just as firing bob mueller would be. it would be further evidence that what happened with james comey was not an isolated act. to me that would be a very definite part of a pattern of obstruction of justice. >> you saw the president's tweet this morning in which he really blasts the leadership. his word, leadership of both the fbi and the department of justice. is all of this, what happened today by the republican party and your committee, presumably working together the white house, an act of obstruction of justice led by the president? >> well, you know, wolf, it could be. i say could be because we don't know what interaction the republican staff on the committee he had with the white house. if this was something that was done in orchestration with the white house, that was. this was orchestrated by the white house, that could go to obstruction of justice. a lot of people are insisting there is no big revelation. why are the democrats making such a big deal about fighting the release of this memo is the why did you fig

mueller. >> the president is looking for a reason to fire bob mueller. the president is looking for a reason to fire rod rosen sateen. the bigger concern i have right now is for rod rosenstein. why? the white house knows it would face a firestorm if it fired bob mueller. what's more effective is to fire bob mueller's boss. why is that more effective? rod rosenstein decides scope of bob mueller's investigation. >> the occupant of the oval office is not the least bit a champion fors democracy. the threat from russia to our democracy is now far less than the threat from within. and tragically, that is, i think, so plainly the case. there is nothing russia can do to us the that rivals what we are doing to ourselves right now. >> as the russia investigation continues to heat up, an overwhelming majority of americans say trump should talk to special counsel robert mueller under oath. in a new poll, 71% of americans say trump should agree to be interviewed by mueller about the russia probe. 22% said he should not. 51% of republicans, 74% of independents and 85%

[heartbeat] >>> here's something in bob mueller's russian indictment. using the contemporary language of today, russians posing as woke black groups. as a legal document, this indictment doesn't evaluate how effective those efforts were. as a political matter, though, after the election, donald trump himself sarcastically thanked african-american voters for what he called low turnout. >> they didn't come out to volt for hillary, they didn't come out. so thank you to the african-american community. >> and the russian effort wasn't limited to what you might call messaging or posts online, they were also trying to ensnare black people voters and leaders in the united states. in fact take a look at this, dr. hebrew brown, i, he's led marches, he's been vocal on how african-americans can get more engaged on issues like, say, police misconduct. >> when you think about the good things that came out of the baltimore uprising, i would say that's one of them that organizations and individuals saw that the individual or organizational approach just wasn't going to

we know that bob mueller is looking very closely at donald trump's conduct in office. you'd think that if the top law enforcement official warns you against doing something, that you might take that under consideration. no? >> yeah, that's right. i mean, look, every time -- i should put it this way. we've seen a pattern of donald trump having really inappropriate interactions with senior federal law enforcement officials, with the attorney general, with the deputy attorney general, with the current fbi director, the former fbi director, the former fbi deputy director. you can go down the list. and what matters is his motive when he has these interactions. and here with the release of this memo, we know what his motives are because he's been clear about it. he's telegraphed publicly and he said to a number of aides privately that he wanted this memo released because he sees it as a pretext to move on rod rosenstein potentially to fire him. we don't know if he'll do it or not. again, that's clearly what he hopes to accomplish doing this. i think authorizing the public re

you may know one of bob mueller's most visible coople critics has been making the rounds. news outlets profiling congressman matt gaetz, noting he is controversial, even notorious, and, quote, the ultimate trump defender. here on "the beat" we've had him twice. >> who are the people that mueller is currently investigating? so you think he is currently investigating hillary clinton? >> his charge is to investigate russia's involvement in the 2016 election. my specific concern about rosenstein is he is not forthcoming with information before the judiciary committee that we're absolutely sure that he has. i'm accusing him of withholding evidence that should have been in the possession of the judiciary committee. >> and as always, i do appreciate you making the time to come on beet byte. >> always a pleasure. >> that was then. in one of the new profiles, congressman gates said this to "the washington examiner," a false claim. quote, i lowered his mic during an interview. a representative responding noting that the mic was never turned down during any of his appearance "the bea

we need to let bob mueller do his job. a big part of what i consider my job right now is making sure we stay the hell out of bob mueller's way. we look at the facts and we decide, does that meet the constitutional standard? that is, i think, the process that we need to follow. barbara: barbara slaven from the atlantic council. thank you for your work. i know you are trying to stay out of bob mueller's way, that i would be interested in your assessment of how he is proceeding in his investigation. whether you have a sense that he may be collecting information that he would not bring to the public until after our november elections, for example, waiting to see if the house changes hands, and if there might actually be a more reasonable prospect of impeachment then there is now, with republican control. the other question i have is whether there is any coordination between what you are doing and what the senate is doing, and if you have a sense of what their goal is in their investigation, and how it might differ from yours.

to end your investigation here. >> but that's not going to apply with bob mueller. >> bob mueller will only then have a choice. does he accept these limitations placed on him by the new deputy chief or does he resign? that's not a position the country or bob mueller should be put in. that would prompt a crisis. >> it sounds like we are headed towards a constitutional crisis of support. >> i don't know, but i do know that what the house is doing right now makes it more likely, not less. at a time when members of congress should be speaking out in both parties and telling the president you need to leave this investigation alone. you already fired the fbi director over russia. you did everything you could to push out the deputy director of the fbi. you have done everything you could to push out others within the department of justice including our own attorney general. all the russian investigation, you need to back off because if you do this, if you commit your own saturday night massacre, this will bring down this administration. >> what do you think the president says 100% you can put

bob mueller will follow the facts wherever they go. >> all right. we have to sneak in one more break. my thanks to jeremy bash, matt miller, chuck rosenberg and ken dilanian. when we come back, will donald trump's members in congress pay any political price for release of classified sensitive information or another norm gone by the wayside in the time of trump? we'll put that question to our panel. my name's dustin. hey, dustin. grab a seat. woman: okay. moderator: nice to meet you. have you ever had car trouble in a place like this? (roaring of truck) yes and it was like the worst experience of my life. seven lanes of traffic and i was in the second lane. when i get into my car, i want to know that it's going to get me from point a to point b. well, then i have some good news. chevy is the only brand to receive j.d. power dependability awards for cars, trucks and suvs two years in a row. woman: wait! (laughing) i definitely feel like i'm in a dependable vehicle right now. woman 2: i want a chevy now. woman 3: i know! >>> senator john mccain release

bob mueller is very good at his job. i think we can expect more indictments down the road and there's been no final conclusion whether there was or not collusion. >> when you listen to the deputy ag today, quote, there is no allegation in this dpimt any american had any knowledge of russia's activities. is he did i pep, dispensing wite idea that it happened? >> this is what bob mueller wants us to know. the government is going to conclude what it means to meet a certain legal threshold. nothing nor. stay tuned. there could be more coming. >> so you have the statement from cillizza. this one says it is more important than ever to come together as americans. we cannot allow this to sow confusion and discord. it is time to stop the attacks and farfetched theories which only serve to further the agendas of bad actors like russia. we must unite as americans to protect the integrity of our democracy and elections. this does not read like anything the president would write. is this even trump? >> well, it is a statement that is

the level of details that bob mueller has, this is a man who knows pretty. everything. i think he is seconding a signal that i know a lot more than you know. >> assuming rick gates is giving accurate information, do you believe manafort will end up cooperating with federal prosecutors? with robert mueller as well, despite that he issued this statement today maintaining his innocence and promising to fight these charges? >> the congressional group are not interested in the charges on the table. what is very interesting since bob mueller is also charged with investigating the russian attack on our election system and whether there was any form of collusion, this is immense leverage. there is a dance before somebody begins to cooperate. but this is not a he said, she said situation. there's taxes that weren't paid. the big question is does paul manafort have something he can offer bob mueller that will allow him to not spend the rest of his days behind bars? >> we'll soon find out. thank you very much for that. >> president trump labors on one key gun control measure. >> w

but i would not blame bob mueller. i would blame whoever drafted the jurisdiction and the charter that empowered him. if you look at it, it says matters that may arise from the investigation. what the heck heck does that mean? is that a bank robbery in topeka, kansas? >> martha: and that language came from rod rosenstein? >> yes, ma'am. >> martha: up next, trey gowdy looks back at some of the most heated moments of his career and who will do it once he leaves. >> the dominant question i get every saturday morning at publi publix, why don't these people go to jail. otezla is not an injection or a cream. it's a pill that treats differently. for psoriasis, 75% clearer skin is achievable with reduced redness, thickness, and scaliness of plaques. and for psoriatic arthritis, otezla is proven to reduce joint swelling, tenderness, and pain. and the otezla prescribing information has no requirement for routine lab monitoring. don't use if you're allergic to otezla. otezla may cause severe diarrhea, nausea, or vomiting. tell yo

if bob mueller gets too close to the president, bob mueller looks at the money laundering issue and that's too threatening for the president, there's no telling what this president will do. what i'm more worried about at the moment is that he fires rod rosenstein. he knows the blowback that would accompany firing the special counsel so he fires rod rosenstein, puts in his own person then becomes bob mueller's boss and you say to bob mueller, you can't look into this, you can't look into that, you need to end your investigation here. but that's not going to fly with bob mueller. congressman schiff bob mueller : will only then have a choice. does he accept these limitations placed on him by the new deputy chief or does heresign? that's not a position the country or bob mueller should be put in. mike allen: it sounds like we are headed towards a constitutional crisis of some sort. congressman schiff: i don't know, but i do know that what the house is doing right now, this is more likely not less. at a time when members of congress should be speaking out in both parties and telling the preside

let me move on to the bob mueller investigation. the president said he's perfectly happy to sit down with the special counsel. but sources are saying his lawyers are opposed to that. which version is right as far as you note? corey: i haven't spoken to the president about this matter. but as a political operative i see no value in the president sitting down with won mueller. his attorneys are right to say send us the interrogatories and we'll answer in writing. i don't see the value of the president sitting down with bob mueller. howie: a lot of pundits agree with you on that point. the president sparked a lot of media outrage when he made comment about the democrats sitting on their hands at the state of the union been when it came to black unemployment. what did you make of the harsh criticism of the president pushing back on the democrats? corey: when the president is articulating a 12-year-old boy taking flags and putting it on the graves of dead american soldiers, and that doesn't get applause, if you can't in a bipartisan natu

this is about discrediting bob mueller. devon nunez, donald trump, fellas like matt gates, the representative from florida, their goal is to discredit mueller. that's what they're trying to do. they're not going to stop there. this effort will continue weather rod rosenstein keeps his job throughout, we'll have to wait and see. >> jill, in normal times you land at -- state of the union, two or three states, maybe even four. that did not happen. we've got another shutdown looming, less than a week away. what do you expect the business end of this west wing will produce next week? >> i'm sorry, what, the state of the union, i'm sorry, i can't remember that that happened. that was only this week. yeah, the president has spent the days since delivering that speech was arguably, very well received by a lot of people. instead he spent it mostly talking to republicans. we spent yesterday talking to both the rnc, at a donor event last night, talking at the republican retreat yesterday. today he spent a big chunk of his day speaking

mueller internally are something that bob mueller looks at? >> i think he would be foolish not to. essentially, all of the elements of obstruction of justice, of an attempt to influence or obstruct a grand jury are there. what's missing is the question of was it their the intent to influence that grand jury. and that intent can be de-decembered. you can have circumstantial evidence that produces it. or you can have direct evidence. and who knows what mueller may have in the way of direct evidence of somebody having confessed somewhere along the way, hey, guys, let's do this. this will make those grand juries think twice about indicting our guy. so, senator, when i hear you talk about that as i'm explaining, i'm thinking devin noness. >> one of the biggest questions out there in washington, d.c. right the now and has gone unanswered and whose answers to the extent that they've tried it have been shallow, nondenial denials has been this. what were the communications, either between the trump legal team or the white house, and e nunes house repub

we need to let bob mueller do his job. a big part of what i consider my job right now is making sure we stay the hell out of bob mueller's way. we look at the facts and we decide, does that meet the constitutional standard? that is, i think, the process that we need to follow. andrea: robert? slaven from the atlantic council. thank you for your work. i know you are trying to stay out of bob mueller's way, that i would be interested in your assessment of how he is proceeding in his investigation. whether you have a sense that he may be collecting information that he would not bring to the public until after our november elections, for example, waiting to see if the house changes hands, and if there might actually be a more reasonable prospect of impeachment then there is now, with republican control. the other question i have is whether there is any coordination between what you are doing and what the senate is doing, and if you have a sense of what their goal is in their investigation, and how it might differ from yours. t

it's not bob mueller's prerogative to determine what an impeachable offense is. i did have that responsibility as the independent counsel. so what we did was to bring the information to congress's attention, and we didn't say it's a crime. we said there's substantial and credible information. so the quarrel i have is, is this a courthouse activity? and i don't think it is, that is, i don't think crimes have been committed. or is it something that for congress to consider? and obviously consider has broad powers. >> you praised robert mueller and you said you think the investigation should run its course. >> right. >> if, you know, the reporting we have tonight is that he's looking at financial dealings of then-candidate trump and even citizen trump when he was thinking about running for president. is that -- do you believe that's fair in his purview because the president seems to think that's a red line. >> i don't know whether it's fair or not, but i do know this. under the special counsel regulations under which bob museumer w mueller was interest poed, there's

>> there's no evidence that if he could fire bob mueller today, he would fire bob mueller today. as i have said before, the founders of this country, drafters of our constitution anticipated a president who would be so taken by power that he would become an autocrat and he would seek tyrannical powers, that is taken care of in our constitution. but mike barnicle, they never, ever, allowed their imaginations to be darkened by the belief that when america's constitution was challenged, when the rule of law was challenged, when constitutional norms were challenged -- that they, that that grave challenge to our republic would be met by compliant members of congress. and i must say, and yes, we have to add, a chief of staff who served honorably, general kelly. who now are both ignoring the fbi director at the deputy attorney general's warning. the justice department's warning. their own justice department's warnings. republicans, one and all, warning them, do not release this memo, it is not in america's best interests. it is not good for our national security. >> each day we sit here

mueller, are desperate for trump to try to keep up with bob mueller? is there any more, is there any more certain way to get this prideful president to take that deposition and interview than to say he's not smart enough to do it? >> i don't think that the president's lawyers trust him in this situation. so i don't think that is the aim. what this may be is an effort to try and put mueller back on his heels to try and make it clear to mueller that they're not going to give in here, to a free-wheeling interview. to try to get better terms for an interview. i think in a dream scenario they would have the ability to provide written answers to questions. i think my guess is that mueller would not go for that that seems a little too elementary for a president. but if the white house could -- and the lawyers could kpreetly control what was coming out of the president -- completely -- in terms of a written statement that would be ideal. the other alternative is they would like more narrow terms of what was going to be talked about. but i think one of the conc

mueller by name. >> bob mueller who was an extremely accomplished investigator and attorney. but let's go to roger -- so remember, let's do the timeline. because i think this is important. we actually know russian operatives were actually trying to communicate with donald trump jr. during the campaign, that he had a couple of email exchanges with him. then within a month, popadopoulos is having his conversation in london which as we have heard and you reported earlier tonight, with communications with his campaign. >> you think it went up the line? >> i think it went up the line. because if donald trump jr. is engaged, and it's not just that he was on the campaign, the family was integrally involved in the campaign. >> so you're talking about if you will the fam theory of the case, that this is a fam business and fam is going to talk. what about sam nunberg's theory, if donald trump were so in on it in such a hands on way, it would have come out by now and he probably was not in it. >> i think that is a big assumption, we don't know. i won't pretend that i have facts connecte

the main one, special counsel's bob mueller, of course, continues. but there is concern this discredits that investigation. that's one of the reasons he signed off on this, dana. >> i should tell you we are waiting to hear from the president in less than a minute, so stay with me while we wait for that tape. you mentioned -- here we go. let's listen to the president. >> thank you very much, everybody. thank you. >> what do you think of the memo? >> i think it's terrible. i think it's a disgrace what's going on in this country. i think it's a disgrace. the memo was sent to congress, it was declassified. congress will do whatever they're going to do, but i think it's a disgrace what's happening in our country. and when you look at that, and you see that and so many other things, what's going on, a lot of people should be ashamed of themselves, and much worse than that. so i sent it over to congress. they will do what they're going to do. whatever they do is fine. it was declassified, and let's see what happens. but a lot of people should be ashamed. th

and these charges show how aggressively bob mueller is going after anyone who lies any time. he got gates to plead guilty to lying to investigators after he was indicted. if that sounds weird, unusual or just plain stupid, well it's all of those things and we have a special report with the prosecutor later this hour. here's why all of this is so bad for paul manafort. he is in a sense the last one standing but with a lot coming at him. gates agreeing to cooperate fully, to turn over all documents and potentially to testify in court. that means basically to testify, we believe against paul manafort. mueller already had a ton of evidence on paul manafort, what's different tonight, he now has cooperating incooperating, alleged co-conspirator. i have bill crystal and a lot more guests in this segment and ahead. but i wanted to begin with you all, joyce, you look at what's happening here, you look at what is basically two breaking stories for us, gates pleading, which is very significant given his senior role in the campaign and new charges against manafort. what does it tell you?

he said this isn't about bob mueller. it is about bob mueller. the president of the united states has told his friends and told people in the white house he was doing this to getting this doctored memo, this incomplete memo to undercut bob mueller and hurt the investigation against him. pawn said this wasn't about the deputy attorney general. that's a law. donald trump himself has told people closest to him this is about undercutting the deputy attorney general, harming his reputation. paul ryan said this is just about legitimate oversight. that, too, is a lie, if it were about legitimate oversight they would have gone to the fisa judges, they would have done this quietly. this wouldn't have been run by devin nunes, this wouldn't have been done in coordination with the white house and they would haven't shut out richard burr, they would haven't shut out senate republicans, they wouldn't have shut out the intel community, they wouldn't have shut out everybody they shut out. he also said that well -- there's so many things to say about that press d

we ought to be trying to focus on an investigation at a professional level by bob mueller and not trying to find a way to obstruct justice or to absolve this president from any responsibility he has. >> i want you to take a listen to what the house intelligence committee chairman devin nunes said about the allegations laid out in the memo of fisa abuse. take a listen. >> i think the american people understand that the fbi should not go to secret courts using information that was paid for by the democrats to open up investigations and get warrants on people of the other political party. that's the type of stuff that happens in banana republics. >> it seems as though the judge was told that the information from the steele dossier was funded by a political source but it was not specifically referred to as having been paid for by the democratic national committee and the clinton campaign. do you think that's problematic? >> what nunes conveniently ignores is this investigation was underway long before the involvement of the steele dossier. and, in fact, the court was advised that there was a

>> i think we should be thankful for the men and women on bob mueller's team and everyone else around the united states intelligence community that have pulled this together. i agree with what jeremy said earlier. if you're an american, go on the internet look up this affidavit and read it because that stuff is real and that's happening to our country right now. >> julia, what are your biggest questions having been there today and you try to look ahead in the story for a living? >> i think we want to know whether or not this rules out actual collusion. i know we're not talking about collusion being a criminal offense that's not really a statute for collusion but all the people named here, the campaign officials one, two, and three. were unwitting. we want to know if there were witting people, people who knew exactly what they were getting into, who knew the information they were taking in about the opponent, information that would help donald trump, who took that knowing exactly who it was coming from and that was the russian government. until we get to that point, we have more questi