the voatz app is being trialled in a county in utah. democracy live in west virginia, injurisdictions in oregon and south carolina. it's not a huge trial. at most, a few thousand will vote this way. the pilots are all being funded by this man, bradley tusk. an early investor in uber, he's got deep pockets and big ambitions. you know, i'm not doing this just because i want to make it easier for military to vote or people with disabilities to vote but because i want to radically increase turnout overall so that we move things into the centre, right? and so that everybody votes, and that means having technology that can handle millions of votes. so, why aren't we all e—voting? why aren't we all voting on our mobile phones? well, it's because there are a lot of people who are very sceptical of the technology and some believe there are some serious security flaws with some of these apps. i caught up with michael, he's reverse engineered these two electronic voting systems and says he's found security flaws in both. i'm definitely surprised

i put those same questions to the founder of voatz. obviously, it's new so there will be criticisms. so, we welcome the scrutiny but at the same time, a lot of that is hypercritical. ——a lot of that is hypothetical. just by looking at one piece of the system without actually transacting with the system in any meaningful way often would lead you to incorrect or incomplete assumptions. so what did terra think of her expensive voting online? ——so what did terra think of her experience of voting online? i like it for people with disabilities because it gives us options and we need options. because some of us just can't get out. some of us require special tools in order to write or speak. and i think that it's a good option for people like that. but i am not necessarily an advocate of electronic voting without a lot more security around. both types of voting have been used before in local elections and both companies say they've never been successfully hacked. is e—voting the future? are voting stations like this the past? not so

the voatz app is being trialled in a county in utah. democracy live in west virginia, injurisdictions in oregon and south carolina. it's not a huge trial. at most, a few thousand will vote this way. the pilots are all being funded by this man, bradley tusk. an early investor in uber, he's got deep pockets and big ambitions. you know, i'm not doing thisjust because i want to make it easier for military to vote or people with disabilities to vote but because i want to radically increase turnout overall so that we move things into the centre, right? and so that everybody votes, and that means having technology that can handle millions of votes. so, why aren't we all e—voting? why aren't we all voting on our mobile phones? well, it's because there are a lot of people who are very sceptical of the technology and some believe there are some serious security flaws with some of these apps. i caught up with michael, he's reverse engineered these two electronic voting systems and says he's found security flaws in both. i'm definitely surprised

. >> i've spoken with a number of voters who used voatz, and overwhelmingly, they had trouble setting it up. trouble.a little there are a couple steps to it. voting is not easy, period, but then they did enjoy it. i don't know if you want to get into the security issue, as well, but i do think there is enough of a consensus among that that is a much tougher nut to crack. >> is there anything we should add to that, or should we get into security issues? >> i think it is interesting if you look at polling on this, in general, if you ask voters, would they like to vote on their phones, they would say yes, but if you mention russia or security attacks or nationstates attacking our elections, those numbers plummet. i think most people when they are thinking about voting and go to vote aren't necessarily thinking about security, but of course that is a great concern. when you raise it with voters, it is a great concern, as well. noting thes worth fact we have moved so dramatically away from voting awaythe internet, moving from paperless voting systems, and how much movement there was, both

nimit sawhney the co-founder of voatz and larry nord and the director of a center for justice. just a reminder if you do have questions h feels -- feel free o drop them in the chat room. voting is on everyone's mind at the moment in with the coronavirus especially more voters than ever are trying mail-in ballots are voting early and as we are talking about our usual voting methods so many things have moved to on line and people are asking will voting become digital as well? i want to start the conversation by asking why would you even want to on line voting and i will say i'm coming from seattle washington where we have a robust mail-in ballots system and it's quite easy. >> i think the appeal is enormous. in theory it's largely been attempted in this country for military servicemembers and it could be used for people with disabilities who f don't have a lot of access to the polls. i think if we somehow had a robust on line voting system that would drastically increase participation and the bigger question than how we would get there. this country doesn't have great numbers of

nimit sawhney the co-founder of voatz and larry nord and the director of a center for justice. just a reminder if you do have