tobin: martin tobin. jerry: good morning, mr. tobin. would you tell us what is your current employment? dr. tobin: i am a physician in pulmonary and could all care medicine. jerry: whereabouts? dr. tobin: in chicago at hines va hospital and loyola university medical school. jerry: is hines va hospital a large facility? dr. tobin: it used to be the largest va hospital in the country. it has now been superseded by one or two others. jerry: do you specialize in pulmonology? dr. tobin: i specialize in pulmonology and in critical care medicine. jerry: would you tell the jury what pulmonology is? dr. tobin: pulmonology is the study of the lungs. it deals with all diseases that affect the respiratory system, the lungs, the chest wall. jerry: what are the various components of the respiratory system? dr. tobin: the respiratory system begins at the nose and mouth and a goes down through the back of the throat down to the windpipe out through the bronchial tubes and down to the air sacs. these are the small grape like structures at the bottom whe

and the second area that doctor tobin has indicated is he said doctor tobin will testify regarding the scientific research supportive of his analysis that showed how the hyper bearings can be narrow. again, i believe he is already extensively testified to his position as to the narrowing of the hyper bearings and whatever this additional research is i have been provided with a single journal article relevant to the treatment of covid patients and that was provided to me last night as well and if it's limited to that single article i guess that could be construed to be additional evidence but again, doctor tobin extensively testified as to his view of the narrowing of the hyperbaric's and the third area is what is written as follows, doctor tobin has reviewed and will testify as to his analysis for the two studies of or that doctor fowler cited regarding outdoor exposure to carbon monoxide, doctor fowler testified that mr. floyd could've had a level of ten or 18% hemoglobin as reflected in the slides disclosed for 13 and that in his opinion this level could have contributed to mr. floyd

blackwell. >> good morning, doctor tobin. >> mr. blackwell. >> thank you for rejoining us and i have just a few follow-up questions i would like to ask you in rebuttal but first just so you are introduced to the jury you are a pulmonologist. >> correct. >> critical care physician. >> yes, intensive care. >> and he studied the physiology of breathing for 46 years. >> correct. >> i want to first ask you about the issue of mr. floyd's potential exposure to carbon monoxide. >> yes. >> were you able to hear testimony regarding this yesterday? >> yes, i was. >> were you able to see this particular slide in the highlighted statement at the bottom is seven minutes mr. floyd's carboxy hemoglobin could have increased by ten or 18%. >> correct. >> would you first just tell us right off the bat, do you agree with that proposition that is highlighted there? >> no, i do not. >> would you tell us what carboxy human woman is. >> carboxy he will go been is when the carbon monoxide combines with the protein in the blood that is caused the hemoglobin

tobin. it's date stamped 50417. they identify four areas of potential rebuttal. the first being that dr. tobin will testify regarding the significance of the hyboxic changes from the physiology and clinical standpoint, including his conclusion that the procedure is not indicative of a primary cardiac event based on the time line of significant events. i believe that dr. tobin has already extensively testified as to the -- his opinion of the significance of the anoxic seizure. that formed a large basis of his testimony and how he concluded that. now the fact that there is a differing opinion, that it's a cardiac event instead of a hypoxic event is, that's the nature. again, the state has had ample notice. this is not rebutting. it's just simply re-introducing what dr. tobin has already testified to extensively. >> well, my recollection of dr. fowler's testimony is that he agreed it's a hypoxic reaction, but it's just a mechanism. i think we were talking about the mechanism due to tra terrible

tobin. >> okay. >> the second area that dr. tobin has indicated is he said dr. tobin will testify regarding the scientific research supportive of his analysis that showed how the hypopharynxes can be narrowed. again, i believe he already extensively testified to his position as to the narrowing of the hypopharynxes. whatever this additional research is, i have been provided with a single journal article relevant to the treatment of covid-19 patients that was provided to me last night as well. if it's limited to that single article, i guess that could be construed to be additional evidence. but again, dr. tobin extensively testified as to his view of the narrowing of the hypopharynxes. the third area is written as follows, dr. tobin has reviewed and will testify as to his analysis of the two studies of dr. -- that dr. fowler cited regarding outdoor exposure to carbon monoxide. dr. fowler received that mr. floyd could have had a level of 10% to 18% carboxihemoglobin and in his opinion this level could have contributed to mr. floyd's cardiac induced death. he'll re

tobin. no further question. >> melissa murray, she's an msnbc contributor and with us, the director of the 21st century, a former new york city police detective. professor murray, let me begin with you, this testimony we heard today many commentaries already said of the most powerful expert testimony yet and especially in a case where the entire defense has presented in the opening statement by defense consult is going to be about cause of death. >> i think that's exactly right, lawrence, not only was this the most important expert testimony we have heard was the most effective. everything reporters have said is that jury was absolutely wrapped as dr. tobin walked them through the entire 9 minutes and 29 seconds that george floyd was prone on the ground and explains to them in lament term that asphyxiation were the cause of death. the first question was whether officer chauvin's conduct was the cause of floyd's death. first determining that cause of death is absolutely critical. >> and, the

tobin disagreed. he said that the lung capacity was reduced by 24% just by the prone position. 43% when you consider the additional pressure. dr. tobin's opinion corroborates the police training and what the police have known for 30 years. that there's a danger in the prone position. the danger is positional asphyxia. the worst thing that can happen with positional asphyxia is death. it wasn't just the lungs. the pressing up against the neck -- remember, when you touched that -- that it reduced the capacity of airflow such that it was as if mr. floyd was breathing through a straw. shallow breaths did not produce enough oxygen, not enough oxygen could get to the lungs. that's what killed george floyd. here is what didn't. this wasn't a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. thomas, dr. rich, dr. tobin, they agree, not a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. that's not how this looks. dr. baker, no medical evidence of a heart attack. we heard from dr. rich. dr. rich treats people who have heart attacks. he found there was

tobin disagreed. he said that the lung capacity was reduced by 24% just by the prone position. 43% when you consider the additional pressure. dr. tobin's opinion corroborates the police training and what the police have known for 30 years. there is a danger in the prone position. the danger is positional asphyxia, the worst thing that can happen there is death. and it wasn't just the lungs. the pressing up against the neck. remember when you touch that it reduced the capacity of airflow such as if mr. floyd was breathing through a straw. his shallow breaths did not produce enough oxygen. not enough oxygen could get to the lungs and that's what killed george floyd. here is what didn't, right? this wasn't a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. smoke, dr. rich and dr. tobin agreed not a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. that's now how this looks. dr. baker, no medical evidence of a heart attack. we heard from dr. rich. he actually treats people who have heart attacks and he found there was nothing on -- in his review

martin tobin. he testified floyd died from a low level of oxygen, not because of drugs in the system but the knee on his neck that led to his death. let's begin with ryan on the hill. good morning. >> reporter: good morning to you, erica. this report from t"the daily beast" indicates another relationship between joel greenberg and matt gaetz. there was a massive federal investigation that involves prostitution, sex trafficking, and a number of other crimes. they outline a series of transactions from gaetz's venmo to greenberg's venmo. $900 in transactions from gaetz to greenberg that then ended up going to three unidentified women. now, the women are not under age. there's no direct evidence that they were paid for sex, but it does outline how close this connection is between gaetz and greenberg and that is important because yesterday in an orlando courtroom greenberg and his attorney announce they'd're ready to make a plea deal with federal prosecutors. if that happens, that means there could be a

tobin spoke was exactly eight seconds long. that is how much time it would take for george floyd to go from saying, "i can't breathe," to dying. eight seconds. >> so it tells you how dangerous this is the concept of, if you can breathe or if you can speak, you can breathe. yes, that is true. on the surface. but highly misleading. very, a very dangerous mantra out there. the cause of death is a low level of oxygen that caused the brain damage and caused the heart to stop. >> dr. tobin delivered the single-most haunting line of expert testimony in the trial so far when he identified the precise moment when the life goes out of george floyd's body. a 17-year-old bravely held up her phone to record video testified she regrets she didn't do more. she testified that she can't sleep at night wishing she could have taken action to stop what derek chauvin was doing to george floyd. but the action that she did take enabled martin tobin to identify that haunting moment and so today in court, the work of a 17-year-old girl from minneapolis

tobin to recognize this. you don't have to be dr. tobin to recognize this. you can see this with your own eyes. you can see what happened. but he couldn't breathe. he said he couldn't breathe. the defendant was on top of him, on his back, on his neck with i had knees pressing down. of course. you saw how his body deflated into the ground. there are multiple moments in time that things could have gone different. and george floyd would have lived. cpr. if he would have left him on the side recovery position in the first place, or just placed him in the side recovery position shortly after the restraint. he wouldn't have died. their on force witness said putting somebody in the side recovery position is pretty fast. pretty easy thing to do. not complicated. no. professor said rotate them 90 degrees, quick. could have done that. relieve the pressure. could have done cpr, chest compressions. was supposed to. a policy he was supposed to follow. right? a duty to provide medical aid. you're not just supposed to phone that in. yoo you are supposed to use your trainin

tobin. the judge went as far as to threat and a mistrial if they discuss topics not approved. we have chuck rosenberg, a former u.s. attorney and senior fbi official and eddie glaud, both msnbc contributors. chuck, we will start with you. we know derek chauvin has decided to invoke his fifth amendment privilege. he will not testify. here is part of how that transpired this morning. we will talk about it on the other side. >> is this your decision not to testify? >> it is, your honor. >> all right. do you have any questions about your right to remain silent or to testify on your own behalf? >> not at this time i don't. >> did anyone promise anything or threatened you to keep you from testified? >> no promises or threats, your honor. >> do you feel your decision not to testify is a voluntary one on your behalf? >> yes, it is. >> what do you make of the choice? clearly, he doesn't want to open himself up to the prosecution. the jury undoubtedly wants what he left his knee on mr. floyd's knee. >

tobin has. he's remarkable at teaching a jury what his testimony means, walking him through it in a csi-type fashion, even inviting them to touch their neck. jurors eat this stuff up like candy. so in the context of how he presented the evidence, yes, i think that that is effectively dead with regard to the fentanyl defense. i think for any intelligent person watching the trial, it's basically over this point and comes down to argument. you just hope the prosecution doesn't mess it up by calling too many witnesses that counterbalance the effectiveness of what we just saw. >> interesting. let me go back to shaq. number one, how many more experts do we expect after the medical examiner? and i also understand, this is -- dr. gupta addressed this at the start, this was perhaps as difficult of a day to watch this trial as any because of how often you had to sort of relive george floyd's death. i know this has been hard on the family today, especially, shaq. >> that's exactly right, chuck. we're getti

tobin, the only dr. in this case that actually calculated george floyd's respiratory rate, and the best doctor to do so, given his training and experience, he stated that the fentanyl in his system didn't depress his respiration. he did not die of a drug overdose. that is not how he died.he did d delirium. you heard about excited delirium. dr. smock, who testified about excited delirium, told you, explain to you, george floyd did not exhibit any signs of excited delirium, one of which being superhuman strength. that's nonsense. there is no superhuman strength. there are no superhumans. impervious to pain. you heard him. you saw him . he was not impervious to pain. it is nonsense. a suggestion that this tumor, literally called and incidental tumor, relatively rare, mainly because his headache. did that causes death at that time? after the restraint, subdue will, nine minutes and 29 seconds? that killed him? no. that's just a story. dr. rich specifically testified that he looked in george floyd's medical r

doctor tobin testimony today _ low level of oxygen. doctor tobin testimony today has _ low level of oxygen. doctor tobin testimony today has left - low level of oxygen. doctor tobin testimony today has left the - low level of oxygen. doctor tobin i testimony today has left the defence case looking we could then probably it has at any point in the last two weeks. his testimony was that george floyd died from oxygen deficiency which led to his brain to stop, it was so significant because it is at the centre of what the prosecution is saying care. the three reasons for that is because he was lying flat on the concrete, handcuffed behind his back, and he had several officers kneeling on him. he also calculated that from the moment george floyd stopped breathing, there were three minutes and 27 seconds when the neck restraint continued. doctortobin seconds when the neck restraint continued. doctor tobin alter this testimony was captivating and masterful in his testimony therefore potentially devastating to the case because the jury paid att

dr tobin would talk about would would be that particular study. and the fact that in the 0 pinions that dr follower had presented in his report he didn't offer the opinion that mr floyd had in the large heart he offered it from the stand he didn't offer it in his report and and had we known at the time from the disclosures that that's what he was going to testify to then we would have addressed that during his testimony during his direct when he was here before i let me let me ask you what specifically do you want. dr told and it does lead to regarding in a large part it was simply testified that if you then look at the the overall studies including the the my own study that we've been talking about that is the floyd's heart weight does not fall within the range that is abnormal. so he'll talk about the the the the broader sort of pool of studies in the framework of discussing the my own study that we had. learned about at least that the doctor follow was going to rely on in this testimony i guess one question they have is. he's the pulmonologist

this is the point where doctor tobin testified that mr floyd | doctor tobin testified that mr floyd had a seizure. but it's not, we are not analysing the use of force from the perspective of a doctor with 46 years of medical experience who had 150 hours of time to watch an event from multiple perspectives. 0ver, from multiple perspectives. over, and over, and over again. it's a reasonable police officer standard, how would a reasonable police officer interpret this. does a reasonable police officer even know what that kind of seizure is? a reasonable police officer will interpret this as at least some form of minimal resistance. reasonable police officers again are just continuing to monitor this, expecting ems to arrive. if you would get him off the groundm _ if you would get him off the ground- - -— look at him! nondeadly force is included but not limited to physically subduing, controlling, capturing, restraining or physically managing a person. these are the policies of the minneapolis police department. reasonable police officers continue to monitor, see if he's breathing. i to m

tobin but is a significant whether mr. derek chauvin moved his leg off of george floyd after george floyd is unconscious pretty. >> no. the movement happened around a different time but obviously, the key thing is everything up to the time that we see the hypopharynx, that is occurring. with the officer derek chauvin moved his knee after that really is not quite have any material impact on the case. >> we can help ladies and gentlemen of the jury understand that if esther derek chauvin is applying pressure on the side of the neck as we see here in exhibit 943, does it translate into narrowing of the hypopharynx. >> is going to depend on what is the orientation of officer derek chauvin body and is orientation of his leg and then also in particular into what is the orientation of mr. george floyd and where exactly is the orientation of george floyd. because it is the ligaments, and is underneath officer derek chauvin's knee, there's going to be various compression of the hypopharynx in this region and then if it moves to the

tobin's testimony is clear. he offers solid visuals, including allowing the jury to feel various portions of their neck. quite frankly, allowing them to relive what mr. floyd went through. it's digestible, comprehensible for the jury. dr. tobin's breakdown of the chain of events that led chauvin's actions to mr. floyd's death was well articulated. he worked backwards talking about how mr. floyd died from a low level of oxygen. it's significant for the prosecution. what was the cause of the low level of oxygen? the small breaths. what caused mr. floyd to have those small, shallow breaths? four forces. mr. floyd was prone on the street. handcuffed with his hands behind his back. knee on his neck. a knee on his back and side. those four forces that allowed mr. floyd's shallow breaths. all perpetrated by derek chauvin. >> john, this is a little bit more of what we heard from dr. tobin, an expert in pulmonology. >> there are a number of forces that led to the size of his breath became so small. a series of forces hig

tobin disagreed. he said that the lung capacity was reduced by 24% just by the prone position. 43% when you consider the additional pressure. dr. tobin's opinion corroborates the police training and what the police have known for 30 years. there is a danger to the prone position, and the danger is positional asphyxia. the danger, the worst thing that can happen, was positional asphyxia and death. it wasn't just the lungs. the pressing up against the neck. remember, when you touch that, it reduced the capacity of air flow, such that it was as if mr. floyd was breathing through a straw. shallow breaths did not produce enough oxygen, not enough oxygen could get to the lungs. that's what killed george floyd. here's what didn't. it wasn't a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. smock told you that. dr. thomas, dr. rich, dr. tobin. they agreed, not a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. that's not how this looks. dr. baker, no medical evidence of a heart attack. okay. we heard from dr. rich. dr. rich actually treats people

tobin, just a few questions just for clarification sake. you were just asked a lot of questions about science and medicine changing, constant changing, evolving by the nano second, milli second, you heard all that in. >> yes, i did. >> i want to go to the period of time when the knee of mr. chauvin was on the neck of mr. floyd? >> yes. >> did you see him got off the neck of mr. floyd in the millisecond, nano second. >> no, i did not. >> where was mr. chauvin the vast majority of that time? >> he was on mr. floyd's neck and on his back and arm. >> not constantly changing? >> no. >> you were asked questions about what injuries were noted on autopsy. >> yes. >> and i think reference was made there was no injury noted to the hypopharynx on autopsy? correct. >> does that make any difference to you whatsoever? >> no. i wouldn't spaekt it. >> why not. >> the type of changes we see say in somebody with sleep apnea, that's not something you're going to see the following morning when you look at something. it just not there. >> there was also a refer

take your mask off. >> my name is martin tobin. >> mr. blackwell. >> good morning, mr. tobin. thank you for rejoining us. just a few follow up questions to ask you in rebuttal. but first, just so you're introduced to the jury, you're a pulmonologist. >> yes. lung specialist. >> critical care physician. >> yes, intensive care doctor. >> and you studied the physiology of breathing for 46 years. >> correct. >> i want to first ask you about the issue of mr. floyd's potential exposure to carbon monoxide. >> yes. >> were you able to hear testimony regarding this yesterday? >> yes, i was. >> were you able to see this particular slide in the highlighted statement at the bottom, the seven minutes mr. floyd's hemoglobin could have increased by 10% to 18%? >> yes, i saw that. >> would you first tell us right off the bat, do you agree with that proposition that is highlighted there? >> no, i do not. >> now would you tell us what carboxihemoglobin is? >> it's when the carbon monoxide combines with the protein in the blood that caused the hemoglobin. it's the combination of the carbon monox

tobin testified about. and i want to illustrate how i think that these demonstrate a bias, because you, still, have to consider an expert witness, in the context of bias. i'm going to call it the finger-and-knuckle testimony, and the toe-lifting testimony. you may remember this slide. right? that, this slide shows george floyd pushing his fingers against the street, to lift his shoulder off the street. that he was pushing his knuckles against the tire. he described, what he interpreted this was, basically, mr. floyd trying to push himself up, into -- onto -- onto his left side to free the right lung to help him breathe. look at the timestamp of the photos taken from the body-worn camera, here. they were taken at 8:19:35. 15 seconds after mr. floyd was placed on the ground. yet, dr. tobin, also, explained that mr. floyd went on to breathe for an additional five minutes and 51 seconds until he took his last breath at 8:25. he neglects the fact that, at this point, this is the point, and we just saw, when mr.

tobin disagreed. he said that the lung capacity was reduced by 24% just by the prone position. 43% when you consider the additional pressure. dr. tobin's opinion corroborates the police training and what the police have known for 30 years. that there's a danger in the prone position and the danger is positional asphyxia, and the danger, the worst thing that can happen with positional asphyxia is death. and it wasn't just the lungs. the pressing up against the neck. remember when you touch that, it reduced the capacity of air flow such that it was as if mr. floyd was breathing through a straw. right. the shallow breaths did not produce enough oxygen, not enough oxygen could get to the lungs, and that's what killed george floyd. and here's what didn't, right? this wasn't a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. smock told you that, dr. thomas, dr. rich, dr. tobin, they agree. not a sudden cardiac arrhythmia, that's not how this looks. dr. baker, no medical evidence of a heart attack. we heard from dr. rich, dr.

tobin, dr. martin tobin there you heard with the slight irish accent. he was so pointed and he at one point had the jury try different things to show them exactly sort of how breathing works and use their own hands to touch parts of their neck that he was referring to and almost all, all but three jurors were doing that and at one point, anderson, the judge says to him and the jurors, now, listen, you don't have to do this after an objection from the defense. you don't have to do this. you don't have to do what he sayings but you can if you want. they did continue to do exactly what dr. martin asked them to do, dr. martin tobin in touching different parts of the neck so they could understand exactly what he was talking about when floyd was unable to breathe. >> thank you. want to bring in laura coats. and mark o'mara. you heard sara talk about the medical expert. how effective was he? >> he was absolutely the most compelling witness we've had so far and that includes the emotional testimony from the age ranging from 9 years old to somebody half a centur

tobin use of palma knowledge assist in his testimony for the prosecution he said that. shallow breathing lead to george ward's death he said that it showed signs of a brain injury 4 minutes before derek shaven lifted his knees and he's not being cross-examined by the defense and they just a sidebar let's listen back in if partially ingested pills that were determined to can contain. both fentanyl and math and fatten were found partially in just in the backseat of a squad of the squad car and that those pearls had been and come have the d.n.a. of the end of the deceased individual on them meaning that they took them. and those pills would have been in his mouth at about $218.00 or 20. is it fair to say that you would expect the peak for. respiratory depression within about 5 minutes. i mean obviously it will depend on how much of it was ingested to be that it was finding the pills won't tell you anything about whether any of it was ingested or some of it or anything but if there was any amount of it ingested yes the peak would be vibrant. and so if it happened at $28.00

tobin may have been compelling. we still, of course, expect the county medical examiner to testify and we know the defense will use his official autopsy, the only official one, and those findings to argue that mr. floyd died from pre-existing conditions and drug use. the medical examiner found mr. floyd, quote, experienced a cardiopulmonary arrest while being restrained by law enforcement officers, lists heart disease, fentanyl intoxication and methamphetamine use as other conditions. that is going to be key for the defense. >> it is. but what's different here is you often have a battle of the experts, where the experts are saying diametrically opposed things and the jury has to sort out who is more credible to them. if you believe dr. tobin, you don't necessarily have to find a conflict. dr. tobin's testimony was what he saw with the low oxygen wouldn't have shown up in the autopsy. even if you believe the autopsy results in the sense of, yes, these substances were there, yes, there was heart disease there. if you

tobin? >> this evidence, this testimony is effective precisely because it's so painful to listen to. it almost puts the jury into the position of experiencing the pain that was inflicted on george floyd, it personalizes the experience in a way that little else can do. and there is something else important going on in this testimony. while psychologically it's devastating to the defense, it also lines up very neatly with what the jury has already heard from police, from everyone that they've heard from, from police employees in minnesota to the excessive force experts yesterday who talk about the risk of positional asphyxia and who say being prone, being cuffed creates a risk of asphyxia when you add pressure on the body, whether it's on the neck, on the shoulderblade, it increases that risk and now we have a medical expert who says, yes, this is why police train the way they do, in effect. this is what the risks are, and this is what caused george floyd's death. it's a very good piece of tes

tobin, a pulmonologist. dr. tobin said you need to apply common sense to the evaluation of the medical testimony. he testified that mr. floyd died exclusively from positional asphyxia. cornary artery disease, hypertension, controlled substances, they played absolutely no role in the death, according to dr. tobin. the state called dr. isenschmid, the toxicologist to explain to you that mr. floyd toxlogical levels were more consistent with a dwi case than a whole bunch of other cases that may or may not have involved an overdose. remember the ratio where he said, no, these are cases -- they may have died of something else, maybe a gunshot wound but they had fentanyl in their system. is to he gave you these strange statistics. but essentially attempting to try to convince you that -- that these levels are insignificant. people drive their cars around, and therefore the drugs played no role in the death of mr. floyd. third, the state called dr. smock, an emergency room physician, right? to explain to you that mr. fl

mike tobin is one with most reporters period. he is unafraid and he's out there in the mix and he does such a professional job. >> sean: did you hear what he said? no, i've got it. i've been gassed before. i'm like, okay. >> laura: he was in the middle east. i think he's cool. i'm not worried about him. he's got it under control. fantastic coverage, sean penn

tobin disagreed. he said the lung capacity was reduced 24% from the prone position, 43% when you consider the additional pressure. dr. tobin's opinion corroborates the police training and what the police have known for 20 years, that there's a danger to the prone position. the danger is positional asphyxia. the worst thing that can happen with positional asphyxia is death. it wasn't just the lungs, the pressing up of the neck. when you touched that, it reduced the capacity of air flow as if mr. floyd was breathing through a straw. these shallow breaths did not produce enough oxygen. not enough oxygen could get to the lungs. that's what killed george floyd. here's what didn't -- this wasn't a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. smock told you that, dr. thomas, dr. rich, dr. tobin they agreed, not a sudden cardiac arrhythmia. dr. baker, no medical evidence of a heart attack. we heard from dr. rich. dr. rich actually treats people who have heart attacks. he found there was nothing on his review, nothing, in g

you don't have to be doctor tobin to recognize this, it's probably nice to be doctor tobin but you don't have to be him to recognize this. you can see this with your own eyes. you can see what happened, that he couldn't breathe. you can see that he couldn't breathe. the defendant was on top of him, with his knees pressing down. but of course you saw how his body sort of deflated into the ground past the point of consciousness. there were multiple moments in time, ladies and gentlemen, multiple moments of time things could have gone different. and that george floyd would have lived. if he was left in the side recovery position in the first place or placed in the side recovery position, and shortly after the restraint, he wouldn't have died. their own force witness testified that putting somebody in the side recovery position is a pretty easy thing to do, not complicated. the professor said you just rotate them 90 degrees, quick. could have done that. relieved the pressure. could have done cpr, chest compressions. was supposed to and had a policy that he was supposed to follow. the duty to

you don't have to be doctor tobin to recognize this, it's probably nice to be doctor tobin but you don't have to be him to recognize this. you can see this with your own eyes. you can see what happened, that he couldn't breathe. you can see that he couldn't breathe. the defendant was on top of him, with his knees pressing down. but of course you saw how his body sort of deflated into the ground past the point of consciousness. there were multiple moments in time, ladies and gentlemen, multiple moments of time things could have gone different. and that george floyd would have lived. if he was left in the side recovery position in the first place or placed in the side recovery position, and shortly after the restraint, he wouldn't have died. their own force witness testified that putting somebody in the side recovery position is a pretty easy thing to do, not complicated. the professor said you just rotate them 90 degrees, quick. could have done that. relieved the pressure. could have done cpr, chest compressions. was supposed to and had a policy that he was supposed to follow. the duty to

martin tobin tells jurors plain and simply what he believes caused george floyd's death. >> mr. floyd died from a low level of oxygen. >> reporter: tobin says floyd being handcuffed in a prone position and sandwiched between the street and the officers on top of him all contributed to his difficulty breathing. >> he's having to use all of his spine just to try to get air into the right side of the body. >> reporter: at one point, floyd's leg goes up. >> the brain is responding to the drastically low level of oxygen. >> reporter: tobin estimated chauvin's knee was on floyd's neck 90% of the time. >> half of his body weight plus half his gear weight is coming down, that's 91.5 pounds, is coming down directly on mr. floyd's neck. >> reporter: the most dramatic testimony? when tobin shows jurors, in slow motion, what he believes to be floyd's final moments. >> you can see his eyes, he's conscious. and then you see that he isn't. and that's the moment the life goes out of his body. the knee remains on the neck for another three minutes and 27 seconds, after he takes his last breath.

martin tobin tells jurors plain and simply what he believes caused george floyd's death. >> mr. floyd died from a low level of oxygen. >> reporter: tobin says floyd being handcuffed in a prone position and sandwiched between the street and the officers on top of him all contributed to his difficulty breathing. >> he's having to use all of his spine just to try to get air into the right side of the body. >> reporter: at one point floyd's legs goes up. >> the brain is responding to the drastically low level of oxygen. >> reporter: tobin estimated chauvin's knee was on floyd's neck 90% of the time. >> half of his body weight plus half his gear weight is coming down, that's 91.5 pounds, is coming down directly on mr. floyd's neck. >> reporter: the most dramatic testimony, when tobin shows jurors in slow motion what he believes to be floyd final moments. >> you can see his eyes, he's conscious, and then you see that he isn't. and that's the moment the life goes out of his body. the knee remains on the neck for another three minutes and 27 seconds, after he takes his last breath. >> r

tobin's testimony today, as you indicated, joy, was riveting. it was graphic, and it was almost as graphic and compelling as the body cam video itself. it was so detailed and precise that it kept your attention. and it's likely that that presentation is really going to inform police tactics and training moving forward. even this concept, this false idea, which i was trained on in the police academy, that if you can talk, you can breathe -- even that will be changed as a result of this specific testimony session. i think future proceedings also involving the use of force and possible positional asphyxiation with the police involved will be changed around. and also for many years there's been a team of doctors out on the west coast, in san diego, who are like the go-to police expert witnesses to support their positions normally associated with asphyxia. i think what dr. tobin did today was to set a different standard and establish and really nullify a lot of the work that these particular doctors have been doing tens of times and getting police of

martin tobin. you know, in touching different parts of they neck, so that they could understand, exactly, what he was talking about when floyd was unable to breathe. pretty remarkable, anderson. >> interesting. sara sidner, appreciate it. thanks. i want to bring in cnn legal analyst, laura coates, former federal prosecutor and defense attorney, mark o'mara. how effective do you think he was? >> oh, he was absolutely the most-compelling witness that we have had, so far. and that includes the emotional testimony that we saw from last week. from the age ranging from 9 years old to somebody more than half a century older. you have had all the law-enforcement officials. no one expected this moment. as opposed to a medical examiner and autopsy to be this captivating. but his methodical approach. his cadence. the rhythm of his information. the way, in which he presented, in very digestible pieces. if you didn't know what a pulmonologist was before he got up there. you certainly were following along with t

tobin? >> what he is describing is torturous. he describes not only the physiology hunld trying to -- behind trying to respirate and him deduced to trying to use finger, knuckles, shoulder, and you combine that with the idea of the kneeling, but he adds a new element here, the manipulation of handcuffs with the street creating a rock and hard place. his z hiss description is so compelling. >> yeah. describing the left side of his body being in a vice. and effectively rendering it as if his left lung had been removed. that's how hard it had been. chief, stick with me. looks like we might be getting back into it. let's listen. >> you may do them and he should phrase it more if you twor do that. and if you wush to do it, that is your choice. you are not rurd equired to do anything that witness instructs you to do. feel free to do it if you wish. mr. blackwell? >> thank you, your honor. if we can go back to explaining the anatomy in the base of the skull. >> yes. so as i'm putting my hand here at the back of my neck and then feeling

thanks, mike tobin. will get back to you as we continue our coverage. bringing back leo 2.0 terrel, larry 1.0 elder, b kayleigh mcenany. there is a political opponent to that that was the denial all summer long of rioting and chaz, chop summer of love autonomous zones, police stations burned to the ground, thousands of cops injured with bricks and rocks and bottles and molotov cocktails. all that happened as well. joe biden and the democrats ignored it. they didn't want to anchor their constituency. tensions rising between police departments and communities, city blocks taken over, police precincts burned down. it brings back a lot of memories of what we've been through. >> it does. as you know, i started that white house podium and i didn't often field critical questions about violence in the streets. i brought it up after st. john's church burned in washington, d.c. st. john's church stayed open during the march on washington. it's an icon of civil rights and faith intersecting but it was burned down among the riots.it 25 people who lost their lives.

doctor tobin told you that. doctor smock, doctor rich, the experts, the experts who testified you can rely on them. doctor smock, doctor rich, doctor, they said like that commercial, right, they know a thing or two because they've seen a thing or two and they know a thing or two. doctor tobin knows a thing or two. about how this works. so, looking at the charges and this is a little bit of a different layout than you see in your printed jury instructions and they are not intended to replicate the instructions completely but it is meant to be a guide for you to look at the different elements in a particular context and so the charge of murder in the secondary, murder in the third degree, manslaughter, second-degree judge read you what the loss of those things are in the law breaks down is different charges into things called elements. first element, second element from a third element, fourth element and each of these have to be proved beyond a reasonable doubt by the state in order for the defendant to be guilty

doctor tobin what is exhibit 943? >> half of theod bodyweight . >> is not always eat. >> the reason that we are saying that is because the total is off is coming down 91.5 pounds n directly on mr. floyd's neck. blackwell: is that all? >> we see that the toe is off the ground having his face smashed directly to the pavement. >> when is faces into the pavement, at that time it like one of the ones that i should do, coming down in the new, there's a huge know bodyweight back on his knees everything is directed down on his knee his shin and his toe and his boot. >> were there times mr. chauvin left knee was on the back of mr. floyd's neck? >> correct. >> that is a separate set of forces it is the same force but compressing a different area it is compressing inside his chest. blackwell: what about the times mr. floyd had his face one - - face >> how would you compare mr. george floyd's oxygen level that mr. derek chauvin was on top of him that first five minutes. >> we know that the oxygen levels were enough to keep his br

tobin had to say. stephanie? >> shaq, i'm sorry to put you on the spot, you may not know, but hearing that we have to ask, do we have any idea what derek chauvin's response was? what was he like sitting during this? >> i don't know during that exact moment, stephanie, but based on pool reports -- and there's a camera we can look and see derek chauvin's reactions but throughout he's been taking a lot of notes. staying focused. sometimes he looks up at the screen or makes eye contact or looks towards the witness but there's not much visible reaction you see from derek chauvin. it's also important to note he's wearing a mask so much of that, as most of the people in the courtroom, much of that reaction is disguised. but when you look at the pool reports and what they say about how he walks into the courtroom, he walks in with a briefcase, sets it down. walks with a confidence in him but he's not that expressive based on the pool reports and clips we are seeing of him in the courtroom as he's listening to that testim

the state first called doctor tobin, a pulmonologist, doctor tobin said that you need to apply common sense to the evaluation of the medical testimony. he testified that mr floyd died exclusively from positional asphyxia. coronary artery disease, hypertension, controlled substances, they played absolutely no role in the death according to doctor tobin. the state called another doctor, a toxicologist to explain to you that mr floyd's topological levels were somehow more consistent with a dwi case and a whole bunch of other cases that may or may not have involved an overdose. rememberthe or may not have involved an overdose. remember the ratio where, no, it was cases, they may have died of something else like a gunshot wound but they had fencing in their system. so he gave it the strange statistics but essentially attempting to try to convince you that these levels are insignificant, people drive their cars around, and therefore the drugs played no role in the death of mr floyd. third, the state called an emergency room physician to explain to you that mr floyd was not experiencing any

tobin. that was another medical expert adding on to what dr. tobin said. can you talk about what the prosecutors do today when it comes to dr. andrew baker, the hennepin county medical examiner? how do they attempt to get him to say asphyxiation? >> well, they laid the foundation through other medical witnesses as you played and, of course, from dr. tobin as others that talked about the lack of oxygen as the cause of death. substantial causal factor in death here. now they have to move to the medical examiner. although the report did not use the word asphyxia, it does speak about cardiac arrest. of course, we learned from prior witnesses that is not synonymous or only inclusive of a heart attack. it is often referred to. people think cardiac arrest, they assume heart attack. they have gone to great lengths to say the medical terms are essentially the human heart. that's how everybody dies, the heart stops beating. they'll be unpacking what this report that is usually written not for juries, per se, but written in medical terms to unpack what that means. it

tobin describes death of mr. floyd essentially as i understand again to hypoxia low oxygen resulting in brain, going to the brain. low oxygen to the brain. dr. fowler also does to hypoxic death but the heart was muscle that did not get the oaks resulting in a sudden cardiac arrhythmia the reasons dr. fowler dismissed brain hypoxia because number one hypoxia of the brain results in observable symptoms. the brain demands more oxygen right, it takes 20% of our oxygen tope function brain even though it is one of the -- smaller percent aiming of our body. it is the most sensitive to the loss of oxygen and it reveals a progressive set of symptoms, confusion which was not exhibited right. if you compare -- if you compare the testimony about how, whether mr. floyd was intoxicated or didn't exhibit any confusion all right. restlessness not exhibited short ness of brt complained of but also by sudden cardiac arrhythmia and incoherent speaking not complained of when someone is experiencing hypoxia to the brain, as doctor to

thank you, doctor tobin. 0ur correspondent larry madowo has been watching the trial in minneapolis. doctor tobin's testimony today has left the defence�*s case looking weaker than it probably has at any point in the last two weeks. his testimony that george floyd died from oxygen deficiency which led to his brain to stop was so significant because it is at the centre of what the prosecution is saying here. the three reasons for that is because he was lying flat on the concrete, handcuffed behind his back, and he had several officers kneeling on him. he also calculated that from the moment george floyd stopped breathing, there were three minutes and 27 seconds when the neck restraint continued. doctor tobin all through this testimony was captivating and masterful and his testimony istherefore potentially devastating to the case because the jury paid attention and took notes. so significant when he spoke about the painkiller fentanyl. that also came up because fentanyl is this addictive opioid that the defence has said again and again is they believe that was in george floyd's syste